Star Wars: Rogue One *spoilers from post 1195*

Tony EH

J Mysterio wrote: »

I'm surprised you rate Rogue One as something between 'very good and excellent'.

It's the best Star Wars film in 33 years. It's not without flaws. But, they're limited mainly to the score and an over zealous use of CGI on Tarkin and a truly bad move with Leia at the end.

Wheeliebin30

golfball37 wrote: »

I watched the first ten minutes of New Hope after finally seeing R1 last week. It gave me goosebumps when I read the line “have won their first victory over the Galactic Empire” I have to say.
R1 went from the sublime to the ridiculous at times but if it can give me something extra when watching the Original Trilogy for the 1000th time then it served its purpose, as far as I’m concerned.

Kind of bad grammar isn't it!

Should say "have their first victory"
Or
"Have scored their first victory"

J Mysterio

Tony EH wrote: »

It's the best Star Wars film in 33 years. It's not without flaws. But, they're limited mainly to the score and an over zealous use of CGI on Tarkin and a truly bad move with Leia at the end.

I agree with your criticisms, but there are many more issues, mostly around the characters, character development and pacing.

The Force Awakens was far superior. I dont have much to criticize in it other than the fact Disney recycled the Death Star and the Rebels took about 5 minutes to lay a plan of attack on it.

For me that is the best Star Wars in 33 years.

Mark Hamill

Tony EH wrote: »

It's all too soon and too easy.

It is quick, but she ends up in situations where she needs to act quickly to get out of trouble (trapped in Kylo Rens base, then fighting him later on). I think is what justifies her preppy open attitude in the film. If she was angtsy like Anakin or whiny like Luke then she couldn't be expected to be so open to the Force and her powers so quick.

Tony EH wrote: »

It's completely unearned, especially so after her comment to Solo about Luke and the Jedi being a "myth". Bizarrely so as it's only a couple of decades since Luke blew the crap out of the Death Star. It's just bad writing.

But Luke blowing the Death Star was a few decades after the Jedi were wiped out. And Han Solo didn't even believe in them then. So you are talking 40-50 years since Jedi were actually around. Not to mention Rey is living on some backwards planet somewhere far from were any of that happened. To Rey, the facts of the Jedi and the Death Star are all away in some History book on another planet she has never been to.

Tony EH wrote: »

Finn says he was kidnapped as a child and raised by the First Order. A stupid backstory in any case, but rendered even more silly with his spur-of-the-moment defection. As said, even if he was just a janitor for his entire First Order existence, what did he think they stood for?

Order, presumably. Villains rarely see themselves as the villain. His training and programming presumable contained a lot about the First Order was good the Galaxy, the Rebels wanted Chaos etc, with very little in the way of questioning that. They presumably weren't having classes on how to mow down unarmed civilians.

tigger123

Mickeroo wrote: »

True, though I think on the other hand it was also used a device to give the audience hope he might still redeem himself...though I'm pretty sure no one was surprised when he ran through his dad.

Kylo Ren is defined in the film by his struggle between good and evil. He takes the mask off later in the film to reveal his humanity and illustrate this to the audience (by showing the face beneath the mask). It makes perfect sense IMO that he does this.

david75

If you enjoyed rogue one more power to you.
I am beginning to think people are just convincing themselves it's brilliant(like we did with the prequels) but that's coming from a place of wondering why there seems to be an endless stream of articles emerging going on about the reshoots and how it was a very different film etc
Would love to know the agenda or even the point of such articles?theres no point wondering about it we got the film we got and aren't gonna be getting a directors cut or even extended edition for it so it just seems strange

Even newstalk are on it
https://www.facebook.com/newstalkfm/posts/10155722281782907

tigger123

You could sit around for the next 20 years picking faults with the films.

tigger123

david75 wrote: »

If you enjoyed rogue one more power to you.
I am beginning to think people are just convincing themselves it's brilliant(like we did with the prequels) but that's coming from a place of wondering why there seems to be an endless stream of articles emerging going on about the reshoots and how it was a very different film etc
Would love to know the agenda or even the point of such articles?theres no point wondering about it we got the film we got and aren't gonna be getting a directors cut or even extended edition for it so it just seems strange

Even newstalk are on it
https://www.facebook.com/newstalkfm/posts/10155722281782907

I'm sure if you run a pop culture website any article with Star Wars or Rogue One in the title will guarantee you a certain amount of hits/ad revenue.

Tony EH

J Mysterio wrote: »

I agree with your criticisms, but there are many more issues, mostly around the characters, character development and pacing.

The Force Awakens was far superior. I dont have much to criticize in it other than the fact Disney recycled the Death Star and the Rebels took about 5 minutes to lay a plan of attack on it.

For me that is the best Star Wars in 33 years.

We'll just have to agree to disagree so.

pixelburp

david75 wrote: »

If you enjoyed rogue one more power to you.
I am beginning to think people are just convincing themselves it's brilliant(like we did with the prequels) but that's coming from a place of wondering why there seems to be an endless stream of articles emerging going on about the reshoots and how it was a very different film etc

I can't tell if it's intended or not, but frankly that above attitude comes across as a little patronising and dismissive of other peoples' opinions; that people like myself might have enjoyed Rogue One more than you isn't down to people 'convincing' themselves it was good, and that kind of talk belittles the debate around here IMO. It all comes across like a backhanded insult

Does Rogue One have faults? Yes, fairly definitive ones but I still enjoyed the film on its own merits and despite those faults. I could look past them & on balance enjoyed it more than Force Awakens, but that's down to my own personal views on the universe, its mythology and what kind of Star Wars is the best Star Wars.

Not entirely sure where you're coming from with the prequels either, because while Phantom Menace might have gained some benefit of the doubt upon release, it quickly evaporated once people realised what Lucas had wrought - or about 30 seconds into Jar Jars Binks' introduction.

Slydice

NIMAN wrote: »

Quick question, as someone who hasn't seen Star Wars Rebels or read any of the books that explain the side stories.

The Cassian character, whats his back story?

He gave a passionate talk to Jyn during R1 where he went on about how he'd been fighting this fight all his life since he was 5 or 6. Has his family history in the SW universe?

Haven't seen him in Rebels yet. Saw is going to be there soon though so maybe he'll show up.

This article speculates on a possible link:
http://screencrush.com/rogue-one-star-wars-rebels-cassian-andor-fulcrum/
fulcrum is a codename for used by the rebels to stop from identifying specific people and there is more than one person who uses the codename. the speculation is that he could be one of them

Mickeroo

tigger123 wrote: »

Kylo Ren is defined in the film by his struggle between good and evil. He takes the mask off later in the film to reveal his humanity and illustrate this to the audience (by showing the face beneath the mask). It makes perfect sense IMO that he does this.

I agree.

ScrubsfanChris

The CGI work on Tarkin was pretty good but for me atleast it still wasn't very convincing. He was given way too much screen time and it was a bit jarring. The part with

Leia

was ok I suppose but she was only on screen for seconds.

In terms of un-convincingness, reminded me of this

murpho999

Tony EH wrote: »

It's the best Star Wars film in 33 years. It's not without flaws. But, they're limited mainly to the score and an over zealous use of CGI on Tarkin and a truly bad move with Leia at the end.

How is the use of CGI bad?

I've seen the film twice, and neither of the people I watched it with knew that Peter Cushing was dead and were very surprised when I told them it was CGI.

I think it was the right thing to do as he was an important character on the Death Star.

As for Leia, she was the link to a New Hope and you now know how she got the disc that she hides in R2D2. Makes perfect sense.

Both roles were quite short in the film and do not detract from it or the story.

mikhail

murpho999 wrote: »

How is the use of CGI bad?

I've seen the film twice, and neither knew that Peter Cushing was dead and were very surprised when I told them it was CGI.

I spotted it straight away, and thought it was very impressive, but my skin would crawl every now and then when something about him seemed off. It's pretty good, but there's a famous effect called the uncanny valley where something that's very nearly human bothers us far more than something that's clearly not. (Clearly, we evolved under evolutionary pressure from Terminators!) People's mileage varies, but the uncanny valley effect has been a problem for lots of people watching the movie.

Roar

mikhail wrote: »

I spotted it straight away, and thought it was very impressive, but my skin would crawl every now and then when something about him seemed off. It's pretty good, but there's a famous effect called the uncanny valley where something that's very nearly human bothers us far more than something that's clearly not. (Clearly, we evolved under evolutionary pressure from Terminators!) People's mileage varies, but the uncanny valley effect has been a problem for lots of people watching the movie.

This. It was their mouths. Looked unnatural. Really offputting.

david75

If you're not watching Star Wars Rebels you should be. Check out this trailer for the rest of this season.

Eh hello Obi wan kenobi
https://www.facebook.com/StarWars/videos/709153422574617/

Theboinkmaster

murpho999 wrote: »

Both roles were quite short in the film and do not detract from it or the story.

I thought the Leia one was fvcking atrocious and pulled me straight out of the film and ruined the ending.

Last shot should have just been the ship flying away with Vader looking on...

Theboinkmaster

david75 wrote: »

If you're not watching Star Wars Rebels you should be. Check out this trailer for the rest of this season.

Eh hello Obi wan kenobi
https://www.facebook.com/StarWars/videos/709153422574617/

Rebels is awesome!

Slydice

Youtube link:

Oh wow! Like... nice of them to go easy and save the good stuff before Rogue One came out.

Looks like season 3 is gonna be awesome!

david75

Slydice wrote: »

Youtube link:

Oh wow! Like... nice of them to go easy and save the good stuff before Rogue One came out.

Looks like season 3 is gonna be awesome!

First half of the season was great. This second half looks like it's gonna be fantastic.

NIMAN

Re: the CGI

I have seen the film twice.

First time I seen Tarkin I was a bit disappointed. I knew Cushing was dead so immediately spotted it as graphics. Thought it really stood out.

Second viewing, I studied it a bit more, and I think they did an excellent job. As realistic as you'll get.

Having said that, I think Leia wasn't as good. Perhaps they didn't put as much effort into her as she was only on screen for a couple of seconds? I think they could have left her with her back turned to camera as the soldier handed her the disc, we all would have known who it was.

david75

Slydice wrote: »

Youtube link:

Oh wow! Like... nice of them to go easy and save the good stuff before Rogue One came out.

Looks like season 3 is gonna be awesome!

Just noticing. Thrawn has Death troopers with him in that trailer.

Tony EH

murpho999 wrote: »

How is the use of CGI bad?

I've seen the film twice, and neither knew that Peter Cushing was dead and were very surprised when I told them it was CGI.

I think it was the right thing to do as he was an important character on the Death Star.

As for Leia, she was the link to a New Hope and you now know how she got the disc that she hides in R2D2. Makes perfect sense.

Both roles were quite short in the film and do not detract from it or the story.

With Tarkin it was merely overused, to the point where the magic broke down as it were. I've said it before on here, I admired the effort and understand completely how much work went into it, but it was on screen too much and as a result the artifice became obvious. Long shots and shadow would have helped immensely to keep the illusion going.

Leia just looked as fake as a 5 bob note.



I hear they're rejigging the CGI for the blu ray release in March.

Sad Professor

Tony EH wrote: »

I hear they're rejigging the CGI for the blu ray release in March.

David mentioned this earlier in the thread, but I can’t find a source for it. Are you sure? It would be unusual considering the CGI won’t look as bad on Blu-ray.

david75

Sad Professor wrote: »

David mentioned this earlier in the thread, but I can’t find a source for it. Are you sure? It would be unusual considering the CGI won’t look as bad on Blu-ray.

My bad.
Anthony Breznican mentioned it in a podcast interview. He didn't say they were he said 'I imagine they will be working on it up to home release' . He talks to lucasfilm daily so it's probably a safe bet they are

Tony EH

Sad Professor wrote: »

David mentioned this earlier in the thread, but I can’t find a source for it. Are you sure? It would be unusual considering the CGI won’t look as bad on Blu-ray.

Heard it word of mouth myself.

J Mysterio

That fuking picture of Leia is creepy as hell.
Horror movie creepy.

murpho999

mikhail wrote: »

I spotted it straight away, and thought it was very impressive, but my skin would crawl every now and then when something about him seemed off. It's pretty good, but there's a famous effect called the uncanny valley where something that's very nearly human bothers us far more than something that's clearly not. (Clearly, we evolved under evolutionary pressure from Terminators!) People's mileage varies, but the uncanny valley effect has been a problem for lots of people watching the movie.

Sorry I have edited my original post, due to me omitting that it was the 2 people I went to see the film with did not spot the CGI.

I did spot it as I knew Cushing was dead and for me with CGI it's the eyes that tell all. It's the same with computer games. They don't get the eyes 100% right like how they look full of life.
I do think on second viewing that they did a decent job.
EIther way, once you get over the shock of the CGI being used and think about why it was necessary to do it then I don't think it detracts from the film at all.

J Mysterio

This guy provided the voice and CGI capture for the Grand Moff. He would have been more than acceptable to me as a stand in, with a bit of make up.