S05 Ep10 - "Mother's Mercy" - HAVE NOT READ THE BOOKS

Anyone remember when Jamie used to have a personality? The night and day switch following him returning with Brienne is becoming completely vanilla. Perhaps the Marcella situation is going to change that. Or maybe not..

duploelabs

Sergio Georgini wrote: »

Anyone remember when Jamie used to have a personality? The night and day switch following him returning with Brienne is becoming completely vanilla. Perhaps the Marcella situation is going to change that. Or maybe not..

You see, it's the same as when we lost the length of his hair he gained morals

Vojera

Hazys wrote: »

This sums up my feelings on Olly:
http://www.barstoolsports.com/newyork/game-of-thrones-season-5-finale-mothers-mercy-rewind/

I agree. There's no doubt that life has been really ****ty for Olly and I wouldn't blame him if he held a grudge for the rest of his life, but they have clearly seen that there are much much bigger issues to deal with than taking revenge on Wildlings.

Then again, Olly is just a child so I can get past that a bit. It's Allister Thorn and the other traitors that I'm more angry with. They should be old enough and seasoned enough to realise that when things get desperate people have to do things that they don't necessary like for the greater good. They need the Wildlings to bulk up their numbers if they're going to have any hope against the White Walkers. I really get the impression that they don't fully believe what they've been told about the White Walkers at Hardhome, otherwise how could they ignore it?

MOH

Vojera wrote: »

I agree. There's no doubt that life has been really ****ty for Olly and I wouldn't blame him if he held a grudge for the rest of his life, but they have clearly seen that there are much much bigger issues to deal with than taking revenge on Wildlings.

Then again, Olly is just a child so I can get past that a bit. It's Allister Thorn and the other traitors that I'm more angry with. They should be old enough and seasoned enough to realise that when things get desperate people have to do things that they don't necessary like for the greater good. They need the Wildlings to bulk up their numbers if they're going to have any hope against the White Walkers. I really get the impression that they don't fully believe what they've been told about the White Walkers at Hardhome, otherwise how could they ignore it?

As Oscar Wilde said:
"To lose one Lord Commander of the Night's Watch to mutiny may be regarded as a misfortune; to lose two looks like carelessness"

mikemac1

Was Myranda actually going to shoot Sansa? Possibly her arms to give a few non fatal wounds?

I don't know what that was about. If the bastard know his wife was being hurt it'd be Myranda getting flayed for it.

So was it all just talk?

Little CuChulainn

Defiler Of The Coffin wrote: »

Ten episodes a season isn't enough with all the different storylines going on. This season felt very rushed and some of the threads weren't fleshed out at all. Expected more to happen with Sansa/Ramsey and the whole Dorne thing was a complete waste of time. The Sand Snakes are about as fearsome as a bunch of cute puppies. Such a load of anti-climaxes all around.

Last night's episode has ruined the Hardholm one for me. Cannot believe they got rid of Jon Snow. If they're going to kill off all the good guys then what is the point of watching if there's no-one left to root for?

I'm pretty certain Jon Snow will live. I believe him to be an important part of the end of the story. The question of his parentage is still hanging around. The TV producers are just trying to be shocking for the sake of it.

DeVore

I dunno why everyone is so up in Olly's grill... he's just a young kid who sees loyalty in black and white (like most kids) and hates the people who butched his whole village in front of his eyes. Not by any means the worst human in the show

mzungu

uncleoswald wrote: »

Can't wait for season 6 already. How will Davos fit in now Stannis and his daughter are gone? Surprised he's still alive so there must be plans for him. Oberon's wife wants to start a war obviously and she'll get it, the Dorne stuff has obviously been the weakest link this season but hopefully they will find a way to fix that. I can see Jamie shedding his nice guy image once and for all.

I hope the Dornish army fight more like Oberyn and less like the sand snakes in that case.

Brancott wrote: »

What was the Miranda one babbling about with the bow and arrow in her hand.
Were she to kill Sansa then Ramsey would have her flayed, she seemed to be doing lots of talking & making no sense.

I was a bit puzzled by that too.

Brancott wrote: »

The sandsnakes are the single worse thing to appear on this show, the writers will march these off to Poochieland once they realise the online hate for these characters.

The sand snakes are pretty much the Jar Jar binks of GOT. I hope we have seen the last of them. Its like they have been imported from a crap B movie.

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Don't see yer wan in Dorne getting away with that poisoning. Waaay too obvious to everybody exactly what happened, even if Bronn didn't mention the poison to Jaime. Maybe she doesn't care, but that's surely her and her coven of tarts dead on the spot?

I was full sure when we saw Oberyns missus taking the antidote, that the camera would pan out and show she had murdered chap in the wheelchair.

I know she is upset over Oberyn, but surely she knew that he volunteered for trial by combat. The only person at fault was Oberyn, if he had not gone all WWF he would have easily dispatched the Mountain. Her revenge seems a wee bit petty and unnessessary.

Knex. wrote: »

That's true, actually.

This season has brought me close to a breaking point, though, in terms of rushed storylines, inconsistencies, ridiculous coincidences, illogical nature of some things, and then just the pointlessness of screen time for scenarios such as Dorne.

I'll still watch next season, as GoT has been some of the best TV I have watched since its introduction four/five years ago, but I know I'm not exactly excited for next season now, or expecting a whole lot, and that's a shame.

From reading the posts in this thread, it seems TV has caught up with the books. Which makes me wonder why they did'nt flesh out the earlier seasons more. Instead of cramming everything into 10 episodes, if they went at a slower pace it might flesh out characters, ideas and the mythology more. It might even give GRRM a few more years to write the next book. Are they going to film series 6 or wait for him to finish the next book.

I agree though, there was a lot of nothing scenes this season. It seemed to thread water for the most part. I still can't wait until next year for the new series though.

DeVore

Oh yeah, not braggin' (much) but as soon as she planted that kiss on her... I knew what the story was going to be. And yeah, I don't think it will take Sherlock Holmes to figure out whodunit....

One more thing, I'm totally going #TeamIceZombies from now on... in the immortal words of Ripley, you don't see them screwing each other over for a percentage!

brevity

DeVore wrote: »

I dunno why everyone is so up in Olly's grill... he's just a young kid who sees loyalty in black and white (like most kids) and hates the people who butched his whole village in front of his eyes. Not by any means the worst human in the show

Ya, I'm fairly indifferent towards him as well. If anything it highlights Jon Snow's ineptitude at not surrounding himself with more allies, or even bringing Allister Thorn to the wildling town.

brevity

DeVore wrote: »

Oh yeah, not braggin' (much) but as soon as she planted that kiss on her... I knew what the story was going to be. And yeah, I don't think it will take Sherlock Holmes to figure out whodunit....

One more thing, I'm totally going #TeamIceZombies from now on... in the immortal words of Ripley, you don't see them screwing each other over for a percentage!

https://medium.com/@bydanielvictor/it-s-time-to-embrace-the-true-heroes-in-game-of-thrones-the-white-walkers-70c6e6869d6

SoupyNorman

DeVore wrote: »

Oh yeah, not braggin' (much) but as soon as she planted that kiss on her... I knew what the story was going to be. And yeah, I don't think it will take Sherlock Holmes to figure out whodunit....

I've a theory that the Sand viper chick slipped Bronn an antidote vial when she went all cringe and bit his ear.

loyatemu

I assumed Theon & Sansa survived, otherwise they would have shown the landing - they'll probably meet up with Brienne.

Kit Harrington has said he's finished, could be a bluff but I'd say Jon is gone. However they've implied in the past that he's actually a Targaeryan, and he's the only one who knows about the Valarian steel killing white walkers, so they've wasted those plot points if he's now dead.

Stannis too, unless Brienne's misguided belief in honour prevented her from executing a defenceless injured man. Shame he didn't manage to get in one last grammatical correction before the end.

Every time someone is killed in GoT, everyone starts saying "maybe they're not really dead" - has it ever actually been true?

mzungu

loyatemu wrote: »

I assumed Theon & Sansa survived, otherwise they would have shown the landing - they'll probably meet up with Brienne.

Kit Harrington has said he's finished, could be a bluff but I'd say Jon is gone. However they've implied in the past that he's actually a Targaeryan, and he's the only one who knows about the Valarian steel killing white walkers, so they've wasted those plot points if he's now dead.

Stannis too, unless Brienne's misguided belief in honour prevented her from executing a defenceless injured man. Shame he didn't manage to get in one last grammatical correction before the end.

Every time someone is killed in GoT, everyone starts saying "maybe they're not really dead" - has it ever actually been true?

Sam knows now, so maybe the story will shift focus to his new role as maester at some stage.

SoupyNorman

loyatemu wrote: »

... and he's the only one who knows about the Valarian steel killing white walkers, so they've wasted those plot points if he's now dead.
?

Sam knows too.

Sheeeeit

mzungu wrote: »

Sam knows now, so maybe the story will shift focus to his new role as maester at some stage.

It's supposed to take years to become a maester, I'm not sure there's enough time left for Sam to become one, but he will learn a lot about killing the white walkers.

Lyssa

SoupyNorman wrote: »

I've a theory that the Sand viper chick slipped Bronn an antidote vial when she went all cringe and bit his ear.

This is what I thought too... Bronn was on the boat, and would have recognised Myrcella's symptoms... She might not be dead either... But, Cersei is gonna be on a mission next season, she'll annihilate the entire Dornish land!

GottaGetGatt

Tbh Kit Harrington isn't going to say " oh yeah I'll be back next season ,no bother. Na ,I'm not dead at all"

DeVore

The focus on the blood coming from Jon seemed a clue to me... (its Kings blood after all no? Just what witchypoo needs ).

I thought Sansa and Theon looked down into deep snow and decided to jump. I didn't get a "suicide" thing off it myself. Mind you, from having actually landed in snow off a much smaller jump myself (snowboarding) ... I wouldn't actually expect them to survive! That one is really up to the writers but I'm betting they live.

Stannis... yeah I think Stannis is gone.

SoupyNorman

GottaGetGatt wrote: »

Tbh Kit Harrington isn't going to say " oh yeah I'll be back next season ,no bother. Na ,I'm not dead at all"

I'm sure IMDB will confirm once filming commences.

My heart says yes but knowing this show he will not return.

Dan_Solo

mzungu wrote: »

Sam knows now, so maybe the story will shift focus to his new role as maester at some stage.

Sam is absolutely the very last person I would like to see get more screen time.

Lyssa

DeVore wrote: »

The focus on the blood coming from Jon seemed a clue to me... (its Kings blood after all no? Just what witchypoo needs ).

I thought Sansa and Theon looked down into deep snow and decided to jump. I didn't get a "suicide" thing off it myself. Mind you, from having actually landed in snow off a much smaller jump myself (snowboarding) ... I wouldn't actually expect them to survive! That one is really up to the writers but I'm betting they live.

Stannis... yeah I think Stannis is gone.

How?
Sorry, have no idea why this is? I didn't think the Starks were related to Robert? I know Ned was in love with Roberts sister, is Jon hers? Or is he a Targaryen, and that's why he has Long Claw?

Dan_Solo

Lyssa wrote: »

How?
Sorry, have no idea why this is? I didn't think the Starks were related to Robert? I know Ned was in love with Roberts sister, is Jon hers? Or is he a Targaryen, and that's why he has Long Claw?

It appears anybody who's been within shouting distance of a king's fifteenth cousin thrice removed will do as the blood. I think this weakens the whole idea of the royal blood magic TBH, but that's what they've done.

bren2001

Lyssa wrote: »

How?
Sorry, have no idea why this is? I didn't think the Starks were related to Robert? I know Ned was in love with Roberts sister, is Jon hers? Or is he a Targaryen, and that's why he has Long Claw?

We have no idea who Jons mother is. Anything you read is speculation. There is one main theory out there which I would be surprised if it wasn't true tbh.

He got Longclaw off Lord Commander Mormont. It was given to him just before he planned to join Rob's army in season 3 (?).

Lyssa

bren2001 wrote: »

We have no idea who Jons mother is. Anything you read is speculation. There is one main theory out there which I would be surprised if it wasn't true tbh.

He got Longclaw off Lord Commander Mormont. It was given to him just before he planned to join Rob's in season 3 (?).

Ah, I thought Maester Aemon had given him Long Claw (Valyrian steel, Targaryan, etc) and wondered if there was a reason..

Dan_Solo

We have a fair idea where dragonglass comes from (and how they might get some more...) but what about Valeryian steel? Is it ever explained why it's special? (even in the books I guess as we're past spoiler territory now?)

bren2001

Dan_Solo wrote: »

We have a fair idea where dragonglass comes from (and how they might get some more...) but what about Valeryian steel? Is it ever explained why it's special? (even in the books I guess as we're past spoiler territory now?)

Valyrian steel was forged in Valyria years prior. The secret to forging it was lost and it is unknown how to do it now. Maybe Sam figures it out? I am not a book reader but that is just what I remember from the show.

EDIT: Tywin also said there was only 3 blacksmiths who could reforge Valyrian steel when he turned Ice into two swords.

DeVore

Valerian steel comes from Essos and was made by the crowd that died in the big volcano and left the city which is now infested with Stone Men.

Apparently the knowledge of how it is made is lost but I'd be willing to bet it had something to do with being forged by dragons fire.

DeVore

Also, cant believe everyone is down on Drogon for not wanting to go back to Mereen with Khalessi! I'd be all ... hell I just rescued your ass from there AND got peppered with spears doing it... and now you want me to take you back? Talk to the wing biatch!

paulmclaughlin

They could do with melting down Xaro Xhoan Daxos' vault, it was made of Valyrian Steel!

SoupyNorman

DeVore wrote: »

Also, cant believe everyone is down on Drogon for not wanting to go back to Mereen with Khalessi! I'd be all ... hell I just rescued your ass from there AND got peppered with spears doing it... and now you want me to take you back? Talk to the wing biatch!

I think Drogon brought her to the LOTR set.

She dropped a very elvish piece of gear to help the guys track her then she's encircled by horse lords running across an open plain.

Where do they get their inspiration from you wonder.

Vojera

DeVore wrote: »

Also, cant believe everyone is down on Drogon for not wanting to go back to Mereen with Khalessi! I'd be all ... hell I just rescued your ass from there AND got peppered with spears doing it... and now you want me to take you back? Talk to the wing biatch!

Yeah, she seemed to have no consideration for that fact that he might be tired after flying all that distance. Feckin Dany, she wrecks my head sometimes.

Dan_Solo

Vojera wrote: »

Yeah, she seemed to have no consideration for that fact that he might be tired after flying all that distance. Feckin Dany, she wrecks my head sometimes.

What's more, for a little wan, she can sure pack it away! Within minutes she was off looking for grub as if she was at death's door with starvation!

Knex*

Vojera wrote: »

Yeah, she seemed to have no consideration for that fact that he might be tired after flying all that distance. Feckin Dany, she wrecks my head sometimes.

She's a head wreck at times, for sure.

Comes from the Roger Moore school of displaying emotions too, only without the eyebrow variations.

lbj666

Dan_Solo wrote: »

It appears anybody who's been within shouting distance of a king's fifteenth cousin thrice removed will do as the blood. I think this weakens the whole idea of the royal blood magic TBH, but that's what they've done.

Its all been Baratheon blood used at the moment, bloodline that had only had claim to the throne for around 20 years. Its worked far from perfectly if at all , thats where Jon comes in and the rumours of his parentage.

If you remember Ned was very coy about talking about his bastards mother to King Robb when they had that picnic in season 1.

Again it could be all wrong.

bur

The Starks were kings in the North for a few thousand years, so yeah, Jon has King's blood.

Dan_Solo

bur wrote: »

The Starks were kings in the North for a few thousand years, so yeah, Jon has King's blood.

Don't 1000s of people have it then? Anybody who calls themselves a king, any relative of theirs (could be 100s of descendents) must have it? I originally thought it was some connection to the "true" king, meaning that the fire god had some recognition of Stannis as the rightful man for the throne.

nxbyveromdwjpg

paulmclaughlin wrote: »

They could do with melting down Xaro Xhoan Daxos' vault, it was made of Valyrian Steel!

I was thinking the throne itself was forged from dragons fire. Plenty of swords in that.

Maybe they'll melt that and use them at the end. Symbolic and all.

J. Marston

nm wrote: »

I was thinking the throne itself was forged from dragons fire. Plenty of swords in that.

Maybe they'll melt that and use them at the end. Symbolic and all.

Melt down the throne, make a giant sword and give it to Wun Wun.

Problem solved.

bur

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Don't 1000s of people have it then? Anybody who calls themselves a king, any relative of theirs (could be 100s of descendents) must have it? I originally thought it was some connection to the "true" king, meaning that the fire god had some recognition of Stannis as the rightful man for the throne.

They probably do but it would be so watered down by now there's not much, if any power left in it.

Huntergonzo

I thought it was a good end to a mediocre season, I thought episodes 8, 9 & 10 were very good though (particularly 8). Last night Stannis's world crumbled but I doubt many cared after Shireen, Cersei really got shamed, Ayra finally done something, something actually happened in Dorne (one of the worst storylines in the series)......although technically it actually happened at sea not in Dorne! Not sure what the story is with Sansa or Daenerys and her moody teenage dragons, we'll have to wait nearly a year to find out.

Finally the tragic death of Jon Snow, once again GOT doesn't do happy endings where the good guys always win which is partly refreshing, partly frustrating but always fascinating.

Gerry Rio

What was the statement they all said before stabbing Jon and why did they say it?

bmwguy

Gerry Rio wrote: »

What was the statement they all said before stabbing Jon and why did they say it?

They all said "for the watch". I just assumed they were mugging him for his Rolex but I'm not sure

GottaGetGatt

When did they stop filming season 5 anyone know?... because Kit harrington was being interviewed by Jimmy Kimmel only 3 days ago and he still had the Jon Snow look about him.

I assume he still has because their starting to film soon.

FobleAsNuck

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

He could still be alive ,and I'm hoping he is ,but the odds are kind of against it.
What does he have left to live for.

He burnt his daughter to death.
His wife killed herself.
His army is wiped out .
The Lord of Light failed him.
His fleet of ships is stranded ,although it surely must have some of his troops manning it.

If he lives on he'd be a lame duck ,would he not ?

he's lost everything then? now, isn't that a perfect reason not to kill him off?

Gerry Rio

bmwguy wrote: »

They all said "for the watch". I just assumed they were mugging him for his Rolex but I'm not sure

You need to turn that into a Meme!

Ok I was half asleep for most of the episodes this season so I'll need why they said this explained to me. Was it because he failed in stopping the Zombie Lads?

Austria!

loyatemu wrote: »

I assumed Theon & Sansa survived, otherwise they would have shown the landing - they'll probably meet up with Brienne.

Kit Harrington has said he's finished, could be a bluff but I'd say Jon is gone. However they've implied in the past that he's actually a Targaeryan, and he's the only one who knows about the Valarian steel killing white walkers, so they've wasted those plot points if he's now dead.

With Sansa, I only considered that Sansa might survive the fall after reading boards. It was more than the height that killed Myranda, and it looked like a suicide. The reason to not show the landing could be to keep people guessing.

With Jon, I think when people survive due to plot armour people complain but when characters that could be important to the plot die people complain too. I like that being potentially a very important character for the plot gives you no protection in GoT.

If I was making season 6 and Jon was dead, I'd sign up Kit to give him a small flashback scene. Everyone would see he's been signed up again and assume he was coming back to life.

Austria!

Gerry Rio wrote: »

You need to turn that into a Meme!

Ok I was half asleep for most of the episodes this season so I'll need why they said this explained to me. Was it because he failed in stopping the Zombie Lads?

It was because he let the wildlings in.

Dan_Solo

Gerry Rio wrote: »

You need to turn that into a Meme!

Ok I was half asleep for most of the episodes this season so I'll need why they said this explained to me. Was it because he failed in stopping the Zombie Lads?

He "sided" with the wildlings making him a traitor. Which is weird because Stannis was all for it too, and the wildlings were all let south of the wall anyway at this stage. And all of the guys who made it back would confirm the ice zombies and white walkers.
It seemed the weirdest time to bother killing him. If he won that election to become Chief, then was it just a few of them decided to kill him?

Faith

GottaGetGatt wrote: »

When did they stop filming season 5 anyone know?... because Kit harrington was being interviewed by Jimmy Kimmel only 3 days ago and he still had the Jon Snow look about him.

I assume he still has because their starting to film soon.

Liam Cunningham recently said they start filming in July.

Re: Dany's ring. Is it not her wedding ring that she took off? From her marriage to Hizdar or whatever his name is. I presume she doesn't want the Dothraki to know she remarried.

Also, it may have just been a camera angle, but it looked like the walls of Winterfell sloped out gradually from top to bottom. Maybe Sansa and Theon could kind of slide down rather then plummet vertically? Killer friction burn though!

I was not satisfied by that episode at all. Before I even read this thread, I guessed that Melisandre would bring Jon back to life. I just can't see him being gone forever after all he has been through as part of the story arc.