Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2015 - Mod Post in OP 23/07

Polo_Mint

Hernandez is still a great striker.

I woud like to see them on pre season and back in a United Shirt.

Cookiemunster

Someones not happy with the boss.

https://twitter.com/1victorvaldes/status/621597700199464961

If he wasn't on his way out before he definitely is now.

Hococop

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Someones not happy with the boss.

https://twitter.com/1victorvaldes/status/621597700199464961

If he wasn't on his way out before he definitely is now.

I'm guessing he played a few but then refused to play one and that's when things got sour

bangkok

Ed The Equalizer wrote: »

I'd prefer 2 top class CBs than 1 CB and 1 striker. Think we'd get by with Rooney, Depay, Hernandez, Fellaini and Wilson up front but not so sure about a couple of defensive injuries and Jones is starting. Particularly if De Gea goes - he papered over lots of cracks.

no way, goals win games, goals win titles. you look at all the top teams they have more than 1 player who can score more than 20 goals a season and that's why they win games. We only really have rooney. We will def be buying another striker.

Compare us to Barca or Madrid, the level we are aiming for.

Suarez 25 goals
neymar 39 goals
messi 58 goals

Ronaldo 61 goals
Benzema 22 goals
Bale 17 goals

we don't even come anywhere near that.

even Bayern Munich

Muller 21 goals
robben 19 goals
gotze 15 goals
lewandowski 28 goals

we are so lacking goals in our team its not even funny. I think at the end of last season we didn't even score a single goal in over 360 mins of football.

100% no doubt about it we will be adding a striker to our squad

aperture_nuig

Hococop wrote: »

I'm guessing he played a few but then refused to play one and that's when things got sour

I'd imagine so, looking at that picture he was happy enough to play Chelsea or Spurs, but would he play the Stoke U21s on a wet wednesday?

Your Airbag

jayo26

bangkok wrote: »

no way, goals win games, goals win titles. you look at all the top teams they have more than 1 player who can score more than 20 goals a season and that's why they win games. We only really have rooney. We will def be buying another striker.

Compare us to Barca or Madrid, the level we are aiming for.

Suarez 25 goals
neymar 39 goals
messi 58 goals

Ronaldo 61 goals
Benzema 22 goals
Bale 17 goals

we don't even come anywhere near that.

even Bayern Munich

Muller 21 goals
robben 19 goals
gotze 15 goals
lewandowski 28 goals

we are so lacking goals in our team its not even funny. I think at the end of last season we didn't even score a single goal in over 360 mins of football.

100% no doubt about it we will be adding a striker to our squad

Goals should come with the changes in midfield, we went on that scoring driught at the end of last season after carrick got injured against city without a base to midfield we found it hard to create anything going forward so hopefully woth midfield somewhat fixed we should get more goals from our forwards.

The Moldy Gowl

aperture_nuig wrote: »

I'd imagine so, looking at that picture he was happy enough to play Chelsea or Spurs, but would he play the Stoke U21s on a wet wednesday?

How can you ascertain his mood, or if he was happy to play that match, from a snapshot of a moment where he is posing and just acting happy for the sake of it?
We all do it.

He probably bitched to lvg about it, but still went on with it.

bangkok

jayo26 wrote: »

Goals should come with the changes in midfield, we went on that scoring driught at the end of last season after carrick got injured against city without a base to midfield we found it hard to create anything going forward so hopefully woth midfield somewhat fixed we should get more goals from our forwards.

but we never created much anyway even with Carrick in the team. that will change this year and with the addition of a Benteke/cavani etc we will be a big force this season

bangkok

remember scholes refused to play with the reserves down at arsenal, fergie went mad and he was fined 2 weeks wages

jayo26

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

How can you ascertain his mood, or if he was happy to play that match, from a snapshot of a moment where he is posing and just acting happy for the sake of it?
We all do it.

He probably bitched to lvg about it, but still went on with it.

I agree with you, when he was left out of tour Monday the first thing he did tuesdsy was post an updste saying he was trsining hard csnt wait for new season and similar response today. Lvg didnt takea disliking to him for no reason.

Coat22

"At the time we had to decide which strikers we could have" he said.

"We had: Welbeck, Chicharito, Van Persie and Wilson.

"Then I had to make a decision to let Welbeck and Chicharito go. We had also bought Falcao.

"So when you play a system with one or two strikers you can have too many strikers.

"You have to make decisions.

"One of those decisions was to let go Chicharito. But now he's coming back on 25 July."

Sounds to me like LVG is planning on keeping Hernandez for the season - and why not? Excellent option. Proven in the PL and CL.

3 seems to be the number of strikers he wants so Chico, Wilson and AN Other?

Benteke would be an interesting signing, would rather Cavani though.

RobertKK

Lou Macari is such a bad analyst, would be an awful manager.

TheDoc

RobertKK wrote: »

Lou Macari is such a bad analyst, would be an awful manager.

Runs a savage chipper in fairness

jayo26

RobertKK wrote: »

Lou Macari is such a bad analyst, would be an awful manager.

He was an awful manager iirc, all the pundits on mutv are awefull apart from msybe david may but the rest look at games with goggle eyes.

The Moldy Gowl

jayo26 wrote: »

I agree with you, when he was left out of tour Monday the first thing he did tuesdsy was post an updste saying he was trsining hard csnt wait for new season and similar response today. Lvg didnt takea disliking to him for no reason.

Yeah. He looks to be playing the victim of this now after being billy big balls, trying to get the fans on his side.

He could also realise his mistake and wants to atone for it but lvg is not buying it.
Lot of armchair pyscology really.

RobertKK

RobertKK wrote: »

Lou Macari is such a bad analyst, would be an awful manager.

He was!

Mitch Connor

jayo26 wrote: »

He was an awful manager iirc, all the pundits on mutv are awefull apart from msybe david may but the rest look at games with goggle eyes.

I'm told what Paddy Crerand says in private about United players and performances is not the same as what he says on MUTV - so I would assume all the presenters are pulling a public line as dictated by their pay-masters.

Sure Roy Keane got bombed out of the club partly for having a go at the players on MUTV.

magnumbud

bangkok wrote: »

remember scholes refused to play with the reserves down at arsenal, fergie went mad and he was fined 2 weeks wages

wasnt that a league cup game not the reserves

Adamocovic

Looked back over some old threads and boy opinions of Smalling have changed in the last year or so :pac:

From a brief glance in my spare time I saw people saying that he doesn't give them confidence when they see him on the team sheet, that he's awful on the ball and makes too many mistakes, that he should only be a squad player when needed. Now he's on nearly everyones predicted or desired starting 11, most peoples opinion on poor Johnny Evans has gone the opposite direction in the last year :P

I really hope Jones proves his critics wrong this year. Honestly, I do like Smalling, don't quite understand how the general consensus on him change so much and Jones hasn't, although Jones only played 22 league games I still feel in those games he performed better than Smalling.

People give out about Jones and say he isn't good enough. I think he's the type of player we need. Not a pretty footballer but gets stuck in and gives it his all, like an old style defender, no fear. I think a lot of people exagerrate his flaws without checking stats, remember someone recently claiming he scores loads of own goals when in all competitios he has something like 2!

Everyone says we need someone like a Vidic, a player I loved a lot. I know stats don't tell it all and depends on team they are with and against but lets look at Vidic, Jones and Smallings stats for their first four seasons at United:

Name Games/Starts Yellows Reds OG Fouls/game Tackles/game Clearance/game
Jones 94/86 18 0 1 0,975 2,15 5,3
Vidic 84/83 15 2 1 1,150 1,70 10,5
Smalling 75/56 4 0 0 0,800 1,25 6,0


(first time I've made a table for boards in ages :P)

Looking at stats, yes he does get a lot of yellows, but makes loads of tackles which can be contributed to that. I loved Vidic and think Jones is a similar style of get stuck in sort of player. Jones isn't at the level Vidic was at, but I feel he has potential to get there. Considering how injury prone everyone says he is it's surprising that in his first four seasons he's played quite a bit more than Vidic and Smalling did in theirs.

I think loads of people then say he's a liability or headless because he gets yellows and gives away frees. A player like him who gets stuck in (his tackles per game is quite impressive) of course he'll concede frees. Vidic commited a bomb of frees also.

Jones in my eyes has the potential and if he gets a full season will surprise a lot of doubters. He's one of the few players I've seen on our team who battle all the way to the end and you can tell it means a lot to them.

Now I hope this long post was worth it and he goes on to have an awesome season. (Now I've jinxed him and wait for him to be injured first game of the preseason :pac:)

homerjay2005

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Someones not happy with the boss.

https://twitter.com/1victorvaldes/status/621597700199464961

If he wasn't on his way out before he definitely is now.

.
in fairness, LVG didn't need to be so public about what happened.

Certain things should remain behind closed doors.

Quandary

MUTV pundits and presenters are all part of the Utd propaganda machine. No surprise they put a very positive spin on everything.

David May is an odd one though. He seems to not really give a fcuk

bangkok

magnumbud wrote: »

wasnt that a league cup game not the reserves

yea think it was, was a 2nd string team that travelled down for it though and scholes didn't want to play with them

bangkok

david may......ha

TheDoc

Quandary wrote: »

MUTV pundits and presenters are all part of the Utd propaganda machine. No surprise they put a very positive spin on everything.

David May is an odd one though. He seems to not really give a fcuk

In fairness I'd never watch MUTV expecting unbiased accurate analysis. I've very little interest in the channel outside of pre-season matches.

Been a few years since I had an active subscription, but it was biased nonsense, along with an outragous amount of repeated content.

Agree with Mars from earlier, that its actually a frustrating move to now have the press conferences as a MUTV exclusive.

Julez

Coat22 wrote: »

"At the time we had to decide which strikers we could have" he said.

"We had: Welbeck, Chicharito, Van Persie and Wilson.

"Then I had to make a decision to let Welbeck and Chicharito go. We had also bought Falcao.

"So when you play a system with one or two strikers you can have too many strikers.

"You have to make decisions.

"One of those decisions was to let go Chicharito. But now he's coming back on 25 July."

Sounds to me like LVG is planning on keeping Hernandez for the season - and why not? Excellent option. Proven in the PL and CL.

3 seems to be the number of strikers he wants so Chico, Wilson and AN Other?

Benteke would be an interesting signing, would rather Cavani though.

Um, Rooney?

The Moldy Gowl

homerjay2005 wrote: »

.
in fairness, LVG didn't need to be so public about what happened.

Certain things should remain behind closed doors.

He asked why he wasn't going on the your, lvg answered.

What's the 'correct' answer? He has personal problems?
He is being sold?

Why is he being sold?
He couldn't obey me.
Lvg is pretty honest, valdes would have known he was gone ages ago.

Adamocovic

Is the kickoff for the first game against 4:00 gmt?

bangkok

if we are going with 3 strikers for the season, Rooney, Hernandez and Wilson are not up to the job.

Rooney might hit 25 goals, Hernandez maybe 10 and Wilson is just not up to the first team at this stage, a loan spell wouldn't be bad for him.

Im really warming to the idea of Benteke, think he would be a class signing, fast, strong, good in the air, not even at full potential yet, re-sale value, average wages, wants to improve, knows the league, would be an excellent signing

Polo_Mint

Adamocovic wrote: »

Is the kickoff for the first game against 4:00 gmt?

4am

Adamocovic

Polo_Mint wrote: »

4am

5am for me so! Might aswell get up early for it and watch it with the fry :P

Coat22

Adamocovic wrote: »

Looked back over some old threads and boy opinions of Smalling have changed in the last year or so :pac:

From a brief glance in my spare time I saw people saying that he doesn't give them confidence when they see him on the team sheet, that he's awful on the ball and makes too many mistakes, that he should only be a squad player when needed. Now he's on nearly everyones predicted or desired starting 11, most peoples opinion on poor Johnny Evans has gone the opposite direction in the last year :P

I really hope Jones proves his critics wrong this year. Honestly, I do like Smalling, don't quite understand how the general consensus on him change so much and Jones hasn't, although Jones only played 22 league games I still feel in those games he performed better than Smalling.

People give out about Jones and say he isn't good enough. I think he's the type of player we need. Not a pretty footballer but gets stuck in and gives it his all, like an old style defender, no fear. I think a lot of people exagerrate his flaws without checking stats, remember someone recently claiming he scores loads of own goals when in all competitios he has something like 2!

Everyone says we need someone like a Vidic, a player I loved a lot. I know stats don't tell it all and depends on team they are with and against but lets look at Vidic, Jones and Smallings stats for their first four seasons at United:

Name Games/Starts Yellows Reds OG Fouls/game Tackles/game Clearance/game
Jones 94/86 18 0 1 0,975 2,15 5,3
Vidic 84/83 15 2 1 1,150 1,70 10,5
Smalling 75/56 4 0 0 0,800 1,25 6,0

(first time I've made a table for boards in ages :P)

Looking at stats, yes he does get a lot of yellows, but makes loads of tackles which can be contributed to that. I loved Vidic and think Jones is a similar style of get stuck in sort of player. Jones isn't at the level Vidic was at, but I feel he has potential to get there. Considering how injury prone everyone says he is it's surprising that in his first four seasons he's played quite a bit more than Vidic and Smalling did in theirs.

I think loads of people then say he's a liability or headless because he gets yellows and gives away frees. A player like him who gets stuck in (his tackles per game is quite impressive) of course he'll concede frees. Vidic commited a bomb of frees also.

Jones in my eyes has the potential and if he gets a full season will surprise a lot of doubters. He's one of the few players I've seen on our team who battle all the way to the end and you can tell it means a lot to them.

Now I hope this long post was worth it and he goes on to have an awesome season. (Now I've jinxed him and wait for him to be injured first game of the preseason :pac:)

Good post but you've ignored the stats in the far right column - clearances where Vidic was a mile ahead. Clearances, rather than tackles is what its about - getting the ball out of the danger area (esp at set pieces)

My opinion remains the same on all 3 (Smalling / Jones / Evans). All squad players at best.

Smalling lived up to his expectations in the first half of last year but redeemed himself post Christmas which is why everyone now has him a starter. Lot still to prove in my opinion and I reckon VG is still sceptical.

Jones did the opposite, started great, got injured (whats new) and then ended the season looking like Phil Neville did when playing left back - awkward and a liability in defence.

Evans went from bad to pure disastrous. Looks as confident as a 12 year old lad at a school disco. Needs to get out for his own sake.

Really hope we sign a real top class CB. Assuming we do then Jones and Smalling are playing for their united careers this season.

Lord TSC

bangkok wrote: »

Suarez 25 goals
neymar 39 goals
messi 58 goals

Ronaldo 61 goals
Benzema 22 goals
Bale 17 goals

Muller 21 goals
robben 19 goals
gotze 15 goals
lewandowski 28 goals

The thing that strikes me there is the number of non-traditional "strikers" you listed; (going on limited knowledge), Neymar, Ronaldo, Bale, Muller and Robben would surely not be classified as "strikers" but more as wide players?

If anything, (and especially if Di Maria goes), I think the argument here is that we need more goals from outwide players. We've obviously got a huge interest in Bale, possibly Muller, and I think we will see a signing that can play on the right wing, cut inside and score goals.

Point is, we don't necessarily need a top, top level striker if Rooney is going to be hogging that spot over the season. We need a top, top level goal scorer, but that can be a wide player just as easily as it is a striker. I think Depay does that for one side, but we now need another goal scorer to flank Rooney. We need bigger threats than the likes of Young and Valencia.

Coat22

Julez wrote: »

Um, Rooney?

Um not a striker

The Moldy Gowl

Coat22 wrote: »

Um not a striker

Rooney is a striker? Where do you get that notion?

Julez

Coat22 wrote: »

Um not a striker

u wot m8?

magnumbud

Adamocovic wrote: »

Is the kickoff for the first game against 4:00 gmt?

4 am saturday morning here

Coat22

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

Rooney is a striker? Where do you get that notion?

He's a centre forward, not a striker, not in the "goal poacher" mode of an RVP, RVN, Owen, Henry or even Chico type of player.

Will never get you more than 15+ a season but will make it happen for the team. Holds the ball, dictates the play but is not a 6 yard box type.

Rooney will of course start but with someone in front of him to poach the 25+ goals needed to win things

magnumbud

Coat22 wrote: »

He's a centre forward, not a striker, not in the "goal poacher" mode of an RVP, RVN, Owen, Henry or even Chico type of player.

Will never get you more than 15+ a season but will make it happen for the team. Holds the ball, dictates the play but is not a 6 yard box type.

Rooney will of course start but with someone in front of him to poach the 25+ goals needed to win things

if we stick with the 433 rooney will be the point at the front. if hes not he shouldnt be on the pitch cause hes not effective in midfield or the wing. grand if we are playing with 2 holding midfielders and him sitting between the striker and midfield but i see the formation being what we played the last 10 or so games.

if he doesnt have to drop deep and the midfield support he'll likely get 20 plus.

Lovely Bloke

Get yer Coat, Coat22

bangkok

Coat22 wrote: »

He's a centre forward, not a striker, not in the "goal poacher" mode of an RVP, RVN, Owen, Henry or even Chico type of player.

Will never get you more than 15+ a season but will make it happen for the team. Holds the ball, dictates the play but is not a 6 yard box type.

Rooney will of course start but with someone in front of him to poach the 25+ goals needed to win things

Henry a goal poacher?! :eek:

The Moldy Gowl

Coat22 wrote: »

He's a centre forward, not a striker, not in the "goal poacher" mode of an RVP, RVN, Owen, Henry or even Chico type of player.

Will never get you more than 15+ a season but will make it happen for the team. Holds the ball, dictates the play but is not a 6 yard box type.

Rooney will of course start but with someone in front of him to poach the 25+ goals needed to win things

Cluless and ignorance.

What you're implying is that he has never scored more than 15. He has, a lot.

bangkok

Lord TSC wrote: »

The thing that strikes me there is the number of non-traditional "strikers" you listed; (going on limited knowledge), Neymar, Ronaldo, Bale, Muller and Robben would surely not be classified as "strikers" but more as wide players?

If anything, (and especially if Di Maria goes), I think the argument here is that we need more goals from outwide players. We've obviously got a huge interest in Bale, possibly Muller, and I think we will see a signing that can play on the right wing, cut inside and score goals.

Point is, we don't necessarily need a top, top level striker if Rooney is going to be hogging that spot over the season. We need a top, top level goal scorer, but that can be a wide player just as easily as it is a striker. I think Depay does that for one side, but we now need another goal scorer to flank Rooney. We need bigger threats than the likes of Young and Valencia.

put it this way, if rooney got injured for a few months we would be screwed. A new striker will def be coming into the team and by the looks of things it will be Benteke

Cantona's Collars

Former Villa manager Lambert pushing the point on Talksport that Benteke would handle a move to United.

Pro. F

Coat22 wrote: »

He's a centre forward, not a striker, not in the "goal poacher" mode of an RVP, RVN, Owen, Henry or even Chico type of player.

Will never get you more than 15+ a season but will make it happen for the team. Holds the ball, dictates the play but is not a 6 yard box type.

Rooney will of course start but with someone in front of him to poach the 25+ goals needed to win things

Rooney is an excellent goal poacher. His off the ball movement is one of the strongest aspects of his game, it's well up there in that list of yours. He has just played other positions as well over his career.

bangkok

Wayne Rooney.... Street "centre forward"

Adamocovic

Coat22 wrote: »

Good post but you've ignored the stats in the far right column - clearances where Vidic was a mile ahead. Clearances, rather than tackles is what its about - getting the ball out of the danger area (esp at set pieces)

My opinion remains the same on all 3 (Smalling / Jones / Evans). All squad players at best.

Smalling lived up to his expectations in the first half of last year but redeemed himself post Christmas which is why everyone now has him a starter. Lot still to prove in my opinion and I reckon VG is still sceptical.

Jones did the opposite, started great, got injured (whats new) and then ended the season looking like Phil Neville did when playing left back - awkward and a liability in defence.

Evans went from bad to pure disastrous. Looks as confident as a 12 year old lad at a school disco. Needs to get out for his own sake.

Really hope we sign a real top class CB. Assuming we do then Jones and Smalling are playing for their united careers this season.

On the whole clearance thing, you must remember firstly, Vidic is 6 foot 2 I think and Smalling is slightly taller yet. Jones on the other hand is 5 foot 10 (or thereabouts) and spent a lot of his time playing alternating between right back, midfield and centre back which affect the amount of clearances he would have to make.

Last season he only played centre back and averaged 7.5 clearances a game, Smalling 6.2. In Jones first two seasons he only averaged 4.4 and 3.5 clearances a game because of the fact he was moved around quite a bit, more clearances will come from the centre back role.

I agree Jones best football last season was before his injury. Personally I hope he starts as CB and becomes a regular. Only 23 buckets of experience and I can only see him improving. People say his development hasn't but looking at the stats since he's arrived he's been improving most seasons. If he gets a full season injury free I can see him going on to be a very important part of our team.

Mind you I will admit my opinion is a bit biased as I do like the player a lot.

The Moldy Gowl

bangkok wrote: »

Wayne Rooney.... Street "centre forward"

I thanked it. But I feel shame for supporting your hypothesis.

Coat22

magnumbud wrote: »

if we stick with the 433 rooney will be the point at the front. if hes not he shouldnt be on the pitch cause hes not effective in midfield or the wing

Yes but will we? I can't see a 4-3-3 with Rooney as the focal point scoring enough goals. To be quite honest I haven't a rashers (as indeed nobody on here has) how LVG sees United playing with the players now at his disposal but very much doubt he sees Rooney as his goal getting forward

ianob7

Rooney has scored 15+ on multiple occasions ! Ridiculous comment