Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread VI: End of the MOC [Revenge of the STH]

Tarf1234

Deleted User wrote: »

Nah Mads left oodles of space at times that a better 10 or more aware centres would have taken advantage of. Not all his fault but it says a lot about our back three that they scored 3 tries without spending any time in our 22.

Absolutely, and time has proven that any defensively strong or solid back 3 is led by the FB. Just look at Smith, Kearney or Brown. Kirchener would have done a significantly better job.

Tarf1234

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Absolutely, and time has proven that any defensively strong or solid back 3 is led by the FB. Just look at Smith, Kearney or Brown. Kirchener would have done a significantly better job.

My opinion is that Sexton still isn't right so they wanted Madigan on the field *somewhere* in case he needed to take over kicking without having to sub Sexton.

Madigan has never? played wing, and we are already having to play McFaddan at 13 so switching Reid out for Madigan at 12 doesn't make sense and destroys continuity.

Kirchner can play wing, so the only option appears to have been to put Madigan at 15 where he has some game time before. That I think is the logic train the selectors came to.

Amazing that Madigan still managed his trademark out on the full kick despite not playing at 10 or 12. As did Sexton mind you.

Two things are guaranteed in this world. Madigan will kick the ball out on the full once per game, and Keith Earls will pass to the touch line once per game (or just randomly fling it over his head backwards).

former total

Deleted User wrote: »

Amazing that Madigan still managed his trademark out on the full kick despite not playing at 10 or 12. As did Sexton mind you.

Sexton's kicks out were far worse IMO. Madigan at least had the excuse of being in open play, under pressure etc. Sexton managed to kick a restart out just after we'd conceded a score and needed a quick boost and then, worst of all, that penalty into the corner that he overcooked was the moment the game was irrevocably lost.

Madigan played much, much better than Sexton last week, let's be fair to him.

Tarf1234

Deleted User wrote: »

My opinion is that Sexton still isn't right so they wanted Madigan on the field *somewhere* in case he needed to take over kicking without having to sub Sexton.

Madigan has never? played wing, and we are already having to play McFaddan at 13 so switching Reid out for Madigan at 12 doesn't make sense and destroys continuity.

Kirchner can play wing, so the only option appears to have been to put Madigan at 15 where he has some game time before. That I think is the logic train the selectors came to.

Amazing that Madigan still managed his trademark out on the full kick despite not playing at 10 or 12. As did Sexton mind you.

Two things are guaranteed in this world. Madigan will kick the ball out on the full once per game, and Keith Earls will pass to the touch line once per game (or just randomly fling it over his head backwards).

I do understand the train of thought. It's not something the selection I would have made but wouldn't disagree with it hugely either. In saying that it does not excuse mistakes made on the pitch.

Personally, I would have preferred any of the out and out wingers play wing and Kirchener to FB. Or even a punt on Ringrose at 13, Ferg wing and Kirchener FB.

Couldn't agree more with your last paragraph, unfortunately.

Clearlier

I haven't seen Leinster play this season so a genuine question. Is Reid a good enough defender to play at 12? The bits that I saw of him last year suggested not but perhaps he has improved?

LostArt

He hasn't.

Tox56

Clearlier wrote: »

I haven't seen Leinster play this season so a genuine question. Is Reid a good enough defender to play at 12? The bits that I saw of him last year suggested not but perhaps he has improved?

He's so frustrating it's unbelievable

former total

former total wrote: »

Sexton's kicks out were far worse IMO. Madigan at least had the excuse of being in open play, under pressure etc. Sexton managed to kick a restart out just after we'd conceded a score and needed a quick boost and then, worst of all, that penalty into the corner that he overcooked was the moment the game was irrevocably lost.

Madigan played much, much better than Sexton last week, let's be fair to him.

Yup, Sexton had a mare not disagreeing with that. Just pointing out a defect about Madigan kicking game from hand.

Exclamation Marc

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Weren't taken advantage of? He was miles out of position for 2 tries! If that's not taking advantage I don't know what is. Does a roofy need to be involved??

Yes I know he was but if Wasps had taken full advantage of how out of position he was through the game, they would have scored 7 or 8 tries.

The one that immediately springs to mind is where Kirchner had to tackle their runner into touch because Madigan was completely out of position and sucked into a tackle he didn't need to make.

Clegg

Clearlier wrote: »

I haven't seen Leinster play this season so a genuine question. Is Reid a good enough defender to play at 12? The bits that I saw of him last year suggested not but perhaps he has improved?

He's an awful defender an every sense. He can't tackle at all and sometimes I wonder if he just doesn't want to put himself in line to make a hit. He also positions himself poorly when making a defensive read. Got burned a good few times by the Wasps centres last Sunday.

It's such a shame that his defensive game is so bad because he's really a vey good attacker. He can spot a gap to run into, has good feet, is a decent offloader and has the most beautiful pass to put a team mate into space. He's basically half a rugby player.

LostArt

Furlong is playing for the A team tomorrow so it's Moore and Ross for Bath.

The Parish King

Will the team be announced today or tomorrow?

Clearlier

LostArt wrote: »

He hasn't.

Tox56 wrote: »

He's so frustrating it's unbelievable

Clegg wrote: »

He's an awful defender an every sense. He can't tackle at all and sometimes I wonder if he just doesn't want to put himself in line to make a hit. He also positions himself poorly when making a defensive read. Got burned a good few times by the Wasps centres last Sunday.

It's such a shame that his defensive game is so bad because he's really a vey good attacker. He can spot a gap to run into, has good feet, is a decent offloader and has the most beautiful pass to put a team mate into space. He's basically half a rugby player.

Given all of this is he ready to be dropped? Unless your name is Shane Williams you can't really carry a player who doesn't defend well in the game these days.

It's one thing to come into the professional game and finding defending difficult - it's quite another to not work on it and turn it into a strength. I've mentioned it before but both BOD and Fitz were poor defenders in their first year or two but both worked on it to the point where it was a major strength. Gordon D'arcy was the original turnstile and got dropped for it (and he did resemble Shane Williams at that stage). James Norton did lose his career because of it.

Are we at that point yet or does he show glimpses of improvement?

LostArt

Clearlier wrote: »

Are we at that point yet or does he show glimpses of improvement?

He's 25 now, this is a make or break season for him imo and his defence is currently not showing signs of major improvement.

Rumour on Munster thread that Dom Ryan being sought to go south!

padser

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Rumour on Munster thread that Dom Ryan being sought to go south!

Could only be a good thing for all involved

vienne86

Deleted User wrote: »

Rumour on Munster thread that Dom Ryan being sought to go south!

Good news for Leinster.

dub_skav

Deleted User wrote: »

Rumour on Munster thread that Dom Ryan being sought to go south!

Straight swap for Murray?

ArmchairQB

LostArt wrote: »

Furlong is playing for the A team tomorrow so it's Moore and Ross for Bath.

Yeah heard that and also that none of O'Brien, McCarthy or Strauss will be available, Ruddock back and fit again

vienne86

ArmchairQB wrote: »

Yeah heard that and also that none of O'Brien, McCarthy or Strauss will be available, Ruddock back and fit again

That's bad news about McCarthy and SOB in particular. Good news about Ruddock - I hope he really is fit.

former total

A back row of Ruddock, Murphy and Heaslip is still plenty good enough, if Ruddock is fit, with Conan on the bench. VDF has been held back from the A's but I'd be surprised if he's included for Saturday.

McCarthy is a big loss, he was one of our best players last weekend. Hopefully Triggs is up to it.

molloyjh

former total wrote: »

Sexton's kicks out were far worse IMO. Madigan at least had the excuse of being in open play, under pressure etc. Sexton managed to kick a restart out just after we'd conceded a score and needed a quick boost and then, worst of all, that penalty into the corner that he overcooked was the moment the game was irrevocably lost.

Madigan played much, much better than Sexton last week, let's be fair to him.

I'm not convinced that is the case. Sexton was poor and Madigan was better than he has been in the past. But Sexton still did a few things pretty well. That chip kick in the first half springs to mind. It was exactly what a few of us have been calling for from Leinster for the last 2 years and was executed brilliantly.

Mads looked good in open play at times, but he still ate up a lot of space with lateral running as well.

Mads was the better of the two, but not by that much IMO.

molloyjh

So based on the rumours and the A squad is it starting to look a little bit like the below?

McGrath Cronin Ross
Toner Triggs
Ruddock Heaslip Murphy

Reddan Sexton
Fitz Te'o
D Kearney Kirchner McFadden

Tracy, Healy, Moore, Denton, Conan, McGrath, Madigan, Ringrose


I'm going to assume Boss isn't in the squad for now, but I've a sneaking suspicion he will be. Toner, Triggs and Denton are definitely the locks given that Molony is with the As. I find that very frustrating as I think Molony is better now and has a far higher ceiling. Agree with FT that VDF will travel as back-up but won't feature in the squad. Personally I'd like to see him in there ahead of Murphy.

WarZ

Leinster were disgraceful, we may as well throw the likes of Conan, JVDF, McGrath etc. in now and see if any of them can reach the standard that a team of european contenders needs to be at.

Right now Leinster's team of hyped players are letting the jersey down. I think the likes of JVDF would play out of their skins if given a chance. Unlike Church, Fitzy, Kearndog etc.

That is NOT a troll, the players are acting like celebrities rather than rugby players and its affecting their performances.

molloyjh

WarZ wrote: »

Leinster were disgraceful, we may as well throw the likes of Conan, JVDF, McGrath etc. in now and see if any of them can reach the standard that a team of european contenders needs to be at.

Right now Leinster's team of hyped players are letting the jersey down. I think the likes of JVDF would play out of their skins if given a chance. Unlike Church, Fitzy, Kearndog etc.

That is NOT a troll, the players are acting like celebrities rather than rugby players and its affecting their performances.

Quick lads, it's spreading. Leg it!

I'm not a troll but....

:pac:

scott1974

Leinster twitter saying Rob, Luke and Ben T'eo are close to fitness....don't like the sounds of that.
Jack Conan out with a broken bone in his foot...ffs

vienne86

scott1974 wrote: »

Leinster twitter saying Rob, Luke and Ben T'eo are close to fitness....don't like the sounds of that.
Jack Conan out with a broken bone in his foot...ffs

Another week too soon for Fitz??? Uh oh.

molloyjh

scott1974 wrote: »

Leinster twitter saying Rob, Luke and Ben T'eo are close to fitness....don't like the sounds of that.
Jack Conan out with a broken bone in his foot...ffs

Well that's a bummer. So we'll get Isa and Ruddock back at best then. At least that might mean VDF might get some time off the bench at the very least....

EDIT: Scratch that, Isa was mentioned in the same tweet so he's probably out too. FFS we just can't catch a break at all can we? So Ruddock is back and that's it. After losing Strauss, Maccer and SOB last week that's not much of a consolation really. Oh well, there's always next season.

Redgirl82

Deleted User wrote: »

Rumour on Munster thread that Dom Ryan being sought to go south!

I heard this on the back of the Stephen Moore blocking. It was mentioned that Munster also tried to sign another foreign player and they where blocked as well so instead they are going for Dom Ryan as they have to look at potential players in the Irish system.....