Cockapoos???

Ash.J.Williams

a dog is a dog ...cop on to yourselves ...snobs, I've only had mongrals that literally turned up at the door other family members have have pedigree inbred freaks of dogs that require serious vet attention and ya know what .....they're all awesome

DBB

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

a dog is a dog ...cop on to yourselves ...snobs, ...
pedigree inbred freaks of dogs

Calm down there Ash.J.Williams,
I feel like a broken record saying this, but if you can't argue with other users without disrespecting them, don't post.
Do not reply to this post on-thread.
Thanks,
DBB

kylith

muddypaws wrote: »

The logic is that he was obviously bred by either a back yard breeder or puppy farmer who didn't give a toss about him, his siblings or parents. If people only bought pups from ethical breeders who insist on contracts then dogs like Josh wouldn't end up in pounds, if owners' circumstances change, then the breeder takes them back, no need for them to be killed in pounds, or for rescues to be completely overwhelmed, as they are at the moment with unwanted dogs. Reputable breeders do the same kind of home checks as good rescues, they don't just sell a pup to anyone who has the money. The breeder I would go to for a husky pup has never, ever, had a dog that they have bred, end up in a pound or rescue either here or in the UK.

False logic. The quality of Josh's breeder doesn't mean a thing because we don't know under what circumstances he wound up in the pound. He may have been collected as a stray. If an owner decides to hand a dog to the pound then no amount of reputable breeding or breeder contracts will stop them from doing it. Josh may have had the best breeder in the country but if he escaped, was lost, or was dumped by his previous owner and thus came to the pound has no reflection on his breeder.

borderlinemeath

kylith wrote: »

False logic. The quality of Josh's breeder doesn't mean a thing because we don't know under what circumstances he wound up in the pound. He may have been collected as a stray. If an owner decides to hand a dog to the pound then no amount of reputable breeding or breeder contracts will stop them from doing it. Josh may have had the best breeder in the country but if he escaped, was lost, or was dumped by his previous owner and thus came to the pound has no reflection on his breeder.

From memory, maybe DeVore can clarify, I don't think Josh was microchipped. He might have got his chip on leaving the pound. Or even if he had one it was never registered. That's a red flag straightaway. No decent breeder doesn't chip or doesn't tell the new owners to ensure to get their details on it straight away.

tk123

ShaShaBear wrote: »

On this topic, I just saw someone in Louth is selling breaking edge hybrid, purpose bred Llapzus.
Yes, Llasa Apso x Shih Tsu
They go for 300 euro and are completely non-shed and hypoallergenic!

:mad:

I'd rather have tumble weeds of dog hair around the place (like what we have now lol :rolleyes:) and my own allergies than have deal with skin issues and allergies that have been bread into some of these hybird/non-shed dogs? I was brushing my two in the park the other week "leave the hair back to nature" and had somebody boasting that their ever allergic dog never sheds hair and it was great! Great for them but not great for the poor dog being pumped full of steroids and scratching itself raw!

dr.fuzzenstein

ShaShaBear wrote: »

All I've ever owned are blender dogs. We currently have a border collie crossed with demolition equipment.
I don't have an issue with people paying for pedigree dogs - sometimes the characteristics (physically or mentally) are desired or required (eg working dogs) and cannot be achieved through rescue. If these people source a breeder that works primarily to strengthen the genetics and lineage of the breed (ie only breeding rarely from top champion dogs proven to be shining examples with immaculate bills of health, excellent skeletal structure and the mental disposition of an angel), then fair dues to them. It's the ones who pay similar prices for someone owning one of these dogs who just got Joe Soap down the road to cover their bitch with his likened breed, neither of which have had veterinary care past their yearly jabs (if even that). They could essentially be getting no better than a mongrel in terms of temperament and health and the money is wasted.

Agreed. Your dog sounds intriguing. :pac:

Magenta

I saw an ad for Cavalier x Papillon which are apparently called "Cavillons" and "are from the Cavillon area of France".
There's no such place!!!!! BS.

sillysmiles

Magenta wrote: »

I saw an ad for Cavalier x Papillon which are apparently called "Cavillons" and "are from the Cavillon area of France".
There's no such place!!!!! BS.

Apparently there is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cavillon

Not saying that the cross is a good idea or that they have any associate with this area, but there is an area in France called Cavillon.

ShaShaBear

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Agreed. Your dog sounds intriguing. :pac:

Do you want him?
He's awesome, I swear :pac:

He just dug a hole in the garden, and when you put your ear to it, you can hear didgeridoos

muddypaws

kylith wrote: »

False logic. The quality of Josh's breeder doesn't mean a thing because we don't know under what circumstances he wound up in the pound. He may have been collected as a stray. If an owner decides to hand a dog to the pound then no amount of reputable breeding or breeder contracts will stop them from doing it. Josh may have had the best breeder in the country but if he escaped, was lost, or was dumped by his previous owner and thus came to the pound has no reflection on his breeder.

Nope, not false logic at all. If he had the best breeder in the country, they will only sell to certain people, and will stay in touch with the owner for the rest of the dog's life. As stated earlier, the one breeder I would get a husky from has never, ever had a dog end up in rescue or a pound. Breed clubs also play a part, as obviously things can happen to people, a breeder may die, or circumstances change drastically so that they can't take the dogs back. A breed club will have a welfare section and will then step up to help.

Unfortunately though, people are liars, and yes you are right, sometimes a breeder will be duped but an unchipped dog ending up in the pound doesn't come from a reputable breeder. I do know of a dog that ended up in the pound, chip was still registered to the breeder, but the pound refused to let the breeder take him back, because they were a breeder. The owner didn't want him anymore due to military commitments. But there was someone trying to do the right thing and not being allowed by the system, because all breeders are bad. :rolleyes:

Nekarsulm

borderlinemeath wrote: »

If you're looking for another Red Setter, there was 9 of them handed into the warden in Limerick pound last week. They've gone to a Munster based SPCA who are taking enquiries for rehoming at the moment. It's against forum rules to mention rescues so if you're interested PM me and I'll point you in their direction

I have to say I'm completely biased towards Red Setters, I have 3 at the moment, and the ones that I'm speaking about look very like my rescue boy who came from the West of Ireland. He too was a failed gun dog, but is the best dog you could ever meet.

Thanks for that, but I'm not going looking till after the holidays. No point getting a dog and leaving him for the guts of three weeks.

boomerang

Aren't Papillons Belgian? And Cavaliers are British?

Magenta

boomerang wrote: »

Aren't Papillons Belgian? And Cavaliers are British?

French and UK respectively says Wikipedia

dr.fuzzenstein

Nekarsulm wrote: »

Thanks for that, but I'm not going looking till after the holidays. No point getting a dog and leaving him for the guts of three weeks.

Totally get what you're saying, but survival chances of dogs in these kennels aren't great.
Read somewhere that Ireland puts down more dogs than England, Scotland and Wales combined. Not percentage or per head of population, total. Animal welfare in this country is not as good as, say, China.

Nekarsulm

I really need to get a good sheep dog pup, to be honest.
The time I got the Red Setter the warden told me that if I didn't want him, not to worry, cause he actually had a waiting list for Labs, Spaniels, Setters and Pointers, and those type breeds were never actually put down.

DeVore

borderlinemeath wrote: »

From memory, maybe DeVore can clarify, I don't think Josh was microchipped. He might have got his chip on leaving the pound. Or even if he had one it was never registered. That's a red flag straightaway. No decent breeder doesn't chip or doesn't tell the new owners to ensure to get their details on it straight away.

Correct Josh wasn't chipped and he's mostly Beagle but clearly has something else in there. (As BorderlineMeath will attest, possibly Kangaroo).

The point still stands that unless its standard practise for a breeder to take back a no-longer-wanted-dog then its pretty irrelevant where Josh came from, it didn't stop his prior owner dumping him.

Unless someone can paint a scenario where an owner who was about to abandon the dog decides against it solely because he's a pure breed from a reputable breeder... then I remain to be convinced about the initial point

muddypaws

DeVore wrote: »

Correct Josh wasn't chipped and he's mostly Beagle but clearly has something else in there. (As BorderlineMeath will attest, possibly Kangaroo).

The point still stands that unless its standard practise for a breeder to take back a no-longer-wanted-dog then its pretty irrelevant where Josh came from, it didn't stop his prior owner dumping him.

Unless someone can paint a scenario where an owner who was about to abandon the dog decides against it solely because he's a pure breed from a reputable breeder... then I remain to be convinced about the initial point

I can give you plenty of examples of that. People contact me wanting to get rid of their dog, first question I ask if if they have contacted the breeder. None of them seem to have even thought of it, they don't know where to put the dog, so its either the pound, or a rescue. However, a couple of months ago it happened, someone was going to have to take the dog to be pts if I couldn't take her, I knew the breeder, and knows that she takes her dogs back. She did indeed, so the dog is still alive.

And the point still stands that if people only ever bought dogs from reputable breeders who do take back their pups, then we wouldn't be in the position where thousands are killed in pounds every year. But, most people want a dog now, they don't want to get to know a breeder and be put on a waiting list, even though it is a purchase that could be in their lives for 15 years or so. It needs a complete change of attitude towards dogs and ownership.

Dubl07

DeVore wrote: »

Correct Josh wasn't chipped and he's mostly Beagle but clearly has something else in there. (As BorderlineMeath will attest, possibly Kangaroo).

The point still stands that unless its standard practise for a breeder to take back a no-longer-wanted-dog then its pretty irrelevant where Josh came from, it didn't stop his prior owner dumping him.

Unless someone can paint a scenario where an owner who was about to abandon the dog decides against it solely because he's a pure breed from a reputable breeder... then I remain to be convinced about the initial point

There's no effective oversight from government/official bodies or charities in either UK or Ireland so yes, some breeders do go to great lengths. Even though the purchasers from the type of breeder Muddypaws is discussing will have signed a contract specifying they'll hand back to the breeder, that still doesn't always happen and is apparently extremely difficult to enforce.

Some of the breeders I'm in touch with in the UK (who chip before releasing pups) put their own name and contact information on the chip registration as primary contact. The subsequent owners details can then be added as a secondary contact. It gives the breeders a real heads-up if a dog from their line goes missing or is handed in and probably does make owners think twice about abandoning a pup/dog. It certainly prods their memory about agreements made if they happen to 'forget' their obligations. It's a lot of responsibility for a breeder to take on; effectively 15+ years of possible returns from every litter they breed.

Same with neutering at maturity or an agreed age. The only way for breeders in UK/Ireland to enforce neutering seems to be by taking a hefty deposit equal to proceeds from a litter and returning that on receipt of proof of neutering.

nala2012

Was looking at an add today for a ridgeback pup. Add said mum was registered but pup couldn't be because of endorsement on paper! Isn't the whole point of endorsement that dog is not bred from at all?

Knine

nala2012 wrote: »

Was looking at an add today for a ridgeback pup. Add said mum was registered but pup couldn't be because of endorsement on paper! Isn't the whole point of endorsement that dog is not bred from at all?

All the endorcement means is that the puppies cannot be registered & some unreputable people will breed anyhow as they will still get buyers for the puppies.

Buyers will also not tell the truth to try & get one of your puppies. I have a puppy still available because when I did some research I found that the puppy buyer was not suitable to have one of mine. It can be a minefield.

Mark Tapley

muddypaws wrote: »

I can give you plenty of examples of that. People contact me wanting to get rid of their dog, first question I ask if if they have contacted the breeder. None of them seem to have even thought of it, they don't know where to put the dog, so its either the pound, or a rescue. However, a couple of months ago it happened, someone was going to have to take the dog to be pts if I couldn't take her, I knew the breeder, and knows that she takes her dogs back. She did indeed, so the dog is still alive.

And the point still stands that if people only ever bought dogs from reputable breeders who do take back their pups, then we wouldn't be in the position where thousands are killed in pounds every year. But, most people want a dog now, they don't want to get to know a breeder and be put on a waiting list, even though it is a purchase that could be in their lives for 15 years or so. It needs a complete change of attitude towards dogs and ownership.

In a scenario where people only got dogs from breeders who presumably breed only pedigree dogs, would that be the end of crossbreeds?
It is terrible that so many dogs end up with pounds and rescues but I would not like to see the mutts disappear completely.

muddypaws

Mark Tapley wrote: »

In a scenario where people only got dogs from breeders who presumably breed only pedigree dogs, would that be the end of crossbreeds?
It is terrible that so many dogs end up with pounds and rescues but I would not like to see the mutts disappear completely.

I know, I won't disagree with you, most of my dogs have been mutts. But, with so many dogs being killed each year unnecessarily I think something major needs to change regarding our attitude to dogs and our relationship with them

dr.fuzzenstein

muddypaws wrote: »

I know, I won't disagree with you, most of my dogs have been mutts. But, with so many dogs being killed each year unnecessarily I think something major needs to change regarding our attitude to dogs and our relationship with them

And that's the thing. it's not the dog's fault or the breed or the lack of papers, you can be sure a lot of people buy dogs for a lot of money and they also get turfed out or put down.
It's ignorance, laziness and stupidity by the owners, not by the dogs.
Also, imagine a law came in forcing everyone to buy pure-bred dogs with paperwork ONLY, compulsory micro chipping, registration with local authorities, frequent inspections and ruthless enforcement? All "illegal" mutts would have to be put down, that would be millions of dogs. More regulation of the dogs is NOT the answer, we would have to regulate the owners, but that is a fool's game in Ireland, since enforcement of anything is mostly non-existent and whatever enforcement bodies do exist mostly don't give a sh*t. It's also the general attitude of the Irish to rules and regulations, which is "fcuk it". Ireland does have all the legislation in the world and there is enforcement (though it should be more), but if no one cares about it, it doesn't mean diddly-squat.
In Germany people have an entirely different attitude to the rules, they are not just an annoyance that get in your way and have to be "gotten round" somehow, people understand that the rules have to exist in order for people to live together in a civilised society. There is not a Polizist hiding behind every street corner and tree, I think it works because people cooperate.

muddypaws

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

And that's the thing. it's not the dog's fault or the breed or the lack of papers, you can be sure a lot of people buy dogs for a lot of money and they also get turfed out or put down.
It's ignorance, laziness and stupidity by the owners, not by the dogs.
Also, imagine a law came in forcing everyone to buy pure-bred dogs with paperwork ONLY, compulsory micro chipping, registration with local authorities, frequent inspections and ruthless enforcement? All "illegal" mutts would have to be put down, that would be millions of dogs. More regulation of the dogs is NOT the answer, we would have to regulate the owners, but that is a fool's game in Ireland, since enforcement of anything is mostly non-existent and whatever enforcement bodies do exist mostly don't give a sh*t. It's also the general attitude of the Irish to rules and regulations, which is "fcuk it". Ireland does have all the legislation in the world and there is enforcement (though it should be more), but if no one cares about it, it doesn't mean diddly-squat.
In Germany people have an entirely different attitude to the rules, they are not just an annoyance that get in your way and have to be "gotten round" somehow, people understand that the rules have to exist in order for people to live together in a civilised society. There is not a Polizist hiding behind every street corner and tree, I think it works because people cooperate.

But I'm not talking about legislation, I'm talking about education. Educate people about what a good breeder is, and what they should look for when buying a puppy. See the dog as a long term part of their life and so waiting for the right dog if necessary isn't a bad thing. There is no legislation that says breeders have to take a dog back, but the good ones do it, because they care about the dogs and the breed, and because they don't breed hundreds of pups, so they have the capacity in their homes to take the dogs back if necessary.

dr.fuzzenstein

muddypaws wrote: »

But I'm not talking about legislation, I'm talking about education. Educate people about what a good breeder is, and what they should look for when buying a puppy. See the dog as a long term part of their life and so waiting for the right dog if necessary isn't a bad thing. There is no legislation that says breeders have to take a dog back, but the good ones do it, because they care about the dogs and the breed, and because they don't breed hundreds of pups, so they have the capacity in their homes to take the dogs back if necessary.

I totally get you. But what's wrong with rescuing a dog from the pound?
If the owners are responsible, a mutt from the pound should be just as well cared for as a full pedigree with paperwork bought for a lot of money from a breeder. I know some people don't appreciate anything that doesn't cost a lot of money, but I don't mind.

Knine

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I totally get you. But what's wrong with rescuing a dog from the pound?
If the owners are responsible, a mutt from the pound should be just as well cared for as a full pedigree with paperwork bought for a lot of money from a breeder. I know some people don't appreciate anything that doesn't cost a lot of money, but I don't mind.

Any mutts in this house are treated exactly the same as their top winning very valuable kennel mates. Anyone who does not do this should not have dogs imo.

dr.fuzzenstein

Knine wrote: »

Any mutts in this house are treated exactly the same as their top winning very valuable kennel mates. Anyone who does not do this should not have dogs imo.

Absolutely. In my house I definitely rank below the dogs as far as Mrs Fuzzenstin is concerned and if I'm in trouble I can't be in the doghouse, the dogs sleep there. Unless they're on the couch.

muddypaws

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I totally get you. But what's wrong with rescuing a dog from the pound?
If the owners are responsible, a mutt from the pound should be just as well cared for as a full pedigree with paperwork bought for a lot of money from a breeder. I know some people don't appreciate anything that doesn't cost a lot of money, but I don't mind.

I've never said don't rescue, but I would prefer if rescue wasn't needed. What about the ones that don't get out of the pound? Most pounds won't rehome any dog on the RB list to the public, its owner only, or a rescue. Some won't even allow rescues to take them. If an RB dog ends up in the pound and the owner isn't found, its killed, with no second chance, no matter how nice a dog it is, and some pounds extend that policy to other breeds that aren't on the RB list.

Adopting from a pound is great, but adopting from a reputable rescue is even better, then the dog is neutered, chipped, matched with the new owner, and with back up from the rescue. Unfortunately there are a large number of dogs that are adopted from the pound that bounce back there, or are then handed into a rescue, when they start displaying unwanted behaviours.

I have mutts, including 2 from the pound, I also have pedigree dogs, again, including 3 from the pound. They all sleep on the sofa or my bed!

PeteFalk78

kylith wrote: »

They're a total crap shoot, like any mongrel. They could be the size of a poodle or a cocker. They could have any type of coat. They are bred by people looking to make money off of the current fashion for mongrels with cute names.

Some of the high horse attitudes on this thread and forum in general is absolutely disgusting

Knine

PeteFalk78 wrote: »

Some of the high horse attitudes on this thread and forum in general is absolutely disgusting

There is nothing disgusting at all about the truth. Breeding dogs for financial gain is disgusting.

Dubl07

Knine wrote: »

There is nothing disgusting at all about the truth. Breeding dogs for financial gain is disgusting.

Bit of an overstatement, I'd reckon. Breeding children for financial gain is disgusting.

Breeding dogs solely for financial gain without regard for the long-term well-being of the dog is reprehensible. Breeding dogs through laziness without regard for the long-term well-being of the dog is reprehensible.

Breeders who stay at home and raise/socialise puppies can't exactly work 9-5 to pay the rent. They need to have a financial gain in order to provide for themselves and their four and two-legged families.

S]Criticising people you don't know for valid choices you may not agree with isn't agreeable but is seemingly within the forum rules.[/S
Sorry about that - had a bit of a crappy day.

Dubl07

And this is truly disgusting. Licence fee information linked with chips should make it impossible for this to happen.

dr.fuzzenstein

muddypaws wrote: »

I've never said don't rescue, but I would prefer if rescue wasn't needed. What about the ones that don't get out of the pound? Most pounds won't rehome any dog on the RB list to the public, its owner only, or a rescue. Some won't even allow rescues to take them. If an RB dog ends up in the pound and the owner isn't found, its killed, with no second chance, no matter how nice a dog it is, and some pounds extend that policy to other breeds that aren't on the RB list.

Adopting from a pound is great, but adopting from a reputable rescue is even better, then the dog is neutered, chipped, matched with the new owner, and with back up from the rescue. Unfortunately there are a large number of dogs that are adopted from the pound that bounce back there, or are then handed into a rescue, when they start displaying unwanted behaviours.

I have mutts, including 2 from the pound, I also have pedigree dogs, again, including 3 from the pound. They all sleep on the sofa or my bed!

I guess you mean restricted breed list. Yes, it is silly to just go by a one size fits all solution.
I would also prefer if rescue wasn't needed, but it is a fact and not likely to go away, there will always be strays or unwanted dogs handed into the <snip>. That is the fault of the people, not the dogs. What's wrong with the <snip> anyway? They are trying to do a very difficult and thankless task with no state funding. They do put down far too many animals as it is, but who else is going to take in the thousands upon thousands of rescue animals? Having a "reputable" rescue center is all well and good, but could they handle the absolute avalanche of homeless animals if the pound just shut shop?
The statistics are grim:
http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/25-of-abandoned-dogs-were-destroyed-227898.html
http://www.thejournal.ie/readme/we%E2%80%99re-a-nation-of-mass-dog-murderers-1269371-Jan2014/
http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/up-to-10-dogs-a-day-put-down-in-pounds-266287.html
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/struggling-shelters-forced-to-put-down-10000-dogs-last-year-26550728.html

It's a bit like what you hear from countries like Bulgaria, Romania and some African countries. There is a crisis and no one cares!
I'm looking for German statistics, but all I can find is websites rescuing dogs from countries outside Germany. The last time I was there I saw a man with a border collie, he got the dog through a rescue organisation and it was indeed an Irish dog. I hope he knows it's "Wau Wau" over there.

Could "reputable rescue centers" process, chip, immunise and rehome the thousands of strays? What is going on in this country regarding dogs (and any other animal) is nothing short of disgusting and a scandal. The treatment of abandoned horses made headline news in Germany, I think the treatment of dogs is worse. That would include the amount of strays, dodgy breeders and let's not even go into dog fighting. There is an utterly fcuked up attitude towards animals in this country. I can't with all good conscience blame the pounds, they are simply a symptom of a wider problem.

Knine

Dubl07 wrote: »

Bit of an overstatement, I'd reckon. Breeding children for financial gain is disgusting.

Breeding dogs solely for financial gain without regard for the long-term well-being of the dog is reprehensible. Breeding dogs through laziness without regard for the long-term well-being of the dog is reprehensible.

Breeders who stay at home and raise/socialise puppies can't exactly work 9-5 to pay the rent. They need to have a financial gain in order to provide for themselves and their four and two-legged families.

Criticising people you don't know for valid choices you may not agree with isn't agreeable but is seemingly within the forum rules.

Really you obviously don't know me. I however do know a lot of responsible breeders. I also know all about breeding & what it involves.

Breeding Children????

muddypaws

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I guess you mean restricted breed list. Yes, it is silly to just go by a one size fits all solution.
I would also prefer if rescue wasn't needed, but it is a fact and not likely to go away, there will always be strays or unwanted dogs handed into the ...... That is the fault of the people, not the dogs. What's wrong with the ..... anyway? They are trying to do a very difficult and thankless task with no state funding. They do put down far too many animals as it is, but who else is going to take in the thousands upon thousands of rescue animals? Having a "reputable" rescue center is all well and good, but could they handle the absolute avalanche of homeless animals if the pound just shut shop?
The statistics are grim:
http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/25-of-abandoned-dogs-were-destroyed-227898.html
http://www.thejournal.ie/readme/we%E2%80%99re-a-nation-of-mass-dog-murderers-1269371-Jan2014/
http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/up-to-10-dogs-a-day-put-down-in-pounds-266287.html
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/struggling-shelters-forced-to-put-down-10000-dogs-last-year-26550728.html

It's a bit like what you hear from countries like Bulgaria, Romania and some African countries. There is a crisis and no one cares!
I'm looking for German statistics, but all I can find is websites rescuing dogs from countries outside Germany. The last time I was there I saw a man with a border collie, he got the dog through a rescue organisation and it was indeed an Irish dog. I hope he knows it's "Wau Wau" over there.

Could "reputable rescue centers" process, chip, immunise and rehome the thousands of strays? What is going on in this country regarding dogs (and any other animal) is nothing short of disgusting and a scandal. The treatment of abandoned horses made headline news in Germany, I think the treatment of dogs is worse. That would include the amount of strays, dodgy breeders and let's not even go into dog fighting. There is an utterly fcuked up attitude towards animals in this country. I can't with all good conscience blame the pounds, they are simply a symptom of a wider problem.

Its against the forum charter to mention specific rescues, but you may want to look at other pounds around the country (I'm not sure why you say THE pound, as if there is just one in Ireland) and see their pts records against the pounds run by the organisation you mention. Why is an organisation that is meant to be about animal welfare killing so many dogs, when other organisations manage to do the same job, without the same high pts figures? Look at Leitrim pound, that is run by a rescue and has the lowest pts figures in the country. Meath pound is also now run by a rescue and again, much, much, much lower pts figures than the ones run by the national animal welfare organisation.

I am a bit confused by part of your post, are you saying the organisation that you mention doesn't have a "reputable" rescue centre?

I'm also not sure that you realise that the organisation you mention doesn't have centres in every county in Ireland, where people can hand dogs in? It is usually the small, local rescues that get dogs out of pounds and into new homes. I think maybe you're confusing a pound and a rescue?

muddypaws

Dubl07 wrote: »

And this is truly disgusting. Licence fee information linked with chips should make it impossible for this to happen.

Why would it make it impossible to happen? The owners surrendered her, even with microchips, licences etc, thats not illegal. It happens every day, legal owners surrender dogs to pounds. A surrendered dog has no time at all before it can be killed, a stray at least gets 5 days.

Dubl07

muddypaws wrote: »

Why would it make it impossible to happen? The owners surrendered her, even with microchips, licences etc, thats not illegal. It happens every day, legal owners surrender dogs to pounds. A surrendered dog has no time at all before it can be killed, a stray at least gets 5 days.

What I meant was that someone should not be permitted to surrender a healthy dog to a pound for such a frivolous reason and retain ownership of other animals.

Dubl07

Knine wrote: »

Really you obviously don't know me. I however do know a lot of responsible breeders. I also know all about breeding & what it involves.

Breeding Children????

I don't know you or your circumstances but I understand that you want the best for dogs in general. Talking tough to well-meaning individuals on t'internet doesn't further that cause, that's all.

Breeding children - having more offspring than you can provide for while on welfare with the sole apparent aim being to live the life of Reilly due to benefits including free housing while paying little or no attention to the current or long-term welfare of the little ankle-biters. It's not solely an Irish practice.

Kattra

Regarding the PTS numbers for dogs in german pounds (Tierheim): Tierheime are all no-kill shelters. Only dogs who are severly ill or are deemed unsafe for the general public are put to sleep.
We had dogs who stayed in our local shelter for over 10 years due to behaviour issues or breed (Staffis were very hard to rehome due to the higher tax and the sheer amount of dogs which came in after the breed legislation was put in place).
This comes with a price: the dogtax is a lot higher then in Ireland ^^
In my little hometown you pay 40 Euro for the first dog, 60 for the second, 78 for all other dogs. And if you have an RB dog (Anlagehund) it is a whooping 600 Euro per year.

DBB

Dubl07 wrote: »

Criticising people you don't know for valid choices you may not agree with isn't agreeable but is seemingly within the forum rules.

Dubl07, this is a discussion forum, where people can give their opinions, which can include criticising people, as long as it's not libellous.
Nobody has mentioned any names, this has been a general discussion about certain groups of people... If you can see anything more harmful than that, please don't hesitate to report the post. Otherwise, it's a perfectly legit discussion.
As for your opinion on what's within the forum rules, please don't take on to discuss this on thread, or to attempt to modify how others post by discussing forum rules or lack thereof. It is teetering dangerously close to back-seat moderating. If you want to take up discussion of forum rules with the mods or cat mods of this forum, please do so by pm or on the feedback forum.
Finally, let's stop the discussion about breeding children, or the whole area of discussing benefits people might receive from having children... It's just not for this forum and will only help to derail the thread.
Do not reply to this post on-thread.
Thanks,
DBB