Tyson Fury (undisputed world champion!) vs Vladimir SEE MOD WARNING POST#558

walshb

ikeano29 wrote: »

Styles also wins fights, that's why I said it. Wlad didn't let go on the inside because he knows fury has a fast counter and was afraid to leave himself open.

Have you watched Wlad? He never had an inside game.

He didn't let go anywhere. Not outside, inside, blind side, side-side, mid range....a complete no show.

ikeano29

walshb wrote: »

Have you watched Wlad? He never had an inside game.

He didn't let go anywhere. Not outside, inside, blind side, side-side, mid range....a complete no show.

That's not down to wlad though, that's down to fury keeping the distance.
All the fury haters just need to admit he had the perfect game plan and a great trainer and tactician in peter fury.

HW division is wide open again and belts will change hands a few times over the next few years, which can only be great for boxing and we have fury to thank for that because there's no other man that could or can beat wlad. Fury's style size speed and tactics won him the fight and will always beat wlad 9 times out of 10

walshb

ikeano29 wrote: »

That's not down to wlad though, that's down to fury keeping the distance. 10

Nonsense. There was plenty of opportunities for Wlad. He just hadn't the balls to commit it seems.

Anyway, point still stands. Wlad never had an inside game. He was-is far from the complete fighter.

walshb

ikeano29 wrote: »

Styles also wins fights, that's why I said it. Wlad didn't let go on the inside because he knows fury has a fast counter and was afraid to leave himself open.

That could be true about Wlad afraid of getting countered. If it is then it's a huge black mark against his character that he'd surrender his title due to the fear of getting hit. It goes completely against what it means to be a fighter.

Btw, anyone else think that Vitali must have been ashamed at the pathetic negative show from his brother? Anyone think Vitali would have given two fooks about maybe getting countered? This is pro boxing. It's the hurt business.

ikeano29

walshb wrote: »

Nonsense. There was plenty of opportunities for Wlad. He just hadn't the balls to commit it seems.

Anyway, point still stands. Wlad never had an inside game. He was-is far from the complete fighter.

He never has the balls to commit, he's a safe fighter, has been for a could few years.

He was never a complete fighter, just very very good at his robotic lean back stance and jab and hold when a fighter gets to close.

wadacrack

walshb wrote: »

That could be true about Wlad afraid of getting countered. If it is then it's a huge black mark against his character that he'd surrender his title due to the fear of getting hit. It goes completely against what it means to be a fighter.

Btw, anyone else think that Vitali must have been ashamed at the pathetic negative show from his brother? Anyone think Vitali would have given two fooks about maybe getting countered? This is pro boxing. It's the hurt business.

Nope, they both treat boxing as a chess match. boring as ****. Fury who knows what will happen now, but he has the excitement factor

walshb

wadacrack wrote: »

Nope, they both treat boxing as a chess match. boring as ****. Fury who knows what will happen now, but he has the excitement factor

You honestly think Vitali would have shat himself and fought so scared?

You know nothing about Vitali if that is what you think.

ikeano29

walshb wrote: »

That could be true about Wlad afraid of getting countered. If it is then it's a huge black mark against his character that he'd surrender his title due to the fear of getting hit. It goes completely against what it means to be a fighter.

Btw, anyone else think that Vitali must have been ashamed at the pathetic negative show from his brother? Anyone think Vitali would have given two fooks about maybe getting countered? This is pro boxing. It's the hurt business.

He actually wouldn't have been champion for so long if he had been a more agressive and take risks fighter.

I'm sure vitali is still proud of his brother whatever you may think of him

Chris_Bradley

Vitali with ease 5 years ago would have ate Tyson Fury.

His brother had this coming though, far too safe behind the jab & thank god someone put it up to him & lets be honest - won with ease.

Dick phelan

Amazing before last Saturday Klitschko was rated the number 3-4 p4p fighter in the world by most people, today he's apparently a shot fighter who was never great to begin with, If Joshua or Wilder did what Fury did on Saturday people would be raving about it, Fury beating Wlad is the 2nd best victory in boxing this year behind Mayweather beating Pacquiao deal with it people.

Chris_Bradley

Dick phelan wrote: »

Mayweather beating Pacquiao deal with it people.

Nothing amazing about that at all.

Dick phelan

Chris_Bradley wrote: »

Nothing amazing about that at all.

What you don't think schooling the number 2 p4p in the world is amazing? It wasn't a great fight but neither was Saturday nights, doesn't take away the quality of the win.

mada82

wadacrack wrote: »

Nope, they both treat boxing as a chess match. boring as ****. Fury who knows what will happen now, but he has the excitement factor

http://youtu.be/alzu9t1CmRM

Chris_Bradley

Dick phelan wrote: »

What you don't think schooling the number 2 p4p in the world is amazing? It wasn't a great fight but neither was Saturday nights, doesn't take away the quality of the win.

An amazing win is something that surprises the Boxing world.... Nobody was surprised to see Floyd win with ease on points.

Anyone with any sense put their house on that win by points.

Pacman is finished anyhow.

Back to this thread, was Fury's win the most amazing fight of the year in regards to the result???? - I'd say it was more of a surprise than say Floyd v Pacman's was that's for sure.

StringerBell

wadacrack wrote: »

Nope, they both treat boxing as a chess match. boring as ****. Fury who knows what will happen now, but he has the excitement factor

Are you mad??

Say what you want about Wlad and his risk averse style but ffs have some cop on when speaking about the other brother!

Mantis Toboggan

Dick phelan wrote: »

Fury beating Wlad is the 2nd best victory in boxing this year behind Mayweather beating Pacquiao deal with it people.

Fury beating Vlad is the best victory of the year, undefeated for 10 years, fighting in vlads back yard, with his gloves, in his ring.... Nobody gave fury a prayer and he went and proved everyone wrong.

Wurzelbert

Dick phelan wrote: »

Amazing before last Saturday Klitschko was rated the number 3-4 p4p fighter in the world by most people, today he's apparently a shot fighter who was never great to begin with, If Joshua or Wilder did what Fury did on Saturday people would be raving about it, Fury beating Wlad is the 2nd best victory in boxing this year behind Mayweather beating Pacquiao deal with it people.

both were lame fights…

StringerBell

Fury beating Wlad is up there as one of the biggest upsets of all time so yes it is the best victory of the year. Mayweather was expected to beat Pacquiao, pretty easily, running, spoiling, and on points. He obliged, don't see what makes it a big deal

Andre 3000

Wurzelbert wrote: »

both were lame fights…

A win is a win and you cannot take that away from them. That's the ultimate aim of any Boxing match, to win. I hate this thinking that a fight is only good if one lad loses a few pints of blood and the other fella has broken ribs and his lip is hanging off him.

The man in red and black

God, just watching the highlights of Vitali there, how in the name of Jesus did Lennox Lewis stay standing in the first few rounds? The shots going in in that fight were ridiculous!

I know obviously Vitali and Vladimir would never fight each other but used they even spar each other in training does anyone know??

Dick phelan

The man in red and black wrote: »

God, just watching the highlights of Vitali there, how in the name of Jesus did Lennox Lewis stay standing in the first few rounds? The shots going in in that fight were ridiculous!

I know obviously Vitali and Vladimir would never fight each other but used they even spar each other in training does anyone know??

Ye Vitali was even sparring with him in the lead up to this fight saw pics online.

walshb

Dick phelan wrote: »

Amazing before last Saturday Klitschko was rated the number 3-4 p4p fighter in the world by most people, today he's apparently a shot fighter who was never great to begin with, If Joshua or Wilder did what Fury did on Saturday people would be raving about it, Fury beating Wlad is the 2nd best victory in boxing this year behind Mayweather beating Pacquiao deal with it people.

Mayweathe beating a man a weight or two below him (in a pathetic fight) 6 years after they should have fought is not something I'd pick out from the year. Mayweather was a favourite there. Pacman winning would have been the stand out win.

Wurzelbert

Andre 3000 wrote: »

A win is a win and you cannot take that away from them. That's the ultimate aim of any Boxing match, to win. I hate this thinking that a fight is only good if one lad loses a few pints of blood and the other fella has broken ribs and his lip is hanging off him.

true, a win is a win even in a lame fight…

Mantis Toboggan

Are sky likely to put the fight up on demand?

Mantis Toboggan

Finally the heavyweight division is going to get interesting. How good can guys like Joshua, hughie Fury and Joseph Parker get? Anyway back for Haye? The second coming of Vladimir? Who should Tyson face next?

nacho libre

StringerBell wrote: »

I assume this is a joke?

Why do you think it is a joke.
How many clean punches did Wlad land out of the punches he threw. If he did not let his fists go more, that is probably due to Fury's tactics.
Fury frustrated Wlad all night, with his speed of movement and because of his reach. Wlad, at his size is always used to being the quicker man and being able to use his reach to keep fighters from getting in close and then pounding them with his jab. He simply wasn't able to do this against Fury. Klitschko's jab hit nothing but air to start, and he found little opportunity to throw the right with Fury staying out of his range throughout the fight, except for maybe the last round.

nacho libre

walshb wrote: »

I still think Joshua sparks Fury. Wlider does it too. That is not me saying Joshua is a great HW. He still has to prove this. I just happen to think he destroys Fury.

Wilder isn't that great and Joshua is unproven yet. I don't think he is good enough to beat Fury. Your friend Haye is the more likely of three to do it.
Haye, if he has not lost his speed, would get to Fury. Haye, unlike in his fight against Wladimir, would take the contest to Fury as he knows Fury isn't a big puncher.

walshb

nacho libre wrote: »

Wilder isn't that great and Joshua is unproven yet. I don't think he is good enough to beat Fury. Your friend Haye is the more likely of three to do it.
Haye, if he has not lost his speed, would get to Fury. Haye, unlike in his fight against Wladimir, would take the contest to Fury as he knows Fury isn't a big puncher.

Can I ask how you see a fight with Fury and the two of them going? Surely Wilder and Joshua will find his chin, and is it not likley they find it early? I don't think he takes the power they bring.

Now, if I had real confidence in his chin I would probabaly make him a favourite, a;beit very slight. I respect Fury and see talent, but I think he's somewhat vulnerable in the chin department, and against these two I think it is exposed.

Fury is a good boxer, but I cannot see a clear lead he possesses in the boxig department over Joshua and Wilder. The thing is, that the latter two also have more power. Power will decide the outcome, and if not, then Fury will need to box his heart out to win on points. I don't see him having an easy time outboxing Wilder or Joshua. Joshua is a very capable boxer. Wilder when he needs to be can be very clever and can box very well. Fury for me is a bit of a mish mash. Nothing great. Gets by with a bit of this and bit of that. He doesn't have the structured boxing that he will need to beat Wilder and Joshua.

Again, the Wlad fight showed me nothing, because Wlad did next to nothing to show me. Fury did next to nothing to show me. Spent a lot of the fight messing and moving backwards. In the 36 minutes I struggled to see clean shots and clean combinations. That is how bad it was.

StringerBell

If there is one thing we can all agree on surely its that the fight, as a spectacle was one of the worst fights certainly I can remember at that level

walshb

StringerBell wrote: »

If there is one thing we can all agree on surely its that the fight, as a spectacle was one of the worst fights certainly I can remember at that level

True. And that is from a completely impartial stance, before anyone comes in with the whole "bitterness" boll£x. One of the most inept displays of boxing skills and fundamentals that I have seen at the so called elite level.

Mantis Toboggan

StringerBell wrote: »

If there is one thing we can all agree on surely its that the fight, as a spectacle was one of the worst fights certainly I can remember at that level

It's was dour enough but Fury fought the perfect fight. When was the last time we had an exciting fight with these two boxers? If you're looking for exciting fights steer clear of the heavyweight division.

Henno30

Fury will have to fight AJ whenever Hearn thinks he's ready, but who knows when that will be. The way fighters are brought along these days it could be 2020. Of course Fury might fall before then, so Hearn better not wait too long.

StringerBell

There can be some entertaining fights at HW but yes the better fights are generally at the lower weights.

Wlad, nor Fury has ever been exciting in the ring obviously, was just hoping for a better showing.

StringerBell

Henno30 wrote: »

Fury will have to fight AJ whenever Hearn thinks he's ready, but who knows when that will be. The way fighters are brought along these days it could be 2020. Of course Fury might fall before then, so Hearn better not wait too long.

This is interesting, I was thinking we would see AJ continue on his path and hit a title shot all going well around 2017, but with Fury in stead, assuming he comes through a rematch if it happens, I can see them pushing the schedule up a bit to try get the fight by the end of 2016.

Parker is another to keep an eye on

Henno30

StringerBell wrote: »

This is interesting, I was thinking we would see AJ continue on his path and hit a title shot all going well around 2017, but with Fury in stead, assuming he comes through a rematch if it happens, I can see them pushing the schedule up a bit to try get the fight by the end of 2016.

Parker is another to keep an eye on

AJ will have to step up his competition big time to be ready for Fury by the end of next year.

Fury might still be the crude fighter he was last week, but he has shown that he's a disciplined and focused boxer who can implement a winning strategy at the highest level. Yes the fight was a disappointment, but for now you would have to give Fury the benefit of the doubt and say that might be what's necessary to beat Wladimir Klitschko. Fury is only 25. He could get a lot better off the back of the belief he'll now have in himself.

Bringing AJ up is a delicate balancing act for Hearn. It could be the biggest money spinner in the history of British boxing, or he could get cracked and embarrassed losing the mystique he has now forever.

Fury having the championship is a golden opportunity. I would like to see Hearn show some balls and give Sky the green light to make it happen.

TheNap

AJ said he wanted to fight him in summer 2016 on SSN yesterday .

Will Fury still be the champ though ?

StringerBell

Fury is 27, pretty sure AJ is 25 so that might be the mix up

I think it probably is still not realistic for them to target a title shot by the end of 2016 given the quality of opposition they are putting him up against so far and they would be better off leaving him continue to build and get one early to mid 2017 with a couple of decent fights in late 2016. If they rush him next year they could burn him out a bit, constantly being either in camp or the ring wouldn't be any good for him.

Johner

If the rematch doesn't happen I can imagine his first defence will be against someone like Lucas Browne to start off with.

Mantis Toboggan

TheNap wrote: »

AJ said he wanted to fight him in summer 2016 on SSN yesterday .

Will Fury still be the champ though ?

AJ needs to do alot more before he deserves a shot of the belts.

StringerBell

Tyson Fury wrote: »

AJ needs to do alot more before he deserves a shot of the belts.

A hell of a lot more, too much do get done by the end of 2016 unless they seriously step up his programme.

walshb

Tyson Fury wrote: »

AJ needs to do alot more before he deserves a shot of the belts.

Joshua's top ten rated in all divisions. Fury was far from worthy if this is the case. He may have been rated higher than Joshua pre Wlad fight, but so what. I reckon Fury threads very carefully now and avoids andy real bangers.

Johner

walshb wrote: »

Joshua's top ten rated in all divisions. Fury was far from worthy if this is the case. He may have been rated higher than Joshua pre Wlad fight, but so what. I reckon Fury threads very carefully now and avoids andy real bangers.

Wasn't Fury mandatory for the WBO belt?

TheNap

I need to see Joshua caught flush on the chin before i believe the hype.

A Shaved Duck?

nacho libre wrote: »

Wlad let his fists go, alright, he just wasn't able to land many clean punches- if he had, Wlad probably would have knocked Tyson Fury out.
Wlad will lose a rematch, he is a less gifted boxer than Fury. I think once he watches the fight back, he will realise that and not bother with a rematch.

You need to watch the fight again, wlad barely threw anything the whole fight..

The rest of your post hurts my brain..

walshb

Johner wrote: »

Wasn't Fury mandatory for the WBO belt?

Yes. I am making the point that Joshua is rated high in some organisations. This worthy of a shot has never meant anything in boxing. He's as worthy as several others, and almost as worthy as Fury was for his shot. I mean, what exactly did Fury do to become worthy? Beat Chisora?

walshb

TheNap wrote: »

I need to see Joshua caught flush on the chin before i believe the hype.

Tha's true, and if Fury had a real wallop I think it would be interesting. Maybe Fury has enough wallop on him to KO Joshua? I doubt it though. I think AJ gets Fury out of there.

FTA69

Weighing into this very late but a couple of points:

1) Say what you like about Tyson Fury, the man has dedicated himself to the sport of boxing. Despite being from a highly disliked minority in the UK, and someone who lacked media exposure as the "next big thing" etc he managed to overcome all obstacles and work his way up through sheer hard graft.

2) He has been let down badly in recent times, he worked his ass off towards three fights that were either cancelled or postponed thus costing him money and valuable career time in the process. Training and then having your opponent pull out at the last minute is a huge, huge blow for a young fighter and he took it well.

3) He went out there and did the business against one of the best heavyweights of all time. Before people laughed at him as a bumbling idiot who punched himself in the face, now he is the heavyweight champion of the world. All credit to him, heavyweight boxing has entered a new era now and hopefully it'll be an exciting one.

TheNap

walshb wrote: »

Tha's true, and if Fury had a real wallop I think it would be interesting. Maybe Fury has enough wallop on him to KO Joshua? I doubt it though. I think AJ gets Fury out of there.

Possibly but theres no way to know for sure until AJ steps up in opposition. Fury on Irish radio today saying he wants the Vlad rematch in Croker .

megadodge

walshb wrote: »

Can I ask how you see a fight with Fury and the two of them going? Surely Wilder and Joshua will find his chin, and is it not likley they find it early? I don't think he takes the power they bring.

Now, if I had real confidence in his chin I would probabaly make him a favourite, a;beit very slight. I respect Fury and see talent, but I think he's somewhat vulnerable in the chin department, and against these two I think it is exposed.

Fury is a good boxer, but I cannot see a clear lead he possesses in the boxig department over Joshua and Wilder. The thing is, that the latter two also have more power. Power will decide the outcome, and if not, then Fury will need to box his heart out to win on points. I don't see him having an easy time outboxing Wilder or Joshua. Joshua is a very capable boxer. Wilder when he needs to be can be very clever and can box very well. Fury for me is a bit of a mish mash. Nothing great. Gets by with a bit of this and bit of that. He doesn't have the structured boxing that he will need to beat Wilder and Joshua.

Again, the Wlad fight showed me nothing, because Wlad did next to nothing to show me. Fury did next to nothing to show me. Spent a lot of the fight messing and moving backwards. In the 36 minutes I struggled to see clean shots and clean combinations. That is how bad it was.

This post encapsulates one of the biggest myths in the whole of boxing - one which you have willingly bought into for years.

That myth is that power is everything in boxing.

Not alone is it not, it's by far and away the most overrated of all the attributes required to be a successful boxer.

How many times over the years do we see the boxer beat the puncher? It's no coincidence that the best fighters in history are fundamentaly boxers first. Even look at the great punchers (SRR, Hearns, Tyson, etc.) and you realise that their timing, balance, judgement of distance, 'boxing' brain, etc. was what enabled them to work their way into a position to create all those KOs.

Now, try telling me that Wilder has any of those attributes! How many fights of his have you actually seen? He's an athlete who boxes. He has a good, fast jab and nearly always has a height advantage, both of which set up his very, very wild power punches. That's about it.

If he fought Fury, just like Vlad, he would be facing a bigger man who knows how to take away his jab. What then? He has shown an unbelievable lack of composure in even the most ordinary of circumstances and I'd be quite confident if Fury was disciplined, he'd take him out of there somewhere around 8-10 rounds. Obviously he has a puncher's chance, but that's about it.

Joshua, on the other hand, has plenty of boxing ability. My one big worry is stamina. He's not unlike Frank Bruno in his physique and until he proves it (not saying he can't) I'll reserve judgement on whether he can go 12 hard rounds.

TheNap

megadodge wrote: »

This post encapsulates one of the biggest myths in the whole of boxing - one which you have willingly bought into for years.

That myth is that power is everything in boxing.

Not alone is it not, it's by far and away the most overrated of all the attributes required to be a successful boxer.

How many times over the years do we see the boxer beat the puncher? It's no coincidence that the best fighters in history are fundamentaly boxers first. Even look at the great punchers (SRR, Hearns, Tyson, etc.) and you realise that their timing, balance, judgement of distance, 'boxing' brain, etc. was what enabled them to work their way into a position to create all those KOs.

Now, try telling me that Wilder has any of those attributes! How many fights of his have you actually seen? He's an athlete who boxes. He has a good, fast jab and nearly always has a height advantage, both of which set up his very, very wild power punches. That's about it.

If he fought Fury, just like Vlad, he would be facing a bigger man who knows how to take away his jab. What then? He has shown an unbelievable lack of composure in even the most ordinary of circumstances and I'd be quite confident if Fury was disciplined, he'd take him out of there somewhere around 8-10 rounds. Obviously he has a puncher's chance, but that's about it.

Joshua, on the other hand, has plenty of boxing ability. My one big worry is stamina. He's not unlike Frank Bruno in his physique and until he proves it (not saying he can't) I'll reserve judgement on whether he can go 12 hard rounds.

Nail on the head