Ireland to assist in migrant crisis in the Med.

inforfun

deseil wrote: »

Yes I am under 40 and no I wont expect anyone to pay my pension. I have 2 pension plans thanks.

I know we are in the midst of a housing crisis and I know many of these are non Irish and probably some will continue the welfare cycle but probably some wont and will take the opportunities afforded to them by this country and get an education and a career.

The Germans and others will need these immigrants, with an aging population and people having less children the future is looking bleak for them without immigrants to add to the workforce.

What do you suggest we do send them all back?

Lets count Holland under "the others" as i have had to listen to that fairytale of "we need them because they will need to pay our pensions one day" for a few years already.

This graph shows the massive contribution various nationalities have made to the Dutch welfare state. These are the percentages of people whose only income is social welfare.

Nationalities are in Dutch but i guess you can work it out.

Now you can counter with: They may need some time to start contributing but a little hint for that is the Turkish and Moroccans who have been there for about 40/45 years now. Only for the first 5 years since they arrived, they had a positive contribution but in 1999 it was calculated they had cost the Dutch 70 billion guilders (32 billion euro)... That was 16 year ago...

This is from the www.cbs.nl website which has English translations for a lot of their stuff. Till 2004 they were run by the government, since then they have been independant.

darkpagandeath

inforfun wrote: »

Lets count Holland under "the others" as i have had to listen to that fairytale of "we need them because they will need to pay our pensions one day" for a few years already.

This graph shows the massive contribution various nationalities have made to the Dutch welfare state. These are the percentages of people whose only income is social welfare.

Nationalities are in Dutch but i guess you can work it out.

Now you can counter with: They may need some time to start contributing but a little hint for that is the Turkish and Moroccans who have been there for about 40/45 years now. Only for the first 5 years since they arrived, they had a positive contribution but in 1999 it was calculated they had cost the Dutch 70 billion guilders (32 billion euro)... That was 16 year ago...

This is from the www.cbs.nl website which has English translations for a lot of their stuff. Till 2004 they were run by the government, since then they have been independant.

Sure all these young single men coming for a better life are out of work programmers and alike. These people clearly have the relevant skill sets we are missing and can fill these roles easily.

snubbleste

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

The Soviets/Russians are/were heavily involved in these countries, do they just get a free pass in all this?

Yep. The migrants just travel north 3000km through Russia to claim asylum in Norway.

Hagar7

How the Germans reacted to the new immigrants from Syria.

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/how-one-german-town-welcomed-coachload-syrian-refugees-1941795119

Means Of Escape

fly_agaric wrote: »

Their effect has not been positive to say the least. They have given arms to who they considered to be the "good" rebels. I wonder where all these weapons are now?
They toppled Saddam [edit: he'd probably have been facing his own "Arab spring" troubles if that war had never happened?]
Their nation building effort in Iraq failed miserably (as everyone who was opposed to that war expected) which in turn has provided some nice lawless spaces for cancers like ISIS to sprout up.

ISIS armed to the teeth with weapons plundered from Gaddafi arsenal.

KingBrian2

RandomName2 wrote: »

I'm not saying that Assad isn't a tyrant; or that Gadaffi or Saddam weren't before him - I'm just saying.

Assad has saved more people than Nato ever has. Before the Iraq war that country was a safe place to live and work in. Arabs, Europeans and Africans respected one another and sectarianism was nowhere near as bad as in places in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia.

twinytwo

Means Of Escape wrote: »

ISIS armed to the teeth with weapons plundered from Gaddafi arsenal.

they got tons more when the iraqi army turned tail and ran at the first sign of trouble.... natuarlly leaving all the gear the yanks gave them behind

Means Of Escape

twinytwo wrote: »

they got tons more when the iraqi army turned tail and ran at the first sign of trouble.... natuarlly leaving all the gear the yanks gave them behind

Furthermore the "rebels"of the Arab Spring were absorbed by ISIS hence their reluctance to disarm after the "battle for a great future"

KingBrian2

Means Of Escape wrote: »

Furthermore the "rebels"of the Arab Spring were absorbed by ISIS hence their reluctance to disarm after the "battle for a great future"

Any future prospects of peace will require decommissioning of all weapons. Libya is an arms dump so was Ukraine for the Soviets. Weakening states allowed the caches to be looted. Stopping the illicit selling of banned weapons will go someway to ending the warring terrorists in Syria, Libya and Iraq.

Means Of Escape

KingBrian2 wrote: »

Any future prospects of peace will require decommissioning of all weapons. Libya is an arms dump so was Ukraine for the Soviets. Weakening states allowed the caches to be looted. Stopping the illicit selling of banned weapons will go someway to ending the warring terrorists in Syria, Libya and Iraq.

True however I doubt if even one bullet will be handed into the relative toothless government given the power vacuum that continues 4 years since Gadaffi

KingBrian2

Means Of Escape wrote: »

True however I doubt if even one bullet will be handed into the relative toothless government given the power vacuum that continues 4 years since Gadaffi

Turks have problems with Kurds, Israeli's have problems with Palestinians, the populations want to defend their peoples but the weapons are going everywhere. Pure madness. Demilitarise and disarm the region. Take a look at the number of groups that were involved in the Iraq civil war.

Baathists

• Army of the Men of the Naqshbandi Order
• Fedayeen Saddam
• General Military Council for Iraqi Revolutionaries
• Al-Awda
• General Command of the Armed Forces, Resistance and Liberation in Iraq
• Popular Army
• New Return
• Patriotic Front
• Political Media Organ of the Ba'ath Party
• Popular Resistance for the Liberation of Iraq
• Al-Abud Network

Iraqi Armed Forces and Police

• Iraqi Air Force
• Iraqi Police
• Iraqi Police Service
• National Police
• Supporting Forces
• Facilities Protection Service

Insurgents

Nationalist Salafis

• Islamic Army in Iraq
• Mujahideen Army
• Mujahideen Battalions of the Salafi Group of Iraq
• Islamic Salafist Boy Scout Battalions
• Mohammad's Army

Salafi Jihadists

• Ansar al-Islam
• Black Banner Organization
• Abu Theeb's group
• Jaish Abi Baker's group
• Jamaat Ansar al-Sunna
• Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant
• Mujahideen Shura Council
• Tanzim Qaidat al-Jihad fi Bilad al-Rafidayn
• Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad
• Wakefulness and Holy War

Militias and others

Shia militias

• Mahdi Army
• Abu Deraa's Mahdi Army faction
• Badr Organization
• Sheibani Network
• Soldiers of Heaven
• Special Groups (Iraq)
• Asa'ib Ahl al-Haq
• Promised Day Brigade
• Kata'ib Hezbollah

Sunni militias

• Awakening groups
• 1920 Revolution Brigade
• Jaish al-Rashideen
• Islamic Front for the Iraqi Resistance
• Hamas of Iraq

Kurdish militias

• Peshmerga
• Kurdistan Workers' Party
• Kurdistan Freedom Falcons
• Party of Free Life of Kurdistan

Minority militias

• Qaraqosh Protection Committee
• Malik Al-Tawus Troop

RichardCeann

Interesting development in Sweden. Sverigedemokraterna top the polls and Jimmie Åkesson has called for a referendum on immigration. That would be interesting.

In his summer talk on Saturday in his hometown of Sölvesborg, Jimmie Åkesson, the leader of the far-right Sweden Democrats, predicted that his party would one day be strong enough to run the country and called for a referendum on immigration.

Just a few hours after a poll-of-polls suggested that the Sweden Democrats would receive just over 18% of the vote if an election was held today, a confident Åkesson said, “We have come a long way - but we're going even further. We’re about to show how we’re able to run the country.



“Sure, it's a long way to the election, but it is obvious that we need to start planning to be prepared to take real responsibility for the country. We should be the establishment. We should dominate the public debate.”



Åkesson also told the audience of 2,000 people that Sweden’s welfare policies were to blame for the deaths of refugees trying to flee war and persecution in the Middle East and Africa.



“What is it that causes people to risk their own and their children's lives to come here? I dare say that it is down to other parties’ lax policies on welfare.”



Åkesson called for a referendum on immigration "as soon as possible."



Åkesson also took the opportunity to snipe at this party’s critics. “So who has spat on us? So who has laughed at us. Now we are finally getting the reward for all the hard work, patience, sweat and all the tears. We’ve had enough – now the Swede rises.”

Last week the Sweden Democrats scored record support in another poll, backing up previous surveys suggesting that voters are abandoning mainstream parties in favour of the nationalists.

http://www.thelocal.se/20150829/sweden-democrat-leader-declares-we-will-run-the-country

custard gannet

KingBrian2 wrote: »

[*]Islamic Salafist Boy Scout Battalions

I'm guessing they are harder than they sound :pac::pac:

DeadHand

RichardCeann wrote: »

Interesting development in Sweden. Sverigedemokraterna top the polls and Jimmie Åkesson has called for a referendum on immigration. That would be interesting.



http://www.thelocal.se/20150829/sweden-democrat-leader-declares-we-will-run-the-country

Sweden is finally taking some measures to preserve itself. Seems the rape epidemic suffered by indigenous Swedish women at the hands of third world immigrants has spurred them into action.

We'll see right wing governments come to power all over Europe. Ordinary people are heartily sick of mass immigration and the toll it is taking on their countries.

Irish Stones

Nodin wrote: »

Yeah, yeah. They set up shops, they're up to something. They work, they're up to something, they don't work, they're up to something.

I wonder where the money necessary to set up a shop comes from.
Several thousands of euros are necessary to furnish a shop, then the items you want to sell. An Italian would ask a bank for a loan, the bank would ask them for a guarantee, generally a property. No guarantee no loan.
Now, what can these migrants use as a guarantee? Probably nothing, so they have the money in their pockets already.

Unfortunately I've no problem believing that particular anecdote.

I don't think I have understood this part.

Nodin

Irish Stones wrote: »

I wonder where the money necessary to set up a shop comes from.
Several thousands of euros are necessary to furnish a shop, then the items you want to sell. An Italian would ask a bank for a loan, the bank would ask them for a guarantee, generally a property. No guarantee no loan.
Now, what can these migrants use as a guarantee? Probably nothing, so they have the money in their pockets already..

Yeah, once you keep in mind they're up to no good, it all becomes clear.

Irish Stones wrote: »

I don't think I have understood this part.

It's the kind of ignorant shite that's repeated a lot, thus I've no problem in believing somebody said it.

Irish Stones

In Sicily a couple has been found slaughtered in their house.
A person, a young man from Ivory Coast, has been taken by police and he's suspected of this crime. He has been found with the mobile phone and a computer from the victims.
The man of the couple had his throat cut with a knife, the woman has been thrown out of the window of the upper floor.
The suspected Ivorian was one of the guests at the provisional centre for migrants in Mineo.

http://www.lastampa.it/2015/08/30/italia/cronache/coppia-trovata-morta-in-casa-nel-catanese-c-un-sospettato-acWYHl56nE9rRcIJlRqlPK/pagina.html

Nice example of gratitude for saving his life at sea!

Nodin

Irish Stones wrote: »

In Sicily a couple has been found slaughtered in their house.
A person, a young man from Ivory Coast, has been taken by police and he's suspected of this crime. He has been found with the mobile phone and a computer from the victims.
The man of the couple had his throat cut with a knife, the woman has been thrown out of the window of the upper floor.
The suspected Ivorian was one of the guests at the provisional centre for migrants in Mineo.

http://www.lastampa.it/2015/08/30/italia/cronache/coppia-trovata-morta-in-casa-nel-catanese-c-un-sospettato-acWYHl56nE9rRcIJlRqlPK/pagina.html

...so obviously they're all guilty, and so is everyone from the Ivory coast.

Old Jakey

Jesus Christ. How many murderers and rapists have we already imported?

Nodin

Old Jakey wrote: »

Jesus Christ. How many murderers and rapists have we already imported?

We're sicillians now? Mad - I look as pale as ever.

Snake Plisken

Old Jakey wrote: »

Jesus Christ. How many murderers and rapists have we already imported?

None according to Nodin they are all grand lads and we are all ignorant racists for suggesting anything different!

Nodin

Snake Plisken wrote: »

None according to Nodin they are all grand lads and we are all ignorant racists for suggesting anything different!

...except I've never done anything of the sort, yeah.

Old Jakey

Snake Plisken wrote: »

None according to Nodin they are all grand lads and we are all ignorant racists for suggesting anything different!

You know sometimes I actually wish I was as naive as him. Must be nice to see the world through rose tinted spectacles.

humanji

MOD: Since you just want to use the thread to insult other users, there's no reason to keep it open.