Mart Price Tracker

charolais0153

Bass Reeves wrote: »

You buy 15-18 middling FR stores for the price of her, they double there money in 12 months and you could go again

It's 1 cow, a huge outlier, raises profile if both their sales, lads up and down the country sent doing it

charolais0153

https://youtu.be/tbZTr8_JJFQ
A normal suckle operation

richie123

No disrespect to suckler men here.
When we were in suckling what used to wredk my head was ..you'd buy a bunch of replacement s..you'd put them with the bull 9 months later (if they're all incalf)you might get a few calves ...hope said calves don't die from scour or pnuemonia! Keep that calf for two years and hope it stays alive.then sell ..honestly is there any other buisness out there that waits so long for such a poor return.

Bass Reeves

richie123 wrote: »

No disrespect to suckler men here.
When we were in suckling what used to wredk my head was ..you'd buy a bunch of replacement s..you'd put them with the bull 9 months later (if they're all incalf)you might get a few calves ...hope said calves don't die from scour or pnuemonia! Keep that calf for two years and hope it stays alive.then sell ..honestly is there any other buisness out there that waits so long for such a poor return.

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/beef-focus-saying-goodbye-to-suckler-farming-after-25-years/

You can see the continual drain of Suckler farmers exiting it at present. That is why it hard to understand the high prices for Suckler cows and replacements on the last few pages.

The farmers above was averaging 1K and over for his calves as well as the 180/ head in subsidies and he still is planning on exiting. They were at the top of the game technically and the switch over to dairying should be within there grasp.

However I often wonder do these lads understand it milking cows 7 days a week for 45 weeks of the year and you are still tied to the place after that.

Ya while Pop's can give a hand or the kids are from maybe 16-23 then there is a bit if relief if you want a weekend away or to go to a match or races, buy only a bit of relief.

In a way I am happy all these are are heading dairying all the talk a few years ago was they would stay on the drystock side. They will continue to provide us with stores and cull cows admittedly a different type. These type of lads are going from producing 30-60 weanlings and a half dozen cull cows to 80 calves and 15-20 culls each year.

Grueller

Bass Reeves wrote: »

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/beef-focus-saying-goodbye-to-suckler-farming-after-25-years/

You can see the continual drain of Suckler farmers exiting it at present. That is why it hard to understand the high prices for Suckler cows and replacements on the last few pages.

The farmers above was averaging 1K and over for his calves as well as the 180/ head in subsidies and he still is planning on exiting. They were at the top of the game technically and the switch over to dairying should be within there grasp.

However I often wonder do these lads understand it milking cows 7 days a week for 45 weeks of the year and you are still tied to the place after that.

Ya while Pop's can give a hand or the kids are from maybe 16-23 then there is a bit if relief if you want a weekend away or to go to a match or races, buy only a bit of relief.

In a way I am happy all these are are heading dairying all the talk a few years ago was they would stay on the drystock side. They will continue to provide us with stores and cull cows admittedly a different type. These type of lads are going from producing 30-60 weanlings and a half dozen cull cows to 80 calves and 15-20 culls each year.

Bass, I am in my first year of dairying. I have stated here before that I am winding down the suckler herd but still have 45 of them at last count. This morning I have milked,scraped cubicles, buffered cows and let them to grass. That took 2 hours. I am in for tea now, but feeding sucklers, seeing 2 batches that are still out and general jobs attached to them took over an hour and a half. Dry stock would have required as much work.
Now whether I am dairy or dry stock I will go to the yard every day and spend a portion of the morning there. That leaves the evening. I have had 3 different local lads from 17-20 approach me looking to do relief milking. All from dairy farms and all good reliable lads. €40 would pay them. Taking every Sunday from 10 o clock on off all year will cost less than €2000. Put that through the books and for myself on the high tax bracket it is €1000 out of the paw.
I will also be dry for 7-8 weeks so the same young lads would do all Sundays work for that €40. Feed and clean cubicle beds being about it. That would leave me 8 Sundays off in a row all bar a 20 minute walkabout to put my own mind at ease.
I like your posts Bass because you have your figures spot on usually, but I do find your view on dairying is quite negative. I am not sure is that experience of it directly or from an outside perspective, but it does not have to be drudgery if facilities are up to and organisation are up to scratch.

richie123

Bass Reeves wrote: »

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/beef-focus-saying-goodbye-to-suckler-farming-after-25-years/

You can see the continual drain of Suckler farmers exiting it at present. That is why it hard to understand the high prices for Suckler cows and replacements on the last few pages.

The farmers above was averaging 1K and over for his calves as well as the 180/ head in subsidies and he still is planning on exiting. They were at the top of the game technically and the switch over to dairying should be within there grasp.

However I often wonder do these lads understand it milking cows 7 days a week for 45 weeks of the year and you are still tied to the place after that.

Ya while Pop's can give a hand or the kids are from maybe 16-23 then there is a bit if relief if you want a weekend away or to go to a match or races, buy only a bit of relief.

In a way I am happy all these are are heading dairying all the talk a few years ago was they would stay on the drystock side. They will continue to provide us with stores and cull cows admittedly a different type. These type of lads are going from producing 30-60 weanlings and a half dozen cull cows to 80 calves and 15-20 culls each year.

But you see my point?? Waiting 3 ****ing years for a return?? That's bolix.and we did for years to make it worse.
Your point about workload in dairying.just take on partime workers.there out there pay them well and don't begrudge paying them well.
That's the key to any buisness.
Delegation.
If the money's not there to do that then don't do it fullstop.
Grueller is spot on imo.

GNWoodd

Grueller wrote: »

Bass, I am in my first year of dairying. I have stated here before that I am winding down the suckler herd but still have 45 of them at last count. This morning I have milked,scraped cubicles, buffered cows and let them to grass. That took 2 hours. I am in for tea now, but feeding sucklers, seeing 2 batches that are still out and general jobs attached to them took over an hour and a half. Dry stock would have required as much work.
Now whether I am dairy or dry stock I will go to the yard every day and spend a portion of the morning there. That leaves the evening. I have had 3 different local lads from 17-20 approach me looking to do relief milking. All from dairy farms and all good reliable lads. €40 would pay them. Taking every Sunday from 10 o clock on off all year will cost less than €2000. Put that through the books and for myself on the high tax bracket it is €1000 out of the paw.
I will also be dry for 7-8 weeks so the same young lads would do all Sundays work for that €40. Feed and clean cubicle beds being about it. That would leave me 8 Sundays off in a row all bar a 20 minute walkabout to put my own mind at ease.
I like your posts Bass because you have your figures spot on usually, but I do find your view on dairying is quite negative. I am not sure is that experience of it directly or from an outside perspective, but it does not have to be drudgery if facilities are up to and organisation are up to scratch.

Forty Euros for how many hours work ?

Grueller

GNWoodd wrote: »

Forty Euros for how many hours work ?

Cows in and out and milked in 1.30- 2 hrs depending on the paddock

charolais0153

richie123 wrote: »

But you see my point?? Waiting 3 ****ing years for a return?? That's bolix.and we did for years to make it worse.
Your point about workload in dairying.just take on partime workers.there out there pay them well and don't begrudge paying them well.
That's the key to any buisness.
Delegation.
If the money's not there to do that then don't do it fullstop.
Grueller is spot on imo.

Where do you get the 3 years from

patsy_mccabe

richie123 wrote: »

But you see my point?? Waiting 3 ****ing years for a return?? That's bolix.and we did for years to make it worse.
Your point about workload in dairying.just take on partime workers.there out there pay them well and don't begrudge paying them well.
That's the key to any buisness.
Delegation.
If the money's not there to do that then don't do it fullstop.
Grueller is spot on imo.

You're looking at it completely wrong. It's the profit every year that counts.

On a suckler farm, every year you will sell culls cows. Lets say the average cow has 5 calves. That's a 20% replacement rate. Allowing for heifers that are not suitable for breeding, don't go in calf, are too wild, too narrow at the hips etc, you need about 25 heifers every year in a 100 cow herd. That means you need to breed 50% of your cows to a maternal type bull. I honestly think that's where most suckler guys go wrong. As most run a terminal type bull , they think they can go out every year and buy in heifers. The heifers are of unknown breeding, cost too much and at the end of the day, a big gamble.

Lady Haywire

I can't understand the farmers who buy in replacements all the time. Haven't bought in any here in many many years, it's just not worth it. No knowledge of the female line behind the heifer regarding calving ability or milk/temperament etc, never mind the TB risk of moving animals in.

In saying that I'm cadging Dad to let me have the 15 acres of fragmented land next year to do my own thing with it & I'd likely buy in heifers or cows with calves at foot to put incalf/sell on :pac:

sonnybill

tanko wrote: »

If she has a heifer calf, it might be sold for 5K in Carnaross in a year or two, you just never know:rolleyes:

Agreed.

richie123

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

You're looking at it completely wrong. It's the profit every year that counts.

On a suckler farm, every year you will sell culls cows. Lets say the average cow has 5 calves. That's a 20% replacement rate. Allowing for heifers that are not suitable for breeding, don't go in calf, are too wild, too narrow at the hips etc, you need about 25 heifers every year in a 100 cow herd. That means you need to breed 50% of your cows to a maternal type bull. I honestly think that's where most suckler guys go wrong. As most run a terminal type bull , they think they can go out every year and buy in heifers. The heifers are of unknown breeding, cost too much and at the end of the day, a big gamble.

I'm looking at it from this point of view.
If I'm starting out in the morning,
I buy 100 heifers to put to the bull..(suckling)
Or I buy 70 calved dairy cows
The heifers roi is in 3 years approx (bar a few culls,suckling)
The 70 calved dairy cows roi is the very next day.
I don't buy the labour argument.
Gruellers last post put that argument to bed imo.

Dozer1

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/memo-to-agriland-i-will-not-be-finishing-cattle-this-winter/

Did This lad get out of beef aswell or is he still at sucklers

patsy_mccabe

Walter Brennans sale

https://www.donedeal.ie/beefcattle-for-sale/special-incalf-springers/26457366

https://www.facebook.com/media/set?vanity=tj.duffy.73&set=a.3476336035785814

Danzy

Dozer1 wrote: »

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/memo-to-agriland-i-will-not-be-finishing-cattle-this-winter/

Did This lad get out of beef aswell or is he still at sucklers

Far as I know, that man is out of sucklers and has dry stock.

Drove past his place last February, incredible setup and grass.

Bass Reeves

Grueller wrote: »

Bass, I am in my first year of dairying. I have stated here before that I am winding down the suckler herd but still have 45 of them at last count. This morning I have milked,scraped cubicles, buffered cows and let them to grass. That took 2 hours. I am in for tea now, but feeding sucklers, seeing 2 batches that are still out and general jobs attached to them took over an hour and a half. Dry stock would have required as much work.
Now whether I am dairy or dry stock I will go to the yard every day and spend a portion of the morning there. That leaves the evening. I have had 3 different local lads from 17-20 approach me looking to do relief milking. All from dairy farms and all good reliable lads. €40 would pay them. Taking every Sunday from 10 o clock on off all year will cost less than €2000. Put that through the books and for myself on the high tax bracket it is €1000 out of the paw.
I will also be dry for 7-8 weeks so the same young lads would do all Sundays work for that €40. Feed and clean cubicle beds being about it. That would leave me 8 Sundays off in a row all bar a 20 minute walkabout to put my own mind at ease.
I like your posts Bass because you have your figures spot on usually, but I do find your view on dairying is quite negative. I am not sure is that experience of it directly or from an outside perspective, but it does not have to be drudgery if facilities are up to and organisation are up to scratch.

I think if you read my posts in different threads over the years you hardly say I am negative about dairying. But I do think there is a lot more to the transition than many think. Its one thing taking Sundays off and getting a lad to cover 1-2 milkings or even a week end. Time off is a different thing

I went to Australia last year for a month. I do not think I could have done that with a dairy operation. My youngest lad was in College but covered weekends, my daughter kept an eye on the few at home while a friend looked after the main farm during the week, all cattle were out, all silage field's closed and it was basically keep them moving between paddocks. While I was on Australia I even ordered ration to be delivered for to start a finishing bunch when I came back.

I coached GAA for a good few years under age. I never saw any lad that was a dairy farmer at a match to watch his son or daughter except for the final which were on in the middle of the day.

Transition to dairying is a multi facet transition. On one hand you have the capital and expense side but this is easily managed by the profitability of dairying. The actual lifestyle change is different and many do not factor that in. You are making a financial decisions that you are committed to for 20 years plus IMO.

I think this is easier in your 20's and 30's. However from 40 on you have to factor in other issues. To make the entry to dairy worth while it is a 20 year plus committment. The ''while Pop's around'' comments was a reflection that labour is needed for a work life balance. It easy in any business to get cover for 1-2 days. It the longer breaks that are the issue. These are manageable while either you have an older or younger family member to help. However nowadays with smaller families and travelling options younger help may not be there when you are in your late 50's. This could see you tied to the place more than you might wish.

While dairying give the option to farm fulltime it comes with a cost of that you need to look at. I think if I had a job unless I disliked the job if I was in my 40's I see it out for another 15 ish years and stay in drystock.


You also have to factor in inheritance/ succession. Going dairying may tie up finance that will see you having to ''stick at it'' for 20+ years. It also may create a situation where the vast majority of your wealth is tied up in the farm or farm business. It very hard to extract that wealth from it. Will one child inherit all.

If lads look back over my posting I have been negative about suckler's for a very long time. I considered the extra subsidities a trap to farmers more than an asset. It kept lads in suckler's. However I think there are other options as well as going dairying.

By the way I think this should be hived off into a separate thread maybe called transition from sucklers or even Suckler endgame or whatever. It a discussion that would not have been had 2-3 years ago but lads seem ready for it now

Bass Reeves

richie123 wrote: »

I'm looking at it from this point of view.
If I'm starting out in the morning,
I buy 100 heifers to put to the bull..(suckling)
Or I buy 70 calved dairy cows
The heifers roi is in 3 years approx (bar a few culls,suckling)
The 70 calved dairy cows roi is the very next day.
I don't buy the labour argument.
Gruellers last post put that argument to bed imo.

With the 70 dairy cows you need paddocks, roadways water setup, a certain amount of reseeding, milking parlour, adapting housing to take cubicles etc. Probably equivalent to 1-1.5k/ cow.

There is no question if you are going farming fulltime that dairying is the best option. But take a father and son( it could be a daughter as well) middle of the road suckler operation. Father had always farmer fulltime, son in his early 40's has a decent job off farm. 100 acre land in one block at present 60 Suckler cows finishing heifers and bulls. Father can no longer manage the cows and it is incapable of sustaining one not to mind giving the father s retirement option as well as an income to the son. Assuming that suckler's are not an option the choices

Going dairying will require the son to leave his fulltime job and assuming that they go 100 cows an investment of anything from 150-200k. It has to be done in one fell swoop or at least a 6-8 month period.

Change over to drystock and into dairy X stock. They have options calf/weanling/store to beef, calf/weanling to store. This can be done using existing calves and culls to start or by selling existing stock. 60 Suckler cows @ 1200 each gives 72k, 60 weanlings @700 each 42k, 60 finished cattle @1200 each 72k throwing 150k free after bills. I think I may be wrong but a retiring farming is allowed to take 200 k out of an business in a retirement package even if not I am sure there are other ways to transfer a lot of that out especially if cattle are valued at any sort of decent base value on the books.

Son buys 100 dairycross weanlings/stores costing 50k and farms away parent gives a hand as much as possible. He writes off start up losses against his PAYE income.

Grueller

Bass Reeves wrote: »

I think if you read my posts in different threads over the years you hardly say I am negative about dairying. But I do think there is a lot more to the transition than many think. Its one thing taking Sundays off and getting a lad to cover 1-2 milkings or even a week end. Time off is a different thing

I went to Australia last year for a month. I do not think I could have done that with a dairy operation. My youngest lad was in College but covered weekends, my daughter kept an eye on the few at home while a friend looked after the main farm during the week, all cattle were out, all silage field's closed and it was basically keep them moving between paddocks. While I was on Australia I even ordered ration to be delivered for to start a finishing bunch when I came back.

I coached GAA for a good few years under age. I never saw any lad that was a dairy farmer at a match to watch his son or daughter except for the final which were on in the middle of the day.

Transition to dairying is a multi facet transition. On one hand you have the capital and expense side but this is easily managed by the profitability of dairying. The actual lifestyle change is different and many do not factor that in. You are making a financial decisions that you are committed to for 20 years plus IMO.

I think this is easier in your 20's and 30's. However from 40 on you have to factor in other issues. To make the entry to dairy worth while it is a 20 year plus committment. The ''while Pop's around'' comments was a reflection that labour is needed for a work life balance. It easy in any business to get cover for 1-2 days. It the longer breaks that are the issue. These are manageable while either you have an older or younger family member to help. However nowadays with smaller families and travelling options younger help may not be there when you are in your late 50's. This could see you tied to the place more than you might wish.

While dairying give the option to farm fulltime it comes with a cost of that you need to look at. I think if I had a job unless I disliked the job if I was in my 40's I see it out for another 15 ish years and stay in drystock.


You also have to factor in inheritance/ succession. Going dairying may tie up finance that will see you having to ''stick at it'' for 20+ years. It also may create a situation where the vast majority of your wealth is tied up in the farm or farm business. It very hard to extract that wealth from it. Will one child inherit all.

If lads look back over my posting I have been negative about suckler's for a very long time. I considered the extra subsidities a trap to farmers more than an asset. It kept lads in suckler's. However I think there are other options as well as going dairying.

By the way I think this should be hived off into a separate thread maybe called transition from sucklers or even Suckler endgame or whatever. It a discussion that would not have been had 2-3 years ago but lads seem ready for it now

My cows are being dried off tomorrow morning Bass. I will start calving on January 15th.
I could head for Oz next week for 2 months easily enough.
You will only be a slave if you make it so.

Bass, I work hard as do most others on here. I start at 5.45am. I work off farm 15-20 hours per week. However with almost no other labour around I am finished every evening at 6.30 - 7.00. Almost is as you call it "Pops". As I am in and out of high risk facilities with Covid I have basically barred him from the yard as he is high risk as is my mother. I can still manage the workload due to good facilities.

The problem with the scenario of going into dairy cross beef is that you are still in beef. I fooled myself for ten years that suckling is profitable. I am not going to do the same that any other type of beef is profitable in any meaningful way.
A friend of mine who was a serious suckler man transitioned to a dairy cross calf to store system. He threw open his books to me. He is making absolutely no more money from that system than he was at suckling, but has less work. He has 110 acres in one block of prime Wexford land but ruled out dairying as he was 46 at the time of changing system. His young lad is 21 now and my friend has said that the problem he sees now is that the son will never farm as due to the low profit levels in the system he sees no future. You said about sticking it out for 15 years if you were in drystock, but that puts that mans son at 36, very little profit on the farm at a stage where he is in the teeth of mortgage, family etc so has not got the cash or opportunity to change system.
You are right that dairy doesn't suit everyone but the man that Inhave outlined above is sorry he "hadn't the guts" as he put it himself.

patsy_mccabe

Great discussion. I'm only a curious observer but does anyone know any tillage lads that made the transition into dairying. Going from suckling is one thing where you have some experience of cows but from tillage....

tabby aspreme

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Great discussion. I'm only a curious observer but does anyone know any tillage lads that made the transition into dairying. Going from suckling is one thing where you have some experience of cows but from tillage....

There are a few around here moving to dairying, but they have teenage, or early 20s sons, who will be doing most of the work, these lads have been welded to John Deere seats all there lives, a lot of the new entrants to dairying seem to be willing to pay lads to do a few milkings each week, unlike older lads who were slaves to dairying.

Bass Reeves

Grueller wrote: »

My cows are being dried off tomorrow morning Bass. I will start calving on January 15th.
I could head for Oz next week for 2 months easily enough.
You will only be a slave if you make it so.

Bass, I work hard as do most others on here. I start at 5.45am. I work off farm 15-20 hours per week. However with almost no other labour around I am finished every evening at 6.30 - 7.00. Almost is as you call it "Pops". As I am in and out of high risk facilities with Covid I have basically barred him from the yard as he is high risk as is my mother. I can still manage the workload due to good facilities.

The problem with the scenario of going into dairy cross beef is that you are still in beef. I fooled myself for ten years that suckling is profitable. I am not going to do the same that any other type of beef is profitable in any meaningful way.
A friend of mine who was a serious suckler man transitioned to a dairy cross calf to store system. He threw open his books to me. He is making absolutely no more money from that system than he was at suckling, but has less work. He has 110 acres in one block of prime Wexford land but ruled out dairying as he was 46 at the time of changing system. His young lad is 21 now and my friend has said that the problem he sees now is that the son will never farm as due to the low profit levels in the system he sees no future. You said about sticking it out for 15 years if you were in drystock, but that puts that mans son at 36, very little profit on the farm at a stage where he is in the teeth of mortgage, family etc so has not got the cash or opportunity to change system.
You are right that dairy doesn't suit everyone but the man that Inhave outlined above is sorry he "hadn't the guts" as he put it himself.

On the other hand your friend's son can go away and build a career for himself, travel and see life. The father can work and farm a simple drystock operation. In 10+ years time the father can start to step back the son or daughter can take over the farm or start to get involved anyway. Father can extract 100-200k by destocking and inheritor can build up a drystock operation using PAYE to offset start up losses.

I think larger drystock operations that were capable of giving a fulltime income are struggling with the transition that smaller drystock operations had to make over the last 10+ years(20-50+ years ago in the west of Ireland) and still hanker for the fulltime option.

Dairying will be a shock to a some of them. I bought the farm in 2003, our family was young we went abroad every second year with them for two weeks even in March early April one year. Dairying ties you down any dairy farmers will attest to that.

jntsnk

Can you explain the method of PAYE to offset start up losses?

DukeCaboom

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Great discussion. I'm only a curious observer but does anyone know any tillage lads that made the transition into dairying. Going from suckling is one thing where you have some experience of cows but from tillage....

My brother, qualified mechanic.
Never saw a cow in his life.
This is his first year, in his mid twenties not married & would be an absolute slave to get through work & very good to apply himself to something .
The money is a great motivation.
It's funny because the main thing people used to say to him was you do know they've to be milked on Sundays too... His reply always was "I know & I can't wait to only work 4 hrs every Sunday.

jfh

DukeCaboom wrote: »

My brother, qualified mechanic.
Never saw a cow in his life.
This is his first year, in his mid twenties not married & would be an absolute slave to get through work & very good to apply himself to something .
The money is a great motivation.
It's funny because the main thing people used to say to him was you do know they've to be milked on Sundays too... His reply always was "I know & I can't wait to only work 4 hrs every Sunday.

If he's busy every Sunday as a mechanic, you can be sure he'll be exactly the same milking cows.

DukeCaboom

jfh wrote: »

If he's busy every Sunday as a mechanic, you can be sure he'll be exactly the same milking cows.

Haha your dead right but he's getting paid more milking.

whelan2

Young lad has a curaheen earp weanling bull. Nice animal. I'd say about 350kg. Weaned a few weeks, born March. What's he worth?

pat73

What are March/April dairy cross whitehead bulls 250kg nice and square making..

charolais0153

whelan2 wrote: »

Young lad has a curaheen earp weanling bull. Nice animal. I'd say about 350kg. Weaned a few weeks, born March. What's he worth?

What colour

whelan2

charolais0153 wrote: »

What colour

Red and white

togeradoo88

How have people found the level 5 restrictions have affected trade ?

charolais0153

whelan2 wrote: »

Red and white

Around 750 depending on quality I'd say

patsy_mccabe

togeradoo88 wrote: »

How have people found the level 5 restrictions have affected trade ?

Welcome to Boards.

whelan2

togeradoo88 wrote: »

How have people found the level 5 restrictions have affected trade ?

Sold a load of animals out of the yard today. All collected by this evening and cheque lodged this afternoon. No waiting around. Happy out.

patsy_mccabe

Some amount of suckler clearance sales on Donedeal. This one looks like watching;

https://www.donedeal.ie/beefcattle-for-sale/60-suckler-herd-sale-tuam-mart-7th-dec-12pm/26507450

Bass Reeves

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Some amount of suckler clearance sales on Donedeal. This one looks like watching;

https://www.donedeal.ie/beefcattle-for-sale/60-suckler-herd-sale-tuam-mart-7th-dec-12pm/26507450

With the last 2yeats I have heard a few lads saying when the BDGP was over they were exiting suckler's. BEAM may have accelerated the decision. By culling now lads may find it easier to hold onto BEAM money. A lad with 40 cows and finishing the progeny would have over 5k . Any dairy lads selling extra cows or heifer over the next couple of years could clean up

patsy_mccabe

I'm out of touch with Beam. How does that affect things?

tanko

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I'm out of touch with Beam. How does that affect things?

Basically if you're in BEAM you have to keep 5% less cattle between June '20 and June '21 compared to June '18 to June '19.

Bass Reeves

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I'm out of touch with Beam. How does that affect things?

BEAM is reliant on a 5% nitrogen reduction. By destocking now it might help to get you under the limit if going milking. When dairy cows are 85 kgs N. When they start calving in your herd a dairy heifer jumps from 57-85. As the reference period is until the end of June having minimum stock for 6-8 weeks might help get you under the limit

Base price

tanko wrote: »

Basically if you're in BEAM you have to keep 5% less cattle between June '20 and June '21 compared to June '18 to June '19.

It's 5% reduction in organic nitrogen compared to the reference year, not 5% reduction in cattle numbers.

Lime Tree Farm

BEAM : The confusion is affecting sales of cattle.


Speaking to the Irish Farmers Journal Ennis mart manager Martin McNamara said: “We have a lot of big customers who are in BEAM and don’t know where they stand in relation to their stocking rates and they have said they’re going to ease up buying because of that.

“The last thing we need next spring is farmers panic selling and beef finishers not being able to buy them because of a Government stipulation. There should be a facility for farmers to view their figures on a monthly basis.”

https://www.farmersjournal.ie/beam-scheme-confusion-a-growing-concern-583302

TooOldBoots

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Some amount of suckler clearance sales on Donedeal. This one looks like watching;

https://www.donedeal.ie/beefcattle-for-sale/60-suckler-herd-sale-tuam-mart-7th-dec-12pm/26507450

Another one at Ennis mart this Tuesday.
https://www.donedeal.ie/beefcattle-for-sale/clearance-sale-of-sucklers-ennis-mart-17th-nov/26493548?campaign=3

In fairness theres not much appetite for sucklers anymore. The world of pedigree Bulls for sale too.
idk what lads are doing, they must be getting into dairying.

patsy_mccabe

This herd about to be sold in sixmilebridge mart today;

https://www.donedeal.ie/beefcattle-for-sale/in-calf-cows/26459254

Bass Reeves

Lime Tree Farm wrote: »

BEAM : The confusion is affecting sales of cattle.


Speaking to the Irish Farmers Journal Ennis mart manager Martin McNamara said: “We have a lot of big customers who are in BEAM and don’t know where they stand in relation to their stocking rates and they have said they’re going to ease up buying because of that.

“The last thing we need next spring is farmers panic selling and beef finishers not being able to buy them because of a Government stipulation. There should be a facility for farmers to view their figures on a monthly basis.”

https://www.farmersjournal.ie/beam-scheme-confusion-a-growing-concern-583302

AFAIK if you look at nitrates on aug food they will have one to the end of June for your farm. It only a matter of found a calculation from that. There is at least two more nitrates updates since then at end of August and September. However most lads need to be spoon fed

jfh

I have resigned to the fact that I will be returning the 1000 euro so be it. My nitrates are going up not down

TooOldBoots

jfh wrote: »

I have resigned to the fact that I will be returning the 1000 euro so be it. My nitrates are going up not down

I'm in the same position. I even added more land since but it seems to make no difference to the Gestapo Ag dept. Falling on deaf ears even though I've added 10% more land they don't care.

Grueller

TooOldBoots wrote: »

I'm in the same position. I even added more land since but it seems to make no difference to the Gestapo Ag dept. Falling on deaf ears even though I've added 10% more land they don't care.

It's not nitrates per ha under that scheme. Its total nitrates per farm so if you took land based on reducing nitrates for beam you were very poorly advised.

MIKEKC

TooOldBoots wrote: »

I'm in the same position. I even added more land since but it seems to make no difference to the Gestapo Ag dept. Falling on deaf ears even though I've added 10% more land they don't care.

From the outset it was stated that adding more land would not be acceptable

patsy_mccabe

At the suckler sale today in SMB it was announced that the farmer was going dairying.

jfh

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

At the suckler sale today in SMB it was announced that the farmer was going dairying.

Fine herd of cows he had too, some reasonable prices