2015-16 UEFA Champions League

Dirty Dingus McGee

eagle eye wrote: »

What? Their fans always demand good football.

For example they would never accept Jose Mourinho style football regardless of the results.

Barca have tried to win on numerous occassions by throwing Pique up front and sending the ball into him.They have no problem abandoning their principles when they need to.

Andersonisgod

eagle eye wrote: »

So why do you support Chelsea then?

And what is going to happen when Pep Guardiola joins Manchester City. Are you jumping ship in the EPL?

I'm not answering those questions again. I've done so multiple times on this forum. I have no doubt you've seen my answers to those questions too since you are so fond of following me around, so why ask again?

kksaints

Andersonisgod wrote: »

I didn't as I'm very popular tonight it seems, however I'm assuming it's in regards to the Boixos Nois? To be fair to the club, Joan Laporta (as famously shown in that documentary on him) did his utmost to fight them.

Yep. Seem to be a violent bunch of right-wing thugs which sadly still exist although as you say at least the club doesnt associate with them too much anymore compared to the 90s.

SlickRic

eagle eye wrote: »

What? Their fans always demand good football.

For example they would never accept Jose Mourinho style football regardless of the results.

Winning is everything. The football is only accepted because they win with it. Winning is key.

They threw Pique up in the last few minutes when they got desperate. And I've seen them do it before. If they'd launched it, and Pique had flicked in a goal, would they have cared?

Not a jot.

eagle eye

eagle eye wrote: »

What? Their fans always demand good football.

For example they would never accept Jose Mourinho style football regardless of the results.

He isnt referring to their passing football which no one will dispute is absolutely poetry and beauty to the eye and all that other waxing lyrical w@nking talk, but to the way their players conduct themselves when things arent going there way.

Take Busquets for example. A gem of a player but a total and utter w@nker for the histrionics when opposition players make the slightest contact with him

MD1990

Andersonisgod wrote: »

You do realise this is a soccer forum on an Irish Board where every weekend hundreds of comments are posted in match threads of ENGLISH Premier League games. Unless everyone here has a granny from Manchester who liked to wear red a lot I think you can probably tar almost everyone with the same brush.

I make no bones about it, I support Barcelona because I believe the Barça way is the only way the game should be played. I love the culture of the club, I love the historical and political importance of the club. I love the mes que un club ideal. I love the dedication of the club to La Masia. I love that this club is at the center of football innovation. I love the players that have played for the club. I love the players that are currently playing for the club. I love the jersey, the crest, the blaugrana, the Camp Nou. I love the Barça fanbase. I love everything that the club stands for, everything it represents. I love being safe in the knowledge that even if I'm having a bad week, come the weekend I'll get to witness 90 minutes of pure exhilaration executed by the finest practitioners of the sport. I love that at Barcelona it's not just enough to win, it has to be the right way. I love this club with every fibre of my being, whether they win or lose.

- You support Chelsea who have a completley different philosophy to Barcelona.
- I believe you supported Spain against Ireland correct me if I'm wrong.
- Have you even went to the Camp Nou often since you love the fans so much or you just follow them on social media.

As I said you are just a gloryhunter.

eagle eye

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Barca have tried to win on numerous occassions by throwing Pique up front and sending the ball into him.They have no problem abandoning their principles when they need to.

It's a hell of a lot different to go to a plan B late in a game.

They play attacking football with the ball on the floor almost always. The fans wouldn't accept anything less.

deaddonkey15

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Tata Martino. Won lots of games (though no trophies) but did it in a manner not befitting of Barcelona.

Even Van Gaal wasn't a very popular figure in Barcelona, not only because of his regular clashes with the Barcelona journalists but his brand of football was not what was expected of the club.

The pursuit of perfection must always remain at the club.

Just like United then, whose fans demand "the United way". United also lump it up to the big man when they're losing.

Manchester United - mes que un cub.

Andersonisgod

kksaints wrote: »

Yep. Seem to be a violent bunch of right-wing thugs which sadly still exist although as you say at least the club doesnt associate with them too much anymore compared to the 90s.

Unfortunately you'll find an element of that at many clubs if you look hard enough. Every fanbase has militant fools, Barcelona's is no exception. However, for the most part, I find the Barcelona fanbase to be tremendous.

TheCitizen

SlickRic wrote: »

Also, this 'mes que un club' stuff is meaningless to anyone who isn't Catalan, or hasn't lived in Catalunya for an extended period of time.

Even Thierry Henry said he didn't understand it until his second year at the club, and it was only after they best Real that season.

It's utterly meaningless unless it's your culture.

Of course it isn't meaningless, if you have any interest in football or culture or politics. Cruyff managed a Catalonia team in a couple of arranged games.

Getting back to football, the way Barcelona play football is one of the templates for the best way to play the game. Other teams using other ways of playing to win is of course admired and respected, but the way Barca currently try to win is the way I'd prefer other teams and youth teams to copy and follow.

NIMAN

I wonder did Barca always have this pretty football philosophy?
Did they have it in the 60s, 70s, 80s?

And did they always have this MORE THAN A CLUB motto, or was it a marketing creation in more recent times?

And as for the love of LA Masia, was that always important to the club? Did they churn out talent from it back in older times? Or when did it start?

CSF

I really don't think it matters who people support. Unless it's your local club, when we're posting in Champions League or Premier League threads, the teams we like are generally for pretty arbitrary or short-term reasons anyway.

Andersonisgod

SlickRic wrote: »

Winning is everything. The football is only accepted because they win with it. Winning is key.

They threw Pique up in the last few minutes when they got desperate. And I've seen them do it before. If they'd launched it, and Pique had flicked in a goal, would they have cared?

Not a jot.

Ok here's a question for you. What if Barcelona won the game tonight playing like Atletico? Would the Barcelona fans and media have accepted it? What if they decided since it worked once, they'll do it again in both legs of the semi finals, would that be acceptable? At the end of the day not all clubs are the same. Success is important but, for Barcelona, the way in which you win is important too. Playing the way Atletico do all season would never be accepted at Barcelona. Is that me putting down Atletico? No, simply stating the expectations are different.

NIMAN

TheCitizen wrote: »

Of course it isn't meaningless, if you have any interest in football or culture or politics. Cruyff managed a Catalonia team in a couple of arranged games.

Getting back to football, the way Barcelona play football is one of the templates for the best way to play the game. Other teams using other ways of playing to win is of course admired and respected, but the way Barca currently try to win is the way I'd prefer other teams and youth teams to copy and follow.

Whatever happened the Ajax way?

I remember when I was younger, coaches from all over the world would rave about their system of coaching, and they were held up as the perfect model of how to teach kids to play the game. I don't remember Barca being mentioned back then.

kksaints

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Unfortunately you'll find an element of that at many clubs if you look hard enough. Every fanbase has militant fools, Barcelona's is no exception. However, for the most part, I find the Barcelona fanbase to be tremendous.

Its more the neo-fascism of the group which I dislike which is odd coming from what I always thought was a sort of left wing bastion in Spain.

deaddonkey15

TheCitizen wrote: »

Of course it isn't meaningless, if you have any interest in football or culture or politics. Cruyff managed a Catalonia team in a couple of arranged games.

Getting back to football, the way Barcelona play football is one of the templates for the best way to play the game. Other teams using other ways of playing to win is of course admired and respected, but the way Barca currently try to win is the way I'd prefer other teams and youth teams to copy and follow.

Diving? Making the most of any hint of a foul? Relentless harassment of referees? Blatant cheating and assault when things aren't going their way? Underhanded methods by which they acquire their players?

Ive no bother with AIGs appreciation of Barca because tbf to him they have given loads to football and many of their greatest players in history are products of their youth system. Credit where due. But you couldn't possibly suggest across the board that the club is perfect in every way. You would be guilty of a Paddy Crerand or worse even a Willie Fraser level of bias objectivity in such an event.

Andersonisgod

MD1990 wrote: »

- You support Chelsea who have a completley different philosophy to Barcelona.
- I believe you supported Spain against Ireland correct me if I'm wrong.
- Have you even went to the Camp Nou often since you love the fans so much or you just follow them on social media.

As I said you are just a gloryhunter.

-Yep, childhood Chelsea fan.
-I don't think that just because I'm from the same island as a team that it automatically warrants me supporting them, especially when their brand of football was as turgid as it was that night.
-I have a couple of times, I'm hoping to go again early next season if you care to join me?

Who do you support? I look forward to casting my weary eye over you.

NIMAN

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Ok here's a question for you. What if Barcelona won the game tonight playing like Atletico? Would the Barcelona fans and media have accepted it? What if they decided since it worked once, they'll do it again in both legs of the semi finals, would that be acceptable? At the end of the day not all clubs are the same. Success is important but, for Barcelona, the way in which you win is important too. Playing the way Atletico do all season would never be accepted at Barcelona. Is that me putting down Atletico? No, simply stating the expectations are different.

AIG,

think I asked you this before, but do you believe Real Madrid also have a 'right way to play' philosophy?

Their fans have booed them off the pitch when winning, as they weren't winning in style.

They have sacked managers who won things because it was lacking in style.

So do you admire how Real play?

SlickRic

TheCitizen wrote: »

Of course it isn't meaningless, if you have any interest in football or culture or politics. Cruyff managed a Catalonia team in a couple of arranged games

I didn't say the phrase 'mes que un club' is meaningless.

I said it's meaningless for anyone to use it who isn't Catalunyan, or has been a part of that culture for a period of time. It's just a nice phrase.

eagle eye

NIMAN wrote: »

I wonder did Barca always have this pretty football philosophy?
Did they have it in the 60s, 70s, 80s?

And did they always have this MORE THAN A CLUB motto, or was it a marketing creation in more recent times?

And as for the love of LA Masia, was that always important to the club? Did they churn out talent from it back in older times? Or when did it start?

The 'more than a club' is around for a long, long time. Long before I started watching the game and I'm 46.

Andersonisgod

Deleted User wrote: »

Ive no bother with AIGs appreciation of Barca because tbf to him they have given loads to football and many of their greatest players in history are products of their youth system. Credit where due. But you couldn't possibly suggest across the board that the club is perfect in every way. You would be guilty of a Paddy Crerand or worse even a Willie Fraser level of bias objectivity in such an event.

I've never suggested the club is perfect. The board is a disgrace, something I've repeated many times here. The financial situation of the club is not ideal. The recruitment policy has been too scattergun for my liking.

Despite all of that, I love this club.

Ulysses Gaze

NIMAN wrote: »

I wonder did Barca always have this pretty football philosophy?
Did they have it in the 60s, 70s, 80s?

And did they always have this MORE THAN A CLUB motto, or was it a marketing creation in more recent times?

And as for the love of LA Masia, was that always important to the club? Did they churn out talent from it back in older times? Or when did it start?

La Masia? The 1970's. I think it was Cruyff who suggested to Nunez who was President at the time to concentrate on building the Cantera. The first real good generation of players that came out of La Masia were part of Cruyff's Dream Team. Guardiola, Guillermo Amor, Albert Ferrer, Sergi Barjuan, Luis Milla and others.

CSF

It worries me when the posts cease to be ones having a bit of a wind up and move towards people actually taking a pop at Barca's football. Wonderful football team with wonderful footballers who just weren't at it for 135 minutes of this 180.

I just happen to not like many of their footballers for various reasons, but most of them are world class and it's hard to argue otherwise.

~Rebel~

adox wrote: »

The beautiful game doesn't always have to be beautiful to be beautiful.

Beautifully put.

ArmaniJeanss

SlickRic wrote: »

Also, this 'mes que un club' stuff is meaningless to anyone who isn't Catalan, or hasn't lived in Catalunya for an extended period of time.

Even Thierry Henry said he didn't understand it until his second year at the club, and it was only after they best Real that season.

It's utterly meaningless unless it's your culture.

Just because a professional footballer doesn't understand something really doesn't mean it can't be understood by others who perhaps read up on things, watch documentaries, have basic knowledge of the Spanish Civil War etc.

Like Henrys probably one of the more cultured players out there, but I suspect when he moved to Catalunya he'd still have been more clueless about it than say an average Leaving Cert'er.

Andersonisgod

NIMAN wrote: »

AIG,

think I asked you this before, but do you believe Real Madrid also have a 'right way to play' philosophy?

Their fans have booed them off the pitch when winning, as they weren't winning in style.

They have sacked managers who won things because it was lacking in style.

So do you admire how Real play?

Absolutely they do. They must attack. They must score goals. They must play exciting football.

It goes a little deeper than that though, for Real Madrid it's about the individual, it's about the Galactico. Cruyff always stressed that it's the collective that matters and that's a core principle of the club that filters right down to their Masia.

The Backwards Man

I know a fella from Larne. He supports Larne, goes to all their games, home and away. He supports a big team too . . .Luton Town (how I know him even though I'm not a Luton supporter but it's the nearest to a professional football club Inishowen has).

I forgot what I meant to say here, but you can stick your Barcelonas up your arse.

NIMAN

NIMAN wrote: »

Whatever happened the Ajax way?

I remember when I was younger, coaches from all over the world would rave about their system of coaching, and they were held up as the perfect model of how to teach kids to play the game. I don't remember Barca being mentioned back then.

Johann Cruyff is believed to have brought the 'Ajax/Total Football' way to Barca originally.

SlickRic

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Ok here's a question for you. What if Barcelona won the game tonight playing like Atletico? Would the Barcelona fans and media have accepted it? What if they decided since it worked once, they'll do it again in both legs of the semi finals, would that be acceptable? At the end of the day not all clubs are the same. Success is important but, for Barcelona, the way in which you win is important too. Playing the way Atletico do all season would never be accepted at Barcelona. Is that me putting down Atletico? No, simply stating the expectations are different.

The expectation is to win. Nothing else. The pretty football is just a nice addition.

Since you asked a question, I get to ask one. If Barca played the same way they do but weren't winning trophies, would it be accepted?

deaddonkey15

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Ok here's a question for you. What if Barcelona won the game tonight playing like Atletico? Would the Barcelona fans and media have accepted it? What if they decided since it worked once, they'll do it again in both legs of the semi finals, would that be acceptable? At the end of the day not all clubs are the same. Success is important but, for Barcelona, the way in which you win is important too. Playing the way Atletico do all season would never be accepted at Barcelona. Is that me putting down Atletico? No, simply stating the expectations are different.

The fans expect a certain style based on the players at their disposal. Since Barcelona get a huge cut from the unfairly distributed La Liga TV money as well as employ dodgy tactics when it comes to player transfers then the fans will demand a certain style. If they had to survive with Atletico's resources, the fans would take victory any way they could get it.

SlickRic

Andersonisgod wrote: »

It goes a little deeper than that though, for Real Madrid it's about the individual, it's about the Galactico.

That's not true. The Galactico thing is a Fiorentino Perez thing. Not a Real Madrid thing.

TheCitizen

SlickRic wrote: »

I didn't say the phrase 'mes que un club' is meaningless.

I said it's meaningless for anyone to use it who isn't Catalunyan, or has been a part of that culture for a period of time. It's just a nice phrase.

It's an inspirational phrase. You don't have to be from Catalonia to empathise with it. I wouldn't describe it as meaningless or nice either.

NIMAN

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Absolutely they do. They must attack. They must score goals. They must play exciting football.

It goes a little deeper than that though, for Real Madrid it's about the individual, it's about the Galactico. Cruyff always stressed that it's the collective that matters and that's a core principle of the club that filters right down to their Masia.

Well the collective won out tonight I'm afraid.

And to be fair, Barca haven't exactly shy of signing plenty of Galatico's over the years themselves.

eagle eye

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I know a fella from Larne. He supports Larne, goes to all their games, home and away. He supports a big team too . . .Luton Town (how I know him even though I'm not a Luton supporter but it's the nearest to a professional football club Inishowen has).

I forgot what I meant to say here, but you can stick your Barcelonas up your arse.

After reading this post I had this view of you living in a very backward, remote part of the world where news filters through a couple of years after it's actually happened.

And I thought to myself, backwards man really is an apt username.

Andersonisgod

SlickRic wrote: »

The expectation is to win. Nothing else. The pretty football is just a nice addition.

Since you asked a question, I get to ask one. If Barca played the same way they do but weren't winning trophies, would it be accepted?

Absolutely not. The 2 things must go hand in hand. Winning without beauty isn't the same as winning with beauty. Just as beauty without winning isn't the same as beauty with winning. That's what I believe, that's what Barcelona as a club believe. If you're interested in the subject seek out some of Xavi's quotes on the matter, a player that embodies the culture of the club, once you read what he's said on this you'll have a greater idea of just what I mean when I say winning isn't enough.

deaddonkey15

Andersonisgod wrote: »

-Yep, childhood Chelsea fan.
-I don't think that just because I'm from the same island as a team that it automatically warrants me supporting them, especially when their brand of football was as turgid as it was that night.
-I have a couple of times, I'm hoping to go again early next season if you care to join me?

Who do you support? I look forward to casting my weary eye over you.

Wow. I think what little credibility you had has all but gone with that line.

NIMAN

TheCitizen wrote: »

It's an inspirational phrase. You don't have to be from Catalonia to empathise with it. I wouldn't describe it as meaningless or nice either.

Bit like Aston Villa's "Prepared" (for the championship).

Andersonisgod

SlickRic wrote: »

That's not true. The Galactico thing is a Fiorentino Perez thing. Not a Real Madrid thing.

The Galactico thing is but then how long has that policy been in place now? Since Perez's first reign as President.

eagle eye

SlickRic wrote: »

That's not true. The Galactico thing is a Fiorentino Perez thing. Not a Real Madrid thing.

Florentino Perez is Real Madrid sadly. He has turned them into a club I don't like even though I love watching a lot of their players.

NIMAN

Andersonisgod wrote: »

The Galactico thing is but then how long has that policy been in place now? Since Perez's first reign as President.

Buying Ronaldo and Bale ......versus buying Suarez and Neymar.

Both quite similar imho.

Barca have always bought the biggest players too, just that they aren't called Galatico's, as it seems the media retain that phrase for Real Madrid signings.

The Backwards Man

eagle eye wrote: »

After reading this post I had this view of you living in a very backward, remote part of the world where news filters through a couple of years after it's actually happened.

And I thought to myself, backwards man really is an apt username.

Haha, we're a bit slow here alright, but more than a club applies to Larne FC or Luton Town same as it does to Blackburn Rovers or Barcelona.

Andersonisgod

NIMAN wrote: »

Buying Ronaldo and Bale ......versus buying Suarez and Neymar.

Both quite similar imho.

Barca have always bought the biggest players too, just that they aren't called Galatico's, as it seems the media retain that phrase for Real Madrid signings.

Certainly Barcelona have bought big players, what big club does not. However the devotion to youth has been there since Cruyff and, from 2008-2016 the proportion of Masia players in the first team squad has been strong. That is only set to continue too.

Corholio

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Don't think anyone bashes Bale. I actually like him. Seems to come across as a genuine guy.

I admire Ronaldo's relentless drive to be the best and his professionalism, but loathe some of his on field antics which I find unnecessary.

I'll bash Perez because he absolutely deserves it. His chicanery has ensured that it is pretty much impossible for him to be challenged as the President of Real Madrid unless someone can stump up €50 million to challenge him. He's patently learned absolutely nothing from his first time in charge of the club continuing to buy flavour of the month players rather than build a team. And he's spent the bulk of €500-600 million and won very little and has turned Real into a three-ring circus.

Plus when the club President replies "I don't know" when he's asked why he sacked the Manager who landed La Decima and who the players wanted to stay on, then he deserves to be bashed and ridiculed.

Perez makes Sandro Rossell and Bartomeu at Barca look competent. He even makes the late Jesus Gil look competent!

I agree with most of what you have said, certainly about Perez. Bale certainly has had criticism in a lot of games. But to be honest, my point wasn't about the ins and outs of opinions, it's the easy bashing that Real get sometimes without balanced opinion and instead the easy targets of Perez and Ronaldo's ego being made to be everything Real. In the same way I don't judge Barca on the likes of Suarez's history, Alba's cheating or the likes of Busquets previous dark arts of the game, despite being a brilliant player. It's the denial of such things that I would take issue with.

Flint Fredstone

Delicious, salty Catalan tears

Ulysses Gaze

NIMAN wrote: »

Bit like Aston Villa's "Prepared" (for the championship).

Well they've just cancelled their Player of the Year awards.

Dempsey

I see a few victims of football marketing on here!

Such wankery and bollocks around style of play and clubs ethos to make money from gullible people.

cowboyBuilder

YES YES YES YES YES YES !!!!!


YEEEEESSSSSS!!!!!!!


What a nice surprise leaving a cinema and checking the FT scores ...


GET IN !!!

Arghus

Andersonisgod wrote: »

I make no bones about it, I support Barcelona because I believe the Barça way is the only way the game should be played. I love the culture of the club, I love the historical and political importance of the club. I love the mes que un club ideal. I love the dedication of the club to La Masia. I love that this club is at the center of football innovation. I love the players that have played for the club. I love the players that are currently playing for the club. I love the jersey, the crest, the blaugrana, the Camp Nou. I love the Barça fanbase. I love everything that the club stands for, everything it represents. I love being safe in the knowledge that even if I'm having a bad week, come the weekend I'll get to witness 90 minutes of pure exhilaration executed by the finest practitioners of the sport. I love that at Barcelona it's not just enough to win, it has to be the right way. I love this club with every fibre of my being, whether they win or lose.

AIG, you seem to be quiet busy tonight, so I'll try to refrain from a needless wind-up, but where would you rate objectivity as being a true element of love?

Andersonisgod

Dempsey wrote: »

I see a few victims of football marketing on here!

Such wankery and bollocks around style of play and clubs ethos to make money from gullible people.

Michel's, Cruyff's and Guardiola's body of work; football marketing, wankery and bollocks since Dempsey declared in on Boards.ie 2016.