Septic Tanks on small areas of land

hearmehearye

Hi guys,


I've a house on a small plot of land, circa 0.1 acres, that's fairly old and was built with no septic tank. The previous owners didn't have a septic tank...


My question is, is there any sort of septic tank system that will fit within a small 0.1 acre site? Or even any sort of legal workarounds? The land beside the plot is farmland, and the owner (farmer) is a horrible man who has been out to get us since day 1. It's rural so there's no chance of a mains connection.

Poor Uncle Tom

Do you only have one neighbour? What about across the roadway from the site?

hearmehearye

He owns all the land around the site, unfortunately. If you imagine a huge quilt with an apple in the middle of it, we're the apple. This includes to the left and right, behind, and across the road.

Poor Uncle Tom

hearmehearye wrote: »

My question is, is there any sort of septic tank system that will fit within a small 0.1 acre site?

None that I'm aware of.

sydthebeat

What county?

Is the house habitable and always lived in?

hearmehearye

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

None that I'm aware of.

****e

lanos

hearmehearye wrote: »

Hi guys,


I've a house on a small plot of land, circa 0.1 acres, that's fairly old and was built with no septic tank. The previous owners didn't have a septic tank...

if it has no septic tank, then can we assume it has no toilets or shower.
therefore probably no planning permission either
the farmer is obviously being horrible because he wants to buy it cheap

this is a fascinating case, please supply more info

bonaparte2

Use a dry composting toilet. They do the finest

hearmehearye

sydthebeat wrote: »

What county?

Is the house habitable and always lived in?

Hiya, it's in Kerry.


The previous owners lived in the house until 2007ish until they got too ill and elderly and then moved to the local nursing home. The last owner died in early 2014 and the deeds on the house have just recently been transferred. No one really looked after the house, just popping their head in.



There's people interested in buying the cottage at the moment, and the farmer neighbour has put them off completely by saying there's no way they would get planning permission for a septic tank. (I suspect he'd object to it anyway), he was executor of the former owner's Will which left the house to my family and I think that he's very sour over the fact he didn't get the house, which is a blip on his perfect ownership of the rest of the land around.


It's all complicated and cosy and very Kerry. The house itself isn't habitable at the moment, but has been declared structurally sound.

hearmehearye

lanos wrote: »

if it has no septic tank, then can we assume it has no toilets or shower.
therefore probably no planning permission either
the farmer is obviously being horrible because he wants to buy it cheap

this is a fascinating case, please supply more info

Hiya, it's a bit peculiar alright.


There was a very strange water collection system, basically a massive concrete basin that collected rainwater that could be manually pumped into an overhead tank which supplied the hot water tank, which then went on to supply the tap in the kitchen, and the tap in the bath, and the toilet. I haven't done any proper excavation, but I've a feeling the pipe from the toilet leads into a nearby stream. This rainwater wasn't treated at all.



I have no certain dates for when it was built, but I'm almost sure it's pre 1964, which makes it exempt from PP. I'm trying to establish what year it was built at the moment.


He definitely wants to buy it, for a measly sum I'd assume, and that field he owns would be properly squared out. The plot of land is an annoying blip on his radar.

hearmehearye

bonaparte2 wrote: »

Use a dry composting toilet. They do the finest

Hmm, interesting.


That's the toilet sorted, so what happens with the bath/shower/washing machine/dishwasher etc water?

Fuzzy Clam

hearmehearye wrote: »

Hmm, interesting.


That's the toilet sorted, so what happens with the bath/shower/washing machine/dishwasher etc water?

Do you need a tank for these?
I think in my house, they're separate to the toilet, possibly connected to the gutter drains.

hearmehearye

Fuzzy Clam wrote: »

Do you need a tank for these?
I think in my house, they're separate to the toilet.

I honestly have no idea, construction is not my forte! But like what happens to soapy water? I can't imagine it being good to just leak out to nowhere..? AFAIK in a septic tank there's a process for dealing with it..?

bonaparte2

There's plenty of sites on the net that deal with living off grid. You have a house and make sure you keep a roof on it , light a fire in it and keep it habitable.
People lived successfully in it before so whats the big deal. Water is a resource , roof water can supply most of your needs, technology allows grey water to be recycled as is done anywhere that its a scarce resource

lanos

hearmehearye wrote: »

He definitely wants to buy it, for a measly sum I'd assume, and that field he owns would be properly squared out. The plot of land is an annoying blip on his radar.

Thanks for the info
Sorry I have no expert advice on septic tank issues but I have been told a bio cycle unit produces almost clear effluent. However you still need a percolation area of some description.
As regards the greedy farmer, hang in there.

Rabbo

There isn't likely to be any system that would comply fully with the EPA COP within those confines. If you could successfully argue that the house has been lived in until recently and has sanitary facilities (albeit rudimentary), the council shouldn't be able to condemn it as long as it's not causing any obvious contamination. They probably wouldn't allow you to add any additional bedrooms but if you submitted a planning application for upgrading of existing wastewater system and do the absolute most you can within the confines of the site (i.e. Treatment plant with raised polishing filter over largest possible area) they would find it difficult to refuse you. The one problem you may have, depending on the site, is providing enough separation disrance to a new well. Your next move should be employing a professional to look at site and then, if it looks like a goer, carry out full site assessment, pre-planning meeting with area engineer and planner and apply for planning. You could apply at the same time to make any required modifications to house without increasing bedrooms. Your neighbour may object but it won't matter if you are able to put a reasonable case together.

Get an engineer to have a look at the house and site. They'll be best placed to answer all your questions.

mcneil

Knew of a house like this in Sligo right beside a salmon river. Was looking to buy it only for the farmer to put us off by saying he'd never allow access to his land for a septic tank and would refuse planning if they went for it on their own part but it was under half an acre.

hearmehearye

mcneil wrote: »

Knew of a house like this in Sligo right beside a salmon river. Was looking to buy it only for the farmer to put us off by saying he'd never allow access to his land for a septic tank and would refuse planning if they went for it on their own part but it was under half an acre.

That's fairly similar to my own case so.


Would you have thought of using alternative methods, ones that don't require septic tanks? (dry compost toilets etc?) Or did the neighbour put you off altogether with his attitude?

hearmehearye

Rabbo wrote: »

There isn't likely to be any system that would comply fully with the EPA COP within those confines. If you could successfully argue that the house has been lived in until recently and has sanitary facilities (albeit rudimentary), the council shouldn't be able to condemn it as long as it's not causing any obvious contamination. They probably wouldn't allow you to add any additional bedrooms but if you submitted a planning application for upgrading of existing wastewater system and do the absolute most you can within the confines of the site (i.e. Treatment plant with raised polishing filter over largest possible area) they would find it difficult to refuse you. The one problem you may have, depending on the site, is providing enough separation disrance to a new well. Your next move should be employing a professional to look at site and then, if it looks like a goer, carry out full site assessment, pre-planning meeting with area engineer and planner and apply for planning. You could apply at the same time to make any required modifications to house without increasing bedrooms. Your neighbour may object but it won't matter if you are able to put a reasonable case together.

Cheers for this. It's beside a roadway so it's possible for the house to be connected to mains water so there's no issue with having to mess around with wells etc.


I'll bear all of the above in mind. Thank you

hearmehearye

Deleted User wrote: »

Get an engineer to have a look at the house and site. They'll be best placed to answer all your questions.

That's hopefully the plan but am trying to be a half a step ahead :eek:

mcneil

hearmehearye wrote: »

That's fairly similar to my own case so.


Would you have thought of using alternative methods, ones that don't require septic tanks? (dry compost toilets etc?) Or did the neighbour put you off altogether with his attitude?

Didn't want the hassle. The farmer had an offer in, the access to it run through his land and just didn't want no problems with any neighbors. A lovely wee house and its always been my dream to be beside a river but thought I'd give it a miss. I suggest you do the same if its going to upset the farmer next to you because some can be right f*ckers and cause you all sorts of hassle in the future. Not worth IMO!

hearmehearye

Hah I should have clarified, I own the house already through inheritance and I'm trying to sell it on. Prospective buyers were put off by nut nut farmer saying there'd be no planning permission.