Mascherano vs Keane (vs Busquets)

Moneymaker

kfallon wrote: »

Proper midfielders can do it all so of course goal scoring will come into it! If you don't take goalscoring into account you may as well say Frank Lampard was a nothing player!

Keane was a better tackler, also he was more of an inspiration to his teamates! I never said his short passing game was better, I said his was fantastic but never compared it to Busquets so not sure what you're babbling on about there!

Never mentioned the World Cup finals, did I? Answer the question, do you think Busquets could do what Keane did in the quaifying campaign, answer the question this time please!

I guess that makes Makelele rubbish by your logic too then. Vieira? Tardelli? Redondo? Gattuso?

Busquets isn't in the team to score goals. He has a very specific role and there's a strong argument that he does it better then perhaps any player has ever done before. His ability to read the game and positioning is as good as any player i've seen.

Playing hearsay and what if's about a world cup campaign is pretty much irrelevant to the discussion.

Andersonisgod

kfallon wrote: »

Proper midfielders can do it all so of course goal scoring will come into it! If you don't take goalscoring into account you may as well say Frank Lampard was a nothing player!

Keane was a better tackler, also he was more of an inspiration to his teamates! I never said his short passing game was better, I said his was fantastic but never compared it to Busquets so not sure what you're babbling on about there!

Never mentioned the World Cup finals, did I? Answer the question, do you think Busquets could do what Keane did in the quaifying campaign, answer the question this time please!

I don't want to sound rude but you seem like someone who missed the last 10 years of football, as though your sole idea of a midfielder is a box to box one. I don't quite think you understand what role Busquets plays for Spain and Barcelona. Every time you see Dani Alves put in a cross from the by line, thank Sergio Busquets. See Pique charge forward and create that 3 vs 2 goal against Juventus? Thank Sergio Busquets. You see Barcelona's overwhelming possession stats? Busquets plays a large part in that. See how few goals Barcelona have conceded? Busquets is pivotal to that in a variety of ways. Box to box isn't, and never had been the job of Busquets, just like it wasn't the job of Makelele, Matic or any holding midfielder to put it into a context you might understand.

Why is he more of an inspiration? He shouts a lot. Busquets is a captain at Barcelona, a leading voice of the team. Just because you don't see him burst a blood vessel on the pitch don't think he is not a leader or that he is not inspirational. Any player coming through La Masia aspires to be Busquets. You are comparing the two, as such I'm obviously going to make a counter point when you bring up a facet of Keane's game, you do know how this works, right?

Haha of course you didn't mention the finals, he didn't play! Why would Busquets have to, Spain typically have no problems in their qualifying campaigns. In the finals, on the big stage where the top teams are tested, Busquets showed all his worth, winning the competition with Spain.

Andersonisgod

Giggsy11 wrote: »

The "I see more in the game and appreciate the game better" type of post.

Somebody has to, when goals scored is brought into a debate regarding Sergio Busquets you know something somewhere has gone terribly wrong.

Turtwig

lassykk wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

To be fair, you have go a long way back into the past for Busquet's play acting. He's cleaned up his act superbly. It's difficult to compare Busquets and Keane, and Masch and Keane. All are apples and oranges if you're being honest.

Out of the 3 players though, Busquets is the most valuable for any team to have. His reading of the game is just phenomenal. On form and fully fit, there's arguably no better DM a team can have. If Arsenal had Busquets they'd probably win the Premier League. His aspect of the game is incredibly under appreciated.

Spanish Johnny

kfallon wrote: »

Proper midfielders can do it all so of course goal scoring will come into it! If you don't take goalscoring into account you may as well say Frank Lampard was a nothing player!

Keane was a better tackler, also he was more of an inspiration to his teamates! I never said his short passing game was better, I said his was fantastic but never compared it to Busquets so not sure what you're babbling on about there!

Never mentioned the World Cup finals, did I? Answer the question, do you think Busquets could do what Keane did in the quaifying campaign, answer the question this time please!

Regarding your point about Busquets doing what Keane did in qualifying....its not a proper comparison. Keane did it as he was the standout player on a rather ordinary team and because of the players he had beside him. Busquets never ever had to do this for Spain simply because of the quality ahead of him and around him. So it's not a stick ha can use to beat Busquets with.

If Busquets played in the equivalent of that Irish team it's fair to say his game may have been much more attacking and Keane like. Wel never know. Better idea to compare club careers as an even comparison.

shamrock55

Two totally different players, its like saying whos better buffon or messi

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Really? Please expand on that.

Keane in his prime was arguably the best player in the world. Keane was arguably the best leader/captain of his generation (him and Maldini were out ahead of the rest). Keane dictated the tempo and pace of games over his Man Utd career - people often forget this, but many were worried about Scholes being able to run a midfield as the 'lead' guy because that role had been Keane's for a decade or so prior, and he led the league in passing nearly every year I think I remember reading. Keane was the absolute definition of 'clutch'. Keane had remarkable defensive intelligence (Makalele is the midfielder of the last 20 years better than him, in this regard) coupled with a great athleticism and a psychotic mentality to never get beaten, but again was very good going forward with 95 career goals (86 for club, 9 for country) and actually played a good bit of his earlier years at Forest/Man Utd in more advanced roles. Keane was proven to be able to operate both as the guy who allowed others to shine in great teams at Man Utd, and the guy to take an average bunch of players on his back and drag them to success with Ireland in the 2002 qualifiers.

There are probably less than a half dozen players in his position who can match the play Roy Keane exhibited from 1998-2002.

Roy Keane is legitimately in the same bracket as Monti, Jose Andrade, Neeskens, Redondo, Falcao, and possibly even Rijkaard and Matthaus (the absolute gold standards at the position). With all due respect to them as they are fine players, Mascherano... is not. And Busquets... is not.

pmasterson95

I thought the reason Ireland can't produce "a Busquets" is due to the fact we don't have a La Masia style academy to teach/develop the talent. How many Irish have gone over spent few years in academy before being dumped and having to come home?


But no its the fact Ireland doesnt appreciate Busquets that leaves us lacking.

Billy86

shamrock55 wrote: »

Two totally different players, its like saying whos better buffon or messi

I would say it's closer to asking who is better - Brad Friedel vs Messi, or Buffon vs Lavezzi. While we are talking different positions, we are also talking about an all timer at one position, vs. a "just" very, very, very good player in the other.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Its telling of the attitude of some Irish fans that they believe that because Keane ran around a lot, screamed at the top of his lungs a bunch and made a crunching tackle that he is having a greater effect on a game than a player who is constantly moving the ball around at pace, that is always available for a pass, that is finding spaces between the lines to play forward into, that is quietly covering his rampaging full backs and, occasionally, centre backs. It's that attitude which is a big reason why Ireland doesn't produce footballers like Sergio Busquets. You have your players chasing the ball around, Barcelona/Spain will have those moving the ball around, see which one wins.

Good job ignoring the fact that he ran Man United's midfield for a good decade both with and without possession, while having fantastic positioning and anticipation as well as great tackling technique - as much as people go on about "crunching" tackles (something I agree often gets very overrated) he was one of the best around at cleanly dispossessing players and making it look easy, in a vein similar to a Rio Ferdinand or Nesta.

The bolded part is a very accurate description of what Keane did actually, and Man Utd fans have been bemoaning the absence of that for the entire decade since he left, which makes me question how often you really watched him play.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Haha of course you didn't mention the finals, he didn't play! Why would Busquets have to, Spain typically have no problems in their qualifying campaigns. In the finals, on the big stage where the top teams are tested, Busquets showed all his worth, winning the competition with Spain.

Which is fair, because as we all know Gary Doherty, Gary Breen, Kenny Cunningham, David Connolly, Mark Kinsella, Matt Holland, Ian Harte, Kevin Kilbane, etc were all world class players, and all timers in their positions. So, it's not like Busquets had a massive, seismic, incomparable advantage there or anything.

Billy86

kfallon wrote: »

I'd say if we mentioned Rakitic he'd be saying he was better than Keane too! It's all about the jersey you wear, not the ability you have!

I'm tempted to make a 'Puyol vs Nesta, Scirea, Beckenbauer, Desailly, Moore, Chumpitaz, Passarella, Baresi and Krol' thread at this stage, just to see... :pac:

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

Keane in his prime was arguably the best player in the world. Keane was arguably the best leader/captain of his generation (him and Maldini were out ahead of the rest). Keane dictated the tempo and pace of games over his Man Utd career - people often forget this, but many were worried about Scholes being able to run a midfield as the 'lead' guy because that role had been Keane's for a decade or so prior, and he led the league in passing nearly every year I think I remember reading. Keane was the absolute definition of 'clutch'. Keane had remarkable defensive intelligence (Makalele is the midfielder of the last 20 years better than him, in this regard) coupled with a great athleticism and a psychotic mentality to never get beaten, but again was very good going forward with 95 career goals (86 for club, 9 for country) and actually played a good bit of his earlier years at Forest/Man Utd in more advanced roles. Keane was proven to be able to operate both as the guy who allowed others to shine in great teams at Man Utd, and the guy to take an average bunch of players on his back and drag them to success with Ireland in the 2002 qualifiers.

There are probably less than a half dozen players in his position who can match the play Roy Keane exhibited from 1998-2002.

Roy Keane is legitimately in the same bracket as Monti, Jose Andrade, Neeskens, Redondo, Falcao, and possibly even Rijkaard and Matthaus (the absolute gold standards at the position). With all due respect to them as they are fine players, Mascherano... is not. And Busquets... is not.

Wow there's really nothing like a spot of Irish bias and nostalgia to really get you going on a Wednesday afternoon. Somebody says Keane was a the best player in the world and nobody bats an eyelid while you make a case for Mascherano and there's uproar. It's all just a bit too bizarre for me really.

I don't mean to be harsh but I think some people here are too happy living in the 90's. Why can't Busquets be compared to those players? 3 Champions Leagues, 5 La Ligas, 3 Copa Del Reys, 2 world club championships, 2 European Championships and a World Cup....not in the same bracket? Busquets stands in a bracket alone, above all others.

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

Which is fair, because as we all know Gary Doherty, Gary Breen, Kenny Cunningham, David Connolly, Mark Kinsella, Matt Holland, Ian Harte, Kevin Kilbane, etc were all world class players, and all timers in their positions. So, it's not like Busquets had a massive, seismic, incomparable advantage there or anything.

I forgot that I was the one who originally brought up that ridiculous comparison with the WC 2002....oh wait....no, I'm actually reading back through the thread and it turns out I didn't....hmmm.....somebody has something to answer for there.

Andersonisgod

Anyway the goals scored thing was odd but the best player in the world thing is far too much for me to contend with, there's genuinely no arguing with that and logical debate becomes pointless. I'll conclude with I'd rather Mascherano than Keane and I'd rather Busquets ahead of Mascherano, Keane or any other holding midfielder.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

I forgot that I was the one who originally brought up that ridiculous comparison with the WC 2002....oh wait....no, I'm actually reading back through the thread and it turns out I didn't....hmmm.....somebody has something to answer for there.

Nobody mentioned the 2002 World Cup. What was brought up were the 2002 qualifiers. Whatever about what happened in Saipan, who is to blame, etc etc they fact is Roy Keane dragged Ireland to it against Figo's Portugal and the Dutch second gold generation. Busquets plays his role exceptionally well, but he is not the type to go and take over a game, or carry an underperforming side on his back - and that is a major asset for a midfielder and leader/captain to have. What he did as part of a team of world class talents and even all timers is irrelevant to that.

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Wow there's really nothing like a spot of Irish bias and nostalgia to really get you going on a Wednesday afternoon. Somebody says Keane was a the best player in the world and nobody bats an eyelid while you make a case for Mascherano and there's uproar. It's all just a bit too bizarre for me really.

I don't mean to be harsh but I think some people here are too happy living in the 90's. Why can't Busquets be compared to those players? 3 Champions Leagues, 5 La Ligas, 3 Copa Del Reys, 2 world club championships, 2 European Championships and a World Cup....not in the same bracket? Busquets stands in a bracket alone, above all others.

Because Mascherano is not the best player in the world, or particularly close. Neither is Busquets. It's that simple.

Ste-

Robbie has more goals :D:pac:

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Anyway the goals scored thing was odd but the best player in the world thing is far too much for me to contend with, there's genuinely no arguing with that and logical debate becomes pointless. I'll conclude with I'd rather Mascherano than Keane and I'd rather Busquets ahead of Mascherano, Keane or any other holding midfielder.

Puyol or Baresi? Pique or Bobby Moore? G'wan, be honest with us here.

gosplan

I'm gonna go ahead and day the premiership was fairly easy for Utd for a long time.

Arsenal went a season unbeaten on the road, two years later they went a whole season unbeaten.

They were Utd's rivals for much of Keane's career but any time they went to Europe they were kept at arms length for a while.

The premiership was a two horse race for a long time.

LuckyLloyd

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Its telling of the attitude of some Irish fans that they believe that because Keane ran around a lot, screamed at the top of his lungs a bunch and made a crunching tackle that he is having a greater effect on a game than a player who is constantly moving the ball around at pace, that is always available for a pass, that is finding spaces between the lines to play forward into, that is quietly covering his rampaging full backs and, occasionally, centre backs. It's that attitude which is a big reason why Ireland doesn't produce footballers like Sergio Busquets. You have your players chasing the ball around, Barcelona/Spain will have those moving the ball around, see which one wins.

Keane did all those things with a lessor supporting cast than Busquets has enjoyed for Barcelona or Spain. I find the arrogant tone of your post while reducing Keane to someone who crunched into tackles, ran after the ball and screamed a lot is absurd.

Ireland is a small country that has produced a handful of world class players capable of living on the type of teams Busquets has played for (Giles, Brady, Keane). There have been many, many great players who didn't play for Barcelona or come from a latin country, and there will be many, many more in the future.

pmasterson95

I get so bored when people spout out ah but this player has won so many titles he is clearly great.

Andersonisgod check out Pegguy Arphexad a "true legend". He won 7 medals for Liverpool without appearing in any of them. The man is clearly world class look at his medals.

Similarly Jerzy Dudek has more CL medals than Buffon clearly Dudek is superior. Djimi Traore is better than Gianluca Zambrotta.



I wonder do people actually watch matches or just count medals or ooooh look at the stats.


Xavi and Iniesta are regarded as two of the greatest midfielders ever. Lee Carsley and Matt Holland are not. Its easier to win titles or have great "stats" when you are surrounded by players who also have great positional awareness and find space Xavi and Iniesta's ability to find space and evade markers made Busquets job of passing to them that much easier than Keane trying to find an unmarked Carsley, Busquets (who is good dont get me wrong) was helped greatly by being flanked by them and other world class players.

gosplan

Keane best player in the world?

WOW!

efb

Could someone let me know when Keane was the best player in the world????

LuckyLloyd

Between 1998 - 2002 he would have been a worthy member of a World XI imo

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

Puyol or Baresi? Pique or Bobby Moore? G'wan, be honest with us here.

Keane or Ronaldo? Keane or Rivaldo? Keane or Zidane? Keane or Figo? Keane or Raul? Keane or Shevchenko? Keane or Ronaldinho? Keane or Messi? G'wan, be honest.

Some Irish fans and their over-inflated sense of self worth. The highest Keane ever got in the Balon D'or when he was "the best player in the world" is 6th in 1999, when Barcelona's Rivaldo won it. "Best in the world", do me a favor.

Billy86

efb wrote: »

Could someone let me know when Keane was the best player in the world????

Sure, from 1998 to 2002. Unless we are only including attacking or goalscoring players as being eligible, of course.

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

Sure, from 1998 to 2002. Unless we are only including attacking or goalscoring players as being eligible, of course.

Has somebody suddenly shifted the goalposts? Now he's no longer the best player in the world, only the best defensive player in the world?

Well heck then Busquets is the best player in the world from 2010-present!

gosplan

Billy86 wrote: »

Sure, from 1998 to 2002. Unless we are only including attacking or goalscoring players as being eligible, of course.

It's not that we'd ony include attacking players but go watch Ronaldo's first two years at inter.

A way better asset then Keane.

pmasterson95

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Has somebody suddenly shifted the goalposts? Now he's no longer the best player in the world, only the best defensive player in the world?

Well heck then Busquets is the best player in the world from 2010-present!

So you dont rate Iniesta?

GavRedKing

Keane? Best player in the world? Nope, not for me.

However, was he the best CM in the world for a time? Ya, he probably was and would easily slot into a World XI of the day.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Has somebody suddenly shifted the goalposts? Now he's no longer the best player in the world, only the best defensive player in the world?

Well heck then Busquets is the best player in the world from 2010-present!

READ. CAREFULLY. AGAIN.

Now go tell me where I said he was only the best defensive player in the world.

You really need to get better at attempting to twist peoples words,because this is just weak.

gosplan

I just think that all the things people say about Keane in terms of dragging his team along, being a captain etc, I think people would say exactly the same about Gerrard if he had been born in Manchester.

Guts and fight are qualities in footballers we tend to overdo in this part of the world.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Keane or Ronaldo? Keane or Rivaldo? Keane or Zidane? Keane or Figo? Keane or Raul? Keane or Shevchenko? Keane or Ronaldinho? Keane or Messi? G'wan, be honest.

Some Irish fans and their over-inflated sense of self worth. The highest Keane ever got in the Balon D'or when he was "the best player in the world" is 6th in 1999, when Barcelona's Rivaldo won it. "Best in the world", do me a favor.

Keane from 1998 - 2002 was better than either Ronaldo, Messi or Ronaldinho were from 1998 - 2002.

He also plays an entirely different position to every single player you mentioned, but from 1998 - 2002 I would have taken him over Shiva or Raul, with very tough calls between Figo, Rivaldo and Zidane (but then again I find Zidane to be one of the more overrated players in history).

You are gas though, acting as if the Ballon d'Or isn't wildly biased towards attacking. David Beckham finished above Keane that year, now go and ask any Man Utd fan who was better that year.

Go on so, Puyol or Baresi? Pique or Moore?

Andersonisgod

pmasterson95 wrote: »

So you dont rate Iniesta?

Too attacking, so sorry can't be included.

Billy86

gosplan wrote: »

It's not that we'd ony include attacking players but go watch Ronaldo's first two years at inter.

A way better asset then Keane.

The thing is though, in 1998/99 Ronaldo played only half the season for Inter. in 1999/00 he played 8 games in all competitions. In 2000/01, he did not play a single minute. In 2001/02, he played 16 games total. These were Keane's peak years - and don't get me wrong, had Ronaldo not been so screwed with injuries he would have been miles out in front of everyone.

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

READ. CAREFULLY. AGAIN.

Now go tell me where I said he was only the best defensive player in the world.

You really need to get better at attempting to twist peoples words,because this is just weak.

You said "best player in the world" you were derided for that comment so then switched to "best player in the world that isn't a goalscorer or attacking player" now, judging by this comment, you are back to just "best player in the world." If you like I can quote the comments you make these claims in because I think you've become rather confused and, as a result, the rest of us are confused with your comments.

I hardly need to twist your words, your doing a fine job of that yourself.

Mr.H

I dont think anyone outside if Ireland would agree that Roy Keane was EVER one of the (never mind THE) best center mids in the world

In the "keane era" you also had Zidane in his prime, Seedorf, Edgar Davids, Ballack, Makelele and Im sure Im leaving out a few big names

Keane was an amazing player and would def make the first XI of players in the premiership on the 90's but I doubt (outside Ireland) that he would even make a first XI of all time premier league players

Masherano is a great player and while he is probably better defensively than Keane, Keane would be better all round

efb

Billy86 wrote: »

Sure, from 1998 to 2002. Unless we are only including attacking or goalscoring players as being eligible, of course.

Wow he was the best player in the world all that time! He must have a lot of Ballon D'ors so!

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

Keane from 1998 - 2002 was better than either Ronaldo, Messi or Ronaldinho were from 1998 - 2002.

He also plays an entirely different position to every single player you mentioned, but from 1998 - 2002 I would have taken him over Shiva or Raul, with very tough calls between Figo, Rivaldo and Zidane (but then again I find Zidane to be one of the more overrated players in history).

You are gas though, acting as if the Ballon d'Or isn't wildly biased towards attacking. David Beckham finished above Keane that year, now go and ask any Man Utd fan who was better that year.

Go on so, Puyol or Baresi? Pique or Moore?

Well you are comparing players from different generations and you appear to have little control of your own argument so why not Ronaldinho or Messi in their prime? Or Beckenbauer vs Keane?

I love the irony of calling Zidane overrated in one paragraph while saying Keane is better than Ronaldo in another. Are you sure your not Eamonn Dunphy circa 2002?

I'm not quite sure what Puyol, Pique or indeed my opinions on those would have in this debate....nice try though.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Too attacking, so sorry can't be included.

Are you trying to be stupid? That's not intended as an insult, it's an honest question.

Nobody ever brought up only including defensive or attacking players. You are just desperately trying to infer that, and it is either a case of exceptionally poor reading comprehension on your part, or just a pathetically transparent attempt to twist words. Allow me to quote myself again.

"Sure, from 1998 to 2002 [Keane had an argument for being the best in the world]. Unless we are only including attacking or goalscoring players as being eligible, of course."

OK, now slowly read that 10 or 12 times if you need. Note how it says "Unless we are only including attacking or goalscoring players as being eligible". Note how that does not say "if we only include defensive players".

efb

Don't be a hero Billy- he was NEVER the best player in the world

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

You said "best player in the world" you were derided for that comment so then switched to "best player in the world that isn't a goalscorer or attacking player" now, judging by this comment, you are back to just "best player in the world." If you like I can quote the comments you make these claims in because I think you've become rather confused and, as a result, the rest of us are confused with your comments.

I hardly need to twist your words, your doing a fine job of that yourself.

http://www.dictionary.com . Enjoy.

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

Are you trying to be stupid? That's not intended as an insult, it's an honest question.

Nobody ever brought up only including defensive or attacking players. You are just desperately trying to infer that, and it is either a case of exceptionally poor reading comprehension on your part, or just a pathetically transparent attempt to twist words. Allow me to quote myself again.

"Sure, from 1998 to 2002 [Keane had an argument for being the best in the world]. Unless we are only including attacking or goalscoring players as being eligible, of course."

OK, now slowly read that 10 or 12 times if you need. Note how it says "Unless we are only including attacking or goalscoring players as being eligible". Note how that does not say "if we only include defensive players".

Don't fret, I feel quite confident with my level of intelligence and reading comprehension. However you appear to have created a labyrinth of arguments that you seem to be struggling to escape, ala a lunatic in a straitjacket. Personally I'm enjoying it but I feel the overwhelming sense of compassion to help you out.

I see you've settled on the argument that Keane was the best player in the world from 1998-2002. Personally I'm happy you settled on that one because it's so utterly ludicrous that it can only be decreed by those of us capable of more rational thought to be utterly insane. Though my compassionate side is urging me to try to convince you to see the error of your ways and to come join the rest of us, the virtual equivalent of trying to talk a man off the ledge.

pmasterson95

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Too attacking, so sorry can't be included.

Can anyone other than Busquets be included in this category you are making.

Billy86

efb wrote: »

Don't be a hero Billy- he was NEVER the best player in the world

I said arguably, because for me there was no standout best player in the world in those years between Ronaldo crocking himself and Ronaldinho rising to glory; Zidane, Figo, Rivaldo, Nesta, Keane, and probably Schevchenko were the top tier in my opinion at that time.

Andersonisgod

pmasterson95 wrote: »

Can anyone other than Busquets be included in this category you are making.

I haven't a clue, I don't make the categories, Billy does, I just poke fun at them.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

I see you've settled on the argument that Keane was the best player in the world from 1998-2002.

I see you've settled on the argument that Busquets is the best player in the world, above Messi and Ronaldo. Good for you.

See how easy it is to be disingenuous? Can't help but notice you don't want to say who you would rate higher in Puyol vs Baresi and Pique vs Moore. :pac:

Though my compassionate side is urging me to try to convince you to see the error of your ways and to come join the rest of us, the virtual equivalent of trying to talk a man off the ledge.

"The rest of us" think Mascherano is better than Keane ever was? Yeah, good luck with that.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

I haven't a clue, I don't make the categories, Billy does, I just poke fun at them.

"Any player, in any position, anywhere in the world" being that category. Seriously, you should consider going back to school at this rate.

efb

Billy86 wrote: »

I said arguably, because for me there was no standout best player in the world in those years between Ronaldo crocking himself and Ronaldinho rising to glory; Zidane, Figo, Rivaldo, Nesta, Keane, and probably Schevchenko were the top tier in my opinion at that time.

Where's the argument for him being the BEST then, at best you're saying here he is top 8!

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

I see you've settled on the argument that Busquets is the best player in the world, above Messi and Ronaldo. Good for you.

See how easy it is to be disingenuous? Can't help but notice you don't want to say who you would rate higher in Puyol vs Baresi and Pique vs Moore. :pac:

"The rest of us" think Mascherano is better than Keane ever was? Yeah, good luck with that.

I wouldn't say settled, I'd say stumbled into that argument given how confusing it was to follow what the requirements were for your claims.

Unless Keane is going to morph into Baresi (unlikely) and Mascherano is going to morph into Puyol (slightly more likely) then I haven't a clue how that would be relevant on this thread.

Actually I meant the rest of us don't think Keane was the best player in the world 1998-2002 only the most biased Man Utd/Ireland fan would try to claim otherwise.