DAB/FM personal radio

heldel00

Living out in the country and love to go for walks. Would love to have a personal radio that would pick up local and national stations to bring with me but is this possible?
Argos have a few around the €80 mark (Roberts &Pure Move) but don't want to buy something that is not gonna pick up any stations for me.
Don't have a smartphone so apps/podcasts etc not an option.

dxhound2005

Have you got any sort of a radio in your house? Or in your car, if you have one? The FM band should be full of stations anywhere in the country. Forget about DAB.

For listening to while walking a small radio with headphones is what you need unless you intend to carry something bigger in your hand, and crank up the volume. I have this Sony which I got in Argos and it is very good. The earbuds are not great so I use proper headphones.

http://www.argos.ie/static/Product/partNumber/5003796/Trail/searchtext%3ESONY+RADIO.htm

heldel00

No it's a handy little one for walking that I'm looking for. I'll take a look at the link you sent. Thank you

Joe Doe

Scrap that idea, just get the €16! (Argos: 911/9882) which has both FM+DAB and the added bonus of 10 quick presets on each, along with headphone out.
Headphone (Line out) is great as means that you can send it into your main hifi/soundbar/Bose™ system etc.
Takes batteries and is pocket sized also, but dab can drain faster than regular dab so mains is best.
If local Dab signals improve, you're future proofed

heldel00

But are these devices going to pick up reception out in the middle of the country?

dxhound2005

heldel00 wrote: »

But are these devices going to pick up reception out in the middle of the country?

Reception outside and especially away from electric power lines will be even better than at home.

Do you own any sort of radio at the moment? Whatever you can hear on that you will hear out walking.

Joe Doe

Well 911/9882 has FM built into too, so if no DAB signals locally, then it will still pick up the main FM channels, by pressing one button.
You can also look at seperate DAB amplifiers/aerials or even quick diy signal hacks which are bound to get something digital.

Capt'n Midnight

If you have a smartphone and a data connection then you can listen to a zillion internet radio stations using something like tune in or various players

heldel00

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

If you have a smartphone and a data connection then you can listen to a zillion internet radio stations using something like tune in or various players

I think I'm the only person left in Ireland without a smartphone!

Capt'n Midnight

heldel00 wrote: »

I think I'm the only person left in Ireland without a smartphone!

Oh yeah you said that

Really it's down to location. If you are out in the styx then your reception will vary. You might not get DAB at all. And then even if you do battery life won't be great. If you can't get FM then you won't get DAB, if you can't get good phone signal then DAB is probably iffy.

If you have line of sight to areas where you walk (unlikely but) you could even do stuff like outdoors wifi antenna and listen to internet radio that way.


someone may have newer maps, and don't forget these are for car antennas
http://www.dbdb.ie/transmission-maps/

watty

Joe Doe wrote: »

... (Argos: 911/9882) which has both FM+DAB ..
Takes batteries and is pocket sized also, but dab can drain faster than regular dab so mains is best.
If local Dab signals improve, you're future proofed

Total junk.

x20 consumption of AM/FM portable on headphones and x6 of AM/FM radio on Loudspeaker.

Nor it is future proofed as DAB will NEVER have the coverage of FM, nor AM and is obsolete. DAB+ is only used to fit in twice as many stations. Even in UK they need hundreds more low power DAB transmitters to equal FM coverage.

My Sony Xperia phone's FM radio far better than any FM set in Argos or Tesco. The only good AM/FM sets now are old ones. No one is selling good ones, and €120+ DAB portable sets are about the quality of a sub €20 AM/FM set.

Oddly, Tesco's €10 world radio beats a lot of €100+ sets, but speaker too small. It will fit a large coat pocket and drive ear buds. They did have €14 to €16 "Kitchen" Radio which was quite good, but it's been replaced by their €12 very similar looking "Portable" model (still LW/MW/VHF), which is total junk, cost reduced insides, not a superhet.

Most areas need the aerial extended for VHF-FM or DAB. The FM Radio in a phone uses the earphone cable as aerial, that's why they won't work in speaker mode without the earphones.

watty

Joe Doe wrote: »

Well 911/9882 has FM built into too, so if no DAB signals locally, then it will still pick up the main FM channels, by pressing one button.
You can also look at seperate DAB amplifiers/aerials or even quick diy signal hacks which are bound to get something digital.

A €2 FM radio is better. It's scrap. Also presets are useless for travelling about.

heldel00

Might just be handier to upgrade the Nokia!!!

Joe Doe

911/9882 is brilliant and is the only one I could fine sub-100 notes that has both headphones (for line-in) and bunch of quick presets. You'd be surprised how many top of the range ones don't have both of these 'essential features'.

At 16 euro yes it's small, portable and mono, but once you send it into your main soundbar/hifi/2.1-5.1speakers/headphones it pumps out brilliant digital stereo, I have x20 DAB stations clear as crystal (way better than FM) on it sent out to the main 100w system. Comes with own mains adapter also.

Could use the FM option when out and DAB when indoors. I've the aerial wired/extended to the washing line which explains why I can get both e.g. BBCR6-1Xtra and RTEPulse-2XM

watty

way better than FM

Given the bit rate that is impossible.

DAB stations clear as crystal

It's digital. Either there is no noise or it doesn't work. But if you have hiss on FM, then you have either a rubbish aerial or rubbish radio or bad reception. Note that FM coverage in Ireland is more than twice DAB coverage.

Most of Ireland has no DAB. Most of the areas with DAB, it's RTE only. DAB is not cost effective for local radio. It only benefits National broadcasters with multiple stations.
RTE only has four extra digital stations, which have better coverage on a €6 DTT stick on a laptop than on DAB.
Add RTE1, 2FM, RTE1LW, Lyric, RnaG
That's 9 stations. Not 20.

My FM radio in my phone gets 21 "crystal clear" real stations (RTE's four extra Digital only stations are a waste of licence payer's money) and up to 50 FM stations.

DAB is Garbage. DAB Radio power consumption is terrible. Digital Radio as a concept is a failure compared with ease of use of FM and AM. It's Digital for the sake of it.

If they were prepared to spend x3 as much money on DAB, then it could be better quality than FM, but they won't, decent bit rate would mean 3 x Mux rather than 1. It's a redundant copy of DTT Radio with less coverage too! DTT "Radio" has the same too low bit rate.

A big issue on Digital radio of any kind is the slow channel change, it's acceptable on TV, but a disaster on Digital Radio. It's very much worse when you have more than one mux, which DAB seriously needs to be any good.

Note that WiFi / Internet Streaming isn't actually radio and has no privacy. It's a data connection where you are uniquely identified. It relies on a fragile and expensive infrastructure. It's not free. I only have Fixed / Home Internet, I can't afford the mobile kind.

heldel00

I think I may just forget about the idea of bringing a radio with me on a walk out in the countryside as Ireland just doesn't seem to have the systems for acceptable reception in place.

As I previously said, upgrading the Nokia seems to be the best idea!

Joe Doe

Perhaps, a 10e Nokia phone may be the best option for the country, I have one that operates fine as a radio even with the SIM card removed.

But for urban/indoor use and as an active Musician I can assure you the x20 (yes, twenty) DAB stations I have (on a 16 euro device) sound much better than their FM alternatives, regardless of bit-stats. CD's are digital and they generally sound fine too. AM/SW: Accessible but mostly just repeater noise from the cold front.

Now I do like the occasional 12" LP sent into a warm dual-12ax7 pre-amp and pair of Celestions, but DAB is fine and dandy also, not to be dismissed.


Norway should be updated on one of the previous posters findings, as they just 'closed down' their 'entire FM range' (today)

Fuzzy Clam

Joe Doe wrote: »

Norway should be updated on one of the previous posters findings, as they just 'closed down' their 'entire FM range' (today)

No they haven't.

They announced the closure of the national network to happen in 2017.

Local radio will continue on FM.

Joe Doe

'17 it is, they say it will save a fair bit of cash (for reinvestment in content), so likely any local stations will follow suit. FM still always useful for Air/Marine/CB/Taxis/Walkies etc. One advantage of domestic FM transceivers 27Mhz and possibly 400-470Mhz is that they may still operate in a Armageddon type empvent. Most cars-radios are a few years old so don't have DAB and tricky to reinstall.

from the press:

The announcement, made by their Ministry of Culture, makes Norway the first country to do away entirely with FM radio. The move is intended to save money and allow a full transition to digital radio, which Norway argues will give listeners "access to more diverse and pluralistic radio content and enjoy better sound quality and new functionality."

In its statement, the Norwegian government said the cost of transmitting national radio channels through the FM network is eight times higher than via the Digital Audio Broadcasting (DAB) system, the standard digital radio technology used across Europe. By shutting off FM, Norway's national radio channels will save more than $25 million a year, according to official figures "releasing funds for investment in radio content," argued Minister of Culture Thorhild Widvey.

"This is an important day for everyone who loves radio," said Thor Gjermund Eriksen, head of public broadcasting network NRK, in a statement. "The minister's decision allows us to concentrate our resources even more upon what is most important, namely to create high-quality and diverse radio content to our listeners."

The DAB system in Norway already offers 22 national channels, compared to just five on the FM band, and has the capacity for 20 more. A recent survey by TNS Gallup found that 55 percent of Norwegian households have at least one DAB-equipped radio.

Norway has long been a digital radio pioneer. NRK launched the world's first DAB channel on June 1, 1995. Other Scandinavian countries as well as the U.K. are thought to be considering an FM switch-off by 2022. The digital rollout in other European countries has been slower, with old FM radio still proving more popular in several territories.

Capt'n Midnight

Joe Doe wrote: »

'17 it is, they say it will save a fair bit of cash (for reinvestment in content), so likely any local stations will follow suit. FM still always useful for Air/Marine/CB/Taxis/Walkies etc. One advantage of domestic FM transceivers 27Mhz and possibly 400-470Mhz is that they may still operate in a Armageddon type empvent. Most cars-radios are a few years old so don't have DAB and tricky to reinstall.

from the press:

A recent survey by TNS Gallup found that 55 percent of Norwegian households have at least one DAB-equipped radio.

It's a bit like saying 55% of households have at least one phone, and it might be a car phone, in an era where you'd expect everyone to have access to their own phone.

watty

Most DAB radios in UK are only used on FM.
Most DAB radios have FM, some don't.

Ownership proves nothing, especially as many shops only have a couple of cheap rubbish non-DAB sets for sale.

watty

Fuzzy Clam wrote: »

No they haven't.

They announced the closure of the national network to happen in 2017.

Local radio will continue on FM.

It's purely driven by "bean counters" with no consideration for consumer. It's purely because DAB benefits a National Network with multiple channels prepared to have reduced quality to save 1/2 to 2/3rds of Mux costs.

So nothing to do with logic, consumer, quality etc. A scheme to save money for a National network that has already foolishly "bought into" Digital Radio.

Digital Radio at economic costs is 1/2 to 1/3 of FM quality and cost local & community stations more.

It costs users of portable sets a fortune more (rechargeable models often only manage less than 1 day operation) in batteries.

Tideswell

Hi. Can anyone get dab stations in Wexford?

watty

Yes. But why bother supporting an inherently substandard, obsolete, unfriendly format that penalises consumers and small broadcasters? It's only of benefit to RTE, and only if they turn off their FM.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/04/27/not_so_fast_on_fm_switchoff_dab_not_so_hot_say_small_broadcasters/

I swindled the NSA

watty wrote: »

Also presets are useless for travelling about.

The OP mentioned walking about Presets should be ok unless they go for LONG walks

watty

Or drive to where they walk.

But many sets don't actually even have enough presets. It's not the 1950s to 1970s anyore.

I swindled the NSA

watty wrote: »

But many sets don't actually even have enough presets..

Particularly ridiculous on DAB or Internet radios ?

Wouldn't recommend DAB for portable use either -poor reception and battery life

watty

FM on DAB sets might only have six presets and need a manual to figure how to retune. There can easily be 15 to 40 local stations.
DAB mode will have all the stations on the scanned multiplex. But if you need to rescan you may need the manual. Volume may be inconvenient pair of buttons.
Compared to simplicity of decent AM/FM where there is a band selector, tuning knob and clear scale and volume knob.

Presets only are useful where you only ever listen to same 4 to 6 stations. Multichannel TV abandoned the 4 to 6 presets of 1960 to 1980s 625 TVs* for an onscreen "tuning scale" with logical channel numbers (USA and Germany used channel numbers from 1950 on FM Radio), the EPG.
I only ever saw one DAB set with FM that had decent User Interface. In FM mode it simulated a tuning scale on the LCD. It was in the €200 and about the audio quality and styling of a €30 mini CD Boom box. Bass a fake thump on its stupid 3" speakers.
Most DAB sets have about enough battery life for half a days use.

(*405 TVs from 1955 had 13 "presets", each only slightly tunable across the associated channel, 1936 to 1950 some models had only one channel, factory or dealer tuned. If you moved from Birmingham to London the TV had to be left into TV Shop!).

"Internet Radio" is an oxymoron. They are Streaming gadgets that require Internet via WiFi, ethernet or 3G. Frequently become useless as the provider changes API, protocol or codec on their server and the manufacturer doesn't provide an upgrade. A cheap laptop and extension speakers or mini MP3 to FM transmitter plugged into Ear/Line out so you can listen on an FM set is better.
Also almost all so called "Internet Radio" have no phone modem so are only portable within your own house, need real Broadband. Also all day listening via Internet uses up a lot of data allowance.

It only works at all on Mobile because few people do it. At decent bit rate a mast sector might support as few as 12 users streaming audio at decent bit rate, assuming no-one making voice calls, video or web access. Mobile capacity is shockingly low. The quoted Mobile speed are for Perfect signal and one user. The connections are ALL unicast, so with 10 users the speed is 1/10th on LTE and 1/15th to 1/20th on 3G (with up to 2 or 3 connections there isn't much difference between 5MHz LTE and 5MHz 3G, it's only when the sector is fully loaded that 4G is twice as good, then typically 0.24Mbps vs 0.12 Mbps)

See http://www.radioway.info/comparewireless/
Explains why Mobile isn't scaleable for listening.
Real Radios are private (Internet they know where, when & who) and is unaffected by number of Radios.

Joe Doe

The 6e cheap one I have has x10 presets each for DAB+FM, very useful.
the 'scan' button performs full scan in 10secs and it's easy to store and retrieve.
Beats playing with a dial & needle on a retro device.

...Granted I had a look at about 20 other dab radios (up to 200 notes) and this was the one with the best interface,
and more importantly a headphones (line-out) socket, ideal for soundbars.

'Internet Radio' is very much over-hyped.

watty

Joe Doe wrote: »

The 6e cheap one I have has x10 presets each for DAB+FM, very useful.
the 'scan' button performs full scan in 10secs and it's easy to store and retrieve.
Beats playing with a dial & needle on a retro device.

10 each is pathetic. My Car radio has 18 FM presets and it's not enough because there is only scan and search, no proper manual tuning.
Six to ten presets is fine if there is decent manual tuning. My HiFi has 40 Presets, which is OK. My two best portable AM/FM has no tuning scale, but have 32 presets and 200 presets, digital frequency display and fast or slow knob based manual tuning (up down scan buttons are painful in comparison).
Search Sony ICF2001D and Yaesu VR500

The Sony phone's FM radio has an LCD simulated tuning scale (with swipe) and presets. Stereo and RDS station ID.

I have stereo table mode portables too.

A decent dial and needle is easy, needs no manual and is faster than 10s.

How many Multiplexes is that for the 10s? Or is that DAB or FM only or Both

"retro device"
Obviously you've never had decent real radio. Exactly how do you define a Retro device? A rubbish £15 radio? One without DAB?
Have you used a radio with LCD touch screen simulation of conventional tuning scale and pointer?

Or one with a flywheel on the mechanical tuning?

DAB is pretty "retro". It's an obsolete "not fit for purpose" standard, misused by broadcasters using 1/2 to 1/4 of the bit rate needed for HiFi.

"it's easy to store and retrieve."
I doubt it. Without sight of Manual?

Why are you so keen to promote a useless "digital for digital" sake technology? How many hours continuous listening on DAB?
Channel change delay on DAB:
1) Same Multiplex
2) A different Multiplex

Good luck on testing that with a tiny percentage of Ireland having more than the single RTE Multiplex and less than 45% having even that with useful reception.

Joe Doe

Again, 10 presets for dab and 10 presets for fm, which suits just fine, can only ever listen to one at a time, of course.
Can receive x20 dab stations (all full-time RTE+BBC*) via the washing line, but would only ever use ten of them anyway.
Some running up to 192 kbit/s Joint Stereo. If traveling (A6 size) the scan/memory setting is very simple process.

After comparing 20 or so, this was the only one that suited needs, irrelevant of price or bling.
Wouldn't suit anyone not on east coast, or anyone without separate amp/soundbar though due to the small speaker.

Have an big old hi-fi, includes twin-tape/cd/am/dial/clock/display etc. doesn't get used though...

dxhound2005

heldel00 wrote: »

I think I may just forget about the idea of bringing a radio with me on a walk out in the countryside as Ireland just doesn't seem to have the systems for acceptable reception in place.

As I previously said, upgrading the Nokia seems to be the best idea!

Rather than forgetting about the idea of bringing a radio with you, why not just bring one with you and see what happens. It appears that you do not possess a radio, nor a car radio, but you have decided that Ireland doesn't have the systems for acceptable reception. The system for reception is a radio, try it.

Fuzzy Clam

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Rather than forgetting about the idea of bringing a radio with you, why not just bring one with you and see what happens. It appears that you do not possess a radio, nor a car radio, but you have decided that Ireland doesn't have the systems for acceptable reception. The system for reception is a radio, try it.

Sometimes the logical suggestion is the best one :):)

thelordgod

I dont see the need for 40 or 50 presets for a radio for going for walks with. I've only newstalk tuned in on the car radio and I manage quite well. On a portable receiver with built-in antenna I would imagine one would pick up 6-8 stations with sufficient signal strength to give a pleasurable experience. Back in the day a rotary dial with no presets did the job and it was a bonus to have VHF (FM).

heldel00

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Rather than forgetting about the idea of bringing a radio with you, why not just bring one with you and see what happens. It appears that you do not possess a radio, nor a car radio, but you have decided that Ireland doesn't have the systems for acceptable reception. The system for reception is a radio, try it.

Of course I have a radio smartarse and guess what - a car radio too! It even has a CD player!!!
I'm looking to buy a handheld personal radio that people may have tried and that might work for me while out walking in the countryside.

What a really unhelpful post!

keithclancy

heldel00 wrote: »

Of course I have a radio smartarse and guess what - a car radio too! It even has a CD player!!!
I'm looking to buy a handheld personal radio that people may have tried and that might work for me while out walking in the countryside.

What a really unhelpful post!

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Roberts-Sports-Personal-Digital-Loudspeaker/dp/B002YT8CXW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1430816924&sr=8-1&keywords=portable+dab+fm

There you go.

heldel00

Thank you Keith.

This is actually the one I had been looking at on argos website. Bit more expensive there but if it works I'll quite happily purchase. Thanks again

Joe Doe

There is also another one which is about the size of a lighter, fairly cheap but not a great interface as only has a few plastic buttons.

On the plus side it's Li-on can be recharged off usb/laptop and does 5hrs on dab, (longer on fm), uses headphones as the antenna.
Bush Pocket DAB/FM Radio - Black. 915/3219 34e. Bought one last year at sale price around 20e...