Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread VI: End of the MOC [Revenge of the STH]

molloyjh

thomond2006 wrote: »

Guess who said this...

Tony can go f**k himself at this stage. This bs crusade of his is getting out of hand. All you need to do is look at the responses to Mads tweet yesterday about the game to see the support he's been shown. And the vast, vast majority the comments I've heard and read about Sunday have been ones of pride in a side who fronted up really well. Ward has no interest in acknowledging that. It just doesn't suit.

vienne86

I used to think Ward was very sound, but this is poor from him. Ward OUT!

total former

thomond2006 wrote: »

Guess who said this...

He's phrased it badly, the "new age fans" bit will get everyone riled up, I've been going to Leinster matches since 1874 blah, blah, but the essence of what he's saying is correct; the majority of Leinster fans on here want rid of the coach(es), not sure about the Rob Kearney bit though. Go over to LF.com and it's even worse, go on to Twitter or Facebook and there's an absolute sh*tstorm of nutters calling for a clearout.

So yeah, people will get bent out of shape about the way he's phrased it, "who is Tony Ward to tell me I'm not a real fan" etc, but the basic point is correct.

Or do people here now feel MOC has earned another season?

Buer

LF has been overrun by a lot of cretins for some time now many of whom only began posting regularly in the past year. Some of the bile posted there was completely over the top in recent weeks. It's notable that a lot of the really good posters from the last decade are rarely seen contributing at this stage.

MOC will be here next season. If there was any doubt about it, that was removed on Sunday. He'll be given the full duration of his contract with Sexton to see if he can rebuild the back line.

total former

total former wrote: »

Or do people here now feel MOC has earned another season?

If anything Sunday showed what the team is capable of yet has failed to do all season.

Honestly, I don't like the idea of dropping a coach mid contract, but if Leinster had someone in mind that they liked the look of I'd not be disappointed to see M'OC go and I think whilst the interruptions to our season from injury and international duty is partially to blame, I actually think O'Connor unfortunately just isn't a fit for Leinster.

I wouldn't be surprised to see him go on and do well elsewhere, but the team has regressed in too many areas of the game and if key players are missing our performances fall off a cliff.

Just to verify my qualification to make this statement:
I first attended a Leinster game in 1995.
I do not get up repeatedly during play to use the facilities
I am in my seat for kick off
I sing the national anthem at least 75% as loud as Peter O'Mahony
I am not yet banned on twitter by Steven Jones but am working on it

thomond2006

molloyjh wrote: »

Tony can go f**k himself at this stage. This bs crusade of his is getting out of hand. All you need to do is look at the responses to Mads tweet yesterday about the game to see the support he's been shown. And the vast, vast majority the comments I've heard and read about Sunday have been ones of pride in a side who fronted up really well. Ward has no interest in acknowledging that. It just doesn't suit.

Social media and online fora are making people like him irrelevant. He's butthurt.

molloyjh

total former wrote: »

He's phrased it badly, the "new age fans" bit will get everyone riled up, I've been going to Leinster matches since 1874 blah, blah, but the essence of what he's saying is correct; the majority of Leinster fans on here want rid of the coach(es), not sure about the Rob Kearney bit though. Go over to LF.com and it's even worse, go on to Twitter or Facebook and there's an absolute sh*tstorm of nutters calling for a clearout.

So yeah, people will get bent out of shape about the way he's phrased it, "who is Tony Ward to tell me I'm not a real fan" etc, but the basic point is correct.

Or do people here now feel MOC has earned another season?

People are allowed to call for a coaches head without being called out as being self-righteous or without the type of sneering condescension we're seeing from the likes of Ward. He has been constructing a nice little straw man for some time now, talking about Leinster fans being spoilt, about them wanting trophies every year and about them only wanting champagne rugby. Is that reflective of what people like me have been saying?

No f-ing way is it in any way reflective of me or my opinion. He sets up this straw man and then uses it to beat anyone who dare have anything but complimentary things to say about the Leinster set-up. Then he waffles on about people wanting Madigan and Kearney out, which you have to admit is just total BS.

Are there people who fit the description he's presenting? Of course they are. Are they the majority or the minority? I'd suggest they are the minority. Most importantly there is a absolutely no acknowledgement from the guy that there are genuine fans with genuine reasons for being unhappy.

I will not apologise for my stance on MOC. I took my time coming to the conclusion I did and I feel I can back up my position with a reasonably logical argument. Tony would have me lumped in with the extreme end of the spectrum though and would not acknowledge that I may have a point. He'd rather I just shut up and went away.

Couple that with the ridiculous Billy Keane article from Saturday and I've decided the Indo is simply a media outlet to be avoided at all costs. A Munster man giving out that Leinster fans don't sing more Leinster songs and somehow thinks that Munster fans (who sing a Connacht song and a Broadway musical) are better.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/billy-keane/billy-keane-leinster-fans-on-tour-arent-half-as-much-sport-as-the-munster-supporters-31152317.html

thomond2006

molloyjh wrote: »

People are allowed to call for a coaches head without being called out as being self-righteous or without the type of sneering condescension we're seeing from the likes of Ward. He has been constructing a nice little straw man for some time now, talking about Leinster fans being spoilt, about them wanting trophies every year and about them only wanting champagne rugby. Is that reflective of what people like me have been saying?

No f-ing way is it in any way reflective of me or my opinion. He sets up this straw man and then uses it to beat anyone who dare have anything but complimentary things to say about the Leinster set-up. Then he waffles on about people wanting Madigan and Kearney out, which you have to admit is just total BS.

Are there people who fit the description he's presenting? Of course they are. Are they the majority or the minority? I'd suggest they are the minority. Most importantly there is a absolutely no acknowledgement from the guy that there are genuine fans with genuine reasons for being unhappy.

I will not apologise for my stance on MOC. I took my time coming to the conclusion I did and I feel I can back up my position with a reasonably logical argument. Tony would have me lumped in with the extreme end of the spectrum though and would not acknowledge that I may have a point. He'd rather I just shut up and went away.

Couple that with the ridiculous Billy Keane article from Saturday and I've decided the Indo is simply a media outlet to be avoided at all costs. A Munster man giving out that Leinster fans don't sing more Leinster songs and somehow thinks that Munster fans (who sing a Connacht song and a Broadway musical) are better.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/billy-keane/billy-keane-leinster-fans-on-tour-arent-half-as-much-sport-as-the-munster-supporters-31152317.html

Billy Keane is Billy Keane though. You know what you get with him.

Tony Ward is a former international player. I'd like to think someone like him can present and articulate an insight that a lay person like me wouldn't see. Instead he throws in passive aggressive barbs at the people who instead he should be trying to educate with his knowledge and experience of the sport.

And hey if you want to make a statement with the Indo, take the free one you get with the Leinster match programme and rip it up on camera a la Toulon!

total former

molloyjh wrote: »

People are allowed to call for a coaches head without being called out as being self-righteous or without the type of sneering condescension we're seeing from the likes of Ward. He has been constructing a nice little straw man for some time now, talking about Leinster fans being spoilt, about them wanting trophies every year and about them only wanting champagne rugby. Is that reflective of what people like me have been saying?

No f-ing way is it in any way reflective of me or my opinion. He sets up this straw man and then uses it to beat anyone who dare have anything but complimentary things to say about the Leinster set-up. Then he waffles on about people wanting Madigan and Kearney out, which you have to admit is just total BS.

Are there people who fit the description he's presenting? Of course they are. Are they the majority or the minority? I'd suggest they are the minority. Most importantly there is a absolutely no acknowledgement from the guy that there are genuine fans with genuine reasons for being unhappy.

I will not apologise for my stance on MOC. I took my time coming to the conclusion I did and I feel I can back up my position with a reasonably logical argument. Tony would have me lumped in with the extreme end of the spectrum though and would not acknowledge that I may have a point. He'd rather I just shut up and went away.

Couple that with the ridiculous Billy Keane article from Saturday and I've decided the Indo is simply a media outlet to be avoided at all costs. A Munster man giving out that Leinster fans don't sing more Leinster songs and somehow thinks that Munster fans (who sing a Connacht song and a Broadway musical) are better.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/billy-keane/billy-keane-leinster-fans-on-tour-arent-half-as-much-sport-as-the-munster-supporters-31152317.html

With the greatest respect there molloyjh, you're lumping yourself in with them by taking offence at Tony's articles. You're a very reasonable poster on a well-moderated forum and I don't think anyone would have too much issue with the sort of contributions you make here. If all the criticism of MOC was as measured, then I don't think Tony would have an issue; the problem is that it is not. You're taking offence at something that is not aimed at you. There are plenty of posters on boards.ie to whom it would apply, however, no need to name names but they are here.

I presume you're the same molloyjh that posts on LF.com? The level of criticism aimed at MOC on that forum is waaay beyond what goes on here, and then there's Twitter and the rest. The frankly mental level of criticism that Tony is talking about does exist, so I don't think it is a strawman. Are there more moderate views? Yes, of course there are, lots of them, but it's like anything, they tend to get drowned out by the wailing of the lunatics.

I'd respond to your comments on Billy Keane but giving you my opinion on Keane would violate multiple aspects of the forum charter so I'd better not.

Teferi

total former wrote: »

Or do people here now feel MOC has earned another season?

What exactly has changed since Sunday? If anything that game shows why we need a change in the coaching setup. If we even played half as well as we did on Sunday all season we wouldn't be finishing up our season in April.

One decent performance every 6 months isn't good enough.

total former

Teferi wrote: »

What exactly has changed since Sunday? If anything that game shows why we need a change in the coaching setup. If we even played half as well as we did on Sunday all season we wouldn't be finishing up our season in April.

One decent performance every 6 months isn't good enough.

No, I don't think Sunday has changed anything at all, but the significance of Sunday depends on how you want to view it.

Perspective 1: "Sunday showed us what this group of players are capable of and if only we had a good coach we could do it more often."

Perspective 2: "Sunday showed us what this coach is capable of when he gets a reasonable bit of continuity with his players."

You can make a solid argument for either one really.

molloyjh

total former wrote: »

With the greatest respect there molloyjh, you're lumping yourself in with them by taking offence at Tony's articles. You're a very reasonable poster on a well-moderated forum and I don't think anyone would have too much issue with the sort of contributions you make here. If all the criticism of MOC was as measured, then I don't think Tony would have an issue; the problem is that it is not. You're taking offence at something that is not aimed at you. There are plenty of posters on boards.ie to whom it would apply, however, no need to name names but they are here.

I presume you're the same molloyjh that posts on LF.com? The level of criticism aimed at MOC on that forum is waaay beyond what goes on here, and then there's Twitter and the rest. The frankly mental level of criticism that Tony is talking about does exist, so I don't think it is a strawman. Are there more moderate views? Yes, of course there are, lots of them, but it's like anything, they tend to get drowned out by the wailing of the lunatics.

I'd respond to your comments on Billy Keane but giving you my opinion on Keane would violate multiple aspects of the forum charter so I'd better not.

Yeah maybe I am lumping myself in with the ones he's directing that article to. But it really wouldn't kill the guy to stick in a line saying that there are those with legitimate grievances. He did follow up his last "ungrateful whingers" article with one that was pretty critical of Leinsters current set-up. I know there's almost no chance of him (or anyone in the Indo) reading the comments section, but after his last piece I posted a comment to try and flag that more reasonable elements exist. It's very frustrating that the reasonable elements get ignored while the extreme elements get the attention.

These articles gives a voice to those loud and vociferous sections when they are exactly the ones that should be ignored. If you think someone is just talking total nonsense then don't give them the time or attention, simple as. You'll notice I rarely engage with them here or on LF (yep that's the same me) regardless of their position on MOC or whatever else. There is literally nothing to be gained from that. As thomond said he could be constructive and educational in his comments, not demeaning and belittling.

Teferi wrote: »

What exactly has changed since Sunday? If anything that game shows why we need a change in the coaching setup. If we even played half as well as we did on Sunday all season we wouldn't be finishing up our season in April.

One decent performance every 6 months isn't good enough.

We played a very limited game on Sunday and despite my belief last week that we should look to run them around it was the right game plan. Credit where it is due etc.

However as I also said before the game we were always going to be better than we had been all season purely based on the squad we had out. We were always going to be more competitive than many believed. We were more competitive than I expected in the end. I thought we'd be right on their heels for 60 minutes and after that we'd start to fall away a little. That didn't happen. How much of that was us and how much of it was their poor form I don't know though. And let's be honest here, Toulon weren't great.

My issue is that without a full strength side we struggle. And we have yet to display an attacking game capable of taking on good sides this season regardless of who we have on the field. These issues aren't solely the fault of the coach, but he has a very large hand in them and I feel he could be doing more. We have always missed players to international duty, and almost all of them our best players. Never as many as now but it's always been a factor. It's crucial to our performance over a season for the coach to be able to get the best out of the entire squad, not just the best 20-25 players. This is where we have failed badly this season. Sundays display changes nothing in that regard. If anything it drives that point home.

dub_skav

Tony mentions it briefly, but it is something that I mentioned during the match in the pub. What is the point of replacing MOC now? The new coach would have little access to his players and have one of the most disrupted seasons possible, he would also have little ability to sign decent players, all tied up until after WC.
That coach would be getting set up to fail.

In keeping MOC for one more year we get to see if maybe he was harshly judged, while seeing out his contract.
With Sexton and Nacewa adding to the current players I do not believe there will be an implosion, MOC will at least keep a steady ship.

If his contract is not renewed then the new coach gets to sign post WC players and has a proper pre-season.

fitz

total former wrote: »

No, I don't think Sunday has changed anything at all, but the significance of Sunday depends on how you want to view it.

Perspective 1: "Sunday showed us what this group of players are capable of and if only we had a good coach we could do it more often."

Perspective 2: "Sunday showed us what this coach is capable of when he gets a reasonable bit of continuity with his players."

You can make a solid argument for either one really.

I'm squarely in the Perspective 1 group.
It's been nearly 2 years, the continuity argument can only be stretched so far.

It's been two seasons of performances that are not getting the most out of the squad, with a few anomalous games along the way where we've seen what the players are capable of. I certainly don't expect silverware every year, but I think an effective coach should be making the team play better than the sum of their parts. In my view, MOC hasn't managed that. I also think he's done a poor job of keeping the skills levels we had under Joe.

I think his manner doesn't help with the fans either.
He's contrary, and sometimes outright class-less in his comments.
I'd trust the players when they say he's a really likable bloke, but he really hasn't come across that way in the media.

Would I prefer someone else in charge? Yeah, am I going to stop supporting Leinster over it? No. Ward's comments are patronising in the extreme.
Someone asked why he isn't offering insight as a former international....I wouldn't really expect much insight into the modern professional game from him tbh, it's moved well on from his time.

P_1

In my eyes some posters would be the equivalent of a tabloid and others would be a broadsheet.

What Ward is doing is essentially saying that all newspapers are like the National Enquirer.

Lazy journalism if you ask me.

Eponymous

molloyjh wrote: »

People are allowed to call for a coaches head without being called out as being self-righteous or without the type of sneering condescension we're seeing from the likes of Ward. He has been constructing a nice little straw man for some time now, talking about Leinster fans being spoilt, about them wanting trophies every year and about them only wanting champagne rugby. Is that reflective of what people like me have been saying?

No f-ing way is it in any way reflective of me or my opinion. He sets up this straw man and then uses it to beat anyone who dare have anything but complimentary things to say about the Leinster set-up. Then he waffles on about people wanting Madigan and Kearney out, which you have to admit is just total BS.

Are there people who fit the description he's presenting? Of course they are. Are they the majority or the minority? I'd suggest they are the minority. Most importantly there is a absolutely no acknowledgement from the guy that there are genuine fans with genuine reasons for being unhappy.

I will not apologise for my stance on MOC. I took my time coming to the conclusion I did and I feel I can back up my position with a reasonably logical argument. Tony would have me lumped in with the extreme end of the spectrum though and would not acknowledge that I may have a point. He'd rather I just shut up and went away.

Couple that with the ridiculous Billy Keane article from Saturday and I've decided the Indo is simply a media outlet to be avoided at all costs. A Munster man giving out that Leinster fans don't sing more Leinster songs and somehow thinks that Munster fans (who sing a Connacht song and a Broadway musical) are better.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/billy-keane/billy-keane-leinster-fans-on-tour-arent-half-as-much-sport-as-the-munster-supporters-31152317.html

Written by a Leinster man.

shuffol

Is Sunday not a bit reminiscent of those passion play performances that we'd get every 6 months or so with Ireland under Kidney, the players get questioned to such an extent that there's an inevitable backlash coupled with our opposition not paying us enough respect which Habana's comments after the game would suggest. I've not really being impressed with any part of MOC's tenure so far and Sunday doesn't really change that. We've a superb pack of forwards, 7 of which started a game for the best team in the 6N, that's all Sunday confirmed for me.

jacothelad

For those in the MOC must go camp, will they still feel the same if Leinster win the pro 12? If they play that way on Friday I doubt if Ulster have the fortward power to do enoufgh to release the backs so a Leinster win then a further 10 points against two crap sides .......

If Leinster get to the K.O. stage why shouldn't they win it? Now that injuries are receding a bit...McF is very unlucky... and the team are able to get continuity they are still formidable. Basically a team fielding the forwards that won the 6Ns allied to 6 or 7 of the backs that did so should now be in a position to move on from the loss of great players.

Eponymous

P_1 wrote: »

In my eyes some posters would be the equivalent of a tabloid and others would be a broadsheet.

What Ward is doing is essentially saying that all newspapers are like the National Enquirer.

Lazy journalism if you ask me.

Shame about the charter saying we can't abuse hacks. They seem to like dishing it out. Well, Ward anyway, the self-righteous appendage that he is.

Eponymous

jacothelad wrote: »

For those in the MOC must go camp, will they still feel the same if Leinster win the pro 12? If they play that way on Friday I doubt if Ulster have the fortward power to do enoufgh to release the backs so a Leinster win then a further 10 points against two crap sides .......

If Leinster get to the K.O. stage why shouldn't they win it? Now that injuries are receding a bit...McF is very unlucky... and the team are able to get continuity they are still formidable. Basically a team fielding the forwards that won the 6Ns allied to 6 or 7 of the backs that did so should now be in a position to move on from the loss of great players.

Because, IF we make the playoffs, it's because of other results working in our favour. It's entirely plausible we win all our remaining matches and not qualify.

A squad with our quality shouldn't be relying on Cardiff or the likes doing us a "favour".

Sunday's performance (IMHO) was about heart and courage and little do to with structured attacks. Some of the same issues were still there, static ball carriers etc... I think all Sunday has done is give us something to cheer about in that we put in a solid 100 minutes against the one of the best sides in Europe. Someone else referred to it as papering over the cracks. I think that's about right.

jacothelad

Eponymous wrote: »

Because, IF we make the playoffs, it's because of other results working in our favour. It's entirely plausible we win all our remaining matches and not qualify.

A squad with our quality shouldn't be relying on Cardiff or the likes doing us a "favour".

Sunday's performance (IMHO) was about heart and courage and little do to with structured attacks. Some of the same issues were still there, static ball carriers etc... I think all Sunday has done is give us something to cheer about in that we put in a solid 100 minutes against the one of the best sides in Europe. Someone else referred to it as papering over the cracks. I think that's about right.

If that's the case, the paper is amazingly think imo.

Rigor Mortis

Eponymous wrote: »

Because, IF we make the playoffs, it's because of other results working in our favour. It's entirely plausible we win all our remaining matches and not qualify.

A squad with our quality shouldn't be relying on Cardiff or the likes doing us a "favour".

In fairness while i think we should be topping the league, this doing favours argument doesn't stack up. EG Ulster have to play Leinster, Munster and Glasgow. They had easier games to this point and are ahead. By the end of these games they may be behind. A league is structured that way and while its annoying that we are not guaranteed to qualify if we win the last 3 and that we are competing for 4th and not 1st, you judge the season on where you are at the end of all games.

jacothelad

jacothelad wrote: »

For those in the MOC must go camp, will they still feel the same if Leinster win the pro 12? If they play that way on Friday I doubt if Ulster have the fortward power to do enoufgh to release the backs so a Leinster win then a further 10 points against two crap sides .......

If Leinster get to the K.O. stage why shouldn't they win it? Now that injuries are receding a bit...McF is very unlucky... and the team are able to get continuity they are still formidable. Basically a team fielding the forwards that won the 6Ns allied to 6 or 7 of the backs that did so should now be in a position to move on from the loss of great players.

Yeah I'd love to be wrong about MO'C and for him to turn out to be the second coming of Joe Cheika but even if we close out the rest of our season well we're relying on other results so it may be for nothing.

If MO'C wins the pro12 this season then you would have to say that the disruption all year was the driving factor and give the guy a bit of slack. But those are all big big If's and it doesn't take away from the huge number of performances where despite having a strong team sheet, we have been pretty awful.

jacothelad wrote: »

10 points against two crap sides .......

We have repeatedly failed to take points in these scenario's all season.

CIARAN_BOYLE

jacothelad wrote: »

For those in the MOC must go camp, will they still feel the same if Leinster win the pro 12? If they play that way on Friday I doubt if Ulster have the fortward power to do enoufgh to release the backs so a Leinster win then a further 10 points against two crap sides .......

If Leinster get to the K.O. stage why shouldn't they win it? Now that injuries are receding a bit...McF is very unlucky... and the team are able to get continuity they are still formidable. Basically a team fielding the forwards that won the 6Ns allied to 6 or 7 of the backs that did so should now be in a position to move on from the loss of great players.

It depends. if leinster play the way they did on Sunday for the every game in the rest of the league then sure I'd give MOC another season but the problem is that we know he has the players and good players will occasionally pull a good performance it has to be consistent though for us to give MOC our support

.ak

jacothelad wrote: »

For those in the MOC must go camp, will they still feel the same if Leinster win the pro 12? If they play that way on Friday I doubt if Ulster have the fortward power to do enoufgh to release the backs so a Leinster win then a further 10 points against two crap sides .......

If Leinster get to the K.O. stage why shouldn't they win it? Now that injuries are receding a bit...McF is very unlucky... and the team are able to get continuity they are still formidable. Basically a team fielding the forwards that won the 6Ns allied to 6 or 7 of the backs that did so should now be in a position to move on from the loss of great players.

I'd be happy enough he sees out his contract tbh. We're in a difficult area right now and my feeling is changing the coach now will compound that. Does that mean I absolve MOC of his responsibilities and failings? No. It just means I think there's a lot more issues at leinster than the coach.

I think getting sexton back will make a huge difference - all joking aside of sexton makes the difference I think he will then MOC could be in for an extension at the end of next season.

molloyjh

jacothelad wrote: »

For those in the MOC must go camp, will they still feel the same if Leinster win the pro 12? If they play that way on Friday I doubt if Ulster have the fortward power to do enoufgh to release the backs so a Leinster win then a further 10 points against two crap sides .......

If Leinster get to the K.O. stage why shouldn't they win it? Now that injuries are receding a bit...McF is very unlucky... and the team are able to get continuity they are still formidable. Basically a team fielding the forwards that won the 6Ns allied to 6 or 7 of the backs that did so should now be in a position to move on from the loss of great players.

That's an interesting question. As I said earlier for me the biggest failing is our inability to get the best out of our entire squad rather than just our first string team. If we win the Pro12 we'll probably do so with the first string team.

That said if we are convincing from here on out then I'd be open to changing my opinion on the coaching set-up, or at least hoping that they can deliver next season.

The big problem with this is the "if". We saw this over the last two weeks in places. "If" we win in Toulon and "if" we win the Champions Cup. The guys can hold their heads up after Sunday, but they didn't win. And they are in for a tough one on Friday against a side starting to find form and who had a rest week building into it. Leinster will need to field as close to full strength as they can and after those 100 minutes on Sunday it's going to be hard on the bodies. "If" we win our remaining games though we still need other results to go our way, as Eponymous said. I found it unlikely that we'd beat Toulon on Sunday, much less win the Champions Cup. I find it similarly unlikely that we'll make the play-offs, let alone win the Pro12. And over the course of the season we simply can't say we deserve to either.

P_1

jacothelad wrote: »

For those in the MOC must go camp, will they still feel the same if Leinster win the pro 12? If they play that way on Friday I doubt if Ulster have the fortward power to do enoufgh to release the backs so a Leinster win then a further 10 points against two crap sides .......

If Leinster get to the K.O. stage why shouldn't they win it? Now that injuries are receding a bit...McF is very unlucky... and the team are able to get continuity they are still formidable. Basically a team fielding the forwards that won the 6Ns allied to 6 or 7 of the backs that did so should now be in a position to move on from the loss of great players.

We're too far into things at the moment really to have a new coach coming in do anything more than cause further confusion and poor performances. Plus having a season with the job (and perhaps future ones) on the line is a great motivator for a coach.

molloyjh

.ak wrote: »

I'd be happy enough he sees put his contract tbh. We're in a difficult area right now and my feeling is changing the coach now will compound that. Does that mean I absolve MOC of his responsibilities and failings? No. It just means I think there's a lot more issues at leinster than the coach.

I think getting sexton back will make a huge difference - all joking aside of sexton makes the difference I think he will then MOC could be in for an extension at the end of next season.

Sexton won't be here for around half of the season. And he'll only be back in the door and he'll be playing in Europe. I think there's way to much reliance on Sexton coming back and making everything ok. He won't help our league season, which is where most of our issues have been this season. He won't enable us to suddenly get the most out of the wider squad either, which has been another key failing. Isa may have some impacts here but he's 2 years out of the game and will be another reason why a young Academy back won't get a shot to step up. If you're not enabling your younger players or your wider squad and if there is a clear distinction between first string, second string and Academy then the squad as a whole won't function as well.

I can see no way that MOCs contract will be extended unless he can the most out of our entire squad. Fail to do this and we'll have another poor showing in the league and that will be that.

P_1

molloyjh wrote: »

Sexton won't be here for around half of the season. And he'll only be back in the door and he'll be playing in Europe. I think there's way to much reliance on Sexton coming back and making everything ok. He won't help our league season, which is where most of our issues have been this season. He won't enable us to suddenly get the most out of the wider squad either, which has been another key failing. Isa may have some impacts here but he's 2 years out of the game and will be another reason why a young Academy back won't get a shot to step up. If you're not enabling your younger players or your wider squad and if there is a clear distinction between first string, second string and Academy then the squad as a whole won't function as well.

I can see no way that MOCs contract will be extended unless he can the most out of our entire squad. Fail to do this and we'll have another poor showing in the league and that will be that.

THB I can't see him getting an extension unless something truly magical happens next season.

Killser

Gotta agree - it's the lack of development of the squad as a whole that's dissappointing. Case in point is options at scrum-half, but there are several others; must be disheartening to be an academy player and not getting much of a look-in to the senior team on a consistent basis - 5/10 minutes here and there is no use. Need to have healthy competition for places!