Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread VI: End of the MOC [Revenge of the STH]

awec

Just realised that I will miss both the Ulster game at the RDS and the Toulon game at Landsdowne Road this year.

padser

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

Yeah, I only saw it on the replay from behind the post where Ringrose basically leaped at him like a spider monkey and just got swept along.

I watched a couple of replays of this during the game.

Initially I thought the same, i.e. that it looked like Ringrose was seriously underpowered and generally what that actually means is that a player got themselves into a bad position to tackle which I think is what happened here.

However, I think the problem really stemmed from Reid (although possibly showed naivety on Ringroses part. Reid went low (and about half a second before Ringrose) and Ringrose then went high to complete the tackle (possibly also with a view to seeing if he could rip the ball). Reid basically missed the low part of the tackle (i.e. he didn't slow down the ball carrier or impede the movement of his feet) meaning that Ringrose suddenly ended up way to high on a guy who only needed to make about 2 yards to the try line and who had some speed built up.

Net result is quite predictable in that Ringrose got blown away. I don't know whether the guys in the post match analysis would regard Reid, Ringrose or both as being at fault.

ArmchairQB

Interested Observer wrote: »

Just getting around to watching the game now. Reid about as effective as a wet noodle in contact for their first try.

He can be a superb footballer but I think stuff like that is going to keep him out of the team.

Looks great going forward in a good backline but way, way off defensively which will keep him out of the top games

scott1974

Rob Kearney looks like he's out for next week and T'eo nursing a slight glute strain!!
Fitz and Cronin both look to be fit again.. T'eo and Fitz in midfield would be pretty nice..

Neil3030

I wonder if a similar conversation took place between Madigan and Sexton when the latter returned to training with Leinster.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqm70usLqYc

ArmchairQB

ArmchairQB wrote: »

Looks great going forward in a good backline but way, way off defensively which will keep him out of the top games

He has things to work on defensively but he has the raw materials. Look at Earls for example, closer to the end of his career than the start and he bounces off an Italian full back that he is trying to tackle worse than Reid did against a scarlets forward 2 feet from the line.

Reid will be fine and while I suspect Henshaw will stay at Conn, he wold benefit the move to Ulster or Leinster as his future partner in crime will be playing at one of these provinces.

Clearlier

Deleted User wrote: »

He has things to work on defensively but he has the raw materials. Look at Earls for example, closer to the end of his career than the start and he bounces off an Italian full back that he is trying to tackle worse than Ringrose did against a scarlets forward 2 feet from the line.

Ringrose will be fine and while I suspect Henshaw will stay at Conn, he wold benefit the move to Ulster or Leinster as his future partner in crime will be playing at one of these provinces.

I get that playing more regularly with his international centre partner at club level could help develop that partnership but I don't think that it's at all clear yet that he will have a long term partner in the centre or even whether he might move to 13. Payne probably has a couple of years left which would see him(Henshaw) at 12. Ringrose might well develop to the point where Henshaw stays at 12 but equally McCloskey and Luke Marshall could means that he moves to 13. Olding if he can stop getting injured could also play either position.

Given all that and the boost that it gives Connacht to have an established international in their squad I think that it might be best in the long term interest of rugby in Ireland to have him stay at Connacht.

With apologies

irishbucsfan

[Deleted User] wrote: »

He has things to work on defensively but he has the raw materials. Look at Earls for example, closer to the end of his career than the start and he bounces off an Italian full back that he is trying to tackle worse than Reid did against a scarlets forward 2 feet from the line.

Reid will be fine and while I suspect Henshaw will stay at Conn, he wold benefit the move to Ulster or Leinster as his future partner in crime will be playing at one of these provinces.

Reid is in a much worse position currently. He's got the same issues McFadden had at 12 and was unable to fix with his decision-making and footwork but also lacks physical power. However I do like him a lot at the position and I reckon McQuilkin will see him right.

He might be close to losing his starting place in the short term though, the defensive line speed was something Cullen brought up as a concern this week.

Clearlier

Clearlier wrote: »

I get that playing more regularly with his international centre partner at club level could help develop that partnership but I don't think that it's at all clear yet that he will have a long term partner in the centre or even whether he might move to 13. Payne probably has a couple of years left which would see him(Henshaw) at 12. Ringrose might well develop to the point where Henshaw stays at 12 but equally McCloskey and Luke Marshall could means that he moves to 13. Olding if he can stop getting injured could also play either position.

Given all that and the boost that it gives Connacht to have an established international in their squad I think that it might be best in the long term interest of rugby in Ireland to have him stay at Connacht.

With apologies

Just like I said. I suspect he'll stay at Conn, but if he moves it will be Ulster or Leinster so that he is surrounded by internationals but also likely his longer term centre partner. For the record it looks more likely that this will be at Ulster currently than Leinster.

So no apologies needed.

awec

Henshaw to Ulster?

Not a chance. We don't need him, were well stocked in all positions that he plays and he wouldn't even be guaranteed a place in our 15.

Clearlier

Deleted User wrote: »

Just like I said. I suspect he'll stay at Conn, but if he moves it will be Ulster or Leinster so that he is surrounded by internationals but also likely his longer term centre partner. For the record it looks more likely that this will be at Ulster currently than Leinster.

So no apologies needed.

:pac: I must have been planning to write something else - have no idea what it was though.

colster

Deleted User wrote: »

Just like I said. I suspect he'll stay at Conn, but if he moves it will be Ulster or Leinster so that he is surrounded by internationals but also likely his longer term centre partner. For the record it looks more likely that this will be at Ulster currently than Leinster.

So no apologies needed.

I don't think potentially playing with his international centre partner will have that much bearing on whether/where he moves. I think playing European Rugby Cup will be a bigger factor and Connacht are looking good on that front.
As a Leinster fan, I would prefer he stayed with Connacht. I think the spread of Irish squad across the provinces is bad enough as it is than to worsen it by Henshaw moving to one of the other provinces.
It would be a major benefit to Connacht and Irish rugby if Henshaw stays with Connacht.

irishbucsfan

This Wasps try from last weekend should give us plenty to think about. They are VERY dangerous out wide when Daly/Wade/Piutau get on the ball. Jackson was quite good at 10 as well which will be important for them in the absence of Gopperth. There were concerns about his fitness given he has missed so much time in recent years, he seems sharp though.



Where they are weak is in their control of possession. We absolutely need to target them there. Their backs are easily turned over (Wade/Daly particularly, not as sure about the rest) and their support is pretty unorganised at times. Might even be worth having JvDF on the bench ahead of Murphy for that reason alone. Also a good reason to start Fitz ahead of Reid for this game. Maybe even start Murphy over Ruddock, although Ruddock might be crucial in stopping Smith. Line speed in defense is going to be really really important against these guys, if we give that backline space they will punish us and they can keep that up for 80 minutes thanks to their halfback combination of Simpson/Robson who are dangerous 9s with lots of pace. Another reason for Fitz at 12 imo.

If we get our defense right and win turnovers up the field we can make hay. We can also target their set piece. Wouldn't be surprised to see us put boot to ball early for those two reasons. Overall I'm confident we can win it but I can see where it could all go wrong.

I would look at:

McGrath, Strauss, Moore, Toner, McCarthy, Ruddock, SOB, Heaslip, Reddan, Sexton, Kearney, Fitzgerald, Te'o, Nacewa/McFadden, Kearney/Nacewa
Cronin, Healy, Ross, Molony, Van Der Flier, McGrath, Madigan, McFadden/Kirchner

irishbucsfan

https://twitter.com/MichaelC_RTE/status/663720302019497984

.ak

Missing Teo will be massive.

He's been our best back and is a game changer.

Rob is a big loss too but Isa is coming back to looking sharp.

I think the best thing to keep some continuity would be a backline of;

Nacewa, McFadden, Fitzgerald, Reid, D. Kearney, Sexton, Reddan.

errlloyd

Fitz 12 Reid 13 or vice versa?

errlloyd

Also any news on our hookers?

irishbucsfan

errlloyd wrote: »

Fitz 12 Reid 13 or vice versa?

I've never seen Reid play 13. Can't imagine there's any chance of that.

scott1974

Irish Times say T'eo is expected to play. .

Cronin fit too

scott1974

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/european-cup/rob-kearney-a-major-doubt-for-leinster-s-european-opener-1.2423124

CIARAN_BOYLE

My backline wiuld be
redden sexton
reid fitzgerald
Kearney Nacewa McFadden

21 Mcgrath
22 Madigan
23 Kirchener

.ak

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I've never seen Reid play 13. Can't imagine there's any chance of that.

He played there after Madigan came on on Friday evening. Can't imagine him starting there tho.

Journeyman_1

.ak wrote: »

He played there after Madigan came on on Friday evening. Can't imagine him starting there tho.

I thought Ringrose went back to 13 and Madigan pushed out to either wing/FB?

errlloyd

Yeah i thought the order ak typed them made him think reid would be outside. Really is the position we have the worst depth in, other than maybe scummie

RichieRich89

I'm pretty sure it was 12 Madigan, 13 Reid towards the end of the Scarlets game. Does Reid's poor defence extend to positional play, or is it just that he's not a strong tackler? I'll have to watch carefully to see. If his ability to "stay relevant", as D'Arcy puts it, is good then maybe he'd be better off at outside centre where defending is more about positioning and less about straight up tackling?

.ak

Journeyman_1 wrote: »

I thought Ringrose went back to 13 and Madigan pushed out to either wing/FB?

No Madigan went to 12

Sangre

If Teo plays, I'm looking forward to him playing well in a ERC game and start getting the wider plaudits he deserves.

errlloyd

Sangre wrote: »

If Teo plays, I'm looking forward to him playing well in a ERC game and start getting the wider plaudits he deserves.

If he starts playing well it won't be long before an insufferable wankfest by the bt team over the fact he's English qualified.

molloyjh

errlloyd wrote: »

If he starts playing well it won't be long before an insufferable wankfest by the bt team over the fact he's English qualified.

Having read Burgess' reasons for leaving Bath and England I'd be hopeful that Ben is suitably turned off the notion of going there. He talks a bit about a sort of relentless negativity in the media and from ex-players and coaches which he found to be poisonous. If he has given Ben the idea that it is almost an inherently destructive environment and we show him something else then fingers crossed that will keep him here.

scott1974

I'm keeping my fingers crossed, I'd tend to believe the Irish Times about T'eo but Michael Corcoran is normally reliable.
Anyway apart from that we are going to have a battle against their backrow, Smith seems to be stealing and turning over ball for fun...plus the other two are big physical guys.
Hopefully O'Brien and Ruddock step up for this game..