Graham Dwyer court case *READ FIRST POST BEFORE POSTING*

brooke 2

LadyAthame wrote: »

I think they had a fantastic gut instinct. And realized how serious the nature of the crime was.

The young Garda in Roundwood was brilliant. If he had not been as diligent as he was, it is very unlikely that Graham Dwyer would now be in jail.

The Gardai in Foxrock were hugely impressive also, but, am I the only one
to be less than enthused by the seemingly lacklustre effort by the Gardai
in Stepaside when EOH originally went
missing?

LadyAthame

brooke 2 wrote: »

The young Garda in Roundwood was brilliant. If he had not been as diligent as he was, it is very unlikely that Graham Dwyer would now be in jail.

The Gardai in Foxrock were hugely impressive also, but, am I the only one
to be less than enthused by the seemingly lacklustre effort by the Gardai
in Stepaside when EOH originally went
missing?

I think that station was shut down a year later. Not excusing it but it was in the process of being closed. Pratically every shop on one side of the street in Stepaside has been burgled since the garda station was closed.:rolleyes:

But yes you are correct to mention it.

discodiva92

Nobody should have been outes in this trail
Surely a judge could put a total ban on media reporting

Omackeral

_Whimsical_ wrote: »

He mentioned the case of a young teenage girl brutally stabbed to death in Dublin and his only comment on it was to say what a lucky guy her killer was.

Did he make previous comments about Raoinead Murray's murder? I know Farah Noor of Scissor Sisters infamy did, but did Dwyer also say something? I could be getting mixed up.

pwurple

discodiva92 wrote: »

Nobody should have been outes in this trail
Surely a judge could put a total ban on media reporting

Justice needs to be conducted in public, not behind closed doors.

MouseTail

pwurple wrote: »

Justice needs to be conducted in public, not behind closed doors.

Justice not only needs to be done in public, it needs to be seen to be done. Had this case been conducted behind closed doors, the public would have been dissatisfied the conviction was safe. It was all the small details that added up which led the jury to convict.

realdanbreen

Smidge wrote: »

I would like to say that I believe in adult sexual relations in whatever shape way or form they come in. You want to dress as a baby, grand. You want a bit of light whipping while having an orange stuck in your gob by a 6'2 woman who looks like Arnie? Good for you, enjoy it.
But here's the kicker.....within reason.

Just wondering: I have searched the house high up and low down and can't find an Orange. Could I use a Lemon instead?

Laois_Man

Omackeral wrote: »

Did he make previous comments about Raoinead Murray's murder? I know Farah Noor of Scissor Sisters infamy did, but did Dwyer also say something? I could be getting mixed up.

Yes he did. He just referred to how her murderer and the murder of that woman in the Phoenix Park was never found.

When asked at one stage by Ms O’Hara about the likelihood of getting away with such a crime, he said: “I will. No one ever caught for Raonaid Murray or homeless woman in Phoenix Park.”

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/more-than-one-woman-under-graham-dwyers-dark-spell-320871.html

The latter was a reference to the unsolved murder of Eugenia Bratis who was stabbed to death in the Phoenix Park in August 2009.

I believe in the Murray murder at least, the Gardai have already checked Dwyers DNA profile against that of her murderer and he has been cleared. Which is grand, as long as they are sure they definitely have the DNA of her murderer!

stickybookmark

what i think was fascinating about this case was the insight it gave into the mind of such a person via the thousands of text messages. correct me if i'm wrong but i think never before in a case like this were the motives and modus operandi of the killer laid so bare. Via the texts he sent to Elaine he discussed all the questions the families of those kind of murder victims ask 'why' 'how' 'why her' etc. he discussed the reason he wanted to kill, how he planned to do it, what kind of victims he thought were suitable, how he planned to get away with it everything. to me that was fascinating and perhaps sheds some light on why similar killers are motivated to do what they do (sexual gratification of stabbing a woman to death during sex) it's not a craving i ever realised middle class 'normal' people like Dwyer possessed. it has really opened my eyes to be honest, and not in a good way

brooke 2

eviltwin wrote: »

The hurt caused to the Dwyer family is not over his affair, it's over the fact he killed a person! The extreme tastes were shared by many, as long as they were consensual participants it's no one's business. Dwyer made it everyone's business by bringing in innocent parties and targeting a vulnerable woman he could easily manipulate.

I imagine the affair caused excruciating pain to Dwyer's wife!! I don't know how the woman is still sane after realising that, at the same time as she was looking forward
to the birth of her second child, her husband was resuming bdsm activity with a
woman whom he eventually killed. 😬 It is heartbreaking enough to discover that
one's husband is cheating at such a time, but, hearing the texts from GD to EOH, a
few days after the baby's birth, in which he said that he could not get away as 'there
were too many people coming to the house to see the baby', must have made Gemma
Dwyer's head explode!!!! It is no surprise that she made the supreme effort to
appear in court to give evidence against him, something which Justice Tony Hunt
wholeheartedly acknowledged. His compassion and empathy for the traumatised woman was absolutely convincing.

So, I would contend that there was a great deal of hurt caused to at least one Dwyer family member by the affair.

Allyall

stickybookmark wrote: »

it's not a craving i ever realised middle class 'normal' people like Dwyer possessed. it has really opened my eyes to be honest, and not in a good way

It's not a craving I ever realised anyone had.. But obviously do..

It's messed up..

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/analyst-reveals-text-conversations-between-elaine-ohara-and-alleged-graham-dwyer-phone-665720.html

Corvo

Allyall wrote: »

It's not a craving I ever realised anyone had.. But obviously do..

It's messed up..

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/analyst-reveals-text-conversations-between-elaine-ohara-and-alleged-graham-dwyer-phone-665720.html

I'm sorry I read that.

_Whimsical_

Allyall wrote: »

It's not a craving I ever realised anyone had.. But obviously do..

It's messed up..

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/analyst-reveals-text-conversations-between-elaine-ohara-and-alleged-graham-dwyer-phone-665720.html

Me too, I never imagine anyone was into anything like this at all, and I'm pretty horrified at it.

During the trial videos were shown to the jury that featured Dwyer acting very violently with other women with their consent( or as much consent as Elaine gave, I suppose we'll never know what their mental state was). Among them was a top ranking female civil servant with responsibility for what was described as "very sensitive matters" in the media. Graham Dwyer has threatened to "out" other highly respected professionals and public figures who were also involved in that scene.
Makes you wonder...

I realise it sounds a prejudiced note to some but personally I can't really imagine how you could have a sexual interest in extreme violence, hurting others or yourself in the manner of Graham Dwyer, and be fully responsible. I feel uncomfortable at the thought of people deep into this stuff in positions of professional responsibility for the public. It's something I think really needs to hold a taboo, even stigma , within society.

eviltwin

brooke 2 wrote: »

I imagine the affair caused excruciating pain to Dwyer's wife!! I don't know how the woman is still sane after realising that, at the same time as she was looking forward
to the birth of her second child, her husband was resuming bdsm activity with a
woman whom he eventually killed. 😬 It is heartbreaking enough to discover that
one's husband is cheating at such a time, but, hearing the texts from GD to EOH, a
few days after the baby's birth, in which he said that he could not get away as 'there
were too many people coming to the house to see the baby', must have made Gemma
Dwyer's head explode!!!! It is no surprise that she made the supreme effort to
appear in court to give evidence against him, something which Justice Tony Hunt
wholeheartedly acknowledged. His compassion and empathy for the traumatised woman was absolutely convincing.

So, I would contend that there was a great deal of hurt caused to at least one Dwyer family member by the affair.

I wasn't implying it didn't Brooke but the affair is small in comparison to her husband being a sadist who murdered a woman. That's the only reason he's in the news, a normal affair Mrs Dwyer might have never found out, forgiven him, whatever. It happens all the time, people move on. Finding out the man you share your bed with was secretly planning to kill someone is a whole other level.

brooke 2

LadyAthame wrote: »

I think that station was shut down a year later. Not excusing it but it was in the process of being closed. Pratically every shop on one side of the street in Stepaside has been burgled since the garda station was closed.:rolleyes:

But yes you are correct to mention it.

I heard someone - Paul Williams? - draw attention to the issue of the closure of
small stations when he was praising the great work done by the gardaí in this
case. It does not bear thinking about if the one in Roundwood had been shut when
the three lads found some of EOH's effects. Would a garda have come out from
Greystones/Bray to search in the mud over a number of days as that young Garda
O'Donoghue from Roundwood actually did? I doubt it!! If it is not too facile a
word to use in such tragic circumstances, that garda was a hero whose diligence
and instinct have impressed all.

However, I was left totally underwhelmed and even gobsmacked at the unbelievably
lacklustre efforts by the gardai in Stepaside. It galled me to hear Williams using
the EOH case to slam the closure of the station, considering what we heard from
some of those gardai in court. When a now retired detective was asked if he did
not think it unusual to find chains in the bedside locker, iirc, he replied that 'it was
strange alright'!! We subsequently found out that GD had hung a noose in EOH's
apartment, which she had asked him to remove. A rope was found in her
apartment after she went missing - this was mentioned by the detective. When
another garda was asked if the rope was included in the items shown in court,
there was no sign of it! Also, the images of GD were available on the CCTV after
she went missing. As he was a stranger to the complex, who visited quite often,
and his name was on her computer when she downloaded all her contacts onto
it, one would wonder why he was not at least questioned.

Perhaps, in hindsight, it was better that they did not manage to get much done,
as it seems like Elaine was crying out from the grave to get justice for her brutal murder. The number of coincidences which eventually led to the discovery of her
remains and GD's conviction for her killing almost seemed to have been
orchestrated by a supernatural force!! Her remains being found on Friday the
13th, which was also GD's birthday, was yet another freaky coincidence.

ncmc

The more I hear about this case, the more I am staggered he didn’t put in a plea of manslaughter or assisted suicide. If you look at the details the guards had from her BDSM profile – she was clearly into hardcore BDSM, in her profile she listed knife play and blood letting as things she was in to. She had already met with a couple of men from the sites who said that her tastes were too extreme for them. She had also stated that she wanted a man to kill her in the course of one of their games. It was also on her file in the hospital that she no longer wanted to live but didn’t want to kill herself. All of this would have tied in nicely with either an assisted suicide defence or the idea of a sex game gone wrong. It would also have explained the haphazard way he disposed of her things – it could have indicated that the whole thing was unplanned or that he was in the grip of panic. He may very well have served similar time as Lillis if he had gone down this route.

It was a very risky move to plead not guilty, it was always going to be an all or nothing situation. Either he was going to walk away a free man or spend the rest of his life in jail. I think it says a lot about the man that his sense of being untouchable probably has caused him to be locked away for the rest of his life.

I wonder what his defence team thought about it, how much of the states case would they have been aware off? Surely they realised that the evidence was very damning, even with the absence of a cause of death.

Stheno

I always wonder how the defence team in cases like this cope with what must be a distasteful job

Valetta

Stheno wrote: »

I always wonder how the defence team in cases like this cope with what must be a distasteful job

€€€ $$$ £££

ohnonotgmail

ncmc wrote: »

The more I hear about this case, the more I am staggered he didn’t put in a plea of manslaughter or assisted suicide. If you look at the details the guards had from her BDSM profile – she was clearly into hardcore BDSM, in her profile she listed knife play and blood letting as things she was in to. She had already met with a couple of men from the sites who said that her tastes were too extreme for them. She had also stated that she wanted a man to kill her in the course of one of their games. It was also on her file in the hospital that she no longer wanted to live but didn’t want to kill herself. All of this would have tied in nicely with either an assisted suicide defence or the idea of a sex game gone wrong. It would also have explained the haphazard way he disposed of her things – it could have indicated that the whole thing was unplanned or that he was in the grip of panic. He may very well have served similar time as Lillis if he had gone down this route.

It was a very risky move to plead not guilty, it was always going to be an all or nothing situation. Either he was going to walk away a free man or spend the rest of his life in jail. I think it says a lot about the man that his sense of being untouchable probably has caused him to be locked away for the rest of his life.

I wonder what his defence team thought about it, how much of the states case would they have been aware off? Surely they realised that the evidence was very damning, even with the absence of a cause of death.

just as a point of information his defence team would have been provided with all of the evidence against him in advance of the trial. its a legal requirement.

Stheno

Valetta wrote: »

€€€ $$$ £££

I'm sure I rwas that Dwyer was on legal aid. Doesn't that impact the fees for the legal team?

Dwarf.Shortage

Stheno wrote: »

I always wonder how the defence team in cases like this cope with what must be a distasteful job

Barristers are supposed to advocate for their clients irrespective of their own interests or feelings, this case is probably as hard as it gets in terms of doing so. I trust as professionals his counsel will give their all to his appeal as they should but it must be hard for them to do so in the circumstances.

brooke 2

eviltwin wrote: »

I wasn't implying it didn't Brooke but the affair is small in comparison to her husband being a sadist who murdered a woman. That's the only reason he's in the news, a normal affair Mrs Dwyer might have never found out, forgiven him, whatever. It happens all the time, people move on. Finding out the man you share your bed with was secretly planning to kill someone is a whole other level.

My post was in reply to your saying that the Dwyer family was not hurt by the affair
but by the murder.

Her husband murdering a woman was horrific in itself. Finding out that he was
involved in bdsm activity with the victim while she (his wife) was still pregnant
must have been excruciating painful for her.

Dwarf.Shortage

Stheno wrote: »

I'm sure I rwas that Dwyer was on legal aid. Doesn't that impact the fees for the legal team?

It means they're fixed (at a fairly high rate). In the high court a brief fee of €3,150 would be paid to cover the initial research and work done before the trial, a refresher fee of €1,350 per day of the trial would also be paid.

A private arrangement with a barrister could be at any level, it's like buying anything, price is agreed between the two parties and is no one else's business.

eviltwin

brooke 2 wrote: »

My post was in reply to your saying that the Dwyer family was not hurt by the affair
but by the murder.

Her husband murdering a woman was horrific in itself. Finding out that he was
involved in bdsm activity with the victim while she (his wife) was still pregnant
must have been excruciating painful for her.

And my post was in response to someone who was focused on the affair as the cause of the family's pain. I never said the affair wouldn't have been hurtful but it's minor compared to the murder charge. That woman's life totally changed, she's had to leave her home, she has to explain to her children about this as they get older, she's forever associated with him....the affair would pale into insignificance compared to all that.

ncmc

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

just as a point of information his defence team would have been provided with all of the evidence against him in advance of the trial. its a legal requirement.

That’s what I thought, you would imagine that an experienced defence team would have seen that the amount of evidence was damning and encouraged him to plea bargain.

But then it fits in of what I’ve read about the man. He probably thinks himself smarter than the defence team. His confidence in himself seems to be incredulous.

walkingshadow

ncmc wrote: »

That’s what I thought, you would imagine that an experienced defence team would have seen that the amount of evidence was damning and encouraged him to plea bargain.

But then it fits in of what I’ve read about the man. He probably thinks himself smarter than the defence team. His confidence in himself seems to be incredulous.

Someone's been watching My Cousin Vinny

ohnonotgmail

ncmc wrote: »

That’s what I thought, you would imagine that an experienced defence team would have seen that the amount of evidence was damning and encouraged him to plea bargain.

But then it fits in of what I’ve read about the man. He probably thinks himself smarter than the defence team. His confidence in himself seems to be incredulous.

that was my reading of it as well. part of his psychopathy.

Dolbert

ncmc wrote: »

The more I hear about this case, the more I am staggered he didn’t put in a plea of manslaughter or assisted suicide. If you look at the details the guards had from her BDSM profile – she was clearly into hardcore BDSM, in her profile she listed knife play and blood letting as things she was in to. She had already met with a couple of men from the sites who said that her tastes were too extreme for them. She had also stated that she wanted a man to kill her in the course of one of their games. It was also on her file in the hospital that she no longer wanted to live but didn’t want to kill herself. All of this would have tied in nicely with either an assisted suicide defence or the idea of a sex game gone wrong. It would also have explained the haphazard way he disposed of her things – it could have indicated that the whole thing was unplanned or that he was in the grip of panic. He may very well have served similar time as Lillis if he had gone down this route.

The judge repeatedly reminded the jury that there is no such thing as consent when it comes to killing in Irish law. She could have hand written him a letter begging him to kill her and it would still be murder. The accidental death defence could have been a different story.

Tordelback

_Whimsical_ wrote: »

Me too, I never imagine anyone was into anything like this at all, and I'm pretty horrified at it.

A tiny, tiny handful of people in a large population. It's appalling, utterly appalling, but in no way representative of something that men, 'middle class professionals' or not, would ever even think of, let alone fantasise about, let alone act on. Dwyer is an aberration, not the revelation of a new facet of male desire.

seamus

Dolbert wrote: »

The judge repeatedly reminded the jury that there is no such thing as consent when it comes to killing in Irish law. She could have hand written him a letter begging him to kill her and it would still be murder.

Indeed, there's no mitigation or anything in that regard. If you intend to cause death and death occurs, it's murder and the sentence is life, no ifs or buts.

In any case when assisted suicide becomes legal, it wouldn't cover situations where two people take upon themselves to get it done outside of a legal process.

_Whimsical_

Tordelback wrote: »

A tiny, tiny handful of people in a large population. It's appalling, utterly appalling, but in no way representative of something that men, 'middle class professionals' or not, would ever even think of, let alone fantasise about, let alone act on. Dwyer is an aberration, not the revelation of a new facet of male desire.

I'm fully aware of that, and aware that it's not just men who are willing to countenance such extremes. My post was about a woman involved with Graham Dwyer.I would never have imagined such desires existed at all among anyone though. In the interests of being clear "middle class professionals" was not a quote from my initial post either, I was not more shocked about this case because of this man's career our background.

_Whimsical_

ncmc wrote: »

The more I hear about this case, the more I am staggered he didn’t put in a plea of manslaughter or assisted suicide. If you look at the details the guards had from her BDSM profile – she was clearly into hardcore BDSM, in her profile she listed knife play and blood letting as things she was in to. She had already met with a couple of men from the sites who said that her tastes were too extreme for them. She had also stated that she wanted a man to kill her in the course of one of their games. It was also on her file in the hospital that she no longer wanted to live but didn’t want to kill herself. All of this would have tied in nicely with either an assisted suicide defence or the idea of a sex game gone wrong. It would also have explained the haphazard way he disposed of her things – it could have indicated that the whole thing was unplanned or that he was in the grip of panic. He may very well have served similar time as Lillis if he had gone down this route.

It was a very risky move to plead not guilty, it was always going to be an all or nothing situation. Either he was going to walk away a free man or spend the rest of his life in jail. I think it says a lot about the man that his sense of being untouchable probably has caused him to be locked away for the rest of his life.

I wonder what his defence team thought about it, how much of the states case would they have been aware off? Surely they realised that the evidence was very damning, even with the absence of a cause of death.

There were several texts in which she told him that she did not want him to kill her. In response he told her she must find another woman to kill if she did not want him to kill her. As a reward he said he would father a baby for her.
It was perfectly clear too him that while she was depressed, mentally ill, suicidal at times, she did not want to be killed by him and all she really wanted was to have a baby

Sala

While I don't think he will get out for a long time, I wonder if it's even possible for An application for parole to be considered if he never admits that he did it? I presume remorse etc are a factor and he couldn't be remorseful if he says he's not guilty?

Stheno

Sala wrote: »

While I don't think he will get out for a long time, I wonder if it's even possible for An application for parole to be considered if he never admits that he did it? I presume remorse etc are a factor and he couldn't be remorseful if he says he's not guilty?

He can automatically after eight years irrc doesnt mean he will be successful

LadyAthame

ncmc wrote: »

The more I hear about this case, the more I am staggered he didn’t put in a plea of manslaughter or assisted suicide. If you look at the details the guards had from her BDSM profile – she was clearly into hardcore BDSM, in her profile she listed knife play and blood letting as things she was in to.

It was nothing to do with BDSM.

He was arrogant that's why.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/analyst-reveals-text-conversations-between-elaine-ohara-and-alleged-graham-dwyer-phone-665720.html

Originally Posted by _Whimsical_
Me too, I never imagine anyone was into anything like this at all, and I'm pretty horrified at it.

He is just evil.

There were several texts in which she told him that she did not want him to kill her.

Yep and he knew this too.

He knew he was being a bastard he just didn't care.

K4t

Allyall wrote: »

I don't count him as people.

I would be happy to learn that every day somebody is pulling a bit of each fingernail out, and that Electrodes are constantly being moved around his body, so he doesn't become accustomed to the pain in a specific area.
I would be overjoyed to think that as each day passed, he was inflicting some sort of mental torture on himself.

I also find it odd that you are looking for the stuff he had downloaded on his computer, even if you were to tell me that you wanted it for research puroposes.

What's odd is that I was obviously joking about wanting links to the porn he had on his pc (though I wouldn't mind having a look at them!), but I'm not sure you're joking about wanting him tortured; nor are many others in this thread. It's quite revealing.

deseil

K4t wrote: »

What's odd is that I was obviously joking about wanting links to the porn he had on his pc (though I wouldn't mind having a look at them!), but I'm not sure you're joking about wanting him tortured; nor are many others in this thread. It's quite revealing.

Yes but he's evil and elaine is dead your just looking for kicks!

Dwarf.Shortage

K4t wrote: »

What's odd is that I was obviously joking about wanting links to the porn he had on his pc (though I wouldn't mind having a look at them!), but I'm not sure you're joking about wanting him tortured; nor are many others in this thread. It's quite revealing.

Took you a while to arrive with that, horse getting old?

K4t

deseil wrote: »

Yes but he's evil and elaine is dead your just looking for kicks!

I don't look for kicks when discussing a person's murder. I don't look for the murderer to be tortured either, no matter how evil he might be.

deseil

K4t wrote: »

I don't look for kicks when discussing a person's murder. I don't look for the murderer to be tortured either, no matter how evil he might be.

You asked for links, retracted it and then asked again. So your just interested in watching other people tortured but don't like talk of Graham dwyer being tortured ...ya

K4t

deseil wrote: »

You asked for links, retracted it and then asked again. So your just interested in watching other people tortured but don't like talk of Graham dwyer being tortured ...ya

They're pornographic videos afaik. Not real I hope. I don't like anybody being tortured, prisoners or otherwise.

Roquentin

hows it, it took a year and the discovery of certain items for the gards to nail him. could they not have checker her phone records and they would have seen all these texts from dywer about rape and murder etc. surely when you send a text to someone meteor or O2 records that text somewhere?

seventeen sheep

K4t wrote: »

They're pornographic videos afaik.

I believe it was a pregnant woman being stabbed ...

Spanish Eyes

Some things strike me here.

What GD's own family in Cork think about his actions. Maybe they think he is innocent. And I think of the notoriety of having a son/brother etc. convicted of this murder. How some people get on with their lives in a small community/neighborhood etc. (Ireland is a small place) is a mystery to me. The embarrassment factor for one. Would you leave the area? Not that it is GD's family's fault, and they are blameless, but to support someone like that makes me wonder. But there is not accounting for family ties. Any statement from his family at all? They supported him all through the trial and beyond. I don't know, maybe it is a natural thing for families to do, but still....

Regarding the children of Dwyer. AFAIK Joe O' Reilly sees his children regularly, his mistress brings them to see him, I read that somewhere. Although Dwyer didn't kill his wife, so maybe the wife (or soon to be former wife I reckon) has some leverage there re access to the children, but I wouldn't bet on it. Human Rights and all that.

And furthermore, not only has his wife to deal with this total embarrassment, shame, awful stuff re her husband ( not that any of those feelings are HER problem, but that's the reality), she also has friends, family, work colleagues, school mammies and dads of her children. Jeees, I so admire that woman for getting up in court with all that going on.

Anyway, an appeal will be next. So that should be interesting.

What do people think grounds for appeal will be?

tayto lover

Roquentin wrote: »

hows it, it took a year and the discovery of certain items for the gards to nail him. could they not have checker her phone records and they would have seen all these texts from dywer about rape and murder etc. surely when you send a text to someone meteor or O2 records that text somewhere?

Dwyer was texting from an untraceable phone and was only linked to him after it was recovered from the reservoir.

K4t

seventeen sheep wrote: »

I believe it was a pregnant woman being stabbed ...

But was it real?

Dwarf.Shortage

tayto lover wrote: »

Dwyer was texting from an untraceable phone and was only linked to him after it was recovered from the reservoir.

IIRC what they stung him on was the frequency with which the master phone would be connecting to the same mast as his personal phone. Basically the two phones moved together so exactly and so often that it was basically impossible for him not to be the possessor of the master phone as if it was someone else's they'd have to have been following him everywhere for months including out to the middle of nowhere when he went to fly his models etc.

Flippyfloppy

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Some things strike me here.

What GD's own family in Cork think about his actions. Maybe they think he is innocent. And I think of the notoriety of having a son/brother etc. convicted of this murder. How some people get on with their lives in a small community/neighborhood etc. (Ireland is a small place) is a mystery to me. The embarrassment factor for one. Would you leave the area? Not that it is GD's family's fault, and they are blameless, but to support someone like that makes me wonder. But there is not accounting for family ties. Any statement from his family at all? They supported him all through the trial and beyond. I don't know, maybe it is a natural thing for families to do, but still....

Regarding the children of Dwyer. AFAIK Joe O' Reilly sees his children regularly, his mistress brings them to see him, I read that somewhere. Although Dwyer didn't kill his wife, so maybe the wife (or soon to be former wife I reckon) has some leverage there re access to the children, but I wouldn't bet on it. Human Rights and all that.

And furthermore, not only has his wife to deal with this total embarrassment, shame, awful stuff re her husband ( not that any of those feelings are HER problem, but that's the reality), she also has friends, family, work colleagues, school mammies and dads of her children. Jeees, I so admire that woman for getting up in court with all that going on.

Anyway, an appeal will be next. So that should be interesting.

What do people think grounds for appeal will be?

Did his family support him through the trial and beyond??? Link.

Dwarf.Shortage

seventeen sheep wrote: »

I believe it was a pregnant woman being stabbed ...

Flashback to The Red Wedding in GOT's, rough.

Roquentin

tayto lover wrote: »

Dwyer was texting from an untraceable phone and was only linked to him after it was recovered from the reservoir.

yea, but couldnt they have seen the texts from elaines phone as in they check her phone records