Nobel Laureate: Female Scientists cause trouble for men in Labs.

ancapailldorcha

The Guardian wrote:

Scientists should work in gender-segregated labs, according to a Nobel laureate, who said the trouble with “girls” is that they cause men to fall in love with them and cry when criticised.

Tim Hunt, an English biochemist who admitted that he has a reputation for being a “chauvinist”, said to the World Conference of Science Journalists in Seoul, South Korea: “Let me tell you about my trouble with girls … three things happen when they are in the lab … You fall in love with them, they fall in love with you and when you criticise them, they cry.”

I find it baffling that someone this intelligent could say something so daft or be so prejudiced. Every time I think that this sort of daft sexism is a thing of the past, someone like Tim here comes along to correct me.

Source.

seamus

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I find it baffling that someone this intelligent could say something so daft or be so prejudiced.

There are PhDs out there who believe in homeopathy.

Being an expert or even a genius in one particular topic does not mean someone is inherently an all-round clever or even nice person.

He's taking quite a bit of flak for it now though anyway.

Mr. Incognito

Gee bag is gee bag and upsets people and blames them.

Just because someone is learned about one particular topic does not elevate them to emotionally intelligent, kind or a decent human being.

Dick says dick things. His job has nothing to do with it

/close thread.

ancapailldorcha

seamus wrote: »

There are PhDs out there who believe in homeopathy.

Not to mention our minister for health in the UK.

I don't see this panning out well for him in any case. If nothing else, he should have known better than saying things like this in public.

GLaDOS

Not much to say about it really. Man says idiotic and offensive thing, is rightly lambasted for it.

catallus

So scientists don't fall in love?

ScumLord

catallus wrote: »

So scientists don't fall in love?

It sounds like scientists fall in love too easily.

arayess

is it just me or are his comments being taken a little too seriously?

ancapailldorcha

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I find it baffling that someone this intelligent could say something so daft or be so prejudiced. Every time I think that this sort of daft sexism is a thing of the past, someone like Tim here comes along to correct me.

Tim Hunt? Are you sure his name isn't misspelled?

As my gran would say, he's one of a dying breed that will live forever.

frostyjacks

I can see his point. There are women in our office who, when work gets really busy and stressful, often get all emotional. You just have to accept that's how women behave. It's a price worth paying though in this nice weather when they get their pins out.

ThinkProgress

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I find it baffling that someone this intelligent could say something so daft or be so prejudiced. Every time I think that this sort of daft sexism is a thing of the past, someone like Tim here comes along to correct me.

Source.

Maybe it pi$$es you off that you can't label him an idiot? lol

Maybe he's not sexist, maybe he is talking about his own personal experiences rather than "girls" as a whole?

Maybe it's not PC of him, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's wrong!

I'm just saying, people will react to it being very NON PC, but is he wrong about segregation? Is there any validity to the premise, once you wind your neck back in?

We do segregate girls and boys in school for similar reasons in academia!

sullivlo

The amount of academics who end up marrying their students / postdocs is quite high, so he may have a point that people fall in love.

I can count three within our department alone!

The Backwards Man

Sounds like Mr. Chomondley Warner from the Harry Enfield skit. If a man can't fire up a Bunsen burner without falling in love its time he got out of the lab for good I think.

hatrickpatrick

Nice to know we're living in a decent society where demographics aren't used to judge people. :rolleyes:

Seriously, this kind of sh!te not only makes me sad for the people who have to put up with it, but also for humanity in general. Not just for grand philosophical reasons either, but even practical ones - how many great advancements and leaps forward in medicine, space travel, manufacturing, farming etc have been lost to the world over the years, just because a male scientist refused to work with a female one, or because a white scientist refused to work with a black one? How many Christian inventors failed to perfect their inventions because they wouldn't share a lab with the Muslim who knew how to finish it? How many young researchers failed to connect the dots leading to a medical breakthrough because they discarded the wisdom of the "auld geezer" working in the next room?

This kind of crap not only hurts individuals, both emotionally and professionally, but massively holds back the progress of mankind in general by introducing entirely artificial reasons for potential geniuses not to work with other potential geniuses. Screw this idiot and anyone who thinks like him.

The Diabolical Monocle

inside source here.

this is revenge for shirtgate.

catallus

sullivlo wrote: »

The amount of academics who end up marrying their students / postdocs is quite high, so he may have a point that people fall in love.

I can count three within our department alone!

http://cdn.meme.am/instances2/500x/183130.jpg

Shenshen

So... scientist doesn't have the social skills to work with females without either falling in love with them or criticising them till they cry, and he thinks that's the females' fault?

Am I the only one thinking that this guy must have been the inspiration for Sheldon Cooper?

ThinkProgress

Some people take this sh*t waaaaay too serious. lol

It's one man's view. He's entitled to it, and being one of the smartest people around, his opinion is worth something.

You could actually argue that a bit of gender rivalry could actually benefit humanity and scientific advancements!

The Dark Side

“Let me tell you about my trouble with girls … three things happen when they are in the lab … You fall in love with them, they fall in love with you and when you criticise them, they cry.”

He was just expressing what happens with himself - what's the problem.

Do people not want honesty?

hatrickpatrick

The Diabolical Monocle wrote: »

inside source here.

this is revenge for shirtgate.

One does not simply respond to a bullsh!t accusation of sexism with actual, genuine sexism.

hatrickpatrick

The Dark Side wrote: »

He was just expressing what happens with himself - what's the problem.

Do people not want honesty?

Oh I agree he has a right to an opinion, I'm glad he aired it, and I hope nobody tries to silence him. I'm merely expressing that I find it profoundly disappointing that views like this still exist. As I say, the woman he doesn't want to work with could be the woman with whom he could have discovered the cause of Alzheimer's. That, apart from the personal aspect (which is also important) is a major reason this kind of mindset should be viewed as a serious impediment to humanity's progress and is something we as a society need to do everything we can to eradicate (not just to silence those who hold those views into submission, but to actually make people realise that such views are almost always unfounded).

Wibbs

frostyjacks wrote: »

I can see his point. There are women in our office who, when work gets really busy and stressful, often get all emotional. You just have to accept that's how women behave. It's a price worth paying though in this nice weather when they get their pins out.

WTF am I reading here? :pac:

catallus

Wibbs wrote: »

WTF am I reading here? :pac:

Oh no, someone woke up wibbs!

We're in for it now :pac:

Wibbs

Wibbs wrote: »

WTF am I reading here? :pac:

The women in his office = all women.

I knew some men once. So now I know what you're all like.

Junkyard Tom

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Maybe it pi$$es you off that you can't label him an idiot? lol

What he said was idiotic, certainly. lol

Maybe he's not sexist maybe he is talking about his own personal experiences rather than "girls" as a whole?

"the trouble with “girls” is that they cause men to fall in love with them"

There's two strands of muppetry going on in that sentence that denigrate both men and women.

1. Women cause men to fall in love with them. Women are to blame for affairs/relationships. That's a prehistoric prejudice.

2. Men are idiots who cannot control themselves around women.

is he wrong about segregation? Is there any validity to the premise,

Maybe we should follow the lead of that bastion of innovation and progressiveness Saudi Arabia?

once you wind your neck back in?

Passive aggressiveness winky smiley time.

We do segregate girls and boys in school for similar reasons in academia!

What reason? Most first world countries would have done away with gender segregation I would have thought.

hatrickpatrick

Wibbs wrote: »

WTF am I reading here? :pac:

Candie wrote: »

The women in his office = all women.

I knew some men once. So now I know what you're all like.

"I knew a woman once, but she died soon afterwards." - Father Liam Purcell, the most boring priest in Ireland

Seriously though I can only sincerely hope that the post ye're responding to was an example of dry sarcasm and nothing more. :eek:

hatrickpatrick

On a more serious note, does anyone else regard this as a good enough reason to do away with single sex schools? Many of the guys I know who are totally clueless about women, and women who are clueless about men, went to single-sex schools and weren't the social type outside school, resulting in limited personal experience when growing up with members of the opposite sex. I can't imagine this is at all helpful in cultivating a healthy, friendly attitude towards the opposite sex.

YouWotM8

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

On a more serious note, does anyone else regard this as a good enough reason to do away with single sex schools? Many of the guys I know who are totally clueless about women, and women who are clueless about men, went to single-sex schools and weren't the social type outside school, resulting in limited personal experience when growing up with members of the opposite sex. I can't imagine this is at all helpful in cultivating a healthy, friendly attitude towards the opposite sex.

I went to a mixed school and there were always the lads who were terrified of going near girls. There will always be that kind of shyness turned mysogony sadly

Junkyard Tom

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

I can't imagine this is at all helpful in cultivating a healthy, friendly attitude towards the opposite sex.

There is also a study in the Journal Of Scientific Studies of Science that found that segregation in schools led to higher levels of gayness.

Riskymove

Hunt said he was "really sorry that I said what I said, it was a very stupid thing to do in the presence of all those journalists".

“What was intended as a light-hearted, ironic comment apparently was interpreted deadly seriously by my audience,” he told BBC Radio 4’s Today programme.

latest

hatrickpatrick

YouWotM8 wrote: »

I went to a mixed school and there were always the lads who were terrified of going near girls. There will always be that kind of shyness turned mysogony sadly

I agree entirely, I'm just wondering if it could be minimised a little by at least ensuring all kids get to know members of the opposite sex on a personal level from a young age, rather than viewing them as aliens who just happen to look a little like humans.

Of course there'll always be shy individuals in a group who don't socialise, but I wonder how many people with attitudes like this could have been prevented from developing them if they'd at least been given the chance to regularly socialise with opposite sex kids and subsequently teens during their youths?

Just a thought, might not be anything in it.

hatrickpatrick

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

There is also a study in the Journal Of Scientific Studies of Science that found that segregation in schools led to higher levels of gayness.

I thought it was the feckin' Greeks?

ThinkProgress

The Dark Side wrote: »

He was just expressing what happens with himself - what's the problem.

Do people not want honesty?

Totally agreed. People would rather he towed the PC line... the truth is only useful when it suits their world view!

Nobody is actually giving his points any real rigorous analysis... they're merely snapping their necks out in disgust.

I think there is some value to segregation in some academic areas. Men and women often operate differently. Sometimes they can be an impediment to each other...

Shenshen

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Totally agreed. People would rather he towed the PC line... the truth is only useful when it suits their world view!

Nobody is actually giving his points any real rigorous analysis... they're merely snapping their necks out in disgust.

I think there is some value to segregation in some academic areas. Men and women often operate differently. Sometimes they can be an impediment to each other...

Yes, we should definitely introduce purdah in all academic institutions. For the advancement of scientific understanding.

goose2005

ScienceNerd wrote: »

Not much to say about it really. Man says idiotic and offensive thing, is rightly lambasted for it.

There'll be another thing to rage about in a day or two, I'm sure.

suicide_circus

He's talking shiite but women in my work place do tend to cry a decent amount

ThinkProgress

Shenshen wrote: »

Yes, we should definitely introduce purdah in all academic institutions. For the advancement of scientific understanding.

Minus the veils though... They're just mean! lol

Would battle of the sexes not be fun? Competition can create great results in many areas!

Male scientists VS Female scientists. Who wins? Humanity, that's who!

One eyed Jack

Riskymove wrote: »

Hunt said he was "really sorry that I said what I said, it was a very stupid thing to do in the presence of all those journalists".

“What was intended as a light-hearted, ironic comment apparently was interpreted deadly seriously by my audience,” he told BBC Radio 4’s Today programme.

latest

Ahh jesus, when you're after digging yourself into a hole, it's best to stop digging :pac:

"If it hadn't been for those pesky kids reporters... reporting"

It's not nice to laugh at people when they come out with stupid comments, but this chap's opinions and then his further justifications, are making it increasingly difficult to keep a straight face.

steddyeddy

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I find it baffling that someone this intelligent could say something so daft or be so prejudiced. Every time I think that this sort of daft sexism is a thing of the past, someone like Tim here comes along to correct me.

Source.

Tim's the discoverer of cyclin dependent kinases, proteins which mediate the cell cycle. He discovered how the cells divide basically. I met Tim at a conference and he seemed like a nice guy. Shocked at this but it goes hand in hand with being a public school boy in England. Some of the values they're taught aren't all that valuable.

steddyeddy

One of the articles on the issue says there is a huge divide in male and female scientists. That was most certainly the case a few decades ago but I'm not sure it holds water today.

_Redzer_

ScumLord wrote: »

It sounds like scientists fall in love too easily.

This is completely my problem

GLaDOS

steddyeddy wrote: »

Tim's the discoverer of cyclin dependent kinases, proteins which mediate the cell cycle. He discovered how the cells divide basically. I met Tim at a conference and he seemed like a nice guy. Shocked at this but it goes hand in hand with being a public school boy in England. Some of the values they're thought aren't all that valuable.

In my experience, these uber powerful PIs can sometimes be a little... odd.

Son Of A Vidic

Most women I've worked with, would cut your throat and stand on your dead carcass if it meant getting ahead and I never expected anything less tbh.

ThinkProgress

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Most women I've worked with, would cut your throat and stand on your dead carcass if it meant getting ahead and I never expected anything less tbh.

Retail?

c_man

People smart in one area, not smart in others. Shocker.


Quick check, yup an article from someone who's most likely never heard of the guy before explaining how this comment shows his exact inner mind and hey hey! a rape reference thrown in within the first few paragraphs! Good old Guardian.

steddyeddy

ScienceNerd wrote: »

In my experience, these uber powerful PIs can sometimes be a little... odd.

Yep mine too. I caught my boss walking along a quiet pathway outside the university. Ever now and again he would pause and stop and stare at the ground. It actually freaked me out and it looked like he was in another world.

A lot of the scientists are complete weirdos and strange unemphatic people.

Son Of A Vidic

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Retail?

Nope, Medical sector public & private.

steddyeddy

I'll be honest I have heard this from some older scientists so the culture definitely used to exist. I've been told women scientists are more ruthless by an older gent from Imperial college.

Samaris

Eh. I'm a woman in the sciences and what this guy has to say doesn't bother me at all. You get this sort of ****. You slag them off and eventually they sort themselves out or retire in disgust.

Mind you, as a female who is fairly shy and who -can- cry in certain types of stressful situations (believe me, I find it frustrating and annoying too), I would be very irritated to think that this would reflect badly on all females. Personal reactions should reflect on oneself and no-one else.

steddyeddy

Samaris wrote: »

Eh. I'm a woman in the sciences and what this guy has to say doesn't bother me at all. You get this sort of ****. You slag them off and eventually they sort themselves out or retire in disgust.

Mind you, as a female who is fairly shy and who -can- cry in certain types of stressful situations (believe me, I find it frustrating and annoying too), I would be very irritated to think that this would reflect badly on all females. Personal reactions should reflect on oneself and no-one else.

I don't think people realise how stressful an environment a lab can be. You'd be forgiven for crying.

ancapailldorcha

Candie wrote: »

Tim Hunt? Are you sure his name isn't misspelled?

As my gran would say, he's one of a dying breed that will live forever.

What do you mean?