Accident this morning (Thursday 9th April) on Grand Canal near Crumlin

glasspicklejar

Hi,

My trike was clipped by a lorry this morning (c.08:20) across from the Maxol station on the Dolphin Road heading east into town. Nobody was hurt, but the bike was damaged. As the trike was dragged along by the lorry, it could have been alot worse.

The lorry didn't stop, we got a partial licence plate, a witness and the Gardai attended the scene. There's no useful CCTV at the location.

Is there anything else I can do?

Any help or advise gratefully received.

Alanstrainor

Any advertising or company on the lorry? There is a big chance that despite hitting the trike and dragging it, the driver just may not have felt or realised anything amiss.

glasspicklejar

Alanstrainor wrote: »

Any advertising or company on the lorry?

Possibly, but not noticed under the circumstances

Dub13

Dublin Bus could be able to help as they have cameras on all buses and that's a very busy part of the city for buses.

couerdelion

Is there any CCTV further up the road that might have got the lorry before the accident?

Hope you're ok and not too shook up

glasspicklejar

Dub13 wrote: »

Dublin Bus could be able to help as they have cameras on all buses and that's a very busy part of the city for buses.

That's a good idea, but it appears that the buses run north/ south rather than east/ west and I don't recall ever seeing a bus on that part of the canal.

Thanks.

glasspicklejar

couerdelion wrote: »

Is there any CCTV further up the road that might have got the lorry before the accident?

Hope you're ok and not too shook up

The Gardai were going to look further up and down the road to look for CCTV. It sounds like they've been through this more than once before in terms of sourcing CCTV though.

Thanks for your concern.

daragh_

Passed you while the Guards were there. Hope you are ok.

Did the lorry continue down the Canal or head into town?

glasspicklejar

daragh_ wrote: »

Passed you while the Guards were there. Hope you are ok.

Did the lorry continue down the Canal or head into town?

It continued down the canal. We're okay. Shook up. Thanks.

daragh_

Dublin City Council have CCTV Cameras on Harold's Cross Bridge.

https://www.dublincity.ie/dublintraffic/#South%20City

schemingbohemia

daragh_ wrote: »

Dublin City Council have CCTV Cameras on Harold's Cross Bridge.

https://www.dublincity.ie/dublintraffic/#South%20City

Having looked for footage before from DCC I was told that they're only for monitoring traffic flows and don't actually record, so doubt the OP would have any luck there, unless one of the people working there saw the lorry at the time of the accident.

Bloggsie

Sorry for your troubles OP, glad no one was injured.

glasspicklejar

schemingbohemia wrote: »

Having looked for footage before from DCC I was told that they're only for monitoring traffic flows and don't actually record, so doubt the OP would have any luck there, unless one of the people working there saw the lorry at the time of the accident.

Unfortunately that seems to still be the case

mal1

I pass here every morning and the lorry traffic can be heavy and intimidating. I've started going earlier in the morning to avoid all the heavy traffic but unfortunately the lorries still come down the canal as early as 6.00am and they go a hell of a lot faster. It was a nightmare during winter, they really muddy up the roads. Glad you are not hurt. It's worth investigating further or at least highlighting with the gardai. They could do with spending the odd morning observing the traffic along the canal.

glasspicklejar

mal1 wrote: »

I pass here every morning and the lorry traffic can be heavy and intimidating. I've started going earlier in the morning to avoid all the heavy traffic but unfortunately the lorries still come down the canal as early as 6.00am and they go a hell of a lot faster. It was a nightmare during winter, they really muddy up the roads. Glad you are not hurt. It's worth investigating further or at least highlighting with the gardai. They could do with spending the odd morning observing the traffic along the canal.

We cycle that route everyday Monday- Friday and have done so for the last 4 years. This is our first such incident. It's with the Gardai now. Thank you for your concern.

mal1

Best of luck. The CCTV avenue is not always fruitful. I tried it when a group of teenagers tried pushing me in the canal as I cycled along the path on Davitt road. The kids had passed many cameras but none helped me out in the end.

monument

glasspicklejar wrote: »

That's a good idea, but it appears that the buses run north/ south rather than east/ west and I don't recall ever seeing a bus on that part of the canal.

Thanks.

If you have the time the collision happened, the bus depot could -- if they are in the willing mood -- look at the footage for buses that could have been stopped at a junction at the same time as the truck might have passed by? If they find a truck like the one in question and it has clear branding, the gardai could compare the company's registered trucks with the partial number plate?

Maybe too much of a long shot?

lgk

Depending on how much of the reg you got, you could enter the possible combinations on some of the car history check sites and see what make/model is returned. Gardaí will be able to do a better search though.

Thargor

What kind of trike is it? Do you commute on a trike?

glasspicklejar

lgk wrote: »

Depending on how much of the reg you got, you could enter the possible combinations on some of the car history check sites and see what make/model is returned. Gardaí will be able to do a better search though.

We've the year, county and first 2 of 5 digits. That leaves 999 combinations. We'll leave it with the Gardaí.

glasspicklejar

Thargor wrote: »

What kind of trike is it? Do you commute on a trike?

It's a Christiania trike. I can't link as account is new.

Zyzz

Eamonnator

glasspicklejar wrote: »

We've the year, county and first 2 of 5 digits. That leaves 999 combinations. We'll leave it with the Gardaí.

Much fewer than that, surely. All non trucks can be eliminated for a start.

glasspicklejar

Eamonnator wrote: »

Much fewer than that, surely. All non trucks can be eliminated for a start.

Presumably I'd have to enter the reg to find out what the vehicle was though...
Happy to be corrected. Can someone suggest some sites?

willdill

Jesus sound frightening i was heading the n81 to blessington 2 weeks ago and was nearly clipped by 2 trucks.Its very scary.Hope your ok.

Weepsie

glasspicklejar wrote: »

Presumably I'd have to enter the reg to find out what the vehicle was though...
Happy to be corrected. Can someone suggest some sites?

Cartell does what you need. IF you split it up between a couple of people you could probably get through it quick enough if its 999 other numbers (presuming its a 5 digit reg)

Wishbone Ash

glasspicklejar wrote: »

.....The lorry didn't stop, we got a partial licence plate, a witness and the Gardai attended the scene....

Can you narrow down the type of truck it was? - articulated, rigid, box body, flat bed, curtainsider, tipper etc.

As has been said, it's possible the driver was unaware of what happened, particularly if it was an articulated truck. (I clipped another vehicle while driving an articulated bus a few years back and was totally unaware of it until the Gardai pulled me over and had a word with me. )

glasspicklejar

Gardai were in touch today. They traced the vehicle and spoke to the driver. He didn't realise he had 'clipped' us. TBH, I assumed that was the case. So the Gardai have offered to provide me with his contact details. When I asked why they were giving me his contact details they said it was a 'material damage accident that is dealt with civilly'.

With all due respect to the Gardai, this doesn't seem right. Not to be inflammatory, but it's a 'hit and run', right? And we've an independent witness to say he encroached on us by coming into our lane whilst overtaking. Isn't this reckless driving, or driving without due care or attention, or something like that?

If he had veered into another lane and clipped a car and spun it around and drove on without noticing, would it be left as a civil matter to figure out the insurance?

I'm not looking for a higher standard to be applied because I'm a cyclist, but I don't see why a lower one should be applied.

Can someone give me some insight here?

cython

glasspicklejar wrote: »

Gardai were in touch today. They traced the vehicle and spoke to the driver. He didn't realise he had 'clipped' us. TBH, I assumed that was the case. So the Gardai have offered to provide me with his contact details. When I asked why they were giving me his contact details they said it was a 'material damage accident that is dealt with civilly'.

With all due respect to the Gardai, this doesn't seem right. Not to be inflammatory, but it's a 'hit and run', right? And we've an independent witness to say he encroached on us by coming into our lane whilst overtaking. Isn't this reckless driving, or driving without due care or attention, or something like that?

If he had veered into another lane and clipped a car and spun it around and drove on without noticing, would it be left as a civil matter to figure out the insurance?

I'm not looking for a higher standard to be applied because I'm a cyclist, but I don't see why a lower one should be applied.

Can someone give me some insight here?

What's your priority here? Do you want to see the driver prosecuted for the mistake, or just get the damage to your own trike fixed? If the former, then push the Gardai to charge the driver with some or all of what you have highlighted (leaving the scene of an accident for the hit and run, albeit potentially unwittingly). They have already spoken to the driver, and may well have cautioned him as part of that, so the next step is prosecution. If the latter, then it is nothing to do with the Gardai, and the reparations are a civil matter as they advised, so take the contact details.

monument

Is there potental to push the Gardai towards giving the driver points, rather than bringing him to court?

glasspicklejar

glasspicklejar wrote: »

Gardai were in touch today. They traced the vehicle and spoke to the driver. He didn't realise he had 'clipped' us. TBH, I assumed that was the case. So the Gardai have offered to provide me with his contact details. When I asked why they were giving me his contact details they said it was a 'material damage accident that is dealt with civilly'.

With all due respect to the Gardai, this doesn't seem right. Not to be inflammatory, but it's a 'hit and run', right? And we've an independent witness to say he encroached on us by coming into our lane whilst overtaking. Isn't this reckless driving, or driving without due care or attention, or something like that?

If he had veered into another lane and clipped a car and spun it around and drove on without noticing, would it be left as a civil matter to figure out the insurance?

I'm not looking for a higher standard to be applied because I'm a cyclist, but I don't see why a lower one should be applied.

Can someone give me some insight here?

Sometimes you have to be assertive to get anywhere(politely of course). A lot of gardai are under pressure with work load and reduced manpower.

It might be that they dont want the hassle of chasing up what they might see as a minor offense.

cython

monument wrote: »

Is there potental to push the Gardai towards giving the driver points, rather than bringing him to court?

Looking at the list of offences, I guess potentially they could be given 3 points for dangerous overtaking without a mandatory court appearance (assuming the clipping was done as part of an overtake). "Driver found to be driving carelessly" and "Breach of duties at an accident" on the other hand have mandatory court appearances, and to be honest are probably more appropriate here.

I will come back to the question that I posed above though, what is the OP's aim in this? Reparations or punishment of the driver as well? The Gardai only come into the latter.

a148pro

I'm sorry, I can't follow your narrative at all - you had your kids in the front box thing and it was dragged along by the truck but no-one was hurt? How was the truck encroaching in your lane while passing out, that's a one lane road is it not? Was he undertaking someone turning right?

I cycle this route a fair bit, and occasionally with my son on the bike seat in front of me. To be honest I regard it as one of the safer cycle lanes in Dublin, so I'm worried to hear this. Once again the absence of a segregated cycle lane puts us at risk.

The interesting thing is there's a little used rough path that actually goes along the canal itself, off road and under bridges that would be fantastic if it was developed into a cycle lane. Given that the canal is only navigated for the sake of it once a year I wonder did they ever think of putting a cycle lane along part of it, would solve a lot of problems.

glasspicklejar

a148pro wrote: »

I'm sorry, I can't follow your narrative at all - you had your kids in the front box thing and it was dragged along by the truck but no-one was hurt? How was the truck encroaching in your lane while passing out, that's a one lane road is it not? Was he undertaking someone turning right?

Kids in the front, lorry overtaking, 'clipped' the mudguard, dragged the bike a bit, bike came loose, vehicle kept going. We were in the bike lane the whole time. Very lucky no-one was injured.

a148pro wrote: »

I cycle this route a fair bit, and occasionally with my son on the bike seat in front of me. To be honest I regard it as one of the safer cycle lanes in Dublin, so I'm worried to hear this. Once again the absence of a segregated cycle lane puts us at risk.

We've cycled this route without incident for four or five years.

Wishbone Ash

glasspicklejar wrote: »

.....Not to be inflammatory, but it's a 'hit and run', right? ...

It's only deemed to be a 'hit and run' if the driver knowingly left the scene of an accident.

When damage following an accident is deemed to be 'material damage' only, the Gardai leave it up to both parties and their insurance companies to sort it out.

a148pro

Not a hit and run for the reasons above, would think it could be careless or dangerous driving though, most likely careless. I'm surprised given the potential consequences that the Gardai aren't prosecuting. It also sounds like they probably had to put a lot of work in to track the driver.

Try and keep them onside as we need to have sympathetic Gardai and ask them why no prosecution for dangerous driving, if it goes nowhere I suppose you could write to the Superintendant of their station asking him / her to review the decision not to prosecute?

This is the kind of thing that makes me not want to cycle with kids, which pisses me off because my son loves the bike, and I hate driving in traffic.