Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2015 - Mod Post in OP 23/07

Giggsy11

MythicalMadMan wrote: »

Do you know if its being shown anywhere on a english speaking channel?

No idea

Alf Veedersane

bucketybuck wrote: »

I actually agree with him. I think McNair just has too much variance in his performances to be considered a top quality prospect. Its not very often you see a player taken off in the first half of a Premier league game for being a complete liability but thats happened a few times with McNair now, and a top level defender simply cannot afford that level of inconsistency.

If you have a top class prospect you will stick with them when they make the inevitable mistake, thats all part of the process. But there are times when McNair isn't just making a few mistakes while playing solidly, but is completely and utterly awful on the pitch. Thats very worrying to me.

He has some quality, but I'm just not seeing enough that a club with Champions league ambitions should be sticking with him in a hope that he will improve.

It was his 5th or 6th game though. He looked flustered and LVG took him off because his confidence was gone and it didn't look like it was coming back.

He has had 12 starts and IMHO he has shown enough that he could be a very, very good player.

Plenty of players for United that had ropey starts that went on to be very, very good players.

Jayop

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

It was his 5th or 6th game though. He looked flustered and LVG took him off because his confidence was gone and it didn't look like it was coming back.

He has had 12 starts and IMHO he has shown enough that he could be a very, very good player.

Plenty of players for United that had ropey starts that went on to be very, very good players.

Paddy was 19 and as you say at the very start of his career. Al, young cb's have bad games, but you need to stick with them if you ever want yo reveal a gem.

Remember the starts Vidic and evra had at united as full senior internationals..

Jayop

The game in Question was Southampton away in December. Long and Pelle bullied a young kid physically. Not the end of the world.

Adamocovic

Based on last season you'd have to go with a Smalling-Jones combination, but considering they are both right footed it appears Van Gaal might want to only play one of them at a time in CB. Then the likes of Rojo, Blind, Blackett compete for the left CB.

I see a lot of people up in arms about Blind not being good enough at CB, to be honest I've only really seen him at CB for us during the preseason. Yeah maybe he played there once or twice last season, and a handful of times for Holland in the world cup (as part of a back three) so can we really say he will be a disaster at CB?

He's a good DM and capable LB, if VG works with him he might do a good job for us at CB. In the pre season he has been quite good at CB, only preseason and all that.

In my opinion the jury is still out regarding how good he is as a CB but if VG believes he is capable he more than likely is.

bangkok

this is smallings year providing he stays injury free. 2nd half of last season he was brilliant. I said he was good enough to play for Barcelona but was laughed at at first but soon enough people came around to the idea. I think he will be our main man at the back this season and I hope the potential finally shines bright this season

Mitch Connor

Jayop wrote: »

In a terrible season destroyed by injuries to our defence we still only conceded 5 more than Chelsea, one less than city and one more than arsenal.

Our problems last year were all midfield, attack and that stupid 3 at the back at the start of the season.

I think that doesn't take in enough context for why we conceded so few.

1. DDG was a fecking superman most of the season and stopped many chances that should have been goals - chances the defence gave up. DDG was our player of the season, if our defence was good enough then our keeper would not have been player of the season, imo.

2. LVG specifically stated that we were defending with possession as our defence wasn't strong enough - so we were conservative with the ball (numbing our attacking play) so as not to be caught out and expose the defence. A better defence would mean a better attack for us.

There were many games where we should have conceded a hatfull and got away with - not because our defense was particularly good, but because the opposition fecked up. Remember the liverpool game, sterling and balotelli could have had a hattrick each. Palace was similar, as was Southampton iirc.

Our defending was often last ditch panic station stuff, rather than a defence you had implicit trust in. We have partly (maybe) solved that with Darmian being an actual right back, but a CB we will still suffer from an inability to organize.

EDIT: Also, a season destroyed by injuries to the defence - and now we are happy to rely on the same defenders (who have a consistent record of getting injured regularly, to stay fit - and for that to be part of the solution: GREAT!

Alf Veedersane

Adamocovic wrote: »

I see a lot of people up in arms about Blind not being good enough at CB, to be honest I've only really seen him at CB for us during the preseason. Yeah maybe he played there once or twice last season, and a handful of times for Holland in the world cup (as part of a back three) so can we really say he will be a disaster at CB?.

I think he's capable of filling in at CB - I don't think he's a disaster by any stretch. Maybe in a back three but I don't think he's suited to CB if it's a two-man central defence.

bucketybuck

Adamocovic wrote: »

I see a lot of people up in arms about Blind not being good enough at CB, to be honest I've only really seen him at CB for us during the preseason.

If anybody is up in arms its because we shouldn't even be discussing Blind at CB at all. It was an area that everybody knew needed strengthening and we had all summer to do it, so it would be incredibly disappointing to ever reach the point of shoehorning Blind in there.

Jayop

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I think that doesn't take in enough context for why we conceded so few.

1. DDG was a fecking superman most of the season and stopped many chances that should have been goals - chances the defence gave up. DDG was our player of the season, if our defence was good enough then our keeper would not have been player of the season, imo.

2. LVG specifically stated that we were defending with possession as our defence wasn't strong enough - so we were conservative with the ball (numbing our attacking play) so as not to be caught out and expose the defence. A better defence would mean a better attack for us.

There were many games where we should have conceded a hatfull and got away with - not because our defense was particularly good, but because the opposition fecked up. Remember the liverpool game, sterling and balotelli could have had a hattrick each. Palace was similar, as was Southampton iirc.

Our defending was often last ditch panic station stuff, rather than a defence you had implicit trust in. We have partly (maybe) solved that with Darmian being an actual right back, but a CB we will still suffer from an inability to organize.

EDIT: Also, a season destroyed by injuries to the defence - and now we are happy to rely on the same defenders (who have a consistent record of getting injured regularly, to stay fit - and for that to be part of the solution: GREAT!

DeGea was great but you know, that's his job and he's looking like he's going to be here next year too.

A large amount of the goals we conceded were at the start of the season when we played a stupid formation. We changed to back four and were immediately more solid.

Most of the chances we gave up last season were not as a result of bad defending but no cover from midfield and giving away possession in crazy areas.

They've now had a full season to learn what vangasl wants do we should be more comfortable with the system.

We've now got a proper rb so don't need to rely on Valencia.

It would be an amazingly unlucky set of circumstances for us to have as bad a season again with injuies. I can't see it happening.

Mitch Connor

Jayop wrote: »

DeGea was great but you know, that's his job and he's looking like he's going to be here next year too.

A large amount of the goals we conceded were at the start of the season when we played a stupid formation. We changed to back four and were immediately more solid.

Most of the chances we gave up last season were not as a result of bad defending but no cover from midfield and giving away possession in crazy areas.

They've now had a full season to learn what vangasl wants do we should be more comfortable with the system.

We've now got a proper rb so don't need to rely on Valencia.

It would be an amazingly unlucky set of circumstances for us to have as bad a season again with injuies. I can't see it happening.

I'll just say I disagree with you, and leave at that.

We'll find out who was right come May.

Liam O

Trilla wrote: »

Fair enough, I disagree. There's always the f*ck-up in Evans in every game he plays. I'm not saying Smalling is perfect but I think he's more composed on the ball and has similar defensive ability

I feel that a lot of Evans' fúck ups last season were because he is comfortable on the ball and would overplay it. There would then be nobody in midfield coming short so he'd panic a bit. These were isolated incidents and he's just as likely to play a lovely ball out to the wings as he is to make a really bad pass. I feel he was a victim of LVG's system at times, left to do the job of both a CB and an LB and was pulled out of position to cover for either an unfit Shaw or a slow Blind.

Adamocovic

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I think that doesn't take in enough context for why we conceded so few.

1. DDG was a fecking superman most of the season and stopped many chances that should have been goals - chances the defence gave up. DDG was our player of the season, if our defence was good enough then our keeper would not have been player of the season, imo.

2. LVG specifically stated that we were defending with possession as our defence wasn't strong enough - so we were conservative with the ball (numbing our attacking play) so as not to be caught out and expose the defence. A better defence would mean a better attack for us.

There were many games where we should have conceded a hatfull and got away with - not because our defense was particularly good, but because the opposition fecked up. Remember the liverpool game, sterling and balotelli could have had a hattrick each. Palace was similar, as was Southampton iirc.

Our defending was often last ditch panic station stuff, rather than a defence you had implicit trust in. We have partly (maybe) solved that with Darmian being an actual right back, but a CB we will still suffer from an inability to organize.

1. Don't fully agree with this "if our defence was good enough then our keeper would not have been player of the season". Firstly he did mention that despite the injuries and the amount of changes made to our defence we still did ok compared to others.

Yes DDG was a big part to play and our best player, but other clubs also have top quality keepers like Hart, Courtois and Cech all producing brilliant saves. I feel DDG has been brilliant when asked upon and deserves his two award but don't necessarily feel that him playing well somehow means the defenders we have are not good enough, as a lot of last year was chopping and changing.

2. He was saying the defence needed to be protected due to the injuries and the amount of players playing in their first season or out of position, again this was mentioned.

As for the opinion that other teams wasted chances, this applies to every team in the league and is not just something we exclusively experience.

Again it is all opinions though and neither of us is right or wrong so we will have to just agree to disagree :pac: I have made it very clear that I feel the current crop of defence is good enough and that the added additions will help even more. Provided we avoid injury disasters I think they will do the job.

Lack of goalscorers is the thing I am most worried about. Hopefully season goes well.

Adamocovic

bucketybuck wrote: »

If anybody is up in arms its because we shouldn't even be discussing Blind at CB at all. It was an area that everybody knew needed strengthening and we had all summer to do it, so it would be incredibly disappointing to ever reach the point of shoehorning Blind in there.

Blind to go on now and get named as our player of the season at CB :pac::pac::pac:

Adamocovic

bangkok wrote: »

this is smallings year providing he stays injury free. 2nd half of last season he was brilliant. I said he was good enough to play for Barcelona but was laughed at at first but soon enough people came around to the idea. I think he will be our main man at the back this season and I hope the potential finally shines bright this season

We all know who's year it is...Phil marches on to victory!! :pac:

MisterAnarchy

bangkok wrote: »

this is smallings year providing he stays injury free. 2nd half of last season he was brilliant. I said he was good enough to play for Barcelona but was laughed at at first but soon enough people came around to the idea.

Smalling good enough for Barcelona ,ah now,have you stopped taking your medication again ?

bangkok

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

Smalling good enough for Barcelona ,ah now,have you stopped taking your medication again ?

ahead of mascherano at centre back, without a shadow of a doubt

NoviGlitzko

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

Smalling good enough for Barcelona ,ah now,have you stopped taking your medication again ?

What's crazy about that? I'd currently take Smalling over any of Barcelona'a defenders. He's underrated by many here placing him in the same boat as Jones when they are streets apart ability-wise. Already one of the best defenders in the league IMO.

Lord TSC

bangkok wrote: »

I said he was good enough to play for Barcelona

No. Just....no.

TheDoc

As a contrasting opinion, while I'd like a new CB, I'd be happy going into the season, with Smalling, Jones and Rojo as CB options. Injuries aside I think it's just about enough to cope.

I'm putting some faith into how our new midfield is going to run, and the new front lineup. I think we will be much more on the front foot this year, dominate a lot more games, and Schweinsteger and Schneiderlan provide more protective options against teams running through us, which was actually the main problem last year for me, not our defence.

I felt the defence situation was blown out of proportion. We had an injury crisis, and we let teams run onto us and create chance after chance.

Didn't we finish the league with like a better defensive record than Chelsea? I know second half of season my frustrations were more about our strikers and lack of chances rather then defensive stuff, although had the odd panic now and then.

Maybe Van Gaal feels with some work, he has enough to do what he wants, and with a settled system and formation, with people knowing their roles, then hopefully things can be tighter.

I'd like a CB to come, but if not, I don't see it as an excuse for Van Gaal, or the team, for not meeting expectations, which is a title challenge.

Trond

There is no way Smalling is more comfortable on the ball than Evans. Not sure how someone with eyes could even form that opinion.

TheDoc

Like, Chelsea is always the comparison. Chelsea defend as an entire unit, as a team. It's what Mourinho does. he needs ever part of the link working hard, which creates their defensive shield and base. It's not just about Matic, it's not just about Terry etc. It's a combination of all. Gary Cahill is not a great defender, and when he plays for England, outside of that Chelsea system, his flaws start to show up for all to see. Even within the Chelsea system, he has floundered. But for the most part, if he performs his functions as part of that machine, then it all works.

Van gaal has mentioned a few times on this tour about the defensive system and movements, so it's obviously something he is working on. And to be honest it's irrelevant about a new CB, that defensive movement as a team needs to improve. A new CB plonking into the team isn't the solution.

The problem last year, bar when Evans played, wasn't our defenders getting roasted. It was them not sure of their positions, and other players positions in the system, and teams could just run at us and overwhelm us too easily. I expect that to be resolved, fully, for the new season.

bangkok

Lord TSC wrote: »

No. Just....no.

So you think Mascherano is a better defender than Smalling?

Nalz

Trond wrote: »

There is no way Smalling is more comfortable on the ball than Evans. Not sure how someone with eyes could even form that opinion.

Evans is more error prone and indecisive imo

bucketybuck

Jayop wrote: »

It would be an amazingly unlucky set of circumstances for us to have as bad a season again with injuies. I can't see it happening.

It wasn't just one season though, injuries have been a problem for the last 3/4 seasons. Whatever the root cause of the issue may be, we would be negligent in simply writing it off as unlucky and hoping it doesn't happen again.

Chris_Bradley

Trilla wrote: »

Evans is more error prone and indecisive imo

Yep, Evans on the ball looks as if he's just about to take a panic attack.

MisterAnarchy

bangkok wrote: »

ahead of mascherano at centre back, without a shadow of a doubt

Mascherano is a much better player than Smalling
What he lacks in height, he more than makes up for with heart, desire, mentality and application.

Smalling is very poor on the ball ,he is slow and ponderous in possession.
He wouldnt fit into a side like Barcelona at all ,they want ball playing centre backs .

What's crazy about that? I'd currently take Smalling over any of Barcelona'a defenders.

Really ,you'd place him ahead of Pique ,who was back to his best last season after being awol for a few years ?
He was probably the best defender in the world last season.

Barcelona's defence was extremely tight last season ,they only conceded 21 league goals or 38 in all competitions.
A defence that was much maligned for their inability to deal with set-pieces and high balls into the box before their treble-winning season in 2014/15 only conceded 2 goals from such situations last season.

Adamocovic

No doubt it has been mentioned here, but for people who missed it like me, Rojo couldn't fly because he forgot to renew his passport :pac::pac::pac:

fined two weeks wages, which while some amount of money to us he probably won't be too worried about it!

Alf Veedersane

The truth about the defence lies somewhere in the midddle of the Venn diagram of all of the opinions.

But as The Doc said, the defence needs to be a unit. Being a collection of good defenders won't always make for a better defence than a unit of defenders that may not be individually as good.

But any good unit has a leader and we're missing that.

The midfield has some steel in it which will protect the defence a lot better than it did last season but again, the defenders need to up their game as well.

What most excites me about the forwards is that they all look like they can ping it about quickly which will make a big difference for creating chances. Losing ADM's ability to create chances by beating people is going to be offset by the collective ability to move it about more quickly.

Trond

Trilla wrote: »

Evans is more error prone and indecisive imo

I think he's prone to more lapses in concentration but technically he's far better in possession than Smalling.

Hococop

So if it's between us getting a striker or defender which would we prefer?

Mongo

What does everyone reckon Herrera's role will be this year? For me he deserves to be starting but the way LVG has been lining out the team I'm not sure if there's space for him with the two Sch's playing and Depay ahead of them?

bangkok

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

Mascherano is a much better player than Smalling
What he lacks in height, he more than makes up for with heart, desire, mentality and application.

Smalling is very poor on the ball ,he is slow and ponderous in possession.
He wouldnt fit into a side like Barcelona at all ,they want ball playing centre backs .


Really ,you'd place him ahead of Pique ,who was back to his best last season after being awol for a few years ?
He was probably the best defender in the world last season.

Barcelona's defence was extremely tight last season ,they only conceded 21 league goals or 38 in all competitions.
A defence that was much maligned for their inability to deal with set-pieces and high balls into the box before their treble-winning season in 2014/15 only conceded 2 goals from such situations last season.

I didn't ask who was a better play, I asked who was the better defender. Can you imagine Mascherano playing centre back in the premier league?! How many crosses do barca have to defend against each game? Very little and they are rarely under any pressure at the back due to the quality of midfield and forwards.

Smalling not ball playing and Mascherano is?!

Barcelona signed Vermaelan last year for near 15m. He was meant to be the new central defender but got injured. Call a spade a spade he is very poor.

other defenders who played were Mathieu and Bartra!!! I would put Smalling above all those players

Mitch Connor

Hococop wrote: »

So if it's between us getting a striker or defender which would we prefer?

defender - as I don't think we have room for a first choice striker while maintaining a good balance (Would mean Rooney wide or in midfield... ugh).

Between a defender and a player like Ronaldo or Bale, i'm going Ronaldo or Bale.

Vic Vinegar

Hococop wrote: »

So if it's between us getting a striker or defender which would we prefer?

CB for me, then a pacy winger.

bucketybuck

Trond wrote: »

I think he's prone to more lapses in concentration but technically he's far better in possession than Smalling.

I think Evans is getting thrown under the bus to be honest. Sure, last season never even got started for him but he isn't as bad as last season, not even close.

Evans has done fine for us over the years, not on a Vidic or Ferdinand level but on many occasions he has been our best defender, and with a run he could be again. He seems to be classed as poison in here but why discard a proven quality defender for the likes of Blackett or McNair? Hopefully Van Gaal has other ideas and gives him another chance to prove the doubters wrong.

Mitch Connor

Mongo wrote: »

What does everyone reckon Herrera's role will be this year? For me he deserves to be starting but the way LVG has been lining out the team I'm not sure if there's space for him with the two Sch's playing and Depay ahead of them?

personally I would say it SHOULD be Herrera first name down for midfield, then two from Schneiderlin, Schweinsteiger and Carrick - with Depay playing wide instead of Young or Mata if he is going to play.

paulbok

Striker.
A Rooney injury will have us putting square pegs in round holes again. Fine for a game or two but not when you are chasing titles.
Been done in midfield for the last few years with CB's and Rooney playing there and should be avoided this time around when there is still time and the resources to get some one in.

Having said that, you could put the same argument to getting a new CB give our injury record at the back over the last few years.
No reason the club can't get both positions attended to but a striker (at a minimum capable of leading the line if Rooney isn't around, ideally to provide competition to him) would have to take priority if it came to it.

Irishcrx

Lads, amyone who thinks Smalling is good on the ball needs their head examined or isn't actually watching the games and spouting rubbish.

So bad is the lad on the ball that when we played with 5 at the back last season teams were more than happy to let him carry the ball all the way into the centre of the park without pressing him in the knowedge that he would either give them back possesion or **** up a simple ball, he is a terrible...terrible player with the ball at his feet and why LVG thought he wasn't is beyond me. Evans is as well, what Smalling is though is a good to possibly becoming very good Centre half, can head the ball well , has pace and his tackling is getting better.

Rojo is the best ball playing CB , and if we need one Blind would be fine at that as well.

Smalling for Barca?....beem me up Scotty

Jayop

bucketybuck wrote: »

It wasn't just one season though, injuries have been a problem for the last 3/4 seasons. Whatever the root cause of the issue may be, we would be negligent in simply writing it off as unlucky and hoping it doesn't happen again.

2 seasons back we had a different line up in defence completely so anything pre-VanGaal is pretty irrelevant. Smalling and Jones were back up players t Vidic and Ferdinand with Evans being 3rd choice. Evra was LB and Rafael was RB. This season we've got Darmian/Valencia at RB, Shaw/Blind at LB, Smalling, Jones, Rojo, Evans (doubtful) and the two young lads at CB cover.

Jones played 39 games in 2013/14
Smalling played 38 games in 2013/14

Both played more than the first choices of Vidic and Ferdinand by a distance. They can be relied upon. Both, especially Jones, seem to be finding the limits of their bodies and get injured going too far. I feel that as both get more mature they will get injured less. Both are entering their peak years.

Shaw again should be more reliable this year and Darmian is never injured, never even missed a day of training according to the Torino manager.

NoviGlitzko

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

Mascherano is a much better player than Smalling
What he lacks in height, he more than makes up for with heart, desire, mentality and application.

Smalling is very poor on the ball ,he is slow and ponderous in possession.
He wouldnt fit into a side like Barcelona at all ,they want ball playing centre backs .

We'll agree to disagree. Heart? What is that exactly? And desire? I don't think so. The only thing that stands out from someone like Mascherano is he is more of a leader.

What about Smalling strengths? He will get plenty more goals & headers in the box than Mascherano will, as well as not being prone to silly yellow/red cards. And it's simply untrue that Smalling is bad with his feet. Phil Jones is a disaster with the ball but Smalling is as good as any of the rest of the previous defenders we've had. "lanky guy must be ****e with his feet" FIFA mentality. He's actually decent.

Really ,you'd place him ahead of Pique ,who was back to his best last season after being awol for a few years ?

It'd be tough of course because I like Pique, but yeah I would. You have to remember that this isn't the same league and it's a chance your taking when they come over. Mascherano looks great atm but was only above average in the PL. I'd take Smalling at this time over Ramos as well because I know what his potential is at United.

If he stays injury free he'll have a great season.

Cantona's Collars

https://twitter.com/TrustyTransfers/status/626016331666690048

Hmmm.....Our surprise signing perhaps?

NoviGlitzko

zerks wrote: »

https://twitter.com/TrustyTransfers/status/626016331666690048

Hmmm.....Our surprise signing perhaps?

One can dream! Anything but Lukaku!

bangkok

Irishcrx wrote: »

Lads, amyone who thinks Smalling is good on the ball needs their head examined or isn't actually watching the games and spouting rubbish.

So bad is the lad on the ball that when we played with 5 at the back last season teams were more than happy to let him carry the ball all the way into the centre of the park without pressing him in the knowedge that he would either give them back possesion or **** up a simple ball, he is a terrible...terrible player with the ball at his feet and why LVG thought he wasn't is beyond me. Evans is as well, what Smalling is though is a good to possibly becoming very good Centre half, can head the ball well , has pace and his tackling is getting better.

Rojo is the best ball playing CB , and if we need one Blind would be fine at that as well.

Smalling for Barca?....beem me up Scotty

Jérémy Mathieu for Barca? Oh wait he already plays with them

also Wenger was chasing Smalling and still is for years. Ferguson rated him very highly. van Gaal rates him highly. I think he is a fantastic defender. If you think "he is a terrible...terrible player with the ball at his feet" maybe you need to ask yourself... should I go to specsavers!!

TheDoc

Mongo wrote: »

What does everyone reckon Herrera's role will be this year? For me he deserves to be starting but the way LVG has been lining out the team I'm not sure if there's space for him with the two Sch's playing and Depay ahead of them?

I think people taking Van Gaal a bit too literally when he said how he lined up for Barca will be more or less the starting lineup for Spurs.

I'd say that the RCM spot is Hererra to lose, and see nothing to indicate he will miss out. Unless there is some massive tactical shift.

Spurs away is tricky. they will be full of energy and pressing and someone with Herreras tenacity will be important in there. I'd say Schweinsteiger is most likely to start on the bench for Spurs away, with Schneiderlan, Carrick and Herrera lining up in midfield, with Mata, Depay and Rooney as the front three.

Blind could well start LB for the trust factor. Shaw has been impressive pre-season, but for what will be seen as a must win, might see Blind in there ahead of him. Darmian I think is doing enough pre-season to warrant a slow striaght in at right back.

I'd say he will go with Smalling and Jones at CB, with Rojo to miss out.

another possability is him actually going with Blind alongside Smalling at CB, and starting Shaw.

I don't think blind is playing there for the laughi in pre-season, there is obviously method to the madness of him starting a load of games at CB. And you know I'd just about trust Blind to do it, like the way he reads the game.

Mitch Connor

Jayop wrote: »

2 seasons back we had a different line up in defence completely so anything pre-VanGaal is pretty irrelevant. Smalling and Jones were back up players t Vidic and Ferdinand with Evans being 3rd choice. Evra was LB and Rafael was RB. This season we've got Darmian/Valencia at RB, Shaw/Blind at LB, Smalling, Jones, Rojo, Evans (doubtful) and the two young lads at CB cover.

Jones played 39 games in 2013/14
Smalling played 38 games in 2013/14

Both played more than the first choices of Vidic and Ferdinand by a distance. They can be relied upon. Both, especially Jones, seem to be finding the limits of their bodies and get injured going too far. I feel that as both get more mature they will get injured less. Both are entering their peak years.

Shaw again should be more reliable this year and Darmian is never injured, never even missed a day of training according to the Torino manager.

We are talking about the CBs, and whether they were first choice or not pre-LVG, they have a consistent history of picking up injuries regularly.

MisterAnarchy

bangkok wrote: »

I didn't ask who was a better play, I asked who was the better defender. Can you imagine Mascherano playing centre back in the premier league?! How many crosses do barca have to defend against each game? Very little and they are rarely under any pressure at the back due to the quality of midfield and forwards.

Smalling not ball playing and Mascherano is?!

Barcelona signed Vermaelan last year for near 15m. He was meant to be the new central defender but got injured. Call a spade a spade he is very poor.

other defenders who played were Mathieu and Bartra!!! I would put Smalling above all those players

You said Smalling was good enough to play in the Barcelona team ,did you not ?
Barcelona do not play in the Premier League ,they play in La Liga so the point about crosses in the Premier league is irrelevant.

Its a different style of football in Spain I agree but Barcelona conceded hardly any set piece goals last season .

Mathieu is also a far more solid defender than Smalling .

Lads, amyone who thinks Smalling is good on the ball needs their head examined or isn't actually watching the games and spouting rubbish.

So bad is the lad on the ball that when we played with 5 at the back last season teams were more than happy to let him carry the ball all the way into the centre of the park without pressing him in the knowedge that he would either give them back possesion or **** up a simple ball, he is a terrible...terrible player with the ball at his feet and why LVG thought he wasn't is beyond me.

Agreed.
Smalling is very poor on the ball from both a technical and tactical aspect.

Jayop

TheDoc wrote: »

I think people taking Van Gaal a bit too literally when he said how he lined up for Barca will be more or less the starting lineup for Spurs.

I'd say that the RCM spot is Hererra to lose, and see nothing to indicate he will miss out. Unless there is some massive tactical shift.

Spurs away is tricky. they will be full of energy and pressing and someone with Herreras tenacity will be important in there. I'd say Schweinsteiger is most likely to start on the bench for Spurs away, with Schneiderlan, Carrick and Herrera lining up in midfield, with Mata, Depay and Rooney as the front three.

Blind could well start LB for the trust factor. Shaw has been impressive pre-season, but for what will be seen as a must win, might see Blind in there ahead of him. Darmian I think is doing enough pre-season to warrant a slow striaght in at right back.

I'd say he will go with Smalling and Jones at CB, with Rojo to miss out.

another possability is him actually going with Blind alongside Smalling at CB, and starting Shaw.

I don't think blind is playing there for the laughi in pre-season, there is obviously method to the madness of him starting a load of games at CB. And you know I'd just about trust Blind to do it, like the way he reads the game.

I agree with you about taking the starting 11 Vs Barca too literally. For example Blind starting with Smalling playing second half was probably just so there was at least one recognised CB at all times Vs Barca. Same with Herrera in the middle.

If we keep the same squad as we have now and everyone is available I think we'll go for...

DDG
Darmian - Jones - Smalling - Shaw
Carrick - Morgan
Herrera
Mata

---

Depay
Rooney

Irishcrx

bangkok wrote: »

Jérémy Mathieu for Barca? Oh wait he already plays with them

also Wenger was chasing Smalling and still is for years. Ferguson rated him very highly. van Gaal rates him highly. I think he is a fantastic defender. If you think "he is a terrible...terrible player with the ball at his feet" maybe you need to ask yourself... should I go to specsavers!!

Yes he replaced Carlos Puyol as an out and out centre back , what does that have to do with Smalling been a poor ball playing defender?

And if you read my post correctly you'll see that I said he is a good to possibly becoming very good defender, just not being asked to carry the ball or create play....specsavers.

Jayop

Mitch Connor wrote: »

We are talking about the CBs, and whether they were first choice or not pre-LVG, they have a consistent history of picking up injuries regularly.

But playing ~40 games 2 seasons back would contradict that.

They were injury prone last season and we had suspensions to deal with too, but that doesn't mean these players can't be relied upon.