ESB cut off

dudara

Off-topic posts deleted and thread moved to Accommodation & Property

dudara

K.Flyer

mcneil wrote: »

3 days its cut off

I can assure you that the ESB did not just decide out of the blue to rock up to their house and cut the power.
There is a protocol of letters and phone calls and endeavours to work out payment plans before that happens.
Having been in a similar situation a few years back, partially my fault and partially the suppliers fault, out of the blue I ended up with a bill for over 2,200 euro. Not an amount of money that I had spare in my back pocket and at the time was just about able to pay the on-going usage.
While arguing and debating with them I was never cut off, although threatened a few times, and the simplest way was to have their PAYG meter fitted.
The arrears are almost cleared off now and I don't have any more hefty bills landing in the letterbox any more.
Its a simple arrangement and works very well and when the debt is cleared I will be keeping the PAYG meter in place.

Atlantic Dawn

K.Flyer wrote: »

I can assure you that the ESB did not just decide out of the blue to rock up to their house and cut the power.
There is a protocol of letters and phone calls and endeavours to work out payment plans before that happens.
Having been in a similar situation a few years back, partially my fault and partially the suppliers fault, out of the blue I ended up with a bill for over 2,200 euro. Not an amount of money that I had spare in my back pocket and at the time was just about able to pay the on-going usage.
While arguing and debating with them I was never cut off, although threatened a few times, and the simplest way was to have their PAYG meter fitted.
The arrears are almost cleared off now and I don't have any more hefty bills landing in the letterbox any more.
Its a simple arrangement and works very well and when the debt is cleared I will be keeping the PAYG meter in place.

But the PAYG is more expensive than the standard setup, if you can't afford the standard setup getting the PAYG in is a bad idea.

K.Flyer

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

But the PAYG is more expensive than the standard setup, if you can't afford the standard setup getting the PAYG in is a bad idea.

I know if you go with some of the companies that advertise the PAYG setup (not mentioning names) yes you do pay over the odds for the service.
But the last time I checked (last year sometime) with my supplier, who supplied the unit directly, I am getting the same rate as their discount customer, so no loss there for me.
The other side of the coin for me was the ability to chip away at the arrears without a penalty of any sort and not have any phone calls, bils or letters from them any more. As long as I am buying electricity I am clearing my arrears at the same time.

the_syco

mcneil wrote: »

Not to avoid it but pay the bill over time because we've heard if you can't pay bill up front, you won't get turned on.

Owing a thousand euros, PAYG will be their ONLY option, as they have shown they can't be trusted to pay in arrears.

Usually a percentage of what they pay gets taken from what they put into the PAYG box, and is put against the outstanding bill.

cerastes

mcneil wrote: »

Not to avoid it but pay the bill over time because we've heard if you can't pay bill up front, you won't get turned on. They don't want a pay as go either because of the radiation from the meters

I suppose its been answered already, what particular wavelength of radiation are they concerned about? and why?

dhaughton99 wrote: »

How did they manage to ignore the bills for a year or 2? Strange why Esb didn't cut them off earlier.

Sounds like some kind of allergy

mcneil wrote: »

There's been 4 deaths in the family, mortgage, depression, car wrote off, lost jobs, attempted suicides to name a few and the electric bill was the least of their worries. I am willing to help them with this bill but first need to know what can be done. I know we can be quick to jump and say they should have paid but they've had their fair share of bad luck since 2012 so I can forgive them for not paying.

tbh, thats a cop out, I am sick to my back teeth of excuses like that, Ive had some of them thrown at me too and basically, if everyone just let everything go when someone died everywhere would shut down, I appreciate a lot of that stuff is terrible, but most people have had to deal with a lot of that, how have you not been affected by all this, presumably your electric bill is relatively up to date? so how does any of this excuse them?
Its like the worst of the worst and not being allowed to say anything for someone that has allowed things to deteriorate and then if or when someone dies, they throw that in as an excuse as to why they cant deal with it when as you say its taken years to get to this point. No one that makes any arrangement with any supplier or creditor will be cut off or shut down, plain and simply they must have been ignoring this, my sympathy goes out to their landlord.

mcneil wrote: »

I know nothing about the pre pay meters!!!!!!!!!!

I wouldnt say there is much to know, but if you take the advice and contact the talk to forum or the bill provider directly then that is your first port of call,
Basically, its a meter you put a card into, this meter is fitted as a replacement to the standard no pre payed meter, the card is topped up with a credit and then you load that into the machine, if you lose the card I think you have to do some basic initial set up again, but its not impossible.

I honestly dont know if you are serious or just dont know or if they have provided this excuse of "Radiation" if they have children, will you please check up to make sure they are fully vaccinated, becuase radiation from the meter is a bit quakery and Im open to opinions on anything really.

TireeTerror

PAYG is NOT the only option for them at all.

There will be a debt flag registered on the network. Debt hopping can still be done. Its up to the new supplier to decide if they want to take the risk and register a new customer, not the existing supplier. All they can do is notify the new supplier if the debt has been owed for a while. If I remember correctly €240-250 must be owed for 3 or 4 months. Obviously they fall into that category, but they could still have changed. The difficulty they face is they waited until they were disconnected and that limits their options as ESB Networks do not cut people off without plenty of warning unless a genuine mistake was made.

The reconnection fee will have to be paid regardless of chosen supplier. I will assume they owe the money to Electric Ireland based on you constantly talking about ESB, a common mistake in this country. Electric Ireland can ask ESB Networks to install a PAYG meter which will be set at a rate to recover the debt owed. Electric Ireland do NOT charge a premium for a PAYG meter unlike the con men at PrePay Power and Pinergy, who target the vulnerable in society with their sneaky €136 hidden charge.

Im not here to tell people how to avoid paying electricity bills. However if I found myself in your situation and I had a concern about PAYG radiation (Utterly hysterical excuse!) then I would register the electric in the name of someone else. Perhaps both your names were not on the bill, if not simply register as a new tenant with the others name. Make sure you setup a direct debit to avoid a deposit and make sure you do NOT use any bank account that was used by the person named on the bill who owes the money. The information the energy suppliers use to detect this kind of action is fairly robust, but with simple enough precautions it can be done. Use a different phone number and email address as the person who owes money may have provided them when they registered and they can catch you out that way. OP you could even register the electric in your own name and setup a DD and then after its registered just change it back into one of their names. The main goal is to have the power back on. If its possible, a small child living in the house can speed things up dramatically. Anyone requiring electrical life saving equipment is also something that would prevent the power being cut off at all.

This is a last resort of course, the reality is that they have just chanced it and no amount of stories about a difficult life will get much sympathy in here where the vast majority would be paying their bills and hate to see people avoiding paying as they are likely to believe that could result in increases for them.

foggy_lad

mcneil wrote: »

Not to avoid it but pay the bill over time because we've heard if you can't pay bill up front, you won't get turned on. They don't want a pay as go either because of the radiation from the meters

Sounds like they are looking for ways of not paying including getting you or others to pay it for them.

mcneil wrote: »

Its their issue, not mine and all I can do is respect their decision. I'm not qualified in that department so I vsnt really judge them, they could be wrong or even right but who am I to say they are because I know nothing about them.

Any excuse not to pay up? they and the esb both know that if they set up a direct debit it will gain them a few months grace before that too goes unpaid.

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

But the PAYG is more expensive than the standard setup, if you can't afford the standard setup getting the PAYG in is a bad idea.

the esb payg meters are far cheaper than any other "prepay power" or other prepay companies because those other companies add at least 13% onto the standard rate to cover the meter and their profit!

the esb only charge only the standard rate plus a small amount for installation afaik.

K.Flyer

foggy_lad wrote: »

the esb only charge only the standard rate plus a small amount for installation afaik.

There is no charge for the installation, in fact, you get your first 5 euro credit free

The_Conductor

K.Flyer wrote: »

There is no charge for the installation, in fact, you get your first 5 euro credit free

Note- if they are renting- they can only get a pre-pay meter with the express permission of the owner of the property- and there is a large fee for removing it at a later date (which is normally incremented onto a tenant's deposit- aka a separate deposit is needed for it). Having a pre-pay meter- automatically makes a property less desirable to most prospective tenants (not all- but definitely a significant majority of people would view it poorly).

K.Flyer

The_Conductor wrote: »

Note- if they are renting- they can only get a pre-pay meter with the express permission of the owner of the property- and there is a large fee for removing it at a later date (which is normally incremented onto a tenant's deposit- aka a separate deposit is needed for it). Having a pre-pay meter- automatically makes a property less desirable to most prospective tenants (not all- but definitely a significant majority of people would view it poorly).

Not so sure you are correct.
I rent and when I was getting the p.p. meter I asked them about having it changed back to a normal meter when I was leaving and they said it would be no problem once the arrears were cleared and that there would be no fee attached to the change back.
They also said that the as the account was between me and the supplier that it was none of the owners business as long as I put it back the way it was and left no arrears.
Not saying they were right or wrong, but that's how mine worked out.

athtrasna

K.Flyer wrote: »

They also said that the as the account was between me and the supplier that it was none of the owners business as long as I put it back the way it was and left no arrears.

Absolutely not true. Installing a meter is altering the landlord's property and should never be considered without prior consent from the landlord

K.Flyer

The meter belongs to the ESB Networks, not the property owner.

athtrasna

K.Flyer wrote: »

The meter belongs to the ESB Networks, not the property owner.

The meter is installed on the landlord's property, materially altering the property. Needs permission from landlord

TheChizler

K.Flyer wrote: »

The meter belongs to the ESB Networks, not the property owner.

The meter requires holes drilled for wires and mounting points though. Same as if you were getting Sky or UPC installed.

K.Flyer

We're going o.t. here, but the main meter in the meter box is mounted onto a wooden board and the cables were not cut or extended.
The internal key pad is a counter top plug in device which sits on the counter, so nothing different than a radio or a kettle. :rolleyes:
So no holes drilled or wiring changed, I know because I was standing next to him.
If there is any problem having it changed back then that will be my problem to deal with then.

athtrasna

The meter is connected to cables/the mains. There has to be connections somewhere, altering the landlord's property. Something a tenant is not entitled to have done without permission from the property owner.

TireeTerror

<SNIP>

It is an absolute fact that a tenant must have the express permission of the landlord or letting agent before having a prepayment meter installed.

You will note that when the sales reps of Prepay Power and Pinergy are out flogging the product, they will not even ask you if you own the property or rent it, they will ALWAYS tick "HOMEOWNER" as they know if they tick TENANT they will need to have the landlords permission and it would either result in a lost sale or a delay which will cost them money. The drama always kicks off when that tenant leaves and the landlord gives out to the supplier for installing it without their permission.

melekalikimaka

You will have to lie to get it installed without ll consent. I think they're in enough of a hole as it is

antoinolachtnai

Most leases forbid the tenants from having their electricity cut off. The tenants are in breach and their tenancy could be terminated.

An ESB networks supplied PAYG meter takes the place of the original meter. It is very hard to see why landlord's permission is needed for this.

ComfortKid

antoinolachtnai wrote:

An ESB networks supplied PAYG meter takes the place of the original meter. It is very hard to see why landlord's permission is needed for this.

ESB told me that the meter is their property and I didn't need to say it to landlord. There was no drilling or anything. Just a keypad that plugs into a socket.

melekalikimaka

A fee would be charged to change it back. ESB are not a charity

antoinolachtnai

melekalikimaka wrote: »

A fee would be charged to change it back. ESB are not a charity

I'd imagine they'd just give you the bypass code. Then it's just a regular meter.

Anyway I don't see much of a choice if their electricity is cut off and they have no money.

the_syco

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

It is very hard to see why landlord's permission is needed for this.

If the tenant leaves before paying off what they owe, their debt follows them, however as the cost of the removal will therefore not be covered (as there's still debt), and it's left with the landlord, who will may have to pay to have it removed.

TireeTerror wrote: »

then I would register the electric in the name of someone else. Perhaps both your names were not on the bill, if not simply register as a new tenant with the others name. Make sure you setup a direct debit to avoid a deposit and make sure you do NOT use any bank account that was used by the person named on the bill who owes the money.

IMO the tenants will just leave the "other party" to pay their bill, as they'll need the money for their holiday/sky/other BS excuse + plus possible emotional blackmail.

antoinolachtnai

Electric Ireland has no recourse against the landlord or new tenant. They will clear the debt off the meter

cerastes

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

Most leases forbid the tenants from having their electricity cut off. The tenants are in breach and their tenancy could be terminated.

An ESB networks supplied PAYG meter takes the place of the original meter. It is very hard to see why landlord's permission is needed for this.

ComfortKid wrote: »

ESB told me that the meter is their property and I didn't need to say it to landlord. There was no drilling or anything. Just a keypad that plugs into a socket.

It is a requirement to have landlord consent signed, networks send out a form to be signed by the landlord for their consent, I was told by networks themselves they needed my consent for such a change, they have obviously come up against this in a bad way before as they won't have a leg to stand on if they have it changed without the landlords permission.

I can see how it is a better idea for a certain type of tenant to have a prepay meter but it is no different to setting aside the money in your account or transferring a certain amount to account we up for bills.

twowheelsonly

cerastes wrote: »

I can see how it is a better idea for a certain type of tenant to have a prepay meter but it is no different to setting aside the money in your account or transferring a certain amount to account we up for bills.

It's a lot easier to handle a PAYG meter than trying to set money aside.
We all know that when things are tight it's all too easy to dig into the bills money - Robbing Peter to pay Paul if you like.
The advantage of the meter is that if you have .50c of power left on it then your next fiver is going on a card and not on a pint/match/chocolate/junk etc. It's all too easy to spend that fiver instead of putting it away for a bill that's due in 6 or 8 weeks time.
The other advantage is no more big bills popping in the door!!
I've had that meter for 20+ years and it's the best thing ever. I haven't had a bill in all that time and you really don't miss the money that you're putting in. If by chance you don't have a fiver or forget about it you can press an ' emergency' button (once in each cycle - can't press it twice in a row without topping up in between). This costs you more though as afaik it's charged at a premium rate so it'll automatically swallow up most of the next fiver.

Best thing ever IMO opinion and I wish I could pay more bills this way !!!
(As far as I can see none of the family have been irradiated into burnt crisps either even though the Mrs definitely looks a bit dodgy these days )

TheChizler

Yuck, I can barely get the energy together to go online and buy phone credit every month, never mind going to the shop and buying electricity credit every couple of weeks.

dhaughton99

TheChizler wrote: »

Yuck, I can barely get the energy together to go online and buy phone credit every month, never mind going to the shop and buying electricity credit every couple of weeks.

Not too mention there is a 50c charge now on every top up inc gas and electric.

K.Flyer

TheChizler wrote: »

Yuck, I can barely get the energy together to go online and buy phone credit every month, never mind going to the shop and buying electricity credit every couple of weeks.

You can buy you Airtricity credit on line now.
So no need to be going to the shop for it.