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Government to pay mortgage arrears *Mod Note in Opening Post*

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    #92
    Smartguy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 214 ✭✭Smartguy


    DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »
    what sort of a question is that? i was working full time in a well paid job.

    A fairly straightforward one. Why not answer it properly? What was your income? How much of a deposit did you pay? What happened since?


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    #93
    Mr. teddywinkles
    Registered Users Posts: 2,181 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    KomradeBishop wrote: »
    It's both - and that's a bad way to resolve it, both economically and society/humanitarian-wise.

    People need to look at the wider macroeconomic issues related to this, not focus myopically on simplified moralistic issues.

    So if I live in a mansion and cant pay I should be subbed by taxpayer. Meanwhile people are trying to keep up with rental increases and mortgage repayments. Usc 2 on the way so.
    You talk about the economic viewpoint of this. Where's the money for this come from. How does that effect the economy of the country taking more money from people to pay for this


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    #94
    cursai
    Registered Users Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭cursai


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    So if I live in a mansion and cant pay I should be subbed by taxpayer. Meanwhile people are trying to keep up with rental increases and mortgage repayments. Usc 2 on the way so.
    You talk about the economic viewpoint of this. Where's the money for this come from. How does that effect the economy of the country taking more money from people to pay for this

    Well you'd be entitled to a humanitarian food drop from the UN every so often....


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    #95
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users Posts: 16,568 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Don't agree with this at all, I waited until I had enough saved and took out a mortgage I could afford to pay back, I would really resent having to foot the bill for someone else who gets bailed out because they borrowed more than they could afford just to live in a nice area in a big house.

    It sends out a message that doing the right thing and keeping the bills paid is a waste of time.


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    #96
    DARK-KNIGHT
    Registered Users Posts: 10,216 ✭✭✭✭DARK-KNIGHT


    Smartguy wrote: »
    A fairly straightforward one. Why not answer it properly? What was your income? How much of a deposit did you pay? What happened since?

    Do you think I should have to answer those questions?


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    #97
    Geniass
    Closed Accounts Posts: 643 ✭✭✭Geniass


    RecordStraight wrote: »
    They are double the rates of other Eurozone countries.

    Yes. I know, they are still low compared to historical rates. When a person takes out a VR mortgage they should count themselves very lucky to have historically low interest rates.


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    #98
    bjork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,554 ✭✭✭bjork


    DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »
    Do you think I should have to answer those questions?

    I don't but I do think you should own your actions

    You limited current earning potential by returning to education

    This will change in the future, but you should have planned extra resources to tide you over until that changes,.

    You say you need 15,000 to survive>. This is less than miminum age a job in a shop would earn you if you want to keep the house.

    Some times in life throws choices and maybe if you want to keep your house you need to postpone your education or do it part time, so you can achieve you goal of owning a house.


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    #99
    bjork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,554 ✭✭✭bjork


    jaysblades wrote: »
    Hahaha, i love reading all these comments from those cry babies who think just because they have a 9 to 5 , other poorer people should struggle on with no help. Keep crying you losers.

    Who's the poorer people?

    That comment doesn't make sense


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    #100
    Geniass
    Closed Accounts Posts: 643 ✭✭✭Geniass


    bjork wrote: »
    but you should have planned extra resources to tide you over until that changes.

    Seriously, did you read his post? Clueless.


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    #101
    jaysblades
    Closed Accounts Posts: 115 ✭✭jaysblades


    bjork wrote: »
    Who's the poorer people?

    That comment doesn't make sense

    People with no jobs and big morgages , ye know , the sick and disabled, and let's not forget those who just don't feel like working god bless em. Basically the people who these card punchers look down on because they have a J.O.B


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    #102
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    jaysblades - quit the trolling.


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    #103
    Mr. teddywinkles
    Registered Users Posts: 2,181 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    jaysblades wrote: »
    People with no jobs and big morgages , ye know , the sick and disabled, and let's not forget those who just don't feel like working god bless em. Basically the people who these card punchers look down on because they have a J.O.B

    What is being sick or being disabled to do with this thread?


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    #104
    RecordStraight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭RecordStraight


    jaysblades wrote: »
    People with no jobs and big morgages , ye know , the sick and disabled, and let's not forget those who just don't feel like working god bless em. Basically the people who these card punchers look down on because they have a J.O.B
    Those who just don't feel like working are living on the charity of those who do have to work. The sick and disabled are also taken care of out of the efforts of those who go to work.


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    #105
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    Folks, you should all know by now not to engage with someone who is trolling, it just drags the threads off topic.


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    #106
    Dwalsh58
    Closed Accounts Posts: 84 ✭✭Dwalsh58


    RecordStraight wrote:
    We could be looking at a situation where the people who thought it was too risky to buy back in the bubble - the smart, cautious people - who opted to rent are now going to see their tax money going to the reckless, foolish people who outbid them back in the day. The people who actually drove up the prices to crazy levels.

    on_my_oe wrote:
    I looked at the price, the interest rates and agreed to the terms. That included paying my mortgage repayment in exchange for (eventually) owning my home outright.

    on_my_oe wrote:
    Those in arrears did the same, and by that argument they don't want to pay the price they don't get to keep the goods.


    Why are you blaming the trackers for your troubles, you would take one if you got it.


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    #107
    JPCN1
    Registered Users Posts: 895 ✭✭✭JPCN1


    I'll not be voting for any TD who goes along with this.


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    #108
    RecordStraight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭RecordStraight


    Dwalsh58 wrote: »
    Why are you blaming the trackers for your troubles, you would take one if you got it.
    Where did that straw man come from? :confused:


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    #109
    Dwalsh58
    Closed Accounts Posts: 84 ✭✭Dwalsh58


    RecordStraight wrote:
    And why do you think there would not be enough property to house people? Are the repossessed houses going to be knocked down? Are there not tens of thousands of empty properties already in the country?


    Who do you think will be put into the repo houses only people who were evicted, vicious circle, costing more money. And ask yourself why are there tens of thousands of empty properties in the country already?


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    #110
    on_my_oe
    Registered Users Posts: 991 ✭✭✭on_my_oe


    My issue isn't with those who got trackers (and yes, I would have loved one).

    My issue is with borrowers who expect my taxes to pay off their commitments while I manage my own cash flow to pay my own bills. I work full time and study part time, and earn a below average wage. If I can do it with a variable rate mortgage, those with trackers can keep paying their own mortgages.

    hats off to anyone whatever their interest rate paying their own bills and not expecting a taxpayer funded write off, myself included.

    Those who can't pay their mortgage will need to adjust their expectations and rent.


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    #111
    on_my_oe
    Registered Users Posts: 991 ✭✭✭on_my_oe


    Dwalsh58 wrote: »
    Who do you think will be put into the repo houses only people who were evicted, vicious circle, costing more money. And ask yourself why are there tens of thousands of empty properties in the country already?

    No, they'll go on the market and be sold to people who can afford to pay their mortgage.

    There are families in Dublin, Galway etc mortgage approved and paying rents higher than the equivalent mortgage repayments. It would be more fair if the properties were repossessed, placed on the open market, and sold to families ready to meet their financial commitments. Their extra cash flow could either be spent on paying down their mortgage faster or in the general economy,Mike retail or domestic tourism.


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    #112
    RecordStraight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭RecordStraight


    Dwalsh58 wrote: »
    Who do you think will be put into the repo houses only people who were evicted, vicious circle, costing more money. And ask yourself why are there tens of thousands of empty properties in the country already?
    How would that be a 'vicious circle'? :confused:

    Do you propose that people who do pay their mortgages be evicted too?


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    #113
    Dwalsh58
    Closed Accounts Posts: 84 ✭✭Dwalsh58


    RecordStraight wrote:
    People seem to keep missing the point: houses are not going to disappear. What will happen is that people who currently rent will be in a position to buy - freeing up rentals. And those who are currently sitting in nice houses and not paying their mortgage would be repossessed, so they would move into the rental properties.

    RecordStraight wrote:
    No property is going to disappear. And there are still tens of thousands of empties out there all over the country.

    So the evicted homeowners can swap with the renters and the "tens of thousands of empties" will still be empty. Also plenty of houses have disappeared, they have been demolished.


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    #114
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Just where are these tens of thousands of vacant homes that several of you have referred to?


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    #115
    KomradeBishop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,981 ✭✭✭KomradeBishop


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    So if I live in a mansion and cant pay I should be subbed by taxpayer. Meanwhile people are trying to keep up with rental increases and mortgage repayments. Usc 2 on the way so.
    You talk about the economic viewpoint of this. Where's the money for this come from. How does that effect the economy of the country taking more money from people to pay for this
    Yes because everyone benefiting from this new policy is living in a mansion, right? :rolleyes:


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    #116
    RecordStraight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭RecordStraight


    Dwalsh58 wrote: »
    So the evicted homeowners can swap with the renters and the "tens of thousands of empties" will still be empty. Also plenty of houses have disappeared, they have been demolished.
    'Plenty'? Ok. I haven't heard of any.

    And what's wrong with the evicted people who aren't paying their mortgages renting? :confused: Renters are evicted every day for not paying their rent. Once you've got a mortgage contract from a bank, you are too good to ever rent?


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    #117
    DARK-KNIGHT
    Registered Users Posts: 10,216 ✭✭✭✭DARK-KNIGHT


    bjork wrote: »
    I don't but I do think you should own your actions

    You limited current earning potential by returning to education

    This will change in the future, but you should have planned extra resources to tide you over until that changes,.

    You say you need 15,000 to survive>. This is less than miminum age a job in a shop would earn you if you want to keep the house.

    Some times in life throws choices and maybe if you want to keep your house you need to postpone your education or do it part time, so you can achieve you goal of owning a house.

    I didn't say I needed 15000 to survive.....


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    #118
    mikemac1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,395 ✭✭✭✭mikemac1


    Gonna call my landlord and ask for rent forgiveness :D


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    #119
    RecordStraight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭RecordStraight


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    Just where are these tens of thousands of vacant homes that several of you have referred to?
    Nationwide. There were 300k empty at the last census. Some were holiday homes, of course.


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    #120
    bjork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,554 ✭✭✭bjork


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    Just where are these tens of thousands of vacant homes that several of you have referred to?

    According to this Feb 2014

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/feb/23/ireland-predicted-26000-empty-properties-end-2014
    There are now 14,000 empty houses and flats scattered across the Irish Republic, including 700 so-called "ghost estates".


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    #121
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    KomradeBishop wrote: »
    Yes because everyone benefiting from this new policy is living in a mansion, right? :rolleyes:

    Only a small minority are- however, there are people who have the means, but are deliberately not paying their mortgages, because hitherto, there has been no implications for them to not paying their mortgages. These free-loaders will be treated in an identical manner to those unfortunates- whose situations have changed and who now find themselves in difficulty. Meanwhile- those who have scrounged and borrowed- sometimes tens of thousands, to keep ontop of their mortgages- will not see any benefit from this- on the contrary- their promised mooted cuts in tax- won't transpire......

    If there was a proposal to strip these people of ownership of the property- and allow them to rent it back at open market rates- if they were in a position to do so- or if they were not- to give them support at the max of the scale to rent elsewhere- I don't think anyone would have any issue with it. It would also free up property for people who are in a position to buy- but because of supply constraints, they have been unable to do so.

    At the end of the day- there will be the same number of houses out there- and the same number of people to be housed. How these people are housed- will vary.

    Giving a subsidy to this subset of borrowers- when others who have been prudent- or have manipulated their scarce finances so they haven't defaulted on their mortgages- is very unfair- and I don't think its going to fly when the government get feedback on how many people are going to actively boycott the government parties, if they pursue this scheme.........

    There is a mess out there. Any solution to the mess- has to be seen as equitable to all taxpayers- and those who have gone to massive lengths not to default. Giving a dig out to people to live in, and eventually own, property they cannot afford- is imprudent- and an insult to the intelligence of the majority of the Irish people.


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