Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread VI: End of the MOC [Revenge of the STH]

.ak

Buer wrote: »

Pretty annoyed with him. If he wants out, fair enough but going public with a sob story is unprofessional. Suck it up, deal with it with the powers that be and come to an agreement.

If the ARU can't afford his release, they're laughing now because Leinster are in an impossible position and their bargaining stance has been completely eroded.

Tin foil hat on.... Possibly ARU advised him to go public to force Leinster's hand.

Personally, I'd like to see Leinster stick to their guns a bit, however on the other side I'd hate to see a young couple about to start a family feel alienated in Ireland.

thomond2006

In fairness to Douglas, we don't know exactly when he informed Leinster he wanted out.

At the same time, there is no way Leinster should be expected to be charitable and let him go for nothing. A contract works both ways and if Party A wants to end it then Party B should be compensated. If Douglas had an Elsom-like season then he might have had some leverage (I'm sorry I want out now but I performed while I was here etc).

.ak

georgewickstaff wrote: »

What is everyone getting upset about? He was dreadful. Dont let the door bang your arse on the way out.

Whilst his performances may at times have been a bit questionable it doesn't change the fact he has pedigree. He's a test lock and we're not exactly producing brilliant locks here. Lock has always been a pivotal role at Leinster as well, where some teams just use them as piano shifters it's easy to see we won trophies when we had the best locks at our disposal (Hines, Leo, Thorn etc).

There's also a question mark over his fitness, he might not have been 100% for us. I was hoping to see what he'd get up to if he hit the ground running after a decent break.

Swiwi.

Podge_irl wrote: »

He wasn't dreadful, though he wasn't great. He showed signs of the player he could be though and would have been improved this year after a bit of a lay-off I think.

I dunno Podge. He was never amazing IMO when all rested up in Sydney, I'm not convinced that his average displays are explained away by fatigue. Maybe he's just not that good?

Promote some youth from the academy or nick someone from the other provinces!

.ak

Well I'm hoping Kearney does the goods for us, but he'll be a slow burner.

Personally I think McCarthy, now that he seems totally out of the Irish setup, will have another big season. I'm a bit of a fan, so probably a bit biased, but on form he's been brilliant for us, himself and Ruddock are our strongest forwards and they make their presence known at every contact situation.

thomond2006

Once again, Neil Francis called it right.

Zzippy

I'd be fairly p1ssed off if I was a Leinster fan. It's fairly obvious he's been advised to go public to put pressure on Leinster, but this is all driven by Cheika/ARU and if I was Mick Dawson I'd be playing hardball. If they let him go easily it sets a bit of a precedent and what club will want to sign any decent Aussie player if this is what could happen... which from an ARU perspective would be ideal, as it lessens the value of their players to foreign clubs. It's win win for the ARU if this goes through.

Zzippy

thomond2006 wrote: »

Once again, Neil Francis called it right.

Banned. For life!

Podge_irl

Swiwi. wrote: »

I dunno Podge. He was never amazing IMO when all rested up in Sydney, I'm not convinced that his average displays are explained away by fatigue. Maybe he's just not that good?

Promote some youth from the academy or nick someone from the other provinces!

Fair enough. But if the kind of displays he mustered for Leinster are standard and that's good enough to get in the Wallabies squad then Aus are screwed.

briantwin

I think that Leinster should stick to their guns. What's the point in having contracts if they only protect the players? It would seem that going public like he did was a mechanism to force Leinster to do what he wants, i hope it fails.

molloyjh

Zzippy wrote: »

I'd be fairly p1ssed off if I was a Leinster fan. It's fairly obvious he's been advised to go public to put pressure on Leinster, but this is all driven by Cheika/ARU and if I was Mick Dawson I'd be playing hardball. If they let him go easily it sets a bit of a precedent and what club will want to sign any decent Aussie player if this is what could happen... which from an ARU perspective would be ideal, as it lessens the value of their players to foreign clubs. It's win win for the ARU if this goes through.

I don't think Leinster need to react to this at all. From the sounds of it they've already stated what it will take to release him, i.e. monetary compensation. It's a totally reasonable position to take on the whole thing. They just need to maintain that position in as polite and agreeable a manner as possible. And as I said the other day maybe even have a word with Douglas saying that if he stays for the coming season they'll sort something out at the end of it. After all Leinster are the injured party in all of this.

Swiwi.

Podge_irl wrote: »

Fair enough. But if the kind of displays he mustered for Leinster are standard and that's good enough to get in the Wallabies squad then Aus are screwed.

Indeed. Their locking stocks are poor at the moment compared to their past glories. I didn't really watch the Ausssie franchises this season, but their best lock was supposed to be Luke Jones and he didn't get selected. From what I saw Horwill was awful, and the Tahs lineout was dismantled by the AB-poor Highlanders pack.

Aussie fans (or at least Tahs ones) have a lot of time for Douglas, which I find a bit bemusing.

From all accounts, maybe Leinster should offer to swap Douglas for Luke Jones?

There's the hardline stance as taken by some Liverpool fans about the Sterling contract debates "let him rot in the reserves" etc, but I don't think there's any point in doing so tbh.

Leinster know this, and so have thrown a big €250k price tag on the remainder of his contract, but will in all likelihood accept less & a player if it were offered.

I don't think they'll release him without any sort of compensation, but I equally don't think they'd 'let him rot' in the A team whilst paying him a decent salary. Would be a phenomenal waste of resources (both € and a NIQ spot).

awec

irishbucsfan wrote: »

On a scale of Sykes to Thorn he was roughly in the middle.

Just let the lads up north know we're ready to take Alan O'Conner back now, cheers for minding him.

And watch while we laugh in your face.

O'Connor is too good for Leinster. You can have Neil McComb. I hear Mike McComish fancies a stint in the second row too.

total former

Podge_irl wrote: »

Fair enough. But if the kind of displays he mustered for Leinster are standard and that's good enough to get in the Wallabies squad then Aus are screwed.

I presume Douglas' performances for the Waratahs under Cheika are the main reason he's been called up.

irishbucsfan

total former wrote: »

I presume Douglas' performances for the Waratahs under Cheika are the main reason he's been called up.

Absolutely. Cheika is not the sentimental type, he knows exactly what he's bargaining for.

thomond2006

awec wrote: »

O'Connor is too good for Leinster. You can have Neil McComb. I hear Mike McComish fancies a stint in the second row too.

The same Mike McComish who scored two tries in Toulon? Sounds good.

Serbian

Swiwi. wrote: »

From all accounts, maybe Leinster should offer to swap Douglas for Luke Jones?

This makes a lot of sense. Really doesn't feel like we're going to get a quarter of a million for Douglas, so a swap deal would be ideal if we can get a decent lock in exchange.

Jones is young (24) and has been a regular starter for the Rebels, and has a few caps for Australia. Making the move does mean giving up on international rugby, which might be a bit much for a young lock like himself.

He looks like a decent ball carrier and strong tackler from this video anyway (cameos from Zane Kirchner and Kane Douglas in the highlights).

Zzippy

molloyjh wrote: »

I don't think Leinster need to react to this at all. From the sounds of it they've already stated what it will take to release him, i.e. monetary compensation. It's a totally reasonable position to take on the whole thing. They just need to maintain that position in as polite and agreeable a manner as possible. And as I said the other day maybe even have a word with Douglas saying that if he stays for the coming season they'll sort something out at the end of it. After all Leinster are the injured party in all of this.

Exactly - doing nothing is playing hardball - the situation is he is under contract, and needs Leinster's permission to sign for another team. Not without some compensation should be the position maintained.

Serbian wrote: »

This makes a lot of sense. Really doesn't feel like we're going to get a quarter of a million for Douglas, so a swap deal would be ideal if we can get a decent lock in exchange.

Jones is young (24) and has been a regular starter for the Rebels, and has a few caps for Australia. Making the move does mean giving up on international rugby, which might be a bit much for a young lock like himself.

He looks like a decent ball carrier and strong tackler from this video anyway (cameos from Zane Kirchner and Kane Douglas in the highlights).

Jeez, we can't be having players moved from Dublin to Galway/Limerick to suit a union's needs but people want players moved from Australia to Ireland for the same reason?

molloyjh

Zzippy wrote: »

Jeez, we can't be having players moved from Dublin to Galway/Limerick to suit a union's needs but people want players moved from Australia to Ireland for the same reason?

???

Who are you referring to here?

.ak

Zzippy wrote: »

Exactly - doing nothing is playing hardball - the situation is he is under contract, and needs Leinster's permission to sign for another team. Not without some compensation should be the position maintained.




Jeez, we can't be having players moved from Dublin to Galway/Limerick to suit a union's needs but people want players moved from Australia to Ireland for the same reason?

Ah we can. Kearney, Roux, Henshaw etc....




:P

Zzippy

molloyjh wrote: »

???

Who are you referring to here?

Referring to many many posts over the last few years saying the IRFU cannot just move players from one province to another, and contrasting it with posters suggesting the ARU could do that with Jones to suit their agenda of bringing KD home. It was tongue in cheek, as I don't think the posters were really serious in thinking that would happen, I just found it slightly ironic.

.ak wrote: »

Ah we can. Kearney, Roux, Henshaw etc....


:P

Heroditas

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Another one bites the dust!

I blame Malcolm O'Kelly tbh. He set the standards too high.

Blame Mal? Surely we can blame this on MOC!!

Larbre34

Ruddock and/or McLaughlin for the conversion course.

Fed up to the back teeth of journeymen southern hemisphere locks. Not Thorn.

sydthebeat

Larbre34 wrote: »

Ruddock and/or McLaughlin for the conversion course.

Fed up to the back teeth of journeymen southern hemisphere locks. Not Thorn.

Luke Jones is certainly no journeyman, id be delighted to see him at Leinster.

that being said theres no hope of that move happening and this is all pie in the sky stuff.

shuffol

So both Leinster and Munster have been dealt an unexpected blow to their resources at lock ahead of the new season, will probably mean a bit more exposure for Moloney this season.

Ulster seem to get the best value out of their lock signings excluding Raaymakers last season, they even managed to make Ed O'Donoghue look like a proper player.

Flanagan back maybe? I thought he was better than Denton tbh. (I thought Marshall was too!)

total former

Deleted User wrote: »

Flanagan back maybe? I thought he was better than Denton tbh. (I thought Marshall was too!)

He's signed for Bedford next season.

Re-signing him instead of giving our current academy guys a shot would be a bit odd anyway.

Dravokivich

georgewickstaff wrote: »

What is everyone getting upset about? He was dreadful. Dont let the door bang your arse on the way out.

I find it a bit funny seeing comments like this. Douglas practically played out 2 league seasons within 16 months. He was tired when he got here and just got more and more fatigued.

matthew8

Dravokivich wrote: »

I find it a bit funny seeing comments like this. Douglas practically played out 2 league seasons within 16 months. He was tired when he got here and just got more and more fatigued.

He only started 15 games for us. It's not like we ran him into the ground.