Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread VI: End of the MOC [Revenge of the STH]

CatFromHue

Hard to know as wasn't he very strongly linked to foreign clubs the last time his contract was up?

Though, and I haven't looked at the Wasps squad, but he could be on a very big money foreign marquee contract possibly with them.

Wasps are a bit light on TH props too.

former total

What the fnck is going on? That's a disaster and a serious balls up by Leinster and/or IRFU.

corny

Zzippy wrote: »

That's not good if we can't hold on to young international players coming into their prime. What would be the problem with offering a 24yo a 3 year contract?

The article states that as the reason but i'd be more inclined to believe its a higher wage catching his eye.

shuffol

For him to leave Leinster is bad but for him to be allowed leave the country is a disaster. He'd massively improve Munster or Ulster.

Should Leinster have been more forward looking at prop, Ross still has a lot to offer but having Moore leave seriously weakens the pack long term. I thought an ideal situation last season would've been for Ross to move down to Munster for a year to help out Archer/Ryan, let Moore and Furlong duke it out for Leinster, that would've really helped Munster and Ireland plus had a limited impact on Leinster.

It's also not like there's potential coming through the academy, Leinster waited a long time for somebody of the quality of Moore and Furlong to come along. Heffernan is the only TH in there now but based on his scrummaging performances for Ireland u-20s you wouldn't hold out much hope for him.

molloyjh

If Moore leaves how will that impact his international position? Seems like a very odd move tbh. With Ross still there and Furlong coming through it may well have an impact on his game time with Ireland. I really hope he's just fishing for a better deal.

aimee1

molloyjh wrote: »

If Moore leaves how will that impact his international position? Seems like a very odd move tbh. With Ross still there and Furlong coming through it may well have an impact on his game time with Ireland. I really hope he's just fishing for a better deal.

Ross signed until end of next season? How likely will he be to get another offer from leinster if he wishes to carry on playing. I hope moore is just fishing for a longer/better deal. Cant sign NIQs ad lib so must keep these guys at the provinces

errlloyd

Moore leaving Leinster isn't actually so bad. It's pretty ridiculous to have three top lads. I think Furlong is really good. But I really think he could be beneficial elsewhere in Ireland. I hope it's just a money grab.

Selliott190

Finally develop some homegrown tightheads and then fail to keep them.. of course

awec

Why are Leinster rumoured to be offering Ross a new deal? What is the point in that.

Let Ross go, give Moore the three years.

.ak

Could be the 2 year vs 3 year thing. For me tho I don't think he has the correct injury profile to offer a 3 year contract, however you'd imagine in this case he'd be offered an 11th hour deal.

I might be alone here but I think Moore has regressed. He's woefully unfit and has very little impact around the field, I think he's struggled to get back into it after injury. For me Furlong is the better player but as always I hate throwing a young, inexperienced prop into the deep end.

Journeyman_1

.ak wrote: »

Could be the 2 year vs 3 year thing. For me tho I don't think he has the correct injury profile to offer a 3 year contract, however you'd imagine in this case he'd be offered an 11th hour deal.

I might be alone here but I think Moore has regressed. He's woefully unfit and has very little impact around the field, I think he's struggled to get back into it after injury. For me Furlong is the better player but as always I hate throwing a young, inexperienced prop into the deep end.

I think you're underestimating Moore there. He looks unfit sure but he pops up at breakdowns all the time and is excellent over the ball. Seems to win 1/2 turnovers a game. That alone and scrummaging are enough for a decent TH imo.

molloyjh

Journeyman_1 wrote: »

I think you're underestimating Moore there. He looks unfit sure but he pops up at breakdowns all the time and is excellent over the ball. Seems to win 1/2 turnovers a game. That alone and scrummaging are enough for a decent TH imo.

I'd agree with this. Maybe the emergence of Furlong has made him seem worse than he is too given how athletic Furlong is for a roundy. Overall Furlong is probably the better prospect and maybe that's why Marty is looking to leave? He sees himself playing second fiddle to Ross and then second fiddle to Furlong after that? That said I think we should be looking to share starts like we used to at LH with Healy and VDM.

ClanofLams

awec wrote: »

Why are Leinster rumoured to be offering Ross a new deal? What is the point in that.

Let Ross go, give Moore the three years.

Doubt the length is the deciding factor, agent is just leaking that because it reads better than saying he would be on 50% more or whatever at Wasps.

errlloyd

Much of this is the product of a short term currency advantage in England. (I hope). That goes for both Irish players going to England and Welsh players coming home from France.

If we want to hold on to our players we need to collapse the sterling. I propose undermining confidence then short selling the Bank of England. Who's in?

Rigor Mortis

The real culprit in all of this is of course Jimmy Gopperth. He has clearly lured Marty to Wasps. Will his malevolent influence never end

El_Duderino 09

.ak wrote:

I might be alone here but I think Moore has regressed. He's woefully unfit and has very little impact around the field, I think he's struggled to get back into it after injury. For me Furlong is the better player but as always I hate throwing a young, inexperienced prop into the deep end.

Jack McGrath was thrown in at the deep end last year when healy was injured. He was busted in a good few of the games at the start of the season but it worked out great. It took half a season before he was winning more than he was losing. He never would have got that chance if healy wasn't injured.

For the same reason, it might be time to say thanks very much to Ross and give the younger lads a chance to fail and learn their trade. Ross is still class in the set piece but his work rate around the pitch is about right for his age.

Give youth a chance?

.ak

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Jack McGrath was thrown in at the deep end last year when healy was injured. He was busted in a good few of the games at the start of the season but it worked out great. It took half a season before he was winning more than he was losing. He never would have got that chance if healy wasn't injured.

For the same reason, it might be time to say thanks very much to Ross and give the younger lads a chance to fail and learn their trade. Ross is still class in the set piece but his work rate around the pitch is about right for his age.

Give youth a chance?

In all for giving youth a chance, but prop, particularly tight head, is a position that can break you if you go up against good opposition. Jack McGrath is a great example actually, people will remember the horror show he had at TH against the Ospreys, he took a massive step back after that game and we didn't see him shine for quite some time after that.

vienne86

Woke up to this news about Moore. Pheck it anyway. Really surprised. I suppose it's the money, but it is awful if he leaves Ireland. He's a fantastic player, but has had injury problems. I would have expected him to get an Ireland contract.

El_Duderino 09

Fair point on the difference between TH and LH. I'll take your word for it that the ospreys game set him back but the point is that when you give them a good chance (a full season in McGrath's case) they can afford to have a bad month, if they learn from at like McGrath clearly did.

It might be the case that McGrath realised he was weak in an area which needed to be readjusted e.g. strength in a particular area or technique which needed to be changed. In either if those cases, it would take at least a month of disimprovement before you would see any real improvement.

If you try McGrath for a month and he gets busted against the Ospreys and has a poor few matches afterwards, you can say it was a failure and the ospreys game broke him. If you try him for a season and he has the dip after ospreys followed by a resurgence later in the season, you could say the ospreys game made him. It just depends on how long a peroid you judge him.

LostArt

Awful news if it's true. It's very disappointing that he's not willing to stay and back himself to be our and Ireland's number 1 next season.

Podge_irl

I'd take three years of Moore over one year of Ross any day.

We don't obviously know exactly the reasoning behind all this but you need at least 4 very strong props to compete these days. Furlong will step up I'm sure but with Ross not getting any younger we could be in a ropey enough position next year.

molloyjh

This could all be contract wrangling and Marty might well have designs on the starting TH position. That said we also don't know what is going on in his personal life either and there may be motivating factors there that we aren't aware of.

former total

What I'm most outraged about is the fact that the other provinces have no-one we can poach to replace him.

It's not good enough.

molloyjh

former total wrote: »

What I'm most outraged about is the fact that the other provinces have no-one we can poach to replace him.

It's not good enough.

Maybe we should get White back from Connacht. It's only fair after all...

Sangre

Would be very disappointing to lose such a homegrown front row talent like that. Lets hope it doesn't happen.

As we saw last time, Moore seems to play his cards right at the negotiating table. Hopefully this is a bargaining tool.

Timothy Bryce

I'd have both feet in the .ak camp on Moore. I believe he's regressed a huge amount since his recent spell on the sideline. He's also about 2-3 stone overweight and is fairly sluggish around the park.

For me Furlong is a better scrummager, a solid ball carrier (7 carries vs Ospreys) and generally quicker around the park. I'd take that over Moore's main plus point; his prowess in the jackal.

Couple of seasons at Wasps could see them make Moore properly fit too.

Sangre

Timothy Bryce wrote: »

I'd have both feet in the .ak camp on Moore. I believe he's regressed a huge amount since his recent spell on the sideline. He's also about 2-3 stone overweight and is fairly sluggish around the park.

For me Furlong is a better scrummager, a solid ball carrier (7 carries vs Ospreys) and generally quicker around the park. I'd take that over Moore's main plus point; his prowess in the jackal.

Couple of seasons at Wasps could see them make Moore properly fit too.

Thats a moot point though. We need at least two quality THs and Ross is 36 and fading.

aimee1

.ak wrote: »

Could be the 2 year vs 3 year thing. For me tho I don't think he has the correct injury profile to offer a 3 year contract, however you'd imagine in this case he'd be offered an 11th hour deal.

I might be alone here but I think Moore has regressed. He's woefully unfit and has very little impact around the field, I think he's struggled to get back into it after injury. For me Furlong is the better player but as always I hate throwing a young, inexperienced prop into the deep end.

Moore has regressed slightly but look at Healy. Injuries meant Moore has missed chunks of two pre-seasons IIRC which are a killer.

former total

Might also be relevant to note that Wasps can't offer Moore the sort of sweetheart deal that Sexton got at Racing; he'd be released for the official international windows and nothing more.

Utah_Saint

would have happily took Moore up in Ulster. Would have freed up a NIQ spot too.