General Elections. The Constituency of Tipperary

It wasnt me123

Xenophile wrote: »

With due respect, I think you confuse election manifestos with the programme for Government. Independents can huff and puff and promise the sun, the moon and the stars and know that they will never be accountable for anything. Of course they can organise protest marches and interfere with people going their daily business and play havoc with business's by causing them lost sales.

A definition for you:

A manifesto is a published verbal declaration of the intentions, motives, or views of the issuer, be it an individual, group, political party or government.

Labour said they wouldn't reduce some social welfare payments, and then reneged - so Labour (not AK necessarily) but the party, won't be getting a vote from me.

Don't assume I vote independent either (but they might get a few preference votes)

digzy

It wasnt me123 wrote: »

A definition for you:

A manifesto is a published verbal declaration of the intentions, motives, or views of the issuer, be it an individual, group, political party or government.

Labour said they wouldn't reduce some social welfare payments, and then reneged - so Labour (not AK necessarily) but the party, won't be getting a vote from me.

Don't assume I vote independent either (but they might get a few preference votes)

Tbf all parties come out with 'manifestos'. Those in government are then struck by the reality that these goals ain't achievable. In a way it might suit the labour narrative that 'we couldn't deliver all of what we wanted because we'd to compromise to the much larger party'. Fine Gael are infamous for forming policy around focus groups. They come out with proposals to garner the most votes.

Look at renua's flat tax rate..... Anyone paying the higher tax rate would take note but I guarantee it's something that will never be brought in. Renua know that too and in the highly unlikely event that they form a part of the next government they'll have the 'our mandate wasn't sufficient to allow us to bring it in' excuse.

It wasnt me123

Then they shouldn't promise the sun, moon and stars and break every promise, and then do the same in the next run up to the election. That's why people say what's the point in voting, shure they're all the same. Liars. Why not just say we'd like a, b and c but we know we'll be part of a coalition and in all honesty can't deliver anything we want. Hopefully we'll be able to curb some of the excesses of whoever we're in government with.

Not very catchy I know, but much more honest

It wasnt me123

Then they shouldn't promise the sun, moon and stars and break every promise, and then do the same in the next run up to the election. That's why people say what's the point in voting, shure they're all the same. Liars. Why not just say we'd like a, b and c but we know we'll be part of a coalition and in all honesty can't deliver anything we want. Hopefully we'll be able to curb some of the excesses of whoever we're in government with.

Not very catchy I know, but much more honest

digzy

It wasnt me123 wrote: »

Then they shouldn't promise the sun, moon and stars and break every promise, and then do the same in the next run up to the election. That's why people say what's the point in voting, shure they're all the same. Liars. Why not just say we'd like a, b and c but we know we'll be part of a coalition and in all honesty can't deliver anything we want. Hopefully we'll be able to curb some of the excesses of whoever we're in government with.

Not very catchy I know, but much more honest

Fair point, but whatever influence a party will have in government it'll have none in opposition. Nearly all election 'promises' are disingenuous one could argue given the highly unlikely situation of single party government.

Xenophile

It wasnt me123 wrote: »

A definition for you:

A manifesto is a published verbal declaration of the intentions,,

Intentions have often to be parked during the horse trading that goes on in order to form a Government after the election results have been declared. That's politics, I hope that we are not embarking on a course like Italy endured where they had to have election after election, such a waste in a country that could ill afford it.

Xenophile

jonski wrote: »

Social conscience might suggest that other things should be taken into consideration .

Maybe you might be good enough to let me know what was the last year Limerick did not have a Senior Minister at the Cabinet Table !

Spirit of 67

Xenophile wrote: »

The voters of Nenagh will have the last say on who gets the credit !

As someone from the area who voted for Kelly in the last GE , I will never vote for him or Labour again and I know plenty of others who voted for him last time around and won`t this time either . He is a fraud of the highest order !

touts

Xenophile wrote: »

No Way Would Nenagh Get These Jobs If Kelly Was Not Living In Nenagh !

So can we take it that as the semi-official Labour spokesperson on boards the Labour party line is the only way to get jobs into an area is to have one of your local TDs be appointed a minister.

And is it really a wise election strategy to in effect say from an employers point of view Nenagh is a worthless backwater and it's knuckle dragging inhabitants have nothing going for it to attract employers other than the benevolent love of Alan Kelly.

Xenophile

touts wrote: »

So can we take it that as the semi-official Labour spokesperson on boards the Labour party line is the only way to get jobs into an area is to have one of your local TDs be appointed a minister.

And is it really a wise election strategy to in effect say from an employers point of view Nenagh is a worthless backwater and it's knuckle dragging inhabitants have nothing going for it to attract employers other than the benevolent love of Alan Kelly.

the semi-official Labour spokesperson on boards the Labour party. No, the self appointed supporter of Alan Kelly.

Back Water on the Motorway to Limerick and Dublin. Rail Station, easy access to The University of Limerick. Now administering many of the functions of Tipperary County Council. It seems that we are a long way of, of getting a Politician of substance in South Tipperary.

jonski

Xenophile wrote: »

Maybe you might be good enough to let me know what was the last year Limerick did not have a Senior Minister at the Cabinet Table !

Wouldn't have a clue and don't see the relevance to the post I made previously, which probably means your conscience is already pricked and we are as well off leaving you alone .

PearlJ

Xenophile wrote: »

Jobs were added in Clonmel while other C&C jobs were lost in England.

There are posters here who do not want to give Kelly credit for anything, obviously he has plenty of opponents.

Political intelligence would suggest how important it is to have a Senior Government represent your constituency at the cabinet table!

I find it odd that you assume that Kelly will hold a Ministry after the next election and will continue to wield the same power.
Even if he does get elected, Labour will be annihilated.
In all liklihood it will be a FG/FF coalition and Kelly will be left with, at best, a bit part in the back benches.
It would be complete lunacy to vote for him thinking that he will have an impact for Tipperary.
If the people of Tipperary want a presence at the Cabinet table it would make more sense to vote for a FG or FF candidate. I'm not saying that to endorse any one candidate but that is what makes political sense.

realdanbreen

Spirit of 67 wrote: »

As someone from the area who voted for Kelly in the last GE , I will never vote for him or Labour again and I know plenty of others who voted for him last time around and won`t this time either . He is a fraud of the highest order !

I am also from the area but have been cast into BIFFO land and can't vote in my native county. If I could I would vote for K if for no other reason than he looks the part in the tailored suit and proper haircut., Seamie morris OTOH goes around in an auld jacket like a fella coming to pump out your septic tank. Mattie and yer man Hayes also by their suits off the clearance rails in Guineys!.

Xenophile

PearlJ wrote: »

I find it odd that you assume that Kelly will hold a Ministry after the next election and will continue to wield the same power.
Even if he does get elected, Labour will be annihilated.
In all liklihood it will be a FG/FF coalition and Kelly will be left with, at best, a bit part in the back benches.
It would be complete lunacy to vote for him thinking that he will have an impact for Tipperary.
If the people of Tipperary want a presence at the Cabinet table it would make more sense to vote for a FG or FF candidate. I'm not saying that to endorse any one candidate but that is what makes political sense.

Not assume but hope !

No FF or FG candidate of suitable calibre to make it to Cabinet in County Tipperary.

Spirit of 67

realdanbreen wrote: »

I am also from the area but have been cast into BIFFO land and can't vote in my native county. If I could I would vote for K if for no other reason than he looks the part in the tailored suit and proper haircut., Seamie morris OTOH goes around in an auld jacket like a fella coming to pump out your septic tank. Mattie and yer man Hayes also by their suits off the clearance rails in Guineys!.

So you vote for someone by what they wear rather than their manifesto , previous record and/or what they have between their ears :rolleyes: !

Expunge

So today is the day of the Right2Water demonstration in Clonmel. And it's definitely not an election rally for Seamus Healy (and Seamus Morris to a lesser extent) - no siree, it's about water for sure.
Those of us who pay for everything in this country will hurry past as we spend precious time with our families before the next work week begins.
We'll prepare to give back up to 53 per cent of our earnings to the State (which still borrows money to keep going).
We'll marvel at how our Welfare friends and family members can get worked up about this idea alone while sucking on a Major cigarette or will enjoy a pint or a few cans afterwards.
The vast majority of the cost of the cigarette or booze is taxation - no demonstration or outrage about that. No outrage from these people about Residential Property Tax or USC.

laoch na mona

while those of us who support paying through taxation will stand up to water charges which open the way for privatisation and do nothing to encourage conservation

mahoney_j

Wouldn't of been a labour or Kelly fan in the past but credit where it's due he has delievered for Nenagh and north tipp ,300 quality highly paid jobs this week and the hydro plant in the mines 2 weeks ago .dont care if it's election politics ,it's real jobs delievered .im self employed and wife works 5 days a week and we certainly ain't as comfortable as we should with the tax squeeze of last few years .taxes are like death unavoidable .i really can't fathom some of the people against water taxes house tax or even any tax they want everything and want to give nothing back .sinn fein politics would turn this country back to and worse than the mess ff made of things and that Along with Gerry Adams as leader and all the skeletons in there closet means they'll never get a vote from me my predictions
Lowry
Mattie
Hayes
Kelly
Cahill

laoch na mona

its a misconception to say we want everything for nothing. The idea is a progressive tax system where everyone pays their fair share instead of the current system where ordinary working people pay more then there share. As for Gerry Adams being leader, he has done more for peace on this Island than any other politician

Expunge

Sure, why don't ya round up the tax rate to 60 per cent while you're at it. The beasts of burden in the middle of the pyramid will continue to carry the can for all services.
God knows the public sector did a stellar job of managing our precious water resources over the last 40 years.
That would suit Seamus Healy's and Sinn Fein's followers just fine. They can go back to paying for fack all in this country.
I'm looking forward to going down to the Main Guard shortly to look at some of the characters involved in this hour of rage.
The work shy and those working on the black will be well known to most of us from the town.
And there'll also be the nutters from the local trade union movement all trying to elbow the Shinners out of the way.
It'll be a great occasion for sure.

mahoney_j

laoch na mona wrote: »

its a misconception to say we want everything for nothing. The idea is a progressive tax system where everyone pays their fair share instead of the current system where ordinary working people pay more then there share. As for Gerry Adams being leader, he has done more for peace on this Island than any other politician

Jaysus some statement ,sure he was never in the ira ,their war council etc .at least mcguiness in fairness has been open about it .adams has no credibility for me as A leader or harping on at other politicians or bankers considering his past

digzy

laoch na mona wrote: »

while those of us who support paying through taxation will stand up to water charges which open the way for privatisation and do nothing to encourage conservation

Yep, It's easy support paying through taxation when you're paying little or no personal tax.

I havent seen too many of the 'we wont pay cos someone else should pay for mine as well as their own'' crew out marching prior to this in order to 'encourage conservation';)

digzy

laoch na mona wrote: »

its a misconception to say we want everything for nothing. The idea is a progressive tax system where everyone pays their fair share instead of the current system where ordinary working people pay more then there share. As for Gerry Adams being leader, he has done more for peace on this Island than any other politician

have you a link for that or by 'ordinary people' perhaps you're referring to those who pay the highest taxes in europe on incomes over 70k per annum?

laoch na mona

digzy wrote: »

have you a link for that or by 'ordinary people' perhaps you're referring to those who pay the highest taxes in europe on incomes over 70k per annum?

anyone on over 70k can afford to pay more then someone on 20k. cutting taxes for the well off only worsens inequality. I would agree the focus on personal tax is flawed we should instead look to raise employer PRSI, corporation tax, financial transaction tax ect to get businesses to pay their fair share. This would mean that the state could spread the benefits of the 'recovery' more evenly throughout society. At the same low wages need to be addressed in order to reduce the number of workers dependent on social welfare.

flutered

mahoney_j wrote: »

Wouldn't of been a labour or Kelly fan in the past but credit where it's due he has delievered for Nenagh and north tipp ,300 quality highly paid jobs this week and the hydro plant in the mines 2 weeks ago .dont care if it's election politics ,it's real jobs delievered .im self employed and wife works 5 days a week and we certainly ain't as comfortable as we should with the tax squeeze of last few years .taxes are like death unavoidable .i really can't fathom some of the people against water taxes house tax or even any tax they want everything and want to give nothing back .sinn fein politics would turn this country back to and worse than the mess ff made of things and that Along with Gerry Adams as leader and all the skeletons in there closet means they'll never get a vote from me my predictions
Lowry
Mattie
Hayes
Kelly
Cahill

when will the full quota of them jobs be filled if ever, tipp is hemmeroging jobs at the moment, a promise is just that a promise

flutered

digzy wrote: »

Yep, It's easy support paying through taxation when you're paying little or no personal tax.

I havent seen too many of the 'we wont pay cos someone else should pay for mine as well as their own'' crew out marching prior to this in order to 'encourage conservation';)

what about conservation, a person with a swimming pool pays the same as an old guy living alone

flutered

Xenophile wrote: »

Maybe you might be good enough to let me know what was the last year Limerick did not have a Senior Minister at the Cabinet Table !

its not long since the present one dissed the local university, i would trade you the one we have for either mattie or lowry

mahoney_j

flutered wrote: »

when will the full quota of them jobs be filled if ever, tipp is hemmeroging jobs at the moment, a promise is just that a promise

Hiring starts late this year ,lots of work to do on site so construction jobs will be imminent ,300 jobs nailed on and very good chance of more .this is great news for Nenagh and north tipp .i worked in P&G for years and still know lots that were let go and took redundancy and struggled for work since ,many have ups killed and done course after course ,hopefully some of these will get jobs there .i also know many that have sat on there Arse and winged and moaned and ran Kelly.lowry etc into the ground .cant please everyone

one man clappin

While I am delighted to hear of the jobs announcement for Nenagh, the cynic in me is saying that it is all electioneering.

In March 2010 Mr Kelly announced 200 jobs for Nenagh in the old Aventis plant. Details here

How many are working in that business at the moment?

one man clappin

While I am delighted to hear of the jobs announcement for Nenagh, the cynic in me is saying that it is all electioneering.

In March 2010 Mr Kelly announced 200 jobs for Nenagh in the old Aventis plant. Details here

How many are working in that business at the moment?