Giro d'Italia 2015 - Stage 20: Saint Vincent - Sestriere **unmasked spoilers**

godtabh

happytramp wrote: »

A bit rich coming from him :rolleyes:

He's speaking from experience

dastardly00

Giovanni Visconti (Movistar) has managed to hang on to win the KOM jersey despite getting shot out the back of the peloton on the lower slopes of the climb to Finestre.

Landa probably would have won the jersey if he didn't have to work for Aru.

dastardly00

The last placed rider in GC, Marco Coledan (Trek) is an enormous 6 hours, 40 minutes and 13 seconds behind Contador. That must be a record for the biggest time gap between first and last place in a modern day Grand Tour.

MPFG

Talib Fiasco wrote: »

I think he'll go to Katusha personally.

Maybe that is a better choice as apart from Purito they don't have a GC guy

Raam

dastardly00 wrote: »

The last placed rider in GC, Marco Coledan (Trek) is an enormous 6 hours, 40 minutes and 13 seconds behind Contador. That must be a record for the biggest time gap between first and last place in a modern day Grand Tour.

There was a picture of him on Twitter earlier waiting before the finish line for some other riders to come in before he would cross it himself. Deleted now.

Smokeyskelton

MPFG wrote: »

Oh I see what you mean

I thought you were alluding to Oleg's Ogles penchant for photographing riders in their underpants :eek:

Fixed your post.

Eamonnator

Raam wrote: »

There was a picture of him on Twitter earlier waiting before the finish line for some other riders to come in before he would cross it himself. Deleted now.

Coledan is about about 6 minutes behind the 2nd last placed man, Kluge of Team IAM. He waited for Kluge today, and finished with him, they were last finishers today. He obviously wants to finish in last place

neris

just watching the last 50km of todays stage. theres cyclists in their lycra with their bikes on the climbs watching the race from the side of the road taking pics and shouting encouragemnet. then you have the idiots dressed in mankinis and god knows what else who insist on running alongside the riders. are the idiots genuine cycling fans or just genuine idiots?

pelevin

If Contador had decided to wait up a bit more hoping for help from a teammate it would have been quite a poor move - the next sign of Saxo riders at the finish line was Basso & Rogers 27 minutes down. Otoh 4 Astana riders in the top 10. 8 Astana riders finished before a Contador teammate arrived. Overall in the Giro to some degree maybe it can be explained by the nature of their tactics & how their riders were used but imo what an utterly sh it performance by Saxo as a team - including tactically - & yet they got the win, or rather Contador got the win.
I wonder how often a GT winner in the key 'killing zones' has been so totally bereft of teammates more or less throughout a race. Offhand the only time I can think of they proved of any real worth was on the flat on the Mortirola stage. Great that an individual prevailed against what would for most be pretty intimidating circumstances day after day.

By contrast it brought to mind the 2013 World Championships in the rain when Chris Froome abandoned whilst still in the lead group, saying:
"After three laps, I looked around, I saw I didn’t have any team-mates with me and thought, this isn’t happening today.”
So he abandoned whilst with the lead group. I'm not specifically having a go at Froome - though I do think that was very weak-minded - but just showing how intimidating that kind of situation can be for riders, & the Worlds by contrast was just a one day event.
Even today's stage probably showed how powerfully in control Contador is where so many would have panicked when struggling but he rode it in brilliantly.

One other thought is I wonder should Landa have told the team to go f themselves when told to wait for Aru or pull the earpiece. That was horse sh . . imo. Since he actually ended finishing with Uran & Hesjedal, this shows they had the stage in the bag with Landa, & their only chance of the overall was Landa going full gas all the way to the line & just see what happened behind. Trying to stage-manage an Aru win Landa had every right to ignore. I don't see any depth to the idea their chance of the overall was strengthened by Landa having to sit up & wait for Aru - maybe you could argue if he'd sat up way earlier but not where he did. And with Landa looking such a talent & with his contract up, why alienate him - as imo would be the natural reaction were I in his shoes.

Eamonnator

He, who pays the piper, calls the tune.

Landa does, what he's told (and paid) to do.

ThisRegard

pelevin wrote: »

big post.

I was only thinking myself over the last few days how utterly lonely and hostile it must be for a race leader to be completely isolated and in situations such as Contador has been in during the giro.

pelevin

Eamonnator wrote: »

He, who pays the piper, calls the tune.

Landa does, what he's told (and paid) to do.

He wouldn't be the first person to take an earpiece from his ear. I also think by winning the stage he was doing what he was paid to do, & by contrast the team were dicking him around.

MPFG

pelevin

I agree re Tinkoff Saxo team being very weak in the Mountains...my point today was Contador performance today cannot be blamed solely on his team....he just didn't have the legs ...Other riders who beat him today had no team mates and they proved as strong in this last week without teams...commentators forget this ...they focus on one rider not having teammates and forget about the others high up on GC


Frankly one of the reasons I admire Hesjedal & Kruijswijk performances is they rode out of their skins without any fanfare or lamenting from Commentators about lack of teams....

Both gained time to Contador in the final week.

They started stage 16 at 11.07 & 11.42 behind and finished Stage 20 ..9.52 & 11.02 behind Contador

Most of the time was lost on just 3 stages : Stage 4 ,the TTT & ITT ....and if they had good teams then Stage 4 & TTT may no have been such problems for in stage 4 they had no one to help chase when Astana attacked and they were out of position

Want to talk about poor teams then Contador is not the only one but its the only one we hear about ...

pelevin

I meant to say though as now edited how often a GT winner has been so bereft of teammates in the key zones rather than just team leaders. I wasn't blaming his struggles yesterday on lack of teammates, but as is pretty reasonable, once he wasn't invincible and did like a normal human have trouble & was obviously under huge pressure not to blow the race, where were those teammates? A half an hour back the road. Contrast to if Aru or Landa needed help, & how much more comfortable a psychological situation it was for their big riders all race.

gordongekko

It's a team sport. He's in the last year of his contract. What team manager would sign a lad who is not a team player. You don't sign trouble.

pelevin

gordongekko wrote: »

It's a team sport. He's in the last year of his contract. What team manager would sign a lad who is not a team player. You don't sign trouble.

If you're saying Landa would be considered trouble for riding on for a certain stage win when even the overall was a small possibility, I'd say there's not many team managers would consider that too off-putting. He had to sit up & sacrifice a certain win to instead let an overall weaker rider back the road try & get an uncertain win instead against other rivals, & where their sole GC possibility of Landa riding on full gas was scuppered in doing so. And he had ridden a superb Giro in the domestique role for nearly 3 weeks, so he had more than earned the right to the plaudits instead of Aru by default getting them instead. Since Aru took no turns at the flat or until his attack, seems pretty obvious he wasn't making any effort to go for the overall GC.

And in terms of not signing trouble, how tough did Stephen Roche find it getting suitors after 1987 I wonder, where Landa if he'd ridden on for the stage & maybe even GC wouldn't remotely compare in terms of a mutiny & being not 'a team player'? Contador also riding against Armstrong & Astana doesn't seem to have had subsequent problems finding big contracts. I think there are times when a rider is right not to kowtow to bulls... & is a greater rather than lesser man for not doing so.

TheBlaaMan

There's a great write up and fantastic images of the stage from the Grubers at http://stories.strava.com/race-day-finestre


Worth a browse

ThisRegard

That's great, they look like refugees in some photos with their over turned shopping trolleys and masses of empty beer bottles.

dastardly00

TheBlaaMan wrote: »

There's a great write up and fantastic images of the stage from the Grubers at http://stories.strava.com/race-day-finestre


Worth a browse

Brilliant fantastic photos. Really amazing.

Those idiots in the pink 'positivi al luppolo' t-shirts should have got a good hiding for their stupid carry-on.

TheBlaaMan

Was having another look through these pics.........

You've got to love Hansen.........he really gets in the spirit of things, just like on the Zoncolan last year.

Take a close look at the fans in the pic: there are those who have seen Hansen and get the joke - on the right, behind him - and then on the left there are those who have just copped this rider in a pink wig and haven't quite got what is going on but the look on their faces simply says.....What the fcuk ?
Priceless

ThisRegard

Contador and motorised bikes still making the headlines. Cipo reckons changing bikes is bad for cyclings image as people believe it's because they have motors in them, which is nonsense imo.


http://velonews.competitor.com/2015/06/news/claim-contador-staged-puncture-to-hide-motor-in-giro-bike_372681

desertcircus

ThisRegard wrote: »

Contador and motorised bikes still making the headlines. Cipo reckons changing bikes is bad for cyclings image as people believe it's because they have motors in them, which is nonsense imo.


http://velonews.competitor.com/2015/06/news/claim-contador-staged-puncture-to-hide-motor-in-giro-bike_372681

With all the claims over the past few years about hidden motors, has a single one been found? Has anyone even managed to produce a workable motor that fits inside a frame or wheel?

perrier

dastardly00 wrote: »

Brilliant fantastic photos. Really amazing.

Those idiots in the pink 'positivi al luppolo' t-shirts should have got a good hiding for their stupid carry-on.

Brilliant photos.

neris

desertcircus wrote: »

With all the claims over the past few years about hidden motors, has a single one been found? Has anyone even managed to produce a workable motor that fits inside a frame or wheel?

Meant to be some video from belgium on youtube of an amateur with a motor up against a pro on a standard bike. Was experiment done for tv

ThisRegard

desertcircus wrote: »

With all the claims over the past few years about hidden motors, has a single one been found? Has anyone even managed to produce a workable motor that fits inside a frame or wheel?

I've wondered myself do they exist. I'm sure there's some small motor out there, but I doubt it would be of any help in cycling over a pebble, never mind an alpine pass.

And that's the funny thing, there's no even working examples that I've seen. You'd think whatever genius designed and made one would have demonstrated it widely now, or sold it to one of the big bike companies so they could get rid of the big battery packs and motors they currently use in their electric bikes.

You'd probably be looking at nano technology to fit a working, and strong, one into a bike used in the peleton.

neris wrote: »

Meant to be some video from belgium on youtube of an amateur with a motor up against a pro on a standard bike. Was experiment done for tv

Was the motor fairly obvious on the bike though ?

lennymc

Motors for bikes exist alright - http://cyclingtips.com.au/2015/04/hidden-motors-for-road-bikes-exist-heres-how-they-work/

ThisRegard

Ah, that is cool alright. Puts my rant right back in its box, biggest problem would be around the design and hiding of the battery pack for the peleton.

pelevin

In terms of motors you'd sometimes see two fellas in plain clothes ahead of the rest of the cyclists going up the mountains what seems to be no problem, & the fella on the back even has a big camera for some reason pointing back at the other cyclists. Definitely looks suspect to me.

dastardly00

I think if motors in bikes did exist in the peloton, they would have been found out by now.

pelevin

The thing is too unlike ped's, once you're tested if your bike does have a motor, you're presumably caught. Also there's no way the team could feasibly distance themselves from that cheating either. Now that the testing goes on it seems a simple no-go area at the higher levels.

check_six

pelevin wrote: »

The thing is too unlike ped's, once you're tested if your bike does have a motor, you're presumably caught. Also there's no way the team could feasibly distance themselves from that cheating either. Now that the testing goes on it seems a simple no-go area at the higher levels.

Ah here, let's not jump the gun here. If you get caught with a motor in your bike, make sure to request them to test your "B Sample", your backup bike.

No motor in the "B" bike? Well then we just got a false positive on the "A" bike.

Nothing to see here, move along...

pelevin

check_six wrote: »

Ah here, let's not jump the gun here. If you get caught with a motor in your bike, make sure to request them to test your "B Sample", your backup bike.

No motor in the "B" bike? Well then we just got a false positive on the "A" bike.

Nothing to see here, move along...

You could also try the line, "That's not me bike. I fell and one of the Orica Aussie fellas stopped & gave me his one. He said he could see I was in a rush & he'd get a lift in on the handlebar of one of his Aussie mates."