Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 3 ***Updated Mod Note Post 1***

PTH2009

My talk of heading to Limerick was premature. Hopefully I can make it to the game. Should be a great crowd at it. Who are the danger men for Tipperary ???

Joe_ Public

mickmackmcgoo wrote: »

They all do it and it's frustrating..

Thought Limerick were a much better team on paper but they didn't build enough of a lead by half time. We will be favourites for sure

Waterford will definitely be favourites and deservedly so, but judging from tonight that might suit this Tipp team. Pure heart and desire won that match tonight although I agree with above post about the injury time. Should have been another minute added on, refs surely have the discretion to do that?

DeiseDawg

Brilliant opening remarks from tipp's paul Maher immediately following win in tg4 interview. :-)

cul beag

Well after my last prediction I'm certainly not going to put a curse on our fellas! Tipp backs are very solid and they are an all round workmanlike outfit. Certainly no pushover and have a great man in charge,Willie Maher. Looking forward to it isn't it brilliant that we are contesting a Munster final in our own backyard.

3ships

Hope its not raining or should i say tipping

Whiplash85

We are a limited enough side. A fact backed up by the fact that only one senior panelist from last Sunday was on the team. Waterford will definitely be strong favourites in 2 weeks time. While it is a very physically imposing team they are more likely to use an iron fist rather than a velvet glove to eek out a victory. There was no silky play tonight or interchanging moves instead aerial bombardment was used to punch holes in the Limerick defense. By the way the ref should have added a further 40 seconds at the end there for the schmozle in injury time.

Joe_ Public

Whiplash85 wrote: »

We are a limited enough side. A fact backed up by the fact that only one senior panelist from last Sunday was on the team. Waterford will definitely be strong favourites in 2 weeks time. While it is a very physically imposing team they are more likely to use an iron fist rather than a velvet glove to eek out a victory. There was no silky play tonight or interchanging moves instead aerial bombardment was used to punch holes in the Limerick defense. By the way the ref should have added a further 40 seconds at the end there for the schmozle in injury time.

Agree substantially although they did get 2 finely worked goals to be fair to them, the first was a great move, the second was beautifully taken. They look a team with great heart and industry but Waterford's firepower will present a different test altogether I think.

Whiplash85

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Agree substantially although they did get 2 finely worked goals to be fair to them, the first was a great move, the second was beautifully taken. They look a team with great heart and industry but Waterford's firepower will present a different test altogether I think.

Yeah they are very dogged. I dont think they will stand off and admire like the Clare side did last night. The attitude or mantra permeating right through Tipp sides at the moment is work work work. You need the right balance of piano shifters and piano players and Tipp management teams had a habit of picking the latter. The subs that came on are much better hurlers evidenced in the fact that they scored 1-3 between them but mightn't be as hard working.

Whiplash85

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Agree substantially although they did get 2 finely worked goals to be fair to them, the first was a great move, the second was beautifully taken. They look a team with great heart and industry but Waterford's firepower will present a different test altogether I think.

Wet or no wet I haven't seen a game in years that had as many groundstrokes and first time pulling as tonight. Even the goal was a great finish. Was great to see.

Dick phelan

So what's the time and date for the final?

Joe_ Public

Whiplash85 wrote: »

Wet or no wet I haven't seen a game in years that had as many groundstrokes and first time pulling as tonight. Even the goal was a great finish. Was great to see.

Yeah spot on. I think Tipp handled the conditions that bit better tonight, there's a bit of old-fashioned heft about them and nothing wrong either with a bit of hit and hope if you've got a stickler like Quirke inside.

As regards subs, yeah certainly Maher seems to be taking some left-field decisions so he's obviously not afraid to put his stamp on it. Wonder if he will make changes for the final, I'd say one or maybe two, but not many anyway. I did think Tommy Nolan might have nailed a starting place this year but maybe it's too soon for him yet.

Joe_ Public

Dick phelan wrote: »

So what's the time and date for the final?

Wednesday week, 27 July anyway, presumably 7.30 but haven't seen that confirmed.

PTH2009

Interesting that former senior Waterford selector Willie Maher is Tipperary under 21 boss. He will know a few Waterford players but would not of worked with some as they only came on the senior scene post 2014, not that it will have much baring on the game I'd say

A nice dry evening will suite us. Anyway we have the seniors to concentrate on for the next 10 days

Deisegodeo

Super second half from Waterford last night. That win was badly needed and great to see one of our teams cut loose in the second half. Doesnt happen too often... Hopefully Stephen Bennett will get a start for the seniors now, real eye for goals - something we badly lack at senior level at present.

Surprising to see Limerick beaten this evening, but Tipp were the better team. The final be interesting, Tipp have a very strong defence and Waterford have real scoring threat, fascinating battle ahead. Great to have it in the Sportsfield too

JesusRef

Tipp looked a very impressive outfit - a very hard working team.

I was struck last night by how easy it was at times for 3 or 4 care players to pop off balls off to each other to point - with no Waterford player pressurising them.

It was on about the 26th minute before I remember seeing a clare player harassed to the point of a turnover.

We have fantastic individuals, hopefully we up the work rate for the dirty stuff - as tipp did tonight - so we won't come unstuck

Clonmel1000

waterford28 wrote: »

When Limerick beat Tipp handy tomorrow it will be confirmend for Walsh Park in two weeks. If by some miracle Tipp win its in Thurles and thats concrete.

Where do you start with this?

cul beag

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

Where do you start with this?

Hahaha. Ah yes indeed,one can only laugh!

jelutong

That is one good Tipperary team.

robopaddy2

PTH2009 wrote: »

Victory over Wexford or Munster under 21 victory ????

If offered one which would you take

I'd take victory in both like everyother deise supporter but victory in the senior championship is bigger Imo. Sadly underage hurling doesn't get as much a following as the seniors do. A lot of people had no idea there was a Match on last night

We have a better chance of winning the all Ireland at under 21 level than at senior level but a lot of hysteria Is created around the city and county if we qualify for a senior semi final against the cats

I'd take the u21 win hands down. We don't win much silverware, an u21 win would be worth much more to us in the long term. Were the only one of the 5 hurling counties in Munster who hasn't won an u21 in recent times. You'd be looking at the Ulster champs in the AI semi and a great chance at getting to an AI final. Weve shown Sunday we are way off winning a senior All Ireland yet and victory over Wexford just sets us up for an inevitable semi final defeat to KK.

robopaddy2

Joe_ Public wrote: »

mickmackmcgoo wrote: »

They all do it and it's frustrating..

Thought Limerick were a much better team on paper but they didn't build enough of a lead by half time. We will be favourites for sure

Waterford will definitely be favourites and deservedly so, but judging from tonight that might suit this Tipp team. Pure heart and desire won that match tonight although I agree with above post about the injury time. Should have been another minute added on, refs surely have the discretion to do that?

Think Limerick were cocky. On paper they should have been favorites for the AI. Thought all they had to do was show up and collect another u21 AI just because so many of last years team are still up to the age. Tipp were hungrier. Will be a tough Munster final but I'm hoping home advantage might give us the edge. Weldone to William Maher who has a super job done with that Tipp bunch. Future Tipp manager in the making I'd say.

Stacksofwacks

robopaddy2 wrote: »

I'd take the u21 win hands down. We don't win much silverware, an u21 win would be worth much more to us in the long term. Were the only one of the 5 hurling counties in Munster who hasn't won an u21 in recent times. You'd be looking at the Ulster champs in the AI semi and a great chance at getting to an AI final. Weve shown Sunday we are way off winning a senior All Ireland yet and victory over Wexford just sets us up for an inevitable semi final defeat to KK.

We'd be better off throwing the match against Wexford so seeing as there is no point in turning up to an all Ireland semi final against Kilkenny. Derek may aswell rest up the U21 lads if your logic is right and I'm not saying it isn't

robopaddy2

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

robopaddy2 wrote: »

I'd take the u21 win hands down. We don't win much silverware, an u21 win would be worth much more to us in the long term. Were the only one of the 5 hurling counties in Munster who hasn't won an u21 in recent times. You'd be looking at the Ulster champs in the AI semi and a great chance at getting to an AI final. Weve shown Sunday we are way off winning a senior All Ireland yet and victory over Wexford just sets us up for an inevitable semi final defeat to KK.

We'd be better off throwing the match against Wexford so seeing as there is no point in turning up to an all Ireland semi final against Kilkenny. Derek may aswell rest up the U21 lads if your logic is right and I'm not saying it isn't

The question was asked, if you had to sacrifice one.

I'm sorry but I don't see us beating KK in an AI semi if we get there. Were not good enough yet. I think we will have the beatings of them in another couple of years (would like to see us do it while Cody is still at the helm). The conveyor belt hasn't been what it was in KK at minor or u21 the past 4 or 5 years so they will level off eventually and counties such as ourselves, Clare & Limerick have caught up to them at underage but still a bit off competing with them consistently at senior.

Like I say, trophies don't come our way very often so a chance at an u21 we should go full throttle,

Stacksofwacks

robopaddy2 wrote: »

The question was asked, if you had to sacrifice one.

I'm sorry but I don't see us beating KK in an AI semi if we get there. Were not good enough yet. I think we will have the beatings of them in another couple of years (would like to see us do it while Cody is still at the helm). The conveyor belt hasn't been what it was in KK at minor or u21 the past 4 or 5 years so they will level off eventually and counties such as ourselves, Clare & Limerick have caught up to them at underage but still a bit off competing with them consistently at senior.

Like I say, trophies don't come our way very often so a chance at an u21 we should go full throttle,

Well we werent too far away from them last year and we beat them in the league this year so who knows.I dont think they are as invincible as yesteryear, the structure of the u21 championship is wrong anyway, it should be played earlier in the year and i feel with the 2 championships running along side each other it may end up costing us in both. at the end of the day, seniors have to take precedence given the amount of training and money put it. It would be silly to say that we should forget about the seniors and focus on only the U21 because we dont think we can beat kilkenny. lets just drive on and see how far we can get, any All Ireland win would be fantastic for the county

Rasputin11

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

Where do you start with this?

The "miracle" was about 7/4 with PP, Westmeath 21's beating Kilkenny was 14/1, slightly more miraculous odds.

blueflame

Nobody should doubt the quality of this Tipp side. From memory, when these lads were at Tony Forrista in 2009 l Waterford and Tipp met in both the A and the B Finals with Waterford winning the B and Tipp winning the A. Aussie played in goal for the Waterford A team the same year. When they met at minor Tipp beat Waterford n the first round in Walsh Park. At U21 you normally have a combination of the best of two or three Forristal teams - Waterford won the tournament in 2010 and Tipp won it in 2011 - so taking this into account not much between them for me it is 50/50 and that is the way we should approach it. .

Tipp looked very physical and delivered ball to the full forward line as quickly as possible- our full back line the other night are all very good hurlers and tigerish markers but a little on the small side so we may need to make some adjustments or alternatively make sure we work very hard out the field particularly in the forwards to limit the supply of quality ball. On the other side of the coin i believe our forwards pose a massive threat and if we can get Aussie pinging ball into our forwards like we all know he can, i believe we have a very good chance of winning this one.

Looking forward to what will hopefully be a marvellous occasion especially if we have managed to put things right a senior level the previous Tuesday. Personally think it would be an even bigger and better occasion if they moved the fixture to the Friday night

Cake Man

Yeah I think it might get an even bigger crowd if they put it back to the Friday evening, you might get say a good few from the likes of north Tipp or even supporters of both counties living up the country who would make the journey but maybe wouldn't on a weekday night. I wonder would it be worth asking the question? Would be great if our lads got a few extra days rest but I doubt Tipp would agree to it. Most likely club games in both counties pencilled in for that weekend anyway (30/31 July).

deiseach

TG4 might not be too amused by the idea of a Friday night game either. Anyway, I'm giddy out at the prospect. I bet the County Board can't believe their luck. By my reckoning there were three Senior/Minor/Under-21 inter-county hurling matches played in Waterford in all of 2015. The Under-21 final will be the eighth in 2016.

JesusRef

What is the capacity for Walsh park these days I have heard 17,000??

Surely we should start playing some 1st round of the munster championship there seeing as Lees than 20000 are going to these games anyway

tomwaterford

JesusRef wrote: »

What is the capacity for Walsh park these days I have heard 17,000??

Surely we should start playing some 1st round of the munster championship there seeing as Lees than 20000 are going to these games anyway

The view off the bank is Terrible though


Could probably host most championship matches if it was bumped up to 25K and facilities imprOved

cornerboy

tomwaterford wrote: »

The view off the bank is Terrible though


Could probably host most championship matches if it was bumped up to 25K and facilities imprOved

Surprising nobody ever thought of moving to Carriganore

deiseach

cornerboy wrote: »

Surprising nobody ever thought of moving to Carriganore

Do you think no-one thought of it?

Or

Do you think people thought of it and you thought it was a good idea?

Or

Do you think people thought of it and you thought it was a bad idea?

Or

All of the above?

danganabu

robopaddy2 wrote: »

Think Limerick were cocky. On paper they should have been favorites for the AI. Thought all they had to do was show up and collect another u21 AI just because so many of last years team are still up to the age. Tipp were hungrier. Will be a tough Munster final but I'm hoping home advantage might give us the edge. Weldone to William Maher who has a super job done with that Tipp bunch. Future Tipp manager in the making I'd say.

Limerick most certainly were, I was at the game and the body language of the Limerick lads was shocking, all the big guns waiting for someone else to take the game to Tipp. Hurling wise Tipp are very limited, particularly in the forwards, but they won that game completely on heart and desire and Willie Maher has to take a huge amount of credit for that.

I would agree that home advantage and having a lot more 'natural' forwards should be enough to swing it in Waterford's favour, I'm sure Willie Maher won't agree with me, but last nights win makes it a successful year for me, very little was expected of this team.

danganabu

JesusRef wrote: »

What is the capacity for Walsh park these days I have heard 17,000??

Surely we should start playing some 1st round of the munster championship there seeing as Lees than 20000 are going to these games anyway

Generally whatever the capacity is it is reduced a few thousand when hosting a Senior Championship match as health and safety requirements etc. are stricter,
the Gaelic Grounds had its capacity reduced by a few thousand recently AFAIK.

PTH2009

the under 21 munster final in Walsh park will be an all ticket affair

Hopefully the tickets go on public sale and not through the clubs like in 2009

Deise189

Does anyone know if Supervalue/Centra would have better tickets than gaa tickets.ie or do they work off the same system? Only section 210 coming up for me online so I might wait a while.

PTH2009

Deise189 wrote: »

Does anyone know if Supervalue/Centra would have better tickets than gaa tickets.ie or do they work off the same system? Only section 210 coming up for me online so I might wait a while.

Almost sure they use the same system in the shops

I'd say a few tickets will go on sale in Walsh Park and Fraher Field next week.

Wexford to bring the biggest crowd I'd say, Clare 2nd and us/Galway too have a small/medium attendance.

I got 4 tickets in 208 row H on Monday night last

wats the craic

PTH2009 wrote: »

Almost sure they use the same system in the shops

I'd say a few tickets will go on sale in Walsh Park and Fraher Field next week.

Wexford to bring the biggest crowd I'd say, Clare 2nd and us/Galway too have a small/medium attendance.

I got 4 tickets in 208 row H on Monday night last

defo we will have the biggest crowd there cant beat a couple of good victories to bring out the band wagon . there is nothing but a buzz around the county again .

hurler on de ditch

wats the craic wrote: »

defo we will have the biggest crowd there cant beat a couple of good victories to bring out the band wagon . there is nothing but a buzz around the county again .

a big scatter for both teams to get to Croke Park,i'd say Kilkenny are ****ting themselves

thesultan

No need of all ticket

Psychedelic

Will they be selling tickets for the u21 final outside Walsh Park on the night as well?

phobia2011

Anyone know what channel the Wexford game is going to be on? Away for a few weeks so need to find out.

deiseach

phobia2011 wrote: »

Anyone know what channel the Wexford game is going to be on? Away for a few weeks so need to find out.

It'll be on RTÉ.

robopaddy2

What do people think we'll see on Sunday? Change in system / personnell? Stephen Bennett nearly has to start after his performance for the u21s.

Cake Man

He probably should start but I wouldn't be at all surprised to see the same starting 15 as the Munster final. The thinking being that it's an opportunity for the lads to respond and redeem themselves.

If Bennett is to start, who would he come in instead of? It would probably have to be at the expense of either Curran, Dunford or Mahony?

robopaddy2

Cake Man wrote: »

He probably should start but I wouldn't be at all surprised to see the same starting 15 as the Munster final. The thinking being that it's an opportunity for the lads to respond and redeem themselves.

If Bennett is to start, who would he come in instead of? It would probably have to be at the expense of either Curran, Dunford or Mahony?

If the system was to change there would be an argument for sticking with the same 15 and giving the lads a chance to prove themselves in a more open, attacking system. But if we are persisting with the sweeper system there should be wholesale changes given so many fellahs who just weren't good enough in the Munster Final. There should be plenty lads on the bench chomping at the bit to have a go. You have guys there like Gavin O'Brien and Shane McNulty who must be wondering what they have to do to get a run.

Deise_2012

The two lads aren't good enough for Senior inter county. Gavin's a great hurler but just isn't quick enough and Mcnulty is a tidy hurler but he couldn't dislodge any of the current backs. Conor Gleeson first sub defender and you're gonna have Conor Prunty added next season too, Harney wouldn't be too far behind if he improves his hurling as well

robopaddy2

Deise_2012 wrote: »

The two lads aren't good enough for Senior inter county. Gavin's a great hurler but just isn't quick enough and Mcnulty is a tidy hurler but he couldn't dislodge any of the current backs. Conor Gleeson first sub defender and you're gonna have Conor Prunty added next season too, Harney wouldn't be too far behind if he improves his hurling as well

Plenty of the lads playing last week weren't either. If were in the business of calling a spade a spade...

PTH2009

robopaddy2 wrote: »

Plenty of the lads playing last week weren't either. If were in the business of calling a spade a spade...

Can't see SOS, Iggy, GOB being in the squad next year if the u21 do well. Connor Prunty, Shane Roache, Jordon Henley, DJ Foran could be the newcomers in 2017

HatchetMan7

robopaddy2 wrote: »

What do people think we'll see on Sunday? Change in system / personnell? Stephen Bennett nearly has to start after his performance for the u21s.

The only change that i think could and should happen against Wexford is having 3 in the full forward line. It seems like McGrath put all his eggs in one basket (sweeper plus congested middle third). At this late stage in the year i don't think he'll deviate from this but you can still have a sweeper plus plenty of bodies in the middle third and also have 3 inside forwards.
The 3 inside forwards is a no brainer IMO (13) Patrick Curran, (14) Maurice Shanahan, (15) Stephan Bennett.
We need a player that looks for goal opportunities and both Bennett and Curran have a good understanding between them but to be honest i don't think he'll start against Wexford.

robopaddy2

HatchetMan7 wrote: »

robopaddy2 wrote: »

What do people think we'll see on Sunday? Change in system / personnell? Stephen Bennett nearly has to start after his performance for the u21s.

The only change that i think could and should happen against Wexford is having 3 in the full forward line. It seems like McGrath put all his eggs in one basket (sweeper plus congested middle third). At this late stage in the year i don't think he'll deviate from this but you can still have a sweeper plus plenty of bodies in the middle third and also have 3 inside forwards.
The 3 inside forwards is a no brainer IMO (13) Patrick Curran, (14) Maurice Shanahan, (15) Stephan Bennett.
We need a player that looks for goal opportunities and both Bennett and Curran have a good understanding between them but to be honest i don't think he'll start against Wexford.

Yea I think that is the best we can hope for as regards a more attacking strategy. McGrath dosen't have a Plan B, nor does he ever intend on having one. This is his philosophy and thats it. I remember him saying a couple weeks before the Tipp game that this team 'may face a few heavy beatings along the way'. I thought it was a very strange thing to say at the time as we were after a very good league campaign and trying to follow from a successful year last year. Maybe he foresaw his chickens coming to roost sooner rather than later.
Just on Stephen Bennett last year he struggled with the system. He needs to be in around the goal with a good supply of ball, and he will do damage. But if your asking him to stand on his own about 30 yards out from the goal with 2 or 3 lads marking him and expect to chase after aimless balls he'd be better off not playing and go away and concentrate on getting over his injury troubles or getting his confidence back with the u21s