The Spring Statement

BoJack Horseman

Ren2k7 wrote: »

Ah right, so we're now expected to elect parties that will invariably bankrupt the country yet again?

Paddy likes to be bribed with his own money.

However I doubt FG intend on running up a €12bn+ deficit like they inherited from FF.... That would take some about turn!

I thought Shinnernomics said taxation was a thing of the past?

Dwarf.Shortage

Rubberchikken wrote: »

have never heard the term 'spring statement' beore or maybe i've been asleep.
still, not worth the paper it was written on imho.

all they're doing is playing with figures, slapping each other on the backs and making out that they actually did something positive for this country during theirm govt term so far.

who will replace them? another crowd of back slapping, pocket lining ninnies.
for the first time ever, i'm thinking my vote will be a complete waste of time when this GE occurs.

Then run.

Ren2k7

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

Paddy likes to be bribed with his own money.

However I doubt FG intend on running up a €12bn+ deficit like they inherited from FF.... That would take some about turn!

I thought Shinnernomics said taxation was a thing of the past?

Where did they say that?

BoJack Horseman

Ren2k7 wrote: »

Where did they say that?

Everywhere.

They've been promising a reversal of austerity taxes for 5 years now.

Just 1 year to go, I can't wait.

Ren2k7

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

Everywhere.

They've been promising a reversal of austerity taxes for 5 years now.

Just 1 year to go, I can't wait.

They've also promised to tax the shyte out of anyone earning over 100k a year to pay for their rolling back of USC. I don't agree with their economics but at least they want to balance their spending with high taxes, unlike FF/FG/Lab and their insane low taxes/high spending mantra. Let's not forget which parties have bankrupted this country on multiple occasions. Hint: it wasn't de Shinners!

Dwarf.Shortage

I find when you hear the phrase "wealth tax" you can essentially stop listening; DIRT, CGT, CAT, Stamp Duty and an income tax system with a top marginal rate above 50% all disproportionately hit the wealthy. We have wealth tax and plenty of it, it's just we levy it on anyone who dares earn north of about €40,000 a year or make any investments outside of a tax exempt pensions vehicle.

What would the shinners have as the top rate of tax? 60%, 70%, 80%, 90%, 100%? A party of rhetoric who haven't a notion and would be signing their own death warrant by getting into power because the extent of their incompetence would be laid bare.

Ren2k7

Dwarf.Shortage wrote: »

I find when you hear the phrase "wealth tax" you can essentially stop listening; DIRT, CGT, CAT, Stamp Duty and an income tax system with a top marginal rate above 50% all disproportionately hit the wealthy. We have wealth tax and plenty of it, it's just we levy it on anyone who dares earn north of about €40,000 a year or make any investments outside of a tax exempt pensions vehicle.

What would the shinners have as the top rate of tax? 60%, 70%, 80%, 90%, 100%? A party of rhetoric who haven't a notion and would be signing their own death warrant by getting into power because the extent of their incompetence would be laid bare.

This literally took me less than a minute to find out:

Amongst our proposals are the introduction of a third rate of income tax of 48% on income over €100,000, the introduction of a 1% wealth tax on assets valued at over €1 million, the standardisation of all discretionary tax reliefs, the capping of public sector salaries at €100,000, increases of 10% in both Capital Gains and Capital Acquisitions taxes, and a cut in the salaries of government Ministers, TD's and Senators. We completely oppose the introduction of the property tax and water charges.

http://www.sinnfein.ie/economy

Dwarf.Shortage

Ren2k7 wrote: »

This literally took me less than a minute to find out:



http://www.sinnfein.ie/economy

From their economic mission statement on their own website.

"In the Six Counties, Sinn Féin wants to see the introduction fo tax varying and borrowing powers ot enable the Executive to generate income and stimulate the economy. Securing this will greatly enhance the economic outlook for all the people of Ireland, and will open up the possibility to implement a full and detailed all-Ireland economic growth plan. We are continuing to push the Britihs government to follow through on its commitment to deliver a peace dividend of £18 billion by 2018."

Sure give them the keys.

Ren2k7

Dwarf.Shortage wrote: »

"In the Six Counties, Sinn Féin wants to see the introduction fo tax varying and borrowing powers ot enable the Executive to generate income and stimulate the economy. Securing this will greatly enhance the economic outlook for all the people of Ireland, and will open up the possibility to implement a full and detailed all-Ireland economic growth plan. We are continuing to push the Britihs government to follow through on its commitment to deliver a peace dividend of £18 billion by 2018."

Sure give them the keys.

You're complaining of a few typos on a website rather than addressing their taxation plans? Getting a tad desperate. :rolleyes:

It should be pointed out of course that SF's taxation are quite timid in comparison with other countries.....like Sweden where they have a top rate of income tax of 56% for all those earning more than €66,400. :eek:

BOHtox

Ren2k7 wrote: »

This literally took me less than a minute to find out:



http://www.sinnfein.ie/economy

Ren2k7 wrote: »

You're complaining of a few typos on a website rather than addressing their taxation plans? Getting a tad desperate. :rolleyes:

It should be pointed out of course that SF's taxation are quite timid in comparison with other countries.....like Sweden where they have a top rate of income tax of 56% for all those earning more than €66,400. :eek:

48+USC (8%) + PRSI (4%) is an effective rate of 60%.

And in fairness we had a top rate of 52% for people earning 32,800 until last year's budget

Dwarf.Shortage

Ren2k7 wrote: »

You're complaining of a few typos on a website rather than addressing their taxation plans? Getting a tad desperate. :rolleyes:

It should be pointed out of course that SF's taxation are quite timid in comparison with other countries.....like Sweden where they have a top rate of income tax of 56% for all those earning more than €66,400. :eek:

I would like to think a group of people we were going to have running the country for 5 years would have the minimal amount of professionalism required to proofread (see spellcheck) policy declarations before they published them.

Also talking about headline tax rates elsewhere is pointless without considering the level of public services they fund. In Ireland a top rate tax earner will pay for almost all public services out of after tax income. Using Sweden as an example is also futile because capital income to the wealthy has soared and replaced income lost to the extremely high marginal tax rate, from The Economist:

"The inheritance tax was eliminated in 2005, the wealth tax in 2007 and taxes on residential property in 2008. Thanks, in part, to these tax changes, capital income has soared, particularly at the top of Sweden’s income scale. "

Doesn't sound very much like what Sinn Fein are attempting to propose.

Ren2k7

BOHtox wrote: »

48+USC (8%) + PRSI (4%) is an effective rate of 60%.

And in fairness we had a top rate of 52% for people earning 32,800 until last year's budget

It would still pale in comparison to many European countries who impose excessive taxes on their people. In Ireland the people want to have Nordic levels of public services but without Nordic levels of taxation.

Dwarf.Shortage wrote: »

I would like to think a group of people we were going to have running the country for 5 years would have the minimal amount of professionalism required to proofread (see spellcheck) policy declarations before they published them.

Wipe your eyes FFS. I've seen worse in reports from the Dept. of Finance. Professionalism?! You mean the public school teachers we have running the country? :rolleyes:

Dwarf.Shortage wrote: »

Also talking about headline tax rates elsewhere is pointless without considering the level of public services they fund. In Ireland a top rate tax earner will pay for almost all public services out of after tax income. Using Sweden as an example is also futile because capital income to the wealthy has soared and replaced income lost to the extremely high marginal tax rate, from The Economist:

"The inheritance tax was eliminated in 2005, the wealth tax in 2007 and taxes on residential property in 2008. Thanks, in part, to these tax changes, capital income has soared, particularly at the top of Sweden’s income scale. "

Doesn't sound very much like what Sinn Fein are attempting to propose.

Ah yes, The Economist, the rag that endorsed Thatcher and has been pushing for massive tax cuts in nearly every country of the OECD. Carry on.

Dwarf.Shortage

Ren2k7 wrote: »

Wipe your eyes FFS. I've seen worse in reports from the Dept. of Finance. Professionalism?! You mean the public school teachers we have running the country? :rolleyes:

If you can link a department of finance report from any Irish Government in the last 50 years that has three complete misspellings and a phrase that, even when spelled correctly, makes little to no sense I will happily concede this point.

Also I would probably rather a public school teacher at the helm than a closet terrorist, but that's just me I suppose.

Ren2k7 wrote: »

Ah yes, The Economist, the rag that endorsed Thatcher and has been pushing for massive tax cuts in nearly every country of the OECD. Carry on.

You could have half a point here except what I quoted to you was a statement of empirical facts, not an opinion piece. Two is two no matter who claims it to be so.

Ren2k7

Dwarf.Shortage wrote: »

If you can link a department of finance report from any Irish Government in the last 50 years that has three complete misspellings and a phrase that, even when spelled correctly, makes little to no sense I will happily concede this point.

Unlike you I don't actually care about such trivialities. It sounds like just another pathetic attempt to bash SF, a rather desperate one at that.

Dwarf.Shortage wrote: »

You could have half a point here except what I quoted to you was a statement of empirical facts, not an opinion piece. Two is two no matter who claims it to be so.

No, it wasn't a fact, it was taking two unrelated events (a cut in taxes and increase in capital income) and inferring a link between them. The Economist is notorious for this.

Your edit:

Dwarf.Shortage wrote: »

Also I would probably rather a public school teacher at the helm than a closet terrorist, but that's just me I suppose.

Good thing Ireland has form in not electing terrorists to lead our country then.......oh wait!

Dwarf.Shortage

Ren2k7 wrote: »

Unlike you I don't actually care about such trivialities. It sounds like just another pathetic attempt to bash SF, a rather desperate one at that.



No, it wasn't a fact, it was taking two unrelated events (a cut in taxes and increase in capital income) and inferring a link between them. The Economist is notorious for this.

So you distinctly remember noticing prolific misspellings in more than one department of finance report despite considering such things "trivialities" you don't care about. I would wager it has more to do with the fact you can't link a single example so are running a mile from your earlier incorrect statement.

If you think removing inheritance tax and a value based tax on residential property doesn't increase net capital income I don't think there's much point arguing with you because it's basic logic.

jank

Godge wrote: »

He didn't say the recovery was delayed. He said there was a double-dip recession.

Either

(1) he was lying, or
(2) he doesn't understand what he is saying, or
(3) he hasn't a clue about economics.

Just wondering which it is.

(4) All of the above?

Godge

Ren2k7 wrote: »

It would still pale in comparison to many European countries who impose excessive taxes on their people. In Ireland the people want to have Nordic levels of public services but without Nordic levels of taxation.


.

http://economic-incentives.blogspot.ie/2015/02/the-same-rates-of-tax.html


I think this article illustrates the problem very well. Due to the highly progressive nature of Ireland's income tax system, those at the top are paying the same as in many European countries. It is those at lower income levels who are paying less than their fair share.