claim made against me,car insurer never informed me

lifeandtimes

Hi,

Can someone help with this?

A claim was made against me and my insurer never contacted me.

I was involved in an accident with another car, the car in front broke really quick in front of me, their break lights weer coverd in dirt on a sunny day and i couldnt see the car stop.The back break light was broke and that was the only damage to the car

Guards were called, details were swapped, other driver was given out to for not having NCT.

All was well and thought nothing more as we both said nothing would come of it but i rang my insurer to inform them anyway, they took minimal details and said i would be contacted back to provide a full story of what happened but never did this was in September 2014

I recently got a new car renewal quote the other in the post that was nearly double my previous one, i rang my insurer and they told me that a claim was made against me in December of 2014 for over 2800 EUR and the insurer has paid out :eek:...for a break light.

I was never contacted about this and the agent and his supervisor both agreed that i should have bee contacted and said they are investigating this and will contact me tomorrow,it seems the driver has pulled a fast one.

Does anyone have any idea whats going on? Has this happened to anyone before, what can i expect to hear tomorrow. I didn't give my side of the story and surely they would have had to provide proof of the damage

Any help or advice is appreciated

Uncle Ben

Did you admit liability at the time?

dudara

Moved to Banking & Insurance & Pensions

dudara

lifeandtimes

Uncle Ben wrote: »

Did you admit liability at the time?

Hi, no did not admit anything, it was just a swap details in front of guards, guards had a word with me and them, they had not NCT. I then contacted my insurer did not admit to them either just let them know what happened but it was just a quick brief, they said i would be contacted but never was.

Uncle Ben

The reason I asked is because approx 20 years ago in the days of PMPA I reversed slowly back to a petrol pump as I drove too far forward. Cut a long story short I hit a car which had come in behind me. Like you there was minimal damage however the other driver called the police. As it was on private property they wouldn't get involved except to make sure that we both had insurance which we did.
I admitted that it was my fault and the other party told me not to worry as it was only a scratch.

The other party however had taken the garda's name and pushed on without me knowing, with his claim. Like you the insurance company paid out and when I found out it was too late. There was no need for them to inform me as I admitted fault and this was backed up PMPA call to the garda concerned.

To Elland Back

You should have been asked to complete a detailed accident report form to give your version of events. You should also have been provided with details of the settlement when it was reached. It is a breach of the Consumer Protection Code (CPC) for them not to do so

From what you say, it would appear that you were liable for the accident, so the outcome was inevitable anyway. This might work in your favour because if you can establish there was a breach, you might be able to negotiate a discount on your premium as compensation

the groutch

Without getting into too much of a legal discussion, could the fact that the other driver's car had no NCT (and therefore should legally not be on the road) effect liability, and complicate the matter?

lifeandtimes

the groutch wrote: »

Without getting into too much of a legal discussion, could the fact that the other driver's car had no NCT (and therefore should legally not be on the road) effect liability, and complicate the matter?

But they have already paid out to the claiment

brightspark

lifeandtimes wrote: »

All was well and thought nothing more

You damaged his car and didn't even offer to pay for the damage privately? (or did you leave that out of your OP?)

The cost of a claim escalates quite rapidly, an assessor was probably paid, car hire, may have needed a new complete light assembly, not just the brake light.

An insurance company may not even argue about right or wrong it would cost even more to fight the case.

To Elland Back

brightspark wrote: »

You damaged his car and didn't even offer to pay for the damage privately? (or did you leave that out of your OP?)

The cost of a claim escalates quite rapidly, an assessor was probably paid, car hire, may have needed a new complete light assembly, not just the brake light.

An insurance company may not even argue about right or wrong it would cost even more to fight the case.

I agree with all of that, but there are procedures insurers are obliged to follow when claims are being settled

Cookie_Dough

lifeandtimes wrote: »

Hi,

Can someone help with this?

A claim was made against me and my insurer never contacted me.

I was involved in an accident with another car, the car in front broke really quick in front of me, their break lights weer coverd in dirt on a sunny day and i couldnt see the car stop.The back break light was broke and that was the only damage to the car

Guards were called, details were swapped, other driver was given out to for not having NCT.

All was well and thought nothing more as we both said nothing would come of it but i rang my insurer to inform them anyway, they took minimal details and said i would be contacted back to provide a full story of what happened but never did this was in September 2014

I recently got a new car renewal quote the other in the post that was nearly double my previous one, i rang my insurer and they told me that a claim was made against me in December of 2014 for over 2800 EUR and the insurer has paid out :eek:...for a break light.

I was never contacted about this and the agent and his supervisor both agreed that i should have bee contacted and said they are investigating this and will contact me tomorrow,it seems the driver has pulled a fast one.

Does anyone have any idea whats going on? Has this happened to anyone before, what can i expect to hear tomorrow. I didn't give my side of the story and surely they would have had to provide proof of the damage

Any help or advice is appreciated

Most insurance companies would not settle the claim without an accident report form completed and signed by you. Did you discuss liability with the insurance company when you rang them?

They also should have written to you requesting claim form and more importantly they are obliged to write and inform you of settlement figures when this was settled settled to comply with consumer protection code outlined by the Central Bank.

You should send a written complaint to the Insurance Company and if you receive no satisfaction escalate your complaint to the Financial Services Ombudsman.

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy

the groutch wrote: »

Without getting into too much of a legal discussion, could the fact that the other driver's car had no NCT (and therefore should legally not be on the road) effect liability, and complicate the matter?

Only if it was wrote off. Having no nct would negatively impact the valuation the insurance company would offer you.

The gardai might also decide to issue penalty points for the offence too.

lifeandtimes

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for your input.

After all your comments i really only have to issues at this point now.

1. As the car had no nct which was acknowledge by the gardai, that would obviously have implications regarding the claim and if it should have been paid out or not, this was all taken down by the guard so I'm sure i will have to do something about that, it was a sunny day and i didn't see their break light turn on but that could also mean that it wasn't working seeing as no nct was on the car.But at this point im sure its irrelevant as payment has been made to them

2. Shouldnt my insurer have followed policy and cotnacted me to take a report(or send something out for me to fill out as you guys have said) and the do their own investigation and contact me with the resolution?

Thanks for all your comments so far, it seems that most people seem to think its a bit strange i wasn't contacted all right

Cookie_Dough

lifeandtimes wrote: »

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for your input.

After all your comments i really only have to issues at this point now.

1. As the car had no nct which was acknowledge by the gardai, that would obviously have implications regarding the claim and if it should have been paid out or not, this was all taken down by the guard so I'm sure i will have to do something about that, it was a sunny day and i didn't see their break light turn on but that could also mean that it wasn't working seeing as no nct was on the car.But at this point im sure its irrelevant as payment has been made to them

2. Shouldnt my insurer have followed policy and cotnacted me to take a report(or send something out for me to fill out as you guys have said) and the do their own investigation and contact me with the resolution?

Thanks for all your comments so far, it seems that most people seem to think its a bit strange i wasn't contacted all right

1) Unfortunately the matter of his NCT being out of date would be more a matter for Gardaí than the insurance company, unless the TP vehicle was a write off, it would affect their vehicle valuation at that stage. Did the guard make any comment on whether his brake lights were working or not? Again this would be a matter for guards but I would definitely get information from the insurance company on what was paid out to the other guy.

2) Even if the insurance company didn't get a claim form from you (they should have investigated if you were contesting liability) the claim handler should have at least phoned you to discuss your version of events.

Did any claim handler call you at any stage to discuss this with you, ask if you wanted to claim for damage to your own car? Did they send anybody out to inspect your car?

Did the agent you spoke to when you rang first say they would post a claim form to you?

Really strange that the insurance company didn't send any letters to you looking for the claim form at any stage, whatever about not phoning you they really should have written to you.

I would think they would need to keep records of the claim such as dates and times of calls and dates of any correspondence issued.

I would contact the insurance company now and ask them-

1) why you never got a call back in the first place
2) why they did not request a claim form
3) if they ever followed up to request a claim form, by letter etc
4) on what basis they settled the other persons claim if they did not speak to you about it or get a claim form
5) why they did not write to you when the claim was settled.

I find it odd that they did not contact you at any point during this process or even inspect the damage to your car to see if it was consistent with the damage to the other persons car.

brightspark

lifeandtimes wrote: »

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for your input.



1. As the car had no nct which was acknowledge by the gardai, that would obviously have implications regarding the claim and if it should have been paid out or not, this was all taken down by the guard so I'm sure i will have to do something about that, it was a sunny day and i didn't see their break light turn on but that could also mean that it wasn't working seeing as no nct was on the car.But at this point im sure its irrelevant as payment has been made to them

An earlier poster was correct having no NCT will reduce the cars value if written off, I know of someone it actually happened to some years ago. The car was just a month out of NCT and had an appointment booked. Remember the NCT only proves the car was roadworthy on the test date, and not having an NCT doesn't prove the car was unworthy.

Maybe if you had a dashcam or other CCTV footage you could prove no brake light came on, but you should still have been able to react to the car ahead slowing down. (And before others mention the scammers who jam on their brakes to deliberately cause accidents, I recently saw dashcam footage where the driver behind safely stopped behind the alleged scammer)

No one really wins with insurance companies, I was involved in an accident a few years ago, more straightforward case, I was stopped in traffic and the other driver failed to stop behind me. My car was written off, too old to repair economically, and I got the "book" value, they even tried deducting €200 because my two of my tyres had just 1mm before they would cease to be legal.
Since then I have had to declare the accident when obtaining insurance, and though none admit it, I'm sure it has increased my premiums. Certainly the online deals were not available to me.


You need to go through your insurance documentation to see what the terms are regarding how they handle claims.

To Elland Back

brightspark wrote: »

You need to go through your insurance documentation to see what the terms are regarding how they handle claims.

It is not up to individual insurers, they are governed by the Central Bank CPC Regulations. In this instance 7.7 (f) is probably the most appropriate for the OP's circumstances (see link)

http://www.centralbank.ie/consumer/cpc/rebates/pages/claims%20processing.aspx

lifeandtimes

To Elland Back wrote: »

It is not up to individual insurers, they are governed by the Central Bank CPC Regulations. In this instance 7.7 (f) is probably the most appropriate for the OP's circumstances (see link)

http://www.centralbank.ie/consumer/cpc/rebates/pages/claims%20processing.aspx

maybe im reading this wrong but this seems to be for people making a claim, doesn't mention the policy holder?

To Elland Back

lifeandtimes wrote: »

maybe im reading this wrong but this seems to be for people making a claim, doesn't mention the policy holder?

When a 3rd party is holding somebody liable for damages, the insured person seeks indemnity from his insurers. In other words, he is claiming under his own insurance for funds to meet his responsibility to the 3rd party. That makes him a claimant

lifeandtimes

oh that clears that up, so they didnt follow any of these procedures then, still waiting on a call back, i let people know what happens,thanks for your help

seamus

As far as I know, once you've reported the incident the insurance company basically has the authority to proceed as they see fit without having to clear it with you.

Claim forms notwithstanding, they don't need your approval to settle the claim and you don't have a right to dispute the paid out amount.

My wife came back to her car in a car park once to find the car behind pressed up against hers. Pulled out, saw some minor damage to her bumper. Hung around for 20 minutes to see if the other driver came back, nope. Went to the security desk, who reviewed the CCTV footage which clearly showed the other car come into contact as it pulled into the space.

My wife took the insurance details of the other car and left. Rang that insurance company, who told my wife to send on pictures of the damage and go get a quote. So she did, two weeks later, got a cheque in the post. We don't even know if the other driver was contacted, but there was basically no dispute or hassle.

Claims handlers actually get commission based on the value and number of claims processed. They're more eager to get that €2,800 claim off their desk than they are to leave it sitting another 6 weeks for the sake of saving €500.

lifeandtimes

seamus wrote: »

As far as I know, once you've reported the incident the insurance company basically has the authority to proceed as they see fit without having to clear it with you.

Claim forms notwithstanding, they don't need your approval to settle the claim and you don't have a right to dispute the paid out amount.

My wife came back to her car in a car park once to find the car behind pressed up against hers. Pulled out, saw some minor damage to her bumper. Hung around for 20 minutes to see if the other driver came back, nope. Went to the security desk, who reviewed the CCTV footage which clearly showed the other car come into contact as it pulled into the space.

My wife took the insurance details of the other car and left. Rang that insurance company, who told my wife to send on pictures of the damage and go get a quote. So she did, two weeks later, got a cheque in the post. We don't even know if the other driver was contacted, but there was basically no dispute or hassle.

Claims handlers actually get commission based on the value and number of claims processed. They're more eager to get that €2,800 claim off their desk than they are to leave it sitting another 6 weeks for the sake of saving €500.

thanks seamus but thats the other side of the story,id be the other driver in this scenario, he may have be contacted and by going by the regulations iyt seems that all people should at least be advised of whats happend

CosmicSmash

Whether or not the car that was damaged had a valid NCT is irrelevant. You hit and damaged a car that was stopped or slowing down. You were driving to close for the road conditions, did you really expect the owner to pay for the damage themselves?

To Elland Back

seamus wrote: »

Claims handlers actually get commission based on the value and number of claims processed. They're more eager to get that €2,800 claim off their desk than they are to leave it sitting another 6 weeks for the sake of saving €500.

Where did you pull that one from?

seamus

To Elland Back wrote: »

Where did you pull that one from?

My brother used to work as one.

thebiglad

He is actually correct - some insurers - i.e. Quinn/Liberty pay their handler a bonus for closing files in x numbers of days.

That said, I do not think that is the issue this time - this is a clear case which the insurer could not hope to win, OP was too close and hit other car in rear there is no argument - if lights were mucky etc why not hang back further, was this the 1st time they had braked? Even if the lights were not 'visible' it should still be possible to a slowing vehicle safely and stop without hitting it - the argument would be pointless, not to mention costly for the insurer.

Check your policy, the insurer has the right to handle the claim as they see fit, if OP is not happy with their decision contact the Ombudsman or register an official complaint although I suspect unless it is shown proper process was not followed there is no argument and certainly the outcome is no different.

The fact that the other car did not have an NCT is a red herring, it was on the road and it is not open season on illegal vehicles - the other driver loses their right to claim for loss of use or a replacement car during repair but they are entitled to have the damage the OP did, fixed. The lack of NCT is a purely Garda matter.

Insurance claims go up in cost very fast so it is important that insurer's process them quickly, especially if circumstances are clear cut.

lifeandtimes

Hi all, sorry i should just point out to clears things up, this was on a busy main road in dublin during rush hour,cars were bumper to bumper literally, the car in front started to drive,i followed and they stopped suddenly and impact happened as described.

I understand this is probably irrelevant at this stage as they have already paid out but i feel my insurance company have not followed policy in dealing with this.