Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread VI: End of the MOC [Revenge of the STH]

total former

Deleted User wrote: »

Will he come straight back in to the main team or will he play some A rugby first? Could well see him up in Ravenhill.

He'll be straight back into the team. There will probably be another friendly as well as the Ulster game, I'd expect him to play both, and the plan is very definitely for him to be a key player while the Irish contingent is away (possibly even the starting out-half...)

awec

Are any of yous heading up to Ravenhill for that game?

sydthebeat

Tox56 wrote: »

What is Leinster currently though? Leinster have a top class international pack and have signed the best player in the world in the most important position on the field. Even with one of our worst performing seasons in recent memory we got to the semi-final of the H Cup. Maybe the world cup complicates things but its not like any prospective coach wouldn't have a lot to work with.

a prospective coach would certainly have a lot to work with, im not disputing that... im just drawing a direct comparison to where highlanders are versus where leinster are, and why it may not be as attractive for Brown as might be assumed.

.ak

awec wrote: »

Are any of yous heading up to Ravenhill for that game?

Might be, I'll see how the funds go!

RichieRich89

total former wrote: »

He'll be straight back into the team. There will probably be another friendly as well as the Ulster game, I'd expect him to play both, and the plan is very definitely for him to be a key player while the Irish contingent is away (possibly even the starting out-half...)

I'd hope any plans of Nacewa playing 10 will have been shelved with MOC leaving. Byrne, Marsh (if he isn't at Connacht) and Crosbie are better options short-term and long-term

Quint2010

RichieRich89 wrote: »

I'd hope any plans of Nacewa playing 10 will have been shelved with MOC leaving. Byrne, Marsh (if he isn't at Connacht) and Crosbie are better options short-term and long-term

What about medium term?

Interested Observer

sydthebeat wrote: »

Probably a harsh truth.
Taking Brown for instance, Highlanders finished 14th in 2013 in browns first season as assistant coach, then 6th in 2014 with an away qualifier... and this season have reached the semis.
so theres definitely an upward curve there, and a real possibility of him being given the Highlanders head coach after Jamie Joseph

compare that to Leinster currently.

14th two seasons ago

Eh yeah, Leinster compare fairly well. If he's in line to get the top job and that's what he wants then fair enough, but 14th. Leinster haven't come close to that poor a season.

CatFromHue

The Highlanders would usually be NZ's weakest Super Rugby team.

awec

awec wrote: »

Are any of yous heading up to Ravenhill for that game?

Yeah I'm heading up. Had planned on making one of the final pro 12 fixtures but ended up caring for an elderly relative who took unwell.

Would you need to book in advance, never had any difficulty getting early season friendly tickets on the day before.

thomond2006

awec wrote: »

Are any of yous heading up to Ravenhill for that game?

I saw Declan Kidney buying a train ticket for Belfast on that day.

thomond2006

thomond2006 wrote: »

I saw Declan Kidney buying a train ticket for Belfast on that day.

You're not even trying anymore...

awec

Deleted User wrote: »

Yeah I'm heading up. Had planned on making one of the final pro 12 fixtures but ended up caring for an elderly relative who took unwell.

Would you need to book in advance, never had any difficulty getting early season friendly tickets on the day before.

I doubt you'd need to book far in advance. I'll probably go and I haven't bought tickets yet.

Think it's 20 quid which will work out pretty pricey when converted to euro. Expensive for a friendly.

vienne86

Think I'll try and get to Ravenhill .....been wanting to go there for ages and this sounds like an easy opportunity.

.ak

It's worth going just to go to St. George's market and getting a breakfast soda from the Belfast bap lads.

thomond2006

Deleted User wrote: »

You're not even trying anymore...

I know.

.ak wrote: »

It's worth going just to go to St. George's market and getting a breakfast soda from the Belfast bap lads.

If it's not clashing with a GAA match I'll want to go to then I'd consider going up.

awec

The only thing is it's on a Friday which will mean an afternoon off work for some.

ssaye2

http://www.the42.ie/matt-oconnor-leinster-4-2182328-Jun2015/

total former

Let's give the clicks to the guys who actually generate the content, not the screen-scrapers.

http://m.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2015/0625/710656-matt-oconnor/

.ak

total former wrote: »

Let's give the clicks to the guys who actually generate the content, not the screen-scrapers.

http://m.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2015/0625/710656-matt-oconnor/

To be honest the last part doesn't sit easily with me. The O'Connor era is something I'll not remember with fondness, not just because we played so poorly, but because of how some of our "fans" acted and that obviously left a bad taste in moc's mouth and probably a lot of other people looking in from the outside.

Yes, I know it's a public role, he should have thicker skin etc., etc. but as the article states a lot of it wasn't merited. I think as a fan base we're better than that. Some of what was said/done was very soccer fan like*

*Yes I'm aware there's plenty of good soccer fans out there but nobody will tell me they majority are sporting, boo'ing Sterling off a pitch at a friendly is something that sticks out in my mind of recent.

matthew8

.ak wrote: »

To be honest the last part doesn't sit easily with me. The O'Connor era is something I'll not remember with fondness, not just because we played so poorly, but because of how some of our "fans" acted and that obviously left a bad taste in moc's mouth and probably a lot of other people looking in from the outside.

Yes, I know it's a public role, he should have thicker skin etc., etc. but as the article states a lot of it wasn't merited. I think as a fan base we're better than that. Some of what was said/done was very soccer fan like*

*Yes I'm aware there's plenty of good soccer fans out there but nobody will tell me they majority are sporting, boo'ing Sterling off a pitch at a friendly is something that sticks out in my mind of recent.

If the Leinster fans treated MOC as badly as you and many others would have us believed, the team would have been booed on at least one occasion. People were dissatisfied and the vast majority were simply critical, some people went over the top and made it personal, but he would have got as bad at any other club in the world.

.ak

matthew8 wrote: »

If the Leinster fans treated MOC as badly as you and many others would have us believed, the team would have been booed on at least one occasion. People were dissatisfied and the vast majority were simply critical, some people went over the top and made it personal, but he would have got as bad at any other club in the world.

Well I don't think the majority acted like that, hence no booing at games, but I can't help but feel we were pretty close to that. Like I said, some of the fans, as in the minority, acted pretty poorly for the whole thing. Petitions etc.

But you're probably right, there's people like that everywhere.

Podge_irl

I'm not overly fond of the general public reaction to MOC in terms of how personal it got etc, but I'm not massively fond of the general theme that we should have lower expectations either.

P_1

.ak wrote: »

To be honest the last part doesn't sit easily with me. The O'Connor era is something I'll not remember with fondness, not just because we played so poorly, but because of how some of our "fans" acted and that obviously left a bad taste in moc's mouth and probably a lot of other people looking in from the outside.

Yes, I know it's a public role, he should have thicker skin etc., etc. but as the article states a lot of it wasn't merited. I think as a fan base we're better than that. Some of what was said/done was very soccer fan like*

*Yes I'm aware there's plenty of good soccer fans out there but nobody will tell me they majority are sporting, boo'ing Sterling off a pitch at a friendly is something that sticks out in my mind of recent.

To be fair you could argue that Leinster picked somewhat of a bandwagon following in recent years and the worst of it came from that.

I won't lie, I was critical of MOC but I'd like to think that I kept my criticism civil

molloyjh

.ak wrote: »

To be honest the last part doesn't sit easily with me. The O'Connor era is something I'll not remember with fondness, not just because we played so poorly, but because of how some of our "fans" acted and that obviously left a bad taste in moc's mouth and probably a lot of other people looking in from the outside.

Yes, I know it's a public role, he should have thicker skin etc., etc. but as the article states a lot of it wasn't merited. I think as a fan base we're better than that. Some of what was said/done was very soccer fan like*

*Yes I'm aware there's plenty of good soccer fans out there but nobody will tell me they majority are sporting, boo'ing Sterling off a pitch at a friendly is something that sticks out in my mind of recent.

And to give so much air time to such a minority does the majority a massive disservice in my view. Also, the comment about fans expectations is one that left me thinking "MOC, you can just f**k right off". Very few people expect their team to win trophies every year but some of those performances, the one against Treviso in the RDS in particular, were a complete and utter shambles. Personally I expected more from Leinster on days like those. And I think that's a pretty bloody realistic expectation. As for winning at home against the Dragons...

Interested Observer

.ak wrote: »

Well I don't think the majority acted like that, hence no booing at games, but I can't help but feel we were pretty close to that. Like I said, some of the fans, as in the minority, acted pretty poorly for the whole thing. Petitions etc.

But you're probably right, there's people like that everywhere.

We were close to booing, there you have it.

The petition was widely panned by just about everyone I thought. How many people signed it?

molloyjh

Interested Observer wrote: »

We were close to booing, there you have it.

The petition was widely panned by just about everyone I thought. How many people signed it?

Feck all and it was removed due to the reaction it got from the fans in general. We'll still hear about it time and again though. It was distasteful but when you have a group of tens of thousands of people you can't expect everyone of them to maintain strict and high standards. It and other distasteful things like it have gotten a disproportionate amount of attention. And that all paints others in a bad light by association.

And it poisoned the debate completely. How often in the media did we hear about the fans being pissed off about things like not winning trophies? Or not playing champagne rugby at every turn (as though we did that under Joe - we didn't!)?

thomond2006

molloyjh wrote: »

Feck all and it was removed due to the reaction it got from the fans in general. We'll still hear about it time and again though. It was distasteful but when you have a group of tens of thousands of people you can't expect everyone of them to maintain strict and high standards. It and other distasteful things like it have gotten a disproportionate amount of attention. And that all paints others in a bad light by association.

And it poisoned the debate completely. How often in the media did we hear about the fans being pissed off about things like not winning trophies? Or not playing champagne rugby at every turn (as though we did that under Joe - we didn't!)?

Well it's much easier to look at it in a black and white sense and make the so called debate between one side (the apologists) and the other (the crazies) when in actual fact the majority of supporters were in the middle.

Suddenly there's so much for Leinster supporters to sink their teeth into. The return of Sexton and Nacewa, a new coaching ticket*, two months' worth of opportunities for youngsters during RWC and a very exciting/difficult European pool. As a semi-neutral season ticket holder, I'm much more excited about this season than last year.

*Gerry Thornley (c)

ArmchairQB

.ak wrote: »

To be honest the last part doesn't sit easily with me. The O'Connor era is something I'll not remember with fondness, not just because we played so poorly, but because of how some of our "fans" acted and that obviously left a bad taste in moc's mouth and probably a lot of other people looking in from the outside.

Yes, I know it's a public role, he should have thicker skin etc., etc. but as the article states a lot of it wasn't merited. I think as a fan base we're better than that. Some of what was said/done was very soccer fan like*

*Yes I'm aware there's plenty of good soccer fans out there but nobody will tell me they majority are sporting, boo'ing Sterling off a pitch at a friendly is something that sticks out in my mind of recent.

Distracts and takes away from the core issue that MOC wasn't good enough and did not get the best out of the squad. As a professional he signed up for it. It is a very public position, well paid and those are the down side of not reaching the levels expected. Many such as I whispered my dissapointment at his lack of youth policy and his tactics and that should be perfectably acceptable, there will always be the loud minority who go too far and the media hacks who think they represent an entire province. As you eluded to he needs to have thicker skin as every professional coach will receive sometimes very harsh and unfounded criticism. One thing does strike me though and this is for all the provinces in that there are alot of fans who go & support Leinster, Munster, Connacht & Ulster that have never been a member of a rugby club and don't necessarily get or understand the unwritten dos & don't s of how to act and behave a seperate issue but bottom line MOC was axed because he didn't perform at the levels required,no different to a player and he unwisely picked an argument with his employers which backfired spectacularly on him.

total former

I suppose the most important question is; is re-hashing all the MOC arguments going to serve any purpose at this point?

There is no new information coming out, there is nothing remotely controversial in his comments to RTE, so I'm not sure what the point is in opening up old wounds.

Let the healing begin.

Who is MOC? A new signing?