Cork Airport - *Read Mod Note in First Post Before Posting*

flexcon

marno21 wrote: »

This is the usual stuff being peddled by the media about Cork vs Dublin and the daa acting in their own interests etc. This belief that the daa are assigning routes or contracting in airlines to operate from Dublin needs to be quashed.

The people who are to blame here are the people who actually board these buses and go to Dublin to fly. Nobody is forcing them onto these buses to go to Dublin, and I can guarantee you some of them will complain that Cork Airport is useless/****/waste of time but didn't even look up flights from Cork. There will be people on that bus going to Dublin to fly to London, Manchester, Paris or other destinations from Cork at likely similar prices to Cork and for as long as people do that Cork Airport will suffer. Said people will be the first to complain about Cork Airport.

Personally, I would always fly out of a regional airport before Dublin, it's much more convenient and a lot less stressful. I cannot understand why you would accept a 3.5 hour bus journey to Dublin Airport without exploring options from Cork. For most UK, parts of Europe, Spain/Portugal and eastbound long haul, there are many decent options from Cork.

Blaming Dublin Airport, the daa or Aircoach is a waste of time and will achieve nothing.

That is a very narrow minded post.

I want to get to Croatia. I can't from Cork. So I pay 70 quid for Ryanair Dublin to Zadar.

Or else 300 quid for Cork to amsterdam and then to Zadar.

If it was 300 direct to Croatia, then I'd happily do it.

I honestly think you are very wrong at the end to suggest blaming DAA or Aircoach is a waste of time and will achieve nothing. It certainly is PART of the issue.

JCX BXC

Yeah, but it's not an issue you can actually fix, it's logical. Dublin has 10x the passengers cork has, and naturally, has more services to more destinations and offers a greater choice. I can't see a Croatian route being on the agenda for another few years ago least.

kooga

last October I flew cork to dubrovnik myself, wife and two kids

outward flight cork Stansted Ryanair - then stan to dubr with jet 2
return dubr - Gatwick Norwegian - then gat cork with Ryanair

all in €1076 or €269 each return

hans aus dtschl

The reason people are so frustrated with Cork losing connections to European business cities like Munich, Amsterdam and Berlin when it has such a fantastic selection of flights to economic backwaters of Spain and Portugal is possibly because they're using the flights for business.

Secondly, many people in the 20-40 age bracket like weekend city breaks that don't involve Thursday flights, Tuesday flights, or midday Saturday flights.

Cork Airport, you can have this groundbreaking market research for free.

marno21

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

The reason people are so frustrated with Cork losing connections to European business cities like Munich, Amsterdam and Berlin when it has such a fantastic selection of flights to economic backwaters of Spain and Portugal is possibly because they're using the flights for business.

Secondly, many people in the 20-40 age bracket like weekend city breaks that don't involve Thursday flights, Tuesday flights, or midday Saturday flights.

Cork Airport, you can have this groundbreaking market research for free.

Flight to Liverpool out Friday 6pm, out Saturday morning, in Sunday afternoon. You could fill 747s some weeks with the demand

Similar with Newcastle

hans aus dtschl

Yes and London and Amsterdam are also both quite do-able Marno, but if you're visiting UK cities every time the shine wears off. And with Brexit coming, we're all trying to desperately wean ourselves OFF our UK customers.

Losing Munich and Berlin were a real loss. Rome's gone now too. Dusseldorf, Girona and Verona aren't quite in the same league.
Not securing Prague was a missed opportunity, as is not running Zurich through Winter, though with any luck they'll change that.

The airport itself is a great facility (though the public transport is lacking) but the route selection and timetabling are the problem.

JCX BXC

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

The reason people are so frustrated with Cork losing connections to European business cities like Munich, Amsterdam and Berlin when it has such a fantastic selection of flights to economic backwaters of Spain and Portugal is possibly because they're using the flights for business.

Secondly, many people in the 20-40 age bracket like weekend city breaks that don't involve Thursday flights, Tuesday flights, or midday Saturday flights.

Cork Airport, you can have this groundbreaking market research for free.

You do realise that airlines choose the routes? Airports have little say. An airline will rarely fly a marginal route in a prime slot as they can and do get better returns on other routes! You can have this groundbreaking logic for free.

hans aus dtschl

JCX BXC wrote: »

You do realise that airlines choose the routes? Airports have little say. An airline will rarely fly a marginal route in a prime slot as they can and do get better returns on other routes! You can have this groundbreaking logic for free.

And if an airline approaches the DAA with a view to doing a route between, say, Prague and Cork, and the DAA wants to run that route between Dublin and Prague instead, in order to boost it's numbers to avoid political problems after recently running a massive infrastructure overspend, which airport would they offer the airline a lower rate from, would you say?

...just theoretically speaking...

This is what many in Cork think about the DAA's running of their largest competitor.

JCX BXC

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

And if an airline approaches the DAA with a view to doing a route between, say, Prague and Cork, and the DAA wants to run that route between Dublin and Prague instead, in order to boost it's numbers to avoid political problems after recently running a massive infrastructure overspend, which airport would they offer the airline a lower rate from, would you say?

...just theoretically speaking...

Cork, as they already have good connections to Prague.

Shannon is now independent, why haven't they received these magic routes?

TheChizler

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

And if an airline approaches the DAA with a view to doing a route between, say, Prague and Cork, and the DAA wants to run that route between Dublin and Prague instead, in order to boost it's numbers to avoid political problems after recently running a massive infrastructure overspend, which airport would they offer the airline a lower rate from, would you say?

...just theoretically speaking...

Why would an airline change the airport they want to fly in to at the request of the DAA? If they wanted to fly in to Dublin they would have approached the DAA with that proposal.

hans aus dtschl

JCX BXC wrote: »

Cork, as they already have good connections to Prague.

Shannon is now independent, why haven't they received these magic routes?

The glut of Dublin connections hasn't spilled over to Cork on many routes, though? How do you explain that?

Shannon has seen good growth: the only route I can think of offhand that Shannon lost over the past few years was the Berlin route, which they lost to Farranfore. Though AFAIK, we're not supposed to be talking about Shannon V Cork on this particular thread.

hans aus dtschl

TheChizler wrote: »

Why would an airline change the airport they want to fly in to at the request of the DAA? If they wanted to fly in to Dublin they would have approached the DAA with that proposal.

If they wanted to fly in to Cork, they would also have approached the DAA with that proposal. And then if everything was cleared and everybody was satisfied, the route would have been announced. Advertised, even, maybe. Before changing to Dublin, instead.
Something like that could never happen, right?

Masala

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

And if an airline approaches the DAA with a view to doing a route between, say, Prague and Cork, and the DAA wants to run that route between Dublin and Prague instead, in order to boost it's numbers to avoid political problems after recently running a massive infrastructure overspend, which airport would they offer the airline a lower rate from, would you say?

...just theoretically speaking...

This is what many in Cork think about the DAA's running of their largest competitor.

...aahh I dunno!!! Thats a bit simplistic view! The boys in Cork will have be handling any potential interested airlines with kiddy gloves..... Dublin will be last people to hear about it. Are you posting in the Aviation thread or the Conspiratory Theory thread????

JCX BXC

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

The glut of Dublin connections hasn't spilled over to Cork on many routes, though? How do you explain that?

Lack of market, not the big bad Dublin stealing ass the passengers.

Shannon has seen good growth: the only route I can think of offhand that Shannon lost over the past few years was the Berlin route, which they lost to Farranfore. Though AFAIK, we're not supposed to be talking about Shannon V Cork on this particular thread.

Yes, but they've gained NO proper continental city routes that are usable for business or weekend breaks. These are the very routes you say the DAA is preventing Cork from getting! And we're not talking SNN v ORK here, we're comparing situations, showing how little difference this split from the DAA actually made, debunking the myth of Dublin strangling regionals by managerial force.

snotboogie

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

JCX BXC wrote: »

Cork, as they already have good connections to Prague.

Shannon is now independent, why haven't they received these magic routes?

The glut of Dublin connections hasn't spilled over to Cork on many routes, though? How do you explain that?

Shannon has seen good growth: the only route I can think of offhand that Shannon lost over the past few years was the Berlin route, which they lost to Farranfore. Though AFAIK, we're not supposed to be talking about Shannon V Cork on this particular thread.

Shannon also had a much worse time during the recession, going from 3.6 million down to 1.4 million and is now back to 1.75 million. Cork went from 3.25 million down to 2 million and is now back to 2.3 million. Both look like they will grow by about 100k this year. This idea that Shannon has flourished outside the DAA and Cork has suffered within it is complete BS, both airports were decimated by the recession but if anything Cork fared a bit better overall.

Masala

but if anything Cork fared a bit better overall.

I always say ..." its always better to be on the inside looking out than to be on the outside looking in !!"

You cant beat the auld cheque coming in from head office every month.

snotboogie

Masala wrote: »

but if anything Cork fared a bit better overall.

I always say ..." its always better to be on the inside looking out than to be on the outside looking in !!"

You cant beat the auld cheque coming in from head office every month.

I'm not talking about money at all, I'm taking about pax.

SleetAndSnow

I’d say give it a chance, it’s his sort of attitude that will decimate cork airports numbers and is one of the main reasons the media keeps doing negative articles surrounding cork airport, because that’s what people are talking about.

As snotboogie pointed out Cork Airport has over 3% growth , airlines WILL see this, they aren’t stupid, they are a business and if they see opportunities they will strike for it. Yes cork airport needs to go out and try to attract the Airlines but if we stop complaining and try to talk about the positives of the Recent success of the airport then more of the population will see the positive press reports and growth will continue.

marno21

snotboogie wrote: »

Shannon also had a much worse time during the recession, going from 3.6 million down to 1.4 million and is now back to 1.75 million. Cork went from 3.25 million down to 2 million and is now back to 2.3 million. Both look like they will grow by about 100k this year. This idea that Shannon has flourished outside the DAA and Cork has suffered within it is complete BS, both airports were decimated by the recession but if anything Cork fared a bit better overall.

Shannon was decimated during the recession due to a massive FR pullout which they were reliant and the end of the Stopover breastfeeding policy. It won't recover to those numbers again unless something radical happens.

SleetAndSnow wrote: »

I’d say give it a chance, it’s his sort of attitude that will decimate cork airports numbers and is one of the main reasons the media keeps doing negative articles surrounding cork airport, because that’s what people are talking about.

As snotboogie pointed out Cork Airport has over 3% growth , airlines WILL see this, they aren’t stupid, they are a business and if they see opportunities they will strike for it. Yes cork airport needs to go out and try to attract the Airlines but if we stop complaining and try to talk about the positives of the Recent success of the airport then more of the population will see the positive press reports and growth will continue.

Cork has had some very respectable and USEFUL route additions in recent years, as you point out. Zurich, Madrid, Paris (AF) are great routes, Zurich especially. Aircraft such as the Bombardier CSeries (now the Airbus A220) will make some of these routes more viable due to the lower overheads with the new planes, as Swiss seem to have been proving.

Prague would be a nice route, as would Rome, and more year round hub connectivity to Madrid, Zurich.

Shn99

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

The glut of Dublin connections hasn't spilled over to Cork on many routes, though? How do you explain that?

Shannon has seen good growth: the only route I can think of offhand that Shannon lost over the past few years was the Berlin route, which they lost to Farranfore. Though AFAIK, we're not supposed to be talking about Shannon V Cork on this particular thread.

Shannon has seen ok growth (23%) since 2013, so has the economy. The notion that the DAA wanted to drive SNN into the ground is a fantasy...airlines werent going to open routes in the height of the recession and they had fallen out with Ryanair. If what your claiming what "happened" to SNN is happening to ORK, take a look at the passenger numbers, new airlines ect. Anyway, lets change the subject

zetalambda

JCX BXC wrote: »

Lack of market, not the big bad Dublin stealing ass the passengers.

I'm not sure I'd agree with that. There's probably the same amount of Cork people flying out of Dublin airport every day as Cork airport. Too many people willing to spend 4 hours on a bus each way just to save €20. And then you have the people that are just in the habit of always using Dublin airport like the guy on here a few months ago from EMC who chose to fly to their head office in Massachusetts via Dublin when it would have been easier and quicker to go from Cork with Norwegian.

Shn99

zetalambda wrote: »

I'm not sure I'd agree with that. There's probably the same amount of Cork people flying out of Dublin airport every day as Cork airport. Too many people willing to spend 4 hours on a bus each way just to save €20. And then you have the people that are just in the habit of always using Dublin airport like the guy on here a few months ago from EMC who chose to fly to their head office in Massachusetts via Dublin when it would have been easier and quicker to go from Cork with Norwegian.

Cityjet to LCY, WOW to KEF, EI to LBA. These routes were axed due to low demand

JCX BXC

zetalambda wrote: »

I'm not sure I'd agree with that.

If the market won't fly then it's not a market.

Although, if I said it was white you'd say it was black. Discussion goes nowhere.

zetalambda

Shn99 wrote: »

Cityjet to LCY, WOW to KEF, EI to LBA. These routes were axed due to low demand

Yes, Einstein, I believe I've covered some of the issues that contribute to low demand. I'm not sure about the other routes you mentioned but Cityjet were flying at a time that suited nobody.

Aer Lingus could add a flight to LHR at 2 a.m and I'm sure this would end up being axed due to low demand too. Or Ryanair could start using an A380 on their STN route and that would be axed due to low demand.

JCX BXC wrote: »

If the market won't fly then it's not a market.

Although, if I said it was white you'd say it was black. Discussion goes nowhere.

If it's any consolation, I agree with your posts 90% of the time.

Shn99

zetalambda wrote: »

Yes, Einstein, I believe I've covered some of the issues that contribute to low demand.

You can use my username Shn99 instead of childish references.

zetalambda

Sorry hon, didn't mean to hurt your feelings.

Jennehy

Flying aerlingus Tuesday 8.15pm. What time would I need to allow to get through security?
Would arriving at short term parking at 7.30pm be cutting it tight? No check in luggage.

.red.

Jennehy wrote: »

Flying aerlingus Tuesday 8.15pm. What time would I need to allow to get through security?
Would arriving at short term parking at 7.30pm be cutting it tight? No check in luggage.

That's the last flight out so the airport will be quiet. If you got to the airport at 7.30pm then you'd have time but any delay and you could be cutting it fine. Depending on where your coming from you could meet a traffic jam from a small crash and end up being late. I'd plan on being there an hour before the flight, just in case.

Flesh Gorden

Decided to try out the Aspire lounge on Saturday, as my flight was delayed by an hour, I was already 90mins early and the bar was packed.

For me, it worked out as everything was closed by the time I was anywhere near my hotel in Paris,
but in general I don't think it would be worth it after they stop serving the breakfast menu.

Food was very good quality, everything was definitely fresh.

They have Heineken on tap and cans of Murphys.
They don't have pint glasses, but I'd be used to the little mini size that you'd get in Italy and France, when you don't want to be necking a full pint at 1pm.

I didn't try any of the whiskeys, as I can't stand the stuff, but my own personal favourite feature was the little sparkling water fountain.

Total cost was €28, considering a pint of stout is €5.50 in the airport and a plate of anything about €10, you can make your own value.



As for the AF vs Aer Lingus CDG flight, Aer Lingus definitely win out.

Given the time that it takes to get through CDG and onto Gare du Nord, if you're arriving there closer to 9pm, there isn't much you can do in the city.
The earlier Aer Lingus flight, feels like less of a day wasted.

The AF flight is every bit as smooth and comfortable, leg room was above average.
The plane is quite small and needed a lot less of the runway, it's probably the closest I'll get to the feeling of taking off in a private jet.

What was very confusing for a lot when boarding, was that the seats are laid out as AC DF, skipping the middle letter as there's only only two seats per row.

The free sandwich and soft drink were a nice touch, something from a bygone era.
I don't think I've ever imagined goats cheese, raspberry and beet in a sandwich but I still happily ate the thing.

Shn99

Speculation re Cork-Provedince can be put to bed. On sale for S19 commencing in April