Xavi

Andersonisgod

pmasterson95 wrote: »

You lot just look for any excuse bloody hell

You'll find that now that Barcelona are back on top, these far fetched, silly jibes crop up more. Really its all they have to cling to and there's not a whole lot of it.

Just a little Samba

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Let me help pmasterson95.

Xavi Hernandez is the greatest footballer Spain has ever produced, but he's more than that. Xavi Hernandez is Barcelona's greatest ever midfielder, but he's more than that too. Xavi Hernandez is not just a player, he's an era. Xavi is the embodiment of tiki taka, his very existence is a thorn in the paw of those who detest tiki taka, Barcelona and everything they stand for. Never has a player been so closely linked to a football philosophy. When they talk of the age of Spain, of whizzing passes and dizzying movement, when they speak of the great Barcelona sides of 2008-2015, Xavi is what you will instantly think of. He is tiki taka to the core, he has blaugrana blood.

His time was finished. In the age of the hulking box to box midfielder, Xavi was an endangered species, close to being wiped out for good. At about 5,8" and practically no outstanding physical attributes it had seemed as though the game had passed him by, that there was no place for the natural successor to Pep Guardiola, another technically gifted/physically hampered player. In 2008, Xavi turned that notion on its head, ushering in a new mould of midfield player in his own likeness. Xavi changed the perception of what is required of a midfielder and of what a midfielder should look like. Every kid who has ever been told they are too small, they are too weak, they are too slow can hold Xavi up as their inspiration, as a symbol that talent, technique and hard work will always win through.

He's the hub, the metronome, the frenzied orchestrator of the Barcelona choir who made all others sing to his tunes. A place in the storied history of Barcelona assured, Xavi rides off into the sunset. He leaves as a kid from the academy done good, the most decorated of players with the most appearances in club history, he leaves as a champion, as a legend, he leaves as a man with Barcelona in his heart, he leaves us safe in the knowledge that one day he will return to Barcelona to follow once more in the footsteps of Guardiola.

All of this ignore the reality that Xabi Alonso, Paul Scholes, Demetrio Albertini, Pepe Guardiola, Fernando Redondo, Andrea Pirlo, Paul Scholes and umpteen more players in a similar mould to Xavi were still playing at the top of the game at the start, middle and end of Xavi's career.


This nonsense that Xavi invented a role or changed a position or anything else is absolute fantasy. He was a very good player who plays in a position that several other very good players also played in and continue to play in.

Xavi along with Scholes, Alonso and Pirlo is one of a handful of very good players in a position that has existed long before he arrived and will continue to exist long after he's gone.

daRobot

monkey9 wrote: »

CSF's post is well constructed and he put it superbly. Your point that Xavi's legacy is tainted is nonsense. It's not what he'll be remembered for.

Please stop embarassing yourself.

You're telling me that you disagree with me, but agree with CSF, when the key point of both his and my posts, was that he was tainting his legacy.

CSF

CSF wrote: »

Corruption is one thing, the death of thousands is something else entirely. Some things are bigger than being a good footballer.

Personally I think people are too good these days at emotionally detaching from these things and not completely relating because this is happening so far away, in a place where we've mostly never been or know people from. Try to think about this as if it was Ireland. Could you imagine thousands of people having to die (probably people we know and love) to bring a World Cup here?

I don't expect football to be able to cure all societies ills, nor will every player and club act in a socially responsible way. Players and clubs may even have indirect links with and play with/ in countries and companies with questionable histories. Do I agree with those things? Mostly, no.

But this is something else entirely, this is a footballer actively promoting an event that is killing thousands. Xavi can play for and work for whoever he wants. But it absolutely pisses all over the great legacy he created as a footballer, and I genuinely feel like the people who don't see that are lacking some form of human empathy, as if these people are just statistics.

Let me guess, posted from a phone /tablet made by a company that has human rights issues, while wearing a football jersey made using child slave labour?


Dig deep enough and everyone probably contributes to human rights problems. Is this the forum for it though?

Turtwig

I don't like that Xavi is moving to Qatar. He's a guy with enough talent that he could play anywhere in the world. Qatar is an awful awful country. (Unless you have money then you'll it's probably the best ever!) Xavi, was effectively seduced by Qataris to go there. It's bit like the PR sh*t the country is doing now. Bringing journalists to villages that "appear" to abide by slightly decent standards. Housing the journalists in 'fair' areas. However, should that journalist step outside those predetermined boundaries? Arrested!

Xavi, while he's in Qatar, will not likely see any of the sht that goes on. I just hope he doesn't publicly come to the WC's defence. That would really taint his legacy. Ideally, he'd get arrested a show what a farce the place actually is.


An amazing, amazing player the decision to go to Qatar will rightly taint his reputation character wise. Or he could yet become one of its most vocal opponents. That seems unlikely but the optimist in me is holding out for it.

Peist2007

callaway92 wrote: »

What a pathetic bunch of tripe posted in this thread.

I thought it was going to be a circlejerk for Xavi (which is warranted) but instead it's a bunch of clueless oafs talking absolute ****e and arguing with eachother over things which have nothing to do with him.

Well he is endorsing what is going on in Qatar by going there and lending his great name to it. That cannot be denied nor glossed over. It is pretty risible to be honest.

Will it taint his legacy as suggested on this thread? I dont think so. It gives an insight into Xavi the man more than anything else. Let's put it this way: the great Maradona would do the same in my opinion. And he has quite a good legacy.

Andersonisgod

Just a little Samba wrote: »

All of this ignore the reality that Xabi Alonso, Paul Scholes, Demetrio Albertini, Pepe Guardiola, Fernando, Andrea Pirlo, Paul Scholes and umpteen more players in a similar mould to Xavi were still playing at the top of the game at the start, middle and end of Xavi's career.


This nonsense that Xavi invented a role or changed a position or anything else is absolute fantasy. He was a very good player who plays in a position that several other very good players also played in and continue to play in.

Xavi along with Scholes, Alonso and Pirlo is one of a handful of very good players in a position that has existed long before he arrived and will continue to exist long after he's gone.

Ironically I'd argue that Xavi's role isn't the same as Alonso or Pirlo, that their Barcelona counterpart is Sergio Busquets.

As I said, he was one of a dying breed. It's tough to remember it now but it all all about box to box, all action midfielders with powerful physiques, Viera, Keane, Gerrard, Edgar Davids, Gattuso, Ballack ect. were the way football was going, that was your prototypical midfielder of the day. It's the rise of Xavi and Spain that has spurred on so many of the technical maestros you see today.

pmasterson95

rarnes1 wrote: »

Let me guess, posted from a phone /tablet made by a company that has human rights issues, while wearing a football jersey made using child slave labour?


Dig deep enough and everyone probably contributes to human rights problems. Is this the forum for it though?

I was thinking that sure that logic Xavi's whole legacy is tainted as he wore a NIKE branded Barca jersey his whole career, same with Messi. Messi is a disgrace aswell. Every footballer playing for a professional club is a disgrace.

monkey9

daRobot wrote: »

Please stop embarassing yourself.

You're telling me that you disagree with me, but agree with CSF, when the key point of both his and my posts, was that he was tainting his legacy.

Yeah I read his post wrong so I take it back.

Andersonisgod

Peist2007 wrote: »

Well he is endorsing what is going on in Qatar by going there and lending his great name to it. That cannot be denied nor glossed over. It is pretty risible to be honest.

Will it taint his legacy as suggested on this thread? I dont think so. It gives an insight into Xavi the man more than anything else. Let's put it this way: the great Maradona would do the same in my opinion. And he has quite a good legacy.

Maradona has coached in Qatar, basically making him an advocate of Qatar, so lets all lambast Maradona. Odd that nobody seems to mention this when they talk about Maradona....maybe it just doesn't matter very much.

Just a little Samba

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Ironically I'd argue that Xavi's role isn't the same as Alonso or Pirlo, that their Barcelona counterpart is Sergio Busquets.

You'd be wrong.

The idea that a player who's sole identity is ball winning and giving it to someone who can use it with a 4 yard sideways pass is comparable in style to two of the best passers of the last 30 years is ridiculous.

Busquets is fantastic at what he does, and for a ball winning midfielder he's very technical, I'd say he's more comparable to the likes of Viera or Vidal than he is to Pirlo, the single greatest passer of the ball of the modern era.

Xavi occpies the same space and does the same job on the pitch as Pirlo, they just do it differently. Where Pirlo is all about diagonal balls to the fullback and defence splitting through balls and set piece delivery, Xavi is/was all about finding space where they was none, playing a simple ball to a team mate and then showing for it again 4 yards further forward, rinse, repeat.

If I was going to compare Pirlo to any Barca player who wasn't Xavi, it would be Ininesta, if only for their ability to score an absolute belter and their passing ranges being comparable.

Just a little Samba

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Maradona has coached in Qatar, basically making him an advocate of Qatar, so lets all lambast Maradona. Odd that nobody seems to mention this when they talk about Maradona....maybe it just doesn't matter very much.

Maradona get's a pretty hard time already as it is to be honest.

Most people think PED's, over weight, cocaine and being a raving lunatic, as well as one of the top 2 or 3 players of all time.


People will still of course think Xavi was one of the best of his generation (to think otherwise would be idiocy), right up there with Messi, Ronaldo x 2, Zidane, Maldini, Scholes and so on.

But unfortunately, they'll also think "he sold his soul for blood money" if he allows himself to be used as a poster boy for the Kingdom of Qatar in the run up to the most controversial world cup ever.

Hopefully he doesn't just player the subservient house boy role and uses his position to put pressure on the Qatari government, but I doubt it.

Turtwig

Just a little Samba wrote: »

Xavi occpies the same space and does the same job on the pitch as Pirlo, they just do it differently. Where Pirlo is all about diagonal balls to the fullback and defence splitting through balls and set piece delivery, Xavi is/was all about finding space where they was none, playing a simple ball to a team mate and then showing for it again 4 yards further forward, rinse, repeat.

Em did you actually watch Xavi? Almost every game he'd play more than four diagonal balls each half to either of Barca's fullbacks, mostly Alves though. The guy's played more games that Maldini did in his career and in his earlier part of the career he was very much about what you described Pirlo as. Did you actually watch Pirlo? Most of the time he was just keeping midfield ticking too; that's the role. I always getting the feeling that if Pirlo hadn't made a mockery of England people would look at him differently. Xavi and Pirlo are very much alike. Xavi just had far better team mates to be more effective. Pirlo, arguably had the luxury of playing against sides that wouldn't just try to deny his team space in the defensive third. As tendonitis took hold Xavi just starting passing more sideways and backwards. Also the opposition was very much defensively focused too making "through" balls rather pointless. I feel that has actually tainted people's impressions of him.

Andersonisgod

Just a little Samba wrote: »

You'd be wrong.

The idea that a player who's sole identity is ball winning and giving it to someone who can use it with a 4 yard sideways pass is comparable in style to two of the best passers of the last 30 years is ridiculous.

Busquets is fantastic at what he does, and for a ball winning midfielder he's very technical, I'd say he's more comparable to the likes of Viera or Vidal than he is to Pirlo, the single greatest passer of the ball of the modern era.

Xavi occpies the same space and does the same job on the pitch as Pirlo, they just do it differently. Where Pirlo is all about diagonal balls to the fullback and defence splitting through balls and set piece delivery, Xavi is/was all about finding space where they was none, playing a simple ball to a team mate and then showing for it again 4 yards further forward, rinse, repeat.

If I was going to compare Pirlo to any Barca player who wasn't Xavi, it would be Ininesta, if only for their ability to score an absolute belter and their passing ranges being comparable.

A couple things here.

I feel as though Busquets, his ability, his role in building up the play for Barcelona, is being seriously diminished in that post. It also contains one of my pet hates, the condescending "4/5 yard pass" claim. Generally his passing game is short because that's what playing that role for Barcelona/Spain demands. Most of the time he is playing these passes with enormous pressure being placed on him by an opposition press, imo and that of many others, he's the best 1 touch player on the planet. He is central to everything Barcelona do and more than warrants comparison with any midfielder of the last 20 years.

I don't agree that Xavi occupies the same space, he was far more about controlling from the center and drifting between the lines to create from an advanced position than Pirlo was for the vast majority of his career.

Perhaps in Iniesta's reformed role this season he is more comparable now to Pirlo but before this season I'd say certainly not.

DrumSteve

This thread is ****ing mental.

Just a little Samba

Turtwig wrote: »

Em did you actually watch Xavi? Almost every game he'd play more than four diagonal balls each half to either of Barca's fullbacks, mostly Alves though. The guy's played more games that Maldini did in his career and in his earlier part of the career he was very much about what you described Pirlo as. Did you actually watch Pirlo? Most of the time he was just keeping midfield ticking too; that's the role. I always getting the feeling that if Pirlo hadn't made a mockery of England people would look at him differently. Xavi and Pirlo are very much alike. Xavi just had far better team mates to be more effective. As tendonitis took hold he just starting passing more sideways and backwards. I feel that has actually tainted people's impressions of him.

The ability to find space when other teams tried to pack midfield to stifle Barca is what made Xavi the genius he is. His ability to find a pass and almost immediately find the space to get the return is a skill very, very few others have mastered and none have done as well as him.

Of course he also plays diagonals to fullbacks or through balls to Iniesta, Messi and Pedro/Henry/whoever he's not a one dimensional player, and of course Pirlo also plays sideways passes and backwards passes to ball playing centre backs like Nesta and Bonucci he's been lucky enough to have behind him.

But Pirlo's "game" is built on his ability to take the ball, find space for himself, and tear a defence in two with a through ball or ball over the top like very few others (Scholes and Iniensta being other obvious examples).

But my arguement was that players like Xavi and Prilo have always existed and when they are good enough, they always rise to the top and become lynchpins in teams that go on to dominate eras.

Albertini at Milan in the 90's, Guardiola at Barca in the 90's, Pirlo at Milan in the early 2000's, Xavi at Barca in the late 2000's, Redondo at Real in the late 90's and so on.

Xavi didn't invent a position and he didn't save it from dying out. It was always there for the "best" teams, and it always will be. Whether it's a lesser version (lesser than Prilo, Scholes and Xavi doesn't mean bad!) like Xabi at Liverpool or promising younger players like Veratti at PSG, the game has space now and will in the future for players who know how to create space for themselves and others or play a pass to bypass the opposition when needed.

Buying cheap clothes is the same as running a sweatshop now.

Just a little Samba

Deleted User wrote: »

Buying cheap clothes is the same as running a sweatshop now.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/whataboutery

Basically you can't defend a position you support on merit so you find a perceived hypocritical angle and attack that instead.

It's an extremely good deflection tactic.

Andersonisgod

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Buying cheap clothes is the same as running a sweatshop now.

If nobody bought the clothes there would be no sweatshop.

Shanotheslayer

CSF wrote: »

Corruption is one thing, the death of thousands is something else entirely. Some things are bigger than being a good footballer.

Personally I think people are too good these days at emotionally detaching from these things and not completely relating because this is happening so far away, in a place where we've mostly never been or know people from. Try to think about this as if it was Ireland. Could you imagine thousands of people having to die (probably people we know and love) to bring a World Cup here?

If everybody was outraged at things in a far away place the world would be full of Hate and Sadness.

Talib Fiasco

In the modern game, he was peerless besides Iniesta. Great great player, more luck to him in Qatar.

adox

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

If everybody was outraged at things in a far away place the world would be full of Hate and Sadness.

So it's all or nothing? That seems to be view being posted here by those who say it should be ignored.

It's ridiculous that a thread should be started about one of the great players and people can't comment on his latest move without being shouted down, or be asked are they whiter than white.

It's will full ignorance by those aspiring it.

Just a little Samba

adox wrote: »

So it's all or nothing? That seems to be view being posted here by those who say it should be ignored.

It's ridiculous that a thread should be started about one of the great players and people can't comment on his latest move without being shouted down, or be asked are they whiter than white.

It's will full ignorance by those aspiring it.

Happens all the time.

People who campaign for the rights of minorities get called hypocrits because they aren't also campaigning for the right of women or LGBT people.

People protesting empire projection of the US or Human rights abuses in China are called hypocrites for not also protesting Empire projection by Russia or human rights abuses by Israel.

See my previous post re: Whataboutery.

Shanotheslayer

adox wrote: »

So it's all or nothing? That seems to be view being posted here by those who say it should be ignored.

It's ridiculous that a thread should be started about one of the great players and people can't comment on his latest move without being shouted down, or be asked are they whiter than white.

It's will full ignorance by those aspiring it.

The poster clearly stated that people didn't care as it was far away etc. I reply is 100% valid to what he/she said.

Turtwig

Just a little Samba wrote: »

The ability to find space when other teams tried to pack midfield to stifle Barca is what made Xavi the genius he is. His ability to find a pass and almost immediately find the space to get the return is a skill very, very few others have mastered and none have done as well as him.

Of course he also plays diagonals to fullbacks or through balls to Iniesta, Messi and Pedro/Henry/whoever he's not a one dimensional player, and of course Pirlo also plays sideways passes and backwards passes to ball playing centre backs like Nesta and Bonucci he's been lucky enough to have behind him.

But Pirlo's "game" is built on his ability to take the ball, find space for himself, and tear a defence in two with a through ball or ball over the top like very few others (Scholes and Iniensta being other obvious examples).

But my arguement was that players like Xavi and Prilo have always existed and when they are good enough, they always rise to the top and become lynchpins in teams that go on to dominate eras.

Albertini at Milan in the 90's, Guardiola at Barca in the 90's, Pirlo at Milan in the early 2000's, Xavi at Barca in the late 2000's, Redondo at Real in the late 90's and so on.

Xavi didn't invent a position and he didn't save it from dying out. It was always there for the "best" teams, and it always will be. Whether it's a lesser version (lesser than Prilo, Scholes and Xavi doesn't mean bad!) like Xabi at Liverpool or promising younger players like Veratti at PSG, the game has space now and will in the future for players who know how to create space for themselves and others or play a pass to bypass the opposition when needed.

Oh sorry, I missed that part about in the thread earlier Xavi inventing a role. Yep, fully agree Xavi didn't invent it. He might have evolved it a little, that'd be the most you could say invention wise.

Also this thread reads very much like people complaining about diabetes being asked what they're doing to prevent road deaths? Xavi has more money than many people in the world. If he wanted to he could abide by whatever ethical practices he liked. Most people in the world don't even have that luxury. Your average minimum wage worker in the US doesn't even have enough wages to pay their rent. Are we suddenly going to stop them from talking about housing policy? Or expressing their opinion on other ethical matters? Because they buy from companies that sell the cheapest produce and most of it has questionable ethical origins?

eagle eye

Xavi is the greatest midfielder I've even seen and I wish him well. I don't like that he is going to Qatar but they have been linked with Barcelona for a while now and it's not a huge surprise that he will get ridic money to go play there.

He played football differently to any other midfielder I've ever seen because he was always available for the ball and almost always(at a higher percentage rate than anybody else ever) completed his pass. He is my favourite player of all time.

CSF

rarnes1 wrote: »

Let me guess, posted from a phone /tablet made by a company that has human rights issues, while wearing a football jersey made using child slave labour?


Dig deep enough and everyone probably contributes to human rights problems. Is this the forum for it though?

I don't think thousands of people died in the making of my phone that I promote in no way, nor do I think thousands of people died in the making of my Penneys tshirt.

I'm not saying people dont come into contact with things that aren't whiter than white, the world can be a very corrupt place.

But that's not the same as directly promoting something to earn a big bag of money, that is directly killing thousands of people.

The Floyd p

This thread is a disgrace. Really shows up how people have more interest in pelting a player for playing out his days for a well earned mega deal than actually discussing his ability as a player for over 15 years. What is going on in Qatar is genuinely awful, but does a player of a higher caliber than most in history not deserve greater adulation than a bunch of rants about the 2022 world cup?

Montroseee

The Floyd p wrote: »

This thread is a disgrace. Really shows up how people have more interest in pelting a player for playing out his days for a well earned mega deal than actually discussing his ability as a player for over 15 years. What is going on in Qatar is genuinely awful, but does a player of a higher caliber than most in history not deserve greater adulation than a bunch of rants about the 2022 world cup?

Sure he's been getting 10 million a year at Barca for 5+ years now.

CSF

The Floyd p wrote: »

This thread is a disgrace. Really shows up how people have more interest in pelting a player for playing out his days for a well earned mega deal than actually discussing his ability as a player for over 15 years. What is going on in Qatar is genuinely awful, but does a player of a higher caliber than most in history not deserve greater adulation than a bunch of rants about the 2022 world cup?

It's actually not about his playing job at all. The other one is the problem.

MisterAnarchy

Montroseee wrote: »

Sure he's been getting 10 million a year at Barca for 5+ years now.

And he has been living with his folks so he must have a good bit of dosh saved up .;)

I'm disappointed he has gone to Qatar ,its a joke of a country and a joke as a footballing nation.

I remember Qatar in Fifa 95 on the Megadrive, the players could barely stand up they were so bad.

dfx-

Delighted he has gone out with the league title, but it was the right time for him to go. Compared to some players at Barcelona that might see the door that I want stay this Summer - Dani Alves and Pedro in particular, nothing but goodwill for him to go now.

Hard to believe the trademark Xavi outball to Alves might be gone altogether next season if both leave.

Favourite goals involving him might be tough. Think the winner against Madrid in 2003-2004 in the Bernabeu would be up there. Goal against Liverpool back in 2002 after 60 trillion passes as well, his final ball to Overmars. The pass to Jordi Alba in the Euro 2012 final was fantastic. The late winner against Malaga in 2007 or so. Even lately, the backheel flick to Suarez a couple of weeks ago against Getafe was marvellous.

Great stuff. Whether he goes to Qatar or not will have no impact on the issues in Qatar, much like the FIFA and the World Cup.

gimmick

This thread is just another Barca hate thread. Simple as that.

Turtwig

gimmick wrote: »

This thread is just another Barca hate thread. Simple as that.

Criticism does not equal hate. No need to throw the toys out of the pram.

eagle eye

Turtwig wrote: »

Criticism does not equal hate. No need to throw the toys out of the pram.

The people acting like children in this thread are those saying his legacy is destroyed by this.

Xavi's legacy is a football one. When you are asked about who you think is the greatest midfielder of all time, his decisions off the field don't come into it for me and for most people I'd imagine.

Bobby Baccala

gimmick wrote: »

This thread is just another Barca hate thread. Simple as that.

Not how I intended it to go whatsoever

dfx-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3aVRY_fq0kM

I know he has gone forward in the past couple of seasons a bit more, but back then, he probably had nose bleeds. :pac:

Such a big goal and statement win that was. Since the Malaga defeat that Christmas, this was the big statement of Rijkaard's team to go ahead of that night and finish ultimately ahead of Madrid and on to the league win the next season and the next, then Messi..

bohsman

Big fan of Barca, not a fan of slavery in middle east. One of the best footballers I have ever seen but can't wish him any luck in his future endeavours.

If Gerrard, Beckham were at the same time becoming ambassadors for the US military they would be similarly lambasted. As for Blatter, of course he is massively hated, surprised people think he isn't.

Andersonisgod

Sorry to drag up this thread but a lovely article/set of quotes put together by Sid Lowe.

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/may/31/xavi-barcelona-la-liga-sid-lowe

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

Best midfielder of his generation, simple as. He was the single most important player of that all-conquering Barcelona team from 2008-2010, and also the Spanish National team in 08, 10 & 12. He dictated their style of play and I think it's no coincidence that with his demise also came Spain's. Barcelona have (finally) changed their style of play to suit Messi (not to say that it didn't suit him before), and moved on from their dependence on Xavi. Anyone who regularly watched Barcelona from 08-11 saw how much reliance the team had on Xavi. Whenever he didn't play, the fluidity of the team was hugely affected.

His sheer number of performances throughout his career have caught up with him, not this season, but arguably after the last Euro's. I'm a huge fan of the football Barcelona play, and I have always been a massive fan of Xavi (my posting history will attest to this), and it disappoints me to see him leaving for Qatar of all places. However, history won't remember what he does post-Barcelona, all that will be talked about is the player he was during his peak.

One of the best midfielders of all time, in my humble opinion. The vital cog in greatest club side of all time, and arguably the greatest national side of all time to boot.

NIMAN

So true. Was a pleasure to watch him play.

NIMAN

Don't want to bring a dampener on all of this, but I do remember him being named before in articles about doping in Spanish football. Nothing concrete, but rather how he used to be constantly injured in the early years of his career and then as he got older he was abel to cover the most km of all players and chase constantly after people, and never be injured.

Now of course this could all be down to a change in training techniques, physio, boots, whatever, but I did read those articles with interest as they did say that a top Dr in Spain (Fuentes) claimed many top players in the top teams in Spain (which would cover Madrid and Barca) were on PEDs.

This little bit of audio from Graham Hunter re: Xavi getting human growth hormones is slightly shocking.
http://www.irishpeloton.com/2012/02/drugs-in-football-pull-the-other-one/