Would you go to Tunisia

Wichita Lineman

I'd steer clear myself at least for a while but in fairness it's not a country I'd consider going to anyway. I was very surprised to hear two thirds went there on a flight from Dublin at the weekend even though they were offered a full refund or an alternative holiday package.

Collie D

Have never really been interested in Tunisia although I did browse hotels there last summer for a few minutes. Have always fancied Egypt though but not in recent years. Would probably go with Tunisia over Egypt to be honest. For whatever reason I think it would be safer.

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

As someone who live up North during some of the worst of the conflict, I'm well aware of the level of misguided fear and complete ignorance that existed back down South. So I would only be too happy to go to Tunisia and show some support to the good people there.

Your post reminded me of someone I used to work with who went to Canada on holidays. When asked by a local was Ireland not a scary place to live with "all the bombs and stuff" she replied "Ah, you get used to it after a while. But it's a right pain in the hole when you've just finished mowing the lawn and some ****er lands a mortar round on it"

FouxDaFaFa

biko wrote: »

One of my best friends is Tunisian. He's ok with my not going to visit his home country. He rarely goes there himself, and he's muslim.
I'd love to visit Jordan and Lebanon though.

Please do. It's a great trip. I read an article just a few days ago that Jordan has seen something mental like a 40% drop in tourist numbers from one year to the next because of Jordan's location and Jordan really relies on tourism for its economy so it's a bad situation. Obviously, it's above Egypt, under Syria and next to Israel and Iraq so that makes some people nervous. There was also the execution of the Jordanian pilot by IS and that has hurt perception deeply.

They're doing everything they can to get the tourists back though, I think you'll find it a lot cheaper than I did when I was there in 2010 and it was pretty cheap then.

There will always be a risk, even if you stay in Ireland but, within reason, you shouldn't let it stop you seeing the world.

Spanish Eyes

When I was younger and a bit of a hippy chick, I did all the North African countries that were safe back then, Morocco, Tunisia, Turkey, Egypt. Fabulous to see the historical sights and all that, but as a woman, it wasn't always a pleasant experience.

Glad I did it when I did, but I would never go back to a Muslim country, purely because of the disrespect they have for Western females.

But places like Tunisia and Turkey are magnets for ladies of a certain age who go over there and are charmed by the love rats. There is even a website out there called Tunisian Love Rats, tell your story!

A beach is a beach, better to slap on yer suncream in Portugal if you are not that interested in Pharaohs, Roman Ruins, or Marrakesh.

Del.Monte

Don't forget to pop into North Korea and the Ukraine on your tour of insanely exciting places in which to holiday.

conorh91

Personally no, I wouldn't, but the comparisons drawn in this thread by nordies are pathetic.

I wish there were some sticky across boards.ie clarifying that an obsession with all the skirmishes in self-obsessed Norn Iron are in no way comparable to the very real dangers and injustices posed by ISIS, apartheid, Palestinian repression and so on… different scale.

moc moc a moc

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

As someone who live up North during some of the worst of the conflict, I'm well aware of the level of misguided fear and complete ignorance that existed back down South

Ah here, leave Cork out of your agenda.

JP Liz V1

No

rossie1977

i have been to morocco and turkey in the past and would have no issue returning to both. we actually had flights booked for cairo and were staying in cyprus but the revolution of 2011 happened and i decided not to fly out on the friday night (when things were really starting to get a little hairy) and stay the extra week in cyrus instead..but egypt and cairo is still one of the places near the top of my list i want to visit in the future

anyway you have about a 1 in 20 million chance of dying due to acts of terrorism...thats a fraction of the odds of drowning in a bath 1 in 800,000 or dying in a car crash 1 in 19,000

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

Probably, but my current location suggests I'm not too fussed about the reputation a country has for violence.

claudscloe

im due to go the end of the month and i think i still will, nothing can compare to the price on sunway and they refuse to refund they only allow you swap and pay extra for another holiday as they all cost more all inclusive. but if i could get a refund and go with a different company like low cost and get another country for the same price i would i think sunway are being really unfair as i cant afford to change!!

FloatingVoter

Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »

Probably, but my current location suggests I'm not too fussed about the reputation a country has for violence.

Would a talcum powder salesman run into any trouble at Bogata customs ?

TheLastMohican

Have been there loads of times. A couple of times in Sousse. Last time was in Hammamet. Will go there again but have Morocco booked for next Feb.
About ten years ago a bunch of brainwashed idiots killed a lot of people in Casablanca. A few years later a guy set off his suicide vest in an internet cafe and killed a few others. Lots of military standing on duty at hotels but the tourists were quick to return.
Both countries are great for sun holidays.

Menas

I was chatting to a work colleague in Tunisia today. He says that the situation there has been deteriorating for the last 18 months.
He said that they never saw radicals before the spring revolution, but now they see more and more radicals in their daily lives. Handing out leaflets on street corners, outside mosques etc.

He said that the country feels to be slipping out of control...there is an air of lawlessness in places...all since the spring revolution.

He reckons the attack last week is just the first. He expects to see more and more of these.

Magico Gonzalez

I wouldn't cancel if I was going, but i can't see it being sufficiently amazing for me to chose to go. I suppose it'll be heavily policed now, but maybe you'd have though that would be the case after the previous terrorist attack. Egypt is different as it is a heavily militarised country, in part due to it's proximity to Israel and the Suez canal's strategic importance. Luxor and those sort of places are heavily guarded now. Is that what you want on holiday? Not for me.

If I was looking for cheap I'd head off to a Greek island with cash in hand.

Mesrine65

weldoninhio wrote: »

Turkey, Tunisia, Morocco, no chance. Never would have even if the attack hadn't happened.

No idea what you are missing in fairness.

I've been to all the countries you've mentioned plus Algeria, Mali, Iran & Libya.

People are people wherever you go & any Muslim country I was ever in, I was treated with respect, friendliness & a lot of curiosity.

Fundamentalism will destroy all that is good about the Muslim world, such a shame IMHO

jimgoose

Yes. North Africa is a mad place, largely in the positive, fun sense. Desert nomad folk such as Bedouin Arab and Berber are decent, hospitable people.

1800

Mr.S wrote: »

Would you go to New York?
Would you go to London?



Yes, different but really?

Are you really comparing London and New York to to the back arse of Tunisia? After what happened the last few months there? Honestly get a reality check, people want to feel safe on their holidays. As for the eejit comparing this to the Donegal border in the Troubles, you have to laugh at the ignorance.

Too many people here are just completely ignorant of what goes on in these countries. To answer the thread no I wouldnt have went even before last week, you'd need to be bonkers. Anyway places like Turkey are utter ****eholes as is.

1800

Mesrine65 wrote: »

No idea what you are missing in fairness.

I've been to all the countries you've mentioned plus Algeria, Mali, Iran & Libya.

People are people wherever you go & any Muslim country I was ever in, I was treated with respect, friendliness & a lot of curiosity.

Fundamentalism will destroy all that is good about the Muslim world, such a shame IMHO

Ah yes lets all go on a relaxing holiday to Libya, that should calm the stress of everyday life.....wow

Mesrine65

1800 wrote: »

Ah yes lets all go on a relaxing holiday to Libya, that should calm the stress of everyday life.....wow

Did I say go to Libya on a holiday?

I stated that I had been to Libya & found the people welcoming, hospitable & friendly.

Away of to the Costa Del Portmarnock with you, don't forget your blinkers :rolleyes:

1800

North Africa is such a relaxing place, thats why the natives are prepared to drown to get on boats to Europe. Great logic.

Menas

1800 wrote: »

North Africa is such a relaxing place, thats why the natives are prepared to drown to get on boats to Europe. Great logic.

Eh...the most common nationalities of those migrants, accounting for 9 out of 10 rescued migrants, in order is...Eritrea, Somalia, Nigeria, Gambia, Syria, Senegal, Mali and Sudan.

lertsnim

I never had any interest in going to north Africa before that attack and my mind hasn't changed.

murpho999

It's funny how people who have never been to the region are saying that they wouldn't go.

What happened last week was awful but it was a rare event.

When you consider the amount of people travel there normally (millions) then it will put it into perspective that the chances of something happening to you in a resort are extremely low.

Have been to Sousse a few times and it's fine. People are very friendly, some of them over friendly, plenty of good food and also plenty of history around if you want.

Turkey also, is an extremely safe country and I would highly recommend it.

People saying that they have to take responsibility for their family etc are probably putting themselves more at risk driving to the airport to be honest.

Also, why do people think that resorts in Spain or Portugal etc are exempt from this events? These guys can strike anywhere at anytime.

murpho999

1800 wrote: »

North Africa is such a relaxing place, thats why the natives are prepared to drown to get on boats to Europe. Great logic.

Most of those are not from North African countries but places like Eritrea.

Magico Gonzalez

murpho999 wrote: »

It's funny how people who have never been to the region are saying that they wouldn't go.

What happened last week was awful but it was a rare event.

When you consider the amount of people travel there normally (millions) then it will put it into perspective that the chances of something happening to you in a resort are extremely low.

Have been to Sousse a few times and it's fine. People are very friendly, some of them over friendly, plenty of good food and also plenty of history around if you want.

Turkey also, is an extremely safe country and I would highly recommend it.

People saying that they have to take responsibility for their family etc are probably putting themselves more at risk driving to the airport to be honest.

Also, why do people think that resorts in Spain or Portugal etc are exempt from this events? These guys can strike anywhere at anytime.

Tunisia - March 2015. 21 Tourists killed in an attack on Bardo museum, tourists specifically targeted.

Tunisia - July 2015. 38 tourists killed on Sousse beach.

In recent history, it's not so rare. Given the context that more attacks are promised, specifically targeting tourists, it's naive to minimise the risk.

murpho999

Magico Gonzalez wrote: »

Tunisia - March 2015. 21 Tourists killed in an attack on Bardo museum, tourists specifically targeted.

Tunisia - July 2015. 38 tourists killed on Sousse beach.

In recent history, it's not so rare. Given the context that more attacks are promised, specifically targeting tourists, it's naive to minimise the risk.

It is rare 2 incidents, tragic, but what percentage is that of people who had travelled there? Last number I can find is 2013 when 6.2 million people went there?
So that's 0.00095% of the tourist population killed?

As I said last week was awful and tragic for those concerned, but some perspective is needed as Tunisia is not a lawless place like you would see in other parts like Libya or Syria.

Magico Gonzalez

murpho999 wrote: »

It is rare 2 incidents, tragic, but what percentage is that of people who had travelled there? Last number I can find is 2013 when 6.2 million people went there?
So that's 0.00095% of the tourist population killed?

As I said last week was awful and tragic for those concerned, but some perspective is needed as Tunisia is not a lawless place like you would see in other parts like Libya or Syria.

The threat has only existed since early this year and as such we have no accurate picture around it's potential to grow. I prefer numbers, if I know that 60 people will be murdered at a tourist site, will I willingly go? No, there are enough other destinations with a different risk profile.

Also, it's an emerging threat, the main issue being the lack of preparedness of the local security forces and the uncertainty around their ability to ramp up. Not a militarised country like Egypt.

From the UK foreign office (don't think ISIS will be giving Irish people a pass):


"Further terrorist attacks are likely, including in tourist resorts, and by individuals who are unknown to the authorities, and whose actions are inspired by terrorist groups via social media. Attacks could be indiscriminate, including in places visited by foreigners. You should be especially vigilant at this time and follow the advice of Tunisian security authorities and your tour operator.
Terrorist attacks have increased in Tunisia since 2013. Tunisia borders Libya, where there is a continuing conflict and an absence of security, and where Islamist terrorist groups operate. The border is porous. In October 2013, there were failed attacks at a hotel in Sousse and the Bourguiba Museum in Monastir."

A porous border with a completely dysfunctional state does not bode well. I'd be worried that the situation can only degrade, I am not optimistic for Tunisia unfortunately. Again, the Egyptian military has been able to provide a security buffer for their resorts, I don't know if the Tunisians are able to do the same, and quickly.

syklops

mariaalice wrote: »

Acutely a mass campaign of holidaying in Tunisia and the resulting publicity from such a campain would be one way of defeating terrorism to some degree.

And then we can have a second mass.

irish gent

If you won a prize and got a choice of a holiday and you had a pick , what one would you pick . el salvador or Tunisia

crockholm

irish gent wrote: »

If you won a prize and got a choice of a holiday and you had a pick , what one would you pick . el salvador or Tunisia

That would be the mother in laws Birthday/Xmas prezzie sorted.

murpho999

Magico Gonzalez wrote: »

The threat has only existed since early this year and as such we have no accurate picture around it's potential to grow. I prefer numbers, if I know that 60 people will be murdered at a tourist site, will I willingly go? No, there are enough other destinations with a different risk profile.

Also, it's an emerging threat, the main issue being the lack of preparedness of the local security forces and the uncertainty around their ability to ramp up. Not a militarised country like Egypt.

From the UK foreign office (don't think ISIS will be giving Irish people a pass):


"Further terrorist attacks are likely, including in tourist resorts, and by individuals who are unknown to the authorities, and whose actions are inspired by terrorist groups via social media. Attacks could be indiscriminate, including in places visited by foreigners. You should be especially vigilant at this time and follow the advice of Tunisian security authorities and your tour operator.
Terrorist attacks have increased in Tunisia since 2013. Tunisia borders Libya, where there is a continuing conflict and an absence of security, and where Islamist terrorist groups operate. The border is porous. In October 2013, there were failed attacks at a hotel in Sousse and the Bourguiba Museum in Monastir."

A porous border with a completely dysfunctional state does not bode well. I'd be worried that the situation can only degrade, I am not optimistic for Tunisia unfortunately. Again, the Egyptian military has been able to provide a security buffer for their resorts, I don't know if the Tunisians are able to do the same, and quickly.

Same website's info on Spain that many people would consider safe;

There is a high threat from terrorism. Attacks could be indiscriminate, including in places visited by foreigners. The Spanish authorities take measures to protect visitors, but you should be vigilant and follow the instructions of the local authorities.

There is considered to be a heightened threat of terrorist attack globally against UK interests and British nationals, from groups or individuals motivated by the conflict in Iraq and Syria. You should be vigilant at this time.

In 2015, Spanish police have disrupted a number of groups suspected of recruiting individuals to travel to Syria and Iraq. Some of them expressed an intention to carry out attacks in Europe. Spanish authorities believe that a number of Spanish nationals have successfully travelled to Syria and Iraq.

FalconGirl

murpho999 wrote: »

It's funny how people who have never been to the region are saying that they wouldn't go.

What happened last week was awful but it was a rare event.

When you consider the amount of people travel there normally (millions) then it will put it into perspective that the chances of something happening to you in a resort are extremely low.

Have been to Sousse a few times and it's fine. People are very friendly, some of them over friendly, plenty of good food and also plenty of history around if you want.

Turkey also, is an extremely safe country and I would highly recommend it.

People saying that they have to take responsibility for their family etc are probably putting themselves more at risk driving to the airport to be honest.

Also, why do people think that resorts in Spain or Portugal etc are exempt from this events? These guys can strike anywhere at anytime.

I have to disagree. Random attacks against non muslims are becoming more frequent. ISIS have a massive presence in North Africa nowadays. It's not a chance I'd be willing to take until the situation calms a bit. I cant see that happening anytime soon and it will get worse before it gets better.

Del.Monte

murpho999 wrote: »

Same website's info on Spain that many people would consider safe;

The south of Spain is far from safe but I'd chance it before North Africa.

Just a little Samba

I'll actually probably be in Tunisia in September for work. It's an EU finded training programme I've been asked to speak at on behalf of my employers.
AFAIK it's still going ahead.

Just a little Samba

Del.Monte wrote: »

The south of Spain is far from safe but I'd chance it before North Africa.

You think the south of Spain isn't safe?

What sort of bubble do you live in where places like Seville, Malaga and Granada are not safe?

Magico Gonzalez

murpho999 wrote: »

Same website's info on Spain that many people would consider safe;

There's no comparison to be drawn !

One mentions a porous border with a failed state where Sunni extremist's can and do cross the border.

The other says take care and listen to the local authorities.

One of those countries has had 2 significant terrorist attacks, specifically targeting tourists and with warnings of further attacks on the same, the other does a nice line in tapas and flamenco dancing.

Come on, there is no comparison, Spain is now much better prepared than Tunisia in terms of it's ability to detect and thwart terrorist attacks. The Tunisians are just not there yet.

In fact, I'd say you've more chance of seeing something happen in France but those attacks have to date been much more focused. The Hebdo attacks had an air of inevitability about them and the recent attack had the potential to be much worse. The French have a greater (arguably moreso now) ability to stop these attacks.

I get it, North Africa is a vibrant place but I'm genuinely sorry to say that Tunisia is facing a potentially serious crisis, and not one it deserves. The destabilisation of Libya has fcked the region, Egypt's problems don't help. What we might euphemistically call "strongmen" held the region together, now that the west has opened pandora's box (previously creating artificial states and picking and chosing the govt's) in the region we're going to have to put up with the violent unwinding of stability and security in that region.

You jumped the shark when comparing Tunisia and Spain. Really.

Magico Gonzalez

Just a little Samba wrote: »

You think the south of Spain isn't safe?

What sort of bubble do you live in where places like Seville, Malaga and Granada are not safe?

Ah now, you could get an awful sun tan if you weren't careful.

Del.Monte

Magico Gonzalez wrote: »

Ah now, you could get an awful sun tan if you weren't careful.

Laugh away.

Just a little Samba

Magico Gonzalez wrote: »

Ah now, you could get an awful sun tan if you weren't careful.

Bit of indigestion from too many for the giants tapa with your €2 tubo's in Granada as well. Fierce dangerous.

billy few mates

I spent several months in Tunisia on business last year, a lot of it in that very region, Sousse, Monastir, Djerba and Sfax and I found the people to be very relaxed, sociable and friendly and many of them were fond of a beer. They actually took security very seriously in the tourist resorts with guards on every gate but the one area they couldn't secure was the beach as these are not private property so anyone is entitled to use and walk along them.
The people I met down there would be just as abhorred by this tragedy as we are, they're muslims but they're very relaxed and Western leaning, they were very proud of the fact that they were the catalyst for the arab spring in that they were the first country to peacefully bring about democracy in the region.
They don't have a lot in the way of oil and gas like their neighbours in Libya and Algeria have so they knew the value of the tourist industry and did everything they could to protect it. Unfortunately they couldn't protect it from this savage act and a great many of them will lose their livelihoods because of it.
I would have no problem going back there but I wouldn't bring my family on holiday there.

Pumpkinseeds

failinis wrote: »

I agree with thebackwardsman and corvus maximus, grew up in the North and its still ridiculous the many people I meet from the south who still won't venture up out of fear or misinformation.

I always wanted to see Morocco, and Tunsia (before all this happened) due to the art, fabric and pottery, and it is still on my list, if I ever have the time to go.

It depends on your experiences I think. I live in the South and there's been a lot of people from the North here since the troubles began. Other than them being very loud and clichey:D nobody ever batted an eye about it. I never really gave things in the North much thought since it didn't directly affect my life. But my husband is English and it wasn't uncommon for him/me or both of us to get some really vicious remarks from Northern men when we were out in bars locally, even going back 10 years. So for that reason I wouldn't go on holiday in the North.

Magico Gonzalez

Del.Monte wrote: »

Laugh away.

gracias !

Magico Gonzalez

billy few mates wrote: »

I spent several months in Tunisia on business last year, a lot of it in that very region, Sousse, Monastir, Djerba and Sfax and I found the people to be very relaxed, sociable and friendly and many of them were fond of a beer. They actually took security very seriously in the tourist resorts with guards on every gate but the one area they couldn't secure was the beach as these are not private property so anyone is entitled to use and walk along them.
The people I met down there would be just as abhorred by this tragedy as we are, they're muslims but they're very relaxed and Western leaning, they were very proud of the fact that they were the catalyst for the arab spring in that they were the first country to peacefully bring about democracy in the region.
They don't have a lot in the way of oil and gas like their neighbours in Libya and Algeria have so they knew the value of the tourist industry and did everything they could to protect it. Unfortunately they couldn't protect it from this savage act and a great many of them will lose their livelihoods because of it.
I would have no problem going back there but I wouldn't bring my family on holiday there.

That's why it's so tragic, a potential beacon for democracy facing years of trying to manage an open border with a failed state fulled of newly radicalised extremists.

billy few mates

The problem is that although they have a couple of fairly secure border crossings between Libya and Algeria, the borders themselves are actually quite long and practically impossible to secure so porous in most areas. They were doing their best but it would be impossible to forsee this and crackdown against it without cracking down on their entire population just as if a rogue nutter in Ireland tried to do something similar.....