Ulster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread II

irishbucsfan

Buer wrote: »

Wee Paul is no spring chicken these days. He turns 31 in July.

His current deal expires at the end of next season and I think Ulster should really consider ditching him at that point and finally using one of their NIQ spots on a project back up for Pienaar who will be winding down.

A project half back these days is hard to find. A good 9, the passing kind.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

irishbucsfan wrote: »

A project half back these days is hard to find. A good 9, the passing kind.

So please be gentle with this Pienaar of mine.

awec

Doubt we'd be allowed another NIQ anyway. We're screwed post-Pienaar.

sfbdqc

Provinces need to learn to develop their own halfbacks.. especially scrumhalf.

irishbucsfan

sfbdqc wrote: »

Provinces need to learn to develop their own halfbacks.. especially scrumhalf.

Irish provinces are no worse really than most other teams. A really difficult position to develop to pro level but more and more teams are finding 7s a useful tool for it (including our ladies team). Our provinces need to get better at bridging the gap although A rugby and 7s should make all the difference. Ulster need to take both more seriously.

sfbdqc

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Irish provinces are no worse really than most other teams. A really difficult position to develop to pro level but more and more teams are finding 7s a useful tool for it (including our ladies team). Our provinces need to get better at bridging the gap although A rugby and 7s should make all the difference. Ulster need to take both more seriously.

compared to wales, Ireland are awful at developing scrumhalves..

still relying on Reddan says it all.

The Black Stags

awec wrote: »

Doubt we'd be allowed another NIQ anyway. We're screwed post-Pienaar.

There's always David Shanahan..

Zzippy

awec wrote: »

Doubt we'd be allowed another NIQ anyway. We're screwed post-Pienaar.

Didn't he say he'd stay at Ulster til they won European silverware? No worries so, he'll be playing for ye til he's 40!

:P

calico77

awec wrote: »

Doubt we'd be allowed another NIQ anyway. We're screwed post-Pienaar.

Are Herbst and Ludik project players though? Thats two less NIQ in the next 18 months, and then Pienaar gone is three less.

Utah_Saint

calico77 wrote: »

Are Herbst and Ludik project players though? Thats two less NIQ in the next 18 months, and then Pienaar gone is three less.

Ludik will be iq next season at some point. I believe Herbie has 2 season to become iq

bilston

calico77 wrote: »

Are Herbst and Ludik project players though? Thats two less NIQ in the next 18 months, and then Pienaar gone is three less.

Well hopefully Pienaar will sign a new contract but yes Ludik and Herbst will both be IQ by 2017/18 and Van Der Merwe will be out of contract as well.

From watching Bryn's interview on UR Extra the other night I'd say he is already on the lookout for signings for 2017/18. Not sure where we would strengthen though. Between AOC, Henderson, Tuohy and hopefully Treadwell and throw in an emerging talent like Thompson and we may be well covered in the second row. We have our NIQ back row in Coetzee, our backs are fine. I can't see us being allowed to sign a NIQ TH given we have Ah You and Herbst for the foreseeable future. Maybe a back up 10, although Nelson might have emerged as a fairly reliable back up by then as he was threatening to do pre injury.

bilston

Utah_Saint wrote: »

Ludik will be iq next season at some point. I believe Herbie has 2 season to become iq

Next season in Herbst's third year at Ulster so he will qualify at the same time as Ludik.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Is there a difference in players who are brought in specifically with the idea of them qualifying and playing for Ireland and players who just happen to be from another country and not capped internationally?

Are they all considered NIQ until they're Q?

awec

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

Is there a difference in players who are brought in specifically with the idea of them qualifying and playing for Ireland and players who just happen to be from another country and not capped internationally?

Are they all considered NIQ until they're Q?

Yea, they are counted seperately.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

awec wrote: »

Yea, they are counted seperately.

So someone like CJ Stander is counted differently from someone like Ben Te'o?

awec

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

So someone like CJ Stander is counted differently from someone like Ben Te'o?

Yes.

At Ulster Ludik was considered a normal NIQ until he signed his latest deal.

rsh118

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

So someone like CJ Stander is counted differently from someone like Ben Te'o?

AFAIK, project players aren't counted in any way towards NIQ slots. So projects are basically treated as IQ from the moment they arrive, whereas Big Ben sucks up an NIQ slot (as long as he was never planned to be a project).

former total

rsh118 wrote: »

AFAIK, project players aren't counted in any way towards NIQ slots. So projects are basically treated as IQ from the moment they arrive, whereas Big Ben sucks up an NIQ slot (as long as he was never planned to be a project).

No, that's not right.

You can have four foreigners, at least one of whom must be eligible as a project. You can't have unlimited project players, they aren't treated as IQ until they actually qualify.

CMOTDibbler

former total wrote: »

No, that's not right.

You can have four foreigners, at least one of whom must be eligible as a project. You can't have unlimited project players, they aren't treated as IQ until they actually qualify.

I thought it was four plus one?

awec

The total is 5, at least one has to be a project.

This means 4+1 usually, but it could be 3+2, 2+3 etc.

former total

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

I thought it was four plus one?

It was, then apparently it was reduced to 3 plus 1, but it now looks like the rules are gone out the window to some extent.

CMOTDibbler

awec wrote: »

The total is 5, at least one has to be a project.

This means 4+1 usually, but it could be 3+2, 2+3 etc.

Has there ever been a case where there were two or more project players at a province? I can't recall any but suspect there must have been.

former total

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Has there ever been a case where there were two or more project players at a province? I can't recall any but suspect there must have been.

Herbst and Ludik
Stander, Bleyendaal and VDH
Strauss and Sykes/Roux

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

former total wrote: »

No, that's not right.

You can have four foreigners, at least one of whom must be eligible as a project. You can't have unlimited project players, they aren't treated as IQ until they actually qualify.

Okay, so foreign is foreign and a project player is someone like Stander who is intended for the Irish squad.

They're all counted as the same though when it comes to taking places in the squad?

bilston

From listening to Bryn and looking at the facts it seems as though the IRFU are prepared to look at each situation on its own merits rather than sticking religiously to the 4+1 or 3+1 rule. To be fair it has pretty much always been this way.

That has got to be a good thing.

bilston

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

Okay, so foreign is foreign and a project player is someone like Stander who is intended for the Irish squad.

They're all counted as the same though when it comes to taking places in the squad?

Usually the foreign players are already ineligible for Ireland before they come here as many of them have been capped or played for their coubtry of birth's second string side.

But I don't think there is a guarentee that a nominated project player actually wants to play for Ireland. Having seen a picture of Wiebhan Herbst waving a SA flag during the WC I'd have my doubts about whether he'd want to play for Ireland. Maybe I'm reading too much into that.

Do we want all these project players playing for Ireland anyway. It's a handy wee way for the provinces to recruit a few more NIQs but we could reach saturation point pretty quickly. There are four already in our current matchday 23 in White, Strauss, Stander and Payne. Of course I suppose if you allow one you have to allow them all. They are either Irish qualified or they are not.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

bilston wrote: »

Do we want all these project players playing for Ireland anyway. It's a handy wee way for the provinces to recruit a few more NIQs but we could reach saturation point pretty quickly. There are four already in our current matchday 23 in White, Strauss, Stander and Payne. Of course I suppose if you allow one you have to allow them all. They are either Irish qualified or they are not.

Well that's it. The rules are the rules and if they are the current rules teams are going to use them to their advantage.

You'd have to trust the IRFU to manage it responsibly. Players moving between provinces rather than abroad would help too.

rsh118

There's no harm in sneaking a few extra project players in to bulk out the squad where you are lacking. Obviously without selling them the dream too hard.

Interesting to see if Herbst makes it to standard. Judging by the 100,000 THs Ireland currently don't have he'll be practicing with the squad soon...

Utah_Saint

rsh118 wrote: »

There's no harm in sneaking a few extra project players in to bulk out the squad where you are lacking. Obviously without selling them the dream too hard.

Interesting to see if Herbst makes it to standard. Judging by the 100,000 THs Ireland currently don't have he'll be practicing with the squad soon...

he looked great in his first season, but the first half of this year he was pretty dire. He's had some injuries so hopefully bounces back. As you say, he'll end up in the squad due to the lack of Irish bred TH....

shuffol

Just got round to watching some of the Glasgow game from last week, really heartening to see Olding looking so good again. Early days but I think he looks sharper than after his previous injury, the step for his break from the 22 was phenomenal.

Zzippy

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Has there ever been a case where there were two or more project players at a province? I can't recall any but suspect there must have been.

Connacht have a number of foreign players who could qualify - Aki, Heenan, Fox-Matamua, Pewhairangi, McCartney

The Black Stags

shuffol wrote: »

Just got round to watching some of the Glasgow game from last week, really heartening to see Olding looking so good again. Early days but I think he looks sharper than after his previous injury, the step for his break from the 22 was phenomenal.

It was mentioned somewhere (perhaps by himself) that he had lost a bit of weight since the last time he came back from injury. If you remember back he was fairly bulky last time; so yeah, bit lighter on his feet now to make more use of his step!

Utah_Saint

The Black Stags wrote: »

It was mentioned somewhere (perhaps by himself) that he had lost a bit of weight since the last time he came back from injury. If you remember back he was fairly bulky last time; so yeah, bit lighter on his feet now to make more use of his step!

Olding stated that. He said he is faster now as he focused more on functional training and not just weight lifting

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Utah_Saint wrote: »

Olding stated that. He said he is faster now as he focused more on functional training and not just weight lifting

I'd imagine when you have a leg related injury it's very easy to overdo it on the upper body workouts while you're recovering.

Billysays no

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

I'd imagine when you have a leg related injury it's very easy to overdo it on the upper body workouts while you're recovering.

Toh got a leg injury. Out for six months. Put on the best part of two stone upper body strength. Very much a better player. Still fast but physically more a threat.

Jump_In_Jack

Zzippy wrote: »

Connacht have a number of foreign players who could qualify - Aki, Heenan, Fox-Matamua, Pewhairangi, McCartney

Pewhairangi Is qualified through his grandmother and already played for Ireland in rugby league.

The Lost Sheep

Sean Reidy has agreed a two-year contract extension and Ricky Lutton has signed on for another year.
http://www.ulsterrugby.com/news/14630.php#.Vs3lt02zLct

bilston

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Sean Reidy has agreed a two-year contract extension and Ricky Lutton has signed on for another year.
http://www.ulsterrugby.com/news/14630.php#.Vs3lt02zLct

Good news about Reidy. He is pretty useful. Lutton frustrates the hell out of me but he will be 3rd choice next year. If I was minded to be harsh I'd say his dumbness cost us the Pro 12 semi final against Glasgow last year.

Paul Smeenus

bilston wrote: »

Good news about Reidy. He is pretty useful. Lutton frustrates the hell out of me but he will be 3rd choice next year. If I was minded to be harsh I'd say his dumbness cost us the Pro 12 semi final against Glasgow last year.

Bloody divers.

bilston

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Bloody divers.

Yeah, but it was still totally needless from Ricky.

Number 137

McCloskey named at 12 for Ireland. Maybe himself and Henshaw will hit it off so well this weekend that when Payne recovers Schmidt decides to select him at full back! Might please a few posters here!

Paul Smeenus

bilston wrote: »

Yeah, but it was still totally needless from Ricky.

Completely idiotic, agreed.

bilston

Didn't see it myself by apparently Piutau was on Rugby Tonight (BT) this evening and said he was honouring his contract next season.

Let that be an end to the speculation please.

MJohnston

bilston wrote: »

Didn't see it myself by apparently Piutau was on Rugby Tonight (BT) this evening and said he was honouring his contract next season.

Let that be an end to the speculation please.

I'd hope he worded it differently from that or he'll be Afoa Mk II

blackdog1

I see Tim Boys started for the crusaders today.....maybe he's the one that got away. ðŸ˜

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

No Ferris on the BBC NI panel today but we've still had an attempt to get as many Ulster players into the Irish starting 15 as possible. This time they want Payne to replace Kearney at 15. Can't say I disagree.

Bazzo

What's going on with Ulster's tackling today??

calico77

wtf was that from PJ

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Arnold done his hamstring again?

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Jeez, that's dreadful from Ulster. Cardiff 12 just brushed past all of them.