House Sales Falling through?

gmisk

I am seeing quite a few houses come back onto the market having gone sale agreed.
For example two houses right beside me both sale agree signs last month...this week both for sale signs outside.
I have see a few more examples recently.
Anyone any ideas what is happening? Maybe people not getting the mortgages they were expecting from banks?

TheDriver

More than likely the reason I would think. Or else issues with title or contract

MAJJ

TheDriver wrote: »

More than likely the reason I would think. Or else issues with title or contract

My own fell through, the day our purchaser paid deposit the property we were buying fell through. Cash buyer simply matched our offer and game over.

NinjaTruncs

I was taking a look at a house on Saturday that was sale agreed but the purchaser couldn't get the finance from the bank. Another house I drive by on my way to work was sale agreed before Christmas and can back onto the market in January. New sale agreed sign on it now though.

MarkAnthony

My house sale is still being delayed 5 months on. Disorganised vendors.

My brother in law has had two sales fall through. One the vendor's were living in cloud cuckoo land in regards to the price after significant damp issues became apparent. Second the vendors could not produce a party wall agreement when asked and he got short shrift from the vendor's solicitor when he enquired further.

So many reasons, mainly anecdotally and IMO because of disorganised and unrealistic vendors.

ted1

They really need to Introduce penalties .

Buyers Losing deposits , sellers doubling deposits if it's on their side

summer21

Been sale agreed on property to buy since mid October. No mortgage or chain issues.
Still not closed.
It appears bank holding it up as property in negative equality
At this point looking at alternatives.
Major inconvience
Vendor should not be able to go to market without bank approval in these cases

washman3

A lot of 'cute hoorism' at play at the moment. Example: house is 'sale agreed', buyer drags it out for as long as he can before parting with payment while keeping a close eye on whether house prices are rising further or falling.
As it stands at the moment prices are actually falling again so many of these 'sale agreed' are back on the market as the 'buyer' senses this and pulls out of the sale. No quick buck to be made so he's crawls back to where he's been for the last 7-8 years.
I'm aware of one particular nasty bit of scum that made lots of money from this practice during the 'Celtic Tiger'

Bob24

ted1 wrote: »

They really need to Introduce penalties .

Buyers Losing deposits , sellers doubling deposits if it's on their side

Doubt this will happen but yes the lack of transparency and the fact that no one is committing to anything until the transaction is fully completed is crazy.

gaius c

Anecdotally, half of all sale agreeds are falling through but I find this very hard to take at face value to be honest.

Edit: have a bit of a hotlist and there's plenty of sale agreeds on it. Very few of them are shifting to sold but I haven't seen any come back to the market yet.

ABajaninCork

gaius c wrote: »

Anecdotally, half of all sale agreeds are falling through but I find this very hard to take at face value to be honest.

Edit: have a bit of a hotlist and there's plenty of sale agreeds on it. Very few of them are shifting to sold but I haven't seen any come back to the market yet.

I suspect more than a few of them are in NE and were either on sale for strategic reasons (holding off the bank) or were put up for sale without agreement from the bank...

FWIW - I agree with the previous poster. Vendors in NE should not be allowed to put their properties up for sale with prior written agreement from the bank.

gaius c

ABajaninCork wrote: »

I suspect more than a few of them are in NE and were either on sale for strategic reasons (holding off the bank) or were put up for sale without agreement from the bank...

FWIW - I agree with the previous poster. Vendors in NE should not be allowed to put their properties up for sale with prior written agreement from the bank.

Incidentally, the bank's usual first response to such a problem is to try and get the buyer to cough up the extra moolah, invariably suggesting that they should get cash from family members.

kippy

House in our estate was sale agreed in November, fell through and back on market the past few weeks.

I went to view the house and if ever the rule about "don't ever believe a thing an auctioneer tells you" needed hammering home, this was a great example.
Auctioneer gave a completely wrong reason as to why the sale fell through (I knew for a fact it was a lie), the proceeded to tell multiple lies about:
The Estate management fee, the status of a number of items in the estate, the neighbours (hard to explain this one but essentially the EA said the guy next door was a certain (desireable to have next door) profession when he was not.

The EA obviously no idea I'd lived in the estate for years but it really shows how many outright lies and misdirection they will use in an effort to get a sale.

I suspect a lot of them falling through are more do to with sellers thinking they might get more than people failing to get the mortgage but that's not based on any proof.

ABajaninCork

gaius c wrote: »

Incidentally, the bank's usual first response to such a problem is to try and get the buyer to cough up the extra moolah, invariably suggesting that they should get cash from family members.

That's not what I've anecdotally seen at all. Friends of mine were FTB's in Cork. They bid on several properties, and were outbid. Eventually, they bid on one property. Sale agreed very quickly, which rang alarm bells with me. Everything was going through nice and smooth, when at the last minute the sale was pulled. Reason? House was in NE and the vendor did not have permission to sell.

The next property, my friends were a little wiser. They asked if there were any problems with the sale. Told no. They eventually found out that too was a NE sale with no forthcoming permission from the bank to sell. At no point were they asked to increase their bid. Not from the banks anyway.

seamus

gaius c wrote: »

Anecdotally, half of all sale agreeds are falling through but I find this very hard to take at face value to be honest.

Edit: have a bit of a hotlist and there's plenty of sale agreeds on it. Very few of them are shifting to sold but I haven't seen any come back to the market yet.

We had an EA tell us that one-third of everything going sale agreed with him, is falling through.

Which is a pretty frank admission from an EA, so it's probably even higher than that.

We've been outbid on six properties in the last two months, and none of them have even been marked sale agreed yet, never mind sold.

My suspicion is that buyers' finances are the main issue.

Sunny Dayz

As someone who bought a year and half ago, now just from my own experience, but before we even went sale agreed, we were asked for proof of finance by the EA/Vendor.
In our case the vendor was a receiver selling a buy to let investment property on behalf of a bank. However for us the sale agreed period felt quite long, our solicitor was very thorough while the vendor's solicitor didn't want to provide much of the documentation requested and seemed to be trying to fob us off. We persisted and threatened to pull out as out mortgage offer was nearing expiration.

bladebrew

There was a house sold on the Douglas road in Cork a few months back, it was listed at €795k and according to the paper was bid up to €900k by 2 parties, it went sale agreed and has now appeared back on the market at €895k!
I would love to know what happened, a house sale up near a million euro is a bit rarer in Cork than in Dublin,

Miamiheat

Been looking and bidding at properties for the last 3 months: it's a nightmare => I have never seem a system that is so inconvenient for both buyers and sellers. Not sure if to blame this on EA but something has to give. I am not from here and it's really an issue making me wonder if i want to live more time in a country with such nonsense. One Property went from 200K to 280K and the owner not deciding to sell yet and we are not talking mansions...
At the same time there is no way in hell the property is worth that much so someone is committing financial suicide.
met a few buyers at viewings saturday and everyone seems fed up running from viewing to viewing without any real hope. I cannot be suggesting to buyers to drop their price expectations but somewhere in the end any speculation will end up creating the world their kids will live in. You see an advertised price, you offer it, expect a little negotiation but what we have here is EBAY. And then from what i can read 30% was for nothing anyways.
Somehow I think a lot of sellers should sell direct to buyers and i think it is much harder to break a deal on which two persons shook hands rather than have an EA linking 2 solicitors and never really having a grasp on what is going on for months and expect to sign one day. One committed seller working with one committed buyer will push to succeed. I am assuming solicitors still get paid for conveyancing even if the sale does not happen.

Pasty12345

A house in our seaside town went up for sale for 72k last year some damage done to property from a leak in the attic. Usually houses in this estate go for 120 to 150k. On estate agents website it's showing as sale agreed but it hasn't came up on property price register and it's been 7 months since it went sale agreed.
Also I rang estate agent and they said its sold.
Should it have not came up on price register or is it ea keeping it for someone who is tryin to get their finances together.

liam7831

Pasty12345 wrote: »

A house in our seaside town went up for sale for 72k last year some damage done to property from a leak in the attic. Usually houses in this estate go for 120 to 150k. On estate agents website it's showing as sale agreed but it hasn't came up on property price register and it's been 7 months since it went sale agreed.
Also I rang estate agent and they said its sold.
Should it have not came up on price register or is it ea keeping it for someone who is tryin to get their finances together.

It wont come up on the register if its bought for cash

johnp001

liam7831 wrote: »

It wont come up on the register if its bought for cash

I think this is incorrect.
It will appear on the PPR as long as stamp duty is paid.
Cash sales (no mortgage) do not form part of the CSO stats but are included in the PPR.

GatsbyGal

liam7831 wrote: »

It wont come up on the register if its bought for cash

We were cash buyers and the property was on the register a few months later.

ForEffsSake

liam7831 wrote: »

It wont come up on the register if its bought for cash

Not true, they register all sales. Just depends on how long it takes the solicitor to get around to registering it. I've seen properties where the people have moved in and it didn't show up for several months.

Pasty12345

liam7831 wrote: »

It wont come up on the register if its bought for cash

Really? God that makes sense. There are a lot of houses that we as sale agreed and I've never seen them up on a website for sale and they haven't appeared on price register

Bob24

Pasty12345 wrote: »

Really? God that makes sense. There are a lot of houses that we as sale agreed and I've never seen them up on a website for sale and they haven't appeared on price register

I'll agree with others and say it is incorrect - all properties sales will be on the register.

Why I believe is based on mortgages data only is the CSO price index (but correct me if this is wrong).

Glenbhoy

ForEffsSake wrote: »

Not true, they register all sales. Just depends on how long it takes the solicitor to get around to registering it. I've seen properties where the people have moved in and it didn't show up for several months.

All sales must be registered, the data comes from stamp duty returns which is payable regardless of how the purchase was funded. These are supposed to be paid within 29 days of completion, if a property hasn't yet come up on the register, it's likely that it hasn't actually completed yet.

HeidiHeidi

ForEffsSake wrote: »

Not true, they register all sales. Just depends on how long it takes the solicitor to get around to registering it. I've seen properties where the people have moved in and it didn't show up for several months.

Without wishing to derail this thread (mods, please feel free to delete if this is inappropriate), there's a house a few doors down from me which was sold about two years ago and still has never appeared on the PPR. If they got anything like the price they pitched it at, it would have fairly big implications for our LPT next time it needs to be assessed.

How could it be possible for a house to be sold, through a well known estate agent, and never appear on the PPR?

seamus

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

How could it be possible for a house to be sold, through a well known estate agent, and never appear on the PPR?

Crap solicitor, has yet to properly register the sale?

There were a few horror stories during the boom years of solicitors holding onto their clients' stamp duties and filing fees and failing to register the property.
It was only when the banks contacted the owners a couple of years later threatening to call in their mortgage that they became aware that the solicitor did not complete the sale.

If someone bought in cash, I could certainly see how there may be a long delay in the solicitor bothering to register the deed.

Woshy

The search function on the PPR isn't great either and sometimes there is ambiguity in what suburb a house is listed as being in so that can throw off the results. For example, I was interested in a house but pulled out of the bidding when we went sale agreed elsewhere. I couldn't find it on the PPR for ages but it turns out the house had been registered as Ballycullen when it was referred to as Furhouse everywhere else. Just putting in the first line if the address (e.g 21 x Avenue) didn't get it to appear for me. It's on,y when I thought to try Ballycullen myself did I find it.

Also things can be listed differently e.g one house in an estate called something like Daisy Hill can be Daisy Hill or Daisyhill making them harder to search for.

In hindsight I should have used Google to search but I've found the results not great there either.

Bob24

Woshy wrote: »

The search function on the PPR isn't great either and sometimes there is ambiguity in what suburb a house is listed as being in so that can throw off the results. For example, I was interested in a house but pulled out of the bidding when we went sale agreed elsewhere. I couldn't find it on the PPR for ages but it turns out the house had been registered as Ballycullen when it was referred to as Furhouse everywhere else. Just putting in the first line if the address (e.g 21 x Avenue) didn't get it to appear for me. It's on,y when I thought to try Ballycullen myself did I find it.

In hindsight I should have used Google to search but I've found the results not great there either.

Absolutely. And I don't know whether it was on purpose to make them unsearchable or just carelessness, but I have seen a few where their were typos in the street/block/town/suburb name which were excluding them from my filters.

seamus

Yeah there's a lot wrong with the PPR. It's a good start, but I'm guessing that they either didn't consult any data specialists for it, or they decided to go for minimum functionality with the idea that they would enhance it later on.

A proper register would link the sale to the folio/deed reference and include other stats like no. of beds/baths, floor area, land area, is it leasehold or freehold, BER, etc.