Deutschland 83/86/89 [SundanceTV] [**Spoilers**]

iguana

I've not watched the finale yet but have managed to answer my own question from last week. The creators hope for Deutschland 83 to be the first part of a trilogy. It will depend on the ratings when it airs on RTL in Germany, but if it is successful there, they hope to make Deutschland '86 next year and Deutschland 89 the year after that.

iguana

Just watched the finale now and my immediate reaction is that the story was too complex to tell in just 8 episodes. It's a complaint I rarely have about a tv show, as I prefer a well told short series to a longer series stuffed with filler but for the story told here, 8 episodes just couldn't cover it. My main complaint throughout the series has been that I don't understand the motivation of some characters, mainly Martin. But the characters I haven't always understood have been those people that have changed significantly. Martin goes through an absolute rollercoaster of experiences and they changed him but we didn't get to see enough of what he is going through. The other complaints I had were the rapidity of things like the sequence of events of the Ku'damm bombing and the handwaving of Jackson ignoring the fact that an allied soldier tried to commit treason leaving two people and another soldier dead. And again, I think that if the series had been longer storylines like those could have been plotted better.

All in all it was a very, very good series and I'll be keeping my eye on how it is received in Germany in the hopes that Deutschland 86 is commissioned. (I'm so intrigued by Tobias waiting for Thomas at the end.) But with 13 episodes instead of 8 I think this would have been a far superior series with better drawn characters.

thegreengoblin

Like most finales, that was probably the weakest episode of the series. Enjoyable but it lacked the tension of previous episodes. It felt like the producers knew they were running out of time so there was a bit of a rush to get to the end. For example, it was some jump from Martin being held by the East Germans in the meeting room to watching him visit home of his own free will. Surely they would have had to debrief him for days.

The question of who killed himself at the Edels house is left hanging. One would think it was Alex, given his state of mind. For the general to do it would be a hell of a stretch considering he just didn't seem the suicidal type. Maybe it could have been Alex who turned the gun on his dad. But the way it was filmed with Alex just walking in the door followed by a bang suggests it may have been his dad.

I thought Lenora's significance just fizzled out as the series went on which is a shame as her character was very interesting. Regarding Martin's parentage, although heavily hinted at previously, apparently they used the wrong subtitles. When Walter and Ingrid are having their chat, he says 'Leave Martin out of this' when he actually says 'Leave our boy out of this' which obviously gives it more emotional weight.

I agree with Iguana that there was just too much to get through in just eight episodes. But it was hugely enjoyable and, as someone with a big interest in the Cold War, it was history heaven for me. It's mad to think this hasn't even been aired in Germany yet. I'm sure it will be a huge ratings success there and we'll get further seasons out of it.

silverharp

a question about episode 4 , has the general's son left the army? for the last episode or 2 he is never in uniform?

snubbleste

I thought Tobias was returning to East Berlin, giving the way he hugged people etc. ok obviously there was going to be a nuclear holocaust in the meantime but next we see him receiving an east german 'criminal' into the GDR.

My favourite character is Lenora - she could carry a tv series all on her own imo.
Overall, it is an incredibly authentic series.

Fred Swanson

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The Black Oil

Pretty much agree with iguana on 8 episodes and the impact on the the storytelling. 10 or 13 would have given them more breathing room. Guess if we get Deutschland 86 the characters won't have aged much, but they will have in 89. Maybe Edel will have retired by then and there'd probably be some upheavals in the East German's intelligence HQ, too.

Fred Swanson

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don ramo

definitely wolfgang that killed himself, his father was a nazi and you could see the shame he carried about that, then he finds out his son became an eastern spy (he definitely recognised him in that picture), he finds out stamm is an actual east german spy, and his best friend is his son, and he also saw him kissing his daughter who has gone to east berlin and not yet contacted him, so for all he know shes gone off with stamm, that and when alex walked in his father suitcase was still at the hall table, i knew the second i saw that,

unquestionably a brilliant series, and yeah id say a few more episode would have pushed up a few more notches, definitely a few storys lacked a little cohesion, but things like that never bother me, once the overall story is easily understood which it was,

the ending is very strange, it kinda leaves it open ended, like stamm is just gonna go back to work in the east german army, it would make you wonder what kind of part he would play in another series, his aunt seems to have pulled a legger, and schweppenstette has a lot to answer for now, that 2 keys people who id be very surprised to see in a second season,

id be highly surprised if this doesnt get a second season, i dont understand why the german ratings matter so much, youd think the sundance ratings would matter most, not like american shows rely on irish and english ratings for renewals,

The Black Oil

Schweppenstette is in a handful of episodes of Sense8.

brian_t

This series has just shown up in the RTE2 listings in DigiGuide.

It's starting on Sunday 29th November at 10.30pm

DMcL1971

That's great news. I have a couple of friends who want to watch this but don't know how to get the show. So RTE will be perfect for them.

Reminder that this starts tonight on RTE2!

fryup

10.30 on a sunday night is a ridiculous time to show it :mad:

well done rte:rolleyes:

brian_t

I've no problem with that time.
It's a big improvement on when they show Elementary, Hawaii 50 and Mad Men - after midnight.
And some Australian dramas - even later.

Channel 4 will premiere it on Jan 3rd. They might have it on earlier.

Keplar240B

Really great fictional betrayal of early '80s Germany, Cold war tensions, and the
Able Archer 83 exercise near miss.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Able_Archer_83

I would have down a different counter-factual ending

Would have worked the 1983 Soviet nuclear false alarm incident into the movie as well it happened like a month before Able Archer 83 exercise started
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1983_Soviet_nuclear_false_alarm_incident
Except set it during Able Archer 83 and have the nukes fly for real.

The Black Oil

I presume RTE will break from this somewhere during Christmas.

First episode is on the player anyway. http://www.rte.ie/player/ie/show/deutschland-83-30003692/10499012/

Strazdas

The Black Oil wrote: »

I presume RTE will break from this somewhere during Christmas.

First episode is on the player anyway. http://www.rte.ie/player/ie/show/deutschland-83-30003692/10499012/

Looking forward to watching this on the Player this week, the reviews have been excellent. The last German language series RTE2 showed 'Generation War' was fantastic, one of the best TV dramas I've ever seen.

fryup

its fukin subtitled thats me out

could they not show a dubbed version ??

Fred Swanson

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pickarooney

fryup wrote: »

its fukin subtitled thats me out

could they not show a dubbed version ??

Sure just learn German. No need to read then.

brian_t

RTE2 is showing episode 2 now 9.30 - 10.30pm.

It's down for 10.30pm in the listings though.

An Ciarraioch

Gah - why, RTE Guide!

shamnspace

So disapointed just turned over to watch 2nd episode only to see the end credits thanks rte

brian_t

They didn't even bother correcting their own listings web page.

http://www.rte.ie/tv/listings_rtetwo.html

signinlate

Disgusted. I missed this because they couldn't show it at the right time .

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

brian_t

I emailed RTE and got this reply :

It was moved to an earlier slot of 21.30 Sundays and will be in that slot until the New Year,
All Epg’s and papers were sent the changes, it was also advertised on tv and online with the change.
Apologies that you missed the programme.

It can be watched back here on the Player at this link:


[URL="mhtml:{C672CEC5-B3E0-4260-97EE-61002876EBA6}mid://00000224/!x-usc:http://www.rte.ie/player/ie/show/deutschland-83-30003692/10501828/"]http://www.rte.ie/player/ie/show/deutschland-83-30003692/10501828/[/URL]

I notice that it will available on the player - Until: Tuesday 05 January 2016

According to DigiGuide RTE are showing Deutschland 83 in a "2 hour 35 minute" slot late night Saturday 19th December.
This might be a repeat of the first 3 episodes.

I hope so anyway as I don't like watching programmes on the RTE Player.

An Ciarraioch

brian_t wrote: »

I emailed RTE and got this reply :




I notice that it will available on the player - Until: Tuesday 05 January 2016

According to DigiGuide RTE are showing Deutschland 83 in a "2 hour 35 minute" slot late night Saturday 19th December.
This might be a repeat of the first 3 episodes.

I hope so anyway as I don't like watching programmes on the RTE Player.

Not to mention that of all the players, it's the only one that won't work in Android!

An Ciarraioch

Android Player actually plays now - must have had a major upgrade lately.

beertons

Just started watching this last night. Didn't realise it was all in subtitles when I turned it on. Was glued to it though, its very good. Funny too, in bits.

What would you like for dinner?
I'll have a steak please.
What kind?
From a cow.

The innocence!

brian_t

brian_t wrote: »

According to DigiGuide RTE are showing Deutschland 83 in a "2 hour 35 minute" slot late night Saturday 19th December.
This might be a repeat of the first 3 episodes.

I see that RTE have a repeat of Deutschland 83 on at midnight Saturday evening. Doesn't say what episode though.

http://www.rte.ie/tv/listings_rtetwo.html

Technocentral

beertons wrote:

Just started watching this last night. Didn't realise it was all in subtitles when I turned it on. Was glued to it though, its very good. Funny too, in bits.

Cheek of a German broadcaster making a historical German show in their native language!

david75

On episode 4. This is a quality series.

An Ciarraioch

Will be interesting to see if '86 and '89 get the green light: foreign critics are raving, but the ratings on RTL have been below expectations!

Marje

This will start on Channel 4 on 03 January.

After watching episode 4 and was wondering

When Martin and Linda met Annett at the train station, will this come back to haunt Martin later as he told in his interview that he never saw Linda after Brussels.

Azalea

Wonderful stuff! Dipped in and out when it was on RTE but it was a graveyard slot. Waited until tonight on Channel 4 to watch it properly.

I love the film Goodbye Lenin! and this seems to be along the same lines. Serious stuff but also some great dry humour. Knew the lads would burst out laughing after giving those students the socialism worshipping guff at the border checks office.

The supermarket reminded me of Aldi/LIDL. :pac:

The Cold War imagery and footage is fantastic too.

iguana

Azalea wrote: »

I love the film Goodbye Lenin! and this seems to be along the same lines.

Tobias on D 83 is played by the same actor who played Alex's sister's western boyfriend and Burger King manager in Goodbye Lenin.

crushproof

iguana wrote: »

Tobias on D 83 is played by the same actor who played Alex's sister's western boyfriend and Burger King manager in Goodbye Lenin.

That's where I knew him from! :pac:

Funny how in the Rebellion thread everyone is harping on about how many Love/Hate, GOT actors etc are in it.
Yet between the most prominent recent German films and the recent historical dramas (Generation War and D83) there are so many interlapping actors... and this in a country of 80 million!

Finished up D83 last night, fantastic series throughout but the ending was disappointing. Definitely could have done with another 3 episodes. So many storylines were wrapped up far too quickly. Lenora faded over the last few episodes, I really wanted to find out her background and how she rose through the ranks.

For Martin, it seemed far too easy for him to escape back to East Germany, how did he get home so quickly from a rest stop in the middle of nowhere?! Didn't he just run aimlessly into a forest?

I reckon it was Wolfgang who pulled the trigger in their home. Everything was collapsing around him, and he really had nothing else. His status among his peers was in tatters and his dreams of his son following his footsteps were nothing but a fantasy. (The "Nazi" argument between him and Alex was really thrilling television, very well played out.)

Schweppenstette's bopping to the western rock music was fantastic. Mad aul fella. In general, the soundtrack was whopper! Bizarre that the rating in Germany are so low, was there a similarly disappointing reaction to Generation War?

Bulbous Salutation

Been watching this for the past few weeks. It's a very enjoyable show. Great soundtrack as well. Captures the whole Cold War paranoia very well.

weemcd

Fantastic show.

Anyone know if they plan on having more episodes? The real theme of the show is paranoia and telling lies, and where it ultimately leads you to.

Very well made, soundtrack was excellent. Will probably watch again with my flatmate. Very interesting time in history.

crushproof

weemcd wrote: »

Fantastic show.

Anyone know if they plan on having more episodes? The real theme of the show is paranoia and telling lies, and where it ultimately leads you to.

Very well made, soundtrack was excellent. Will probably watch again with my flatmate. Very interesting time in history.

Seemingly it's going to be a This Is England kinda thing. There's plans for a D86 and D89.
Although it would be fantastic to have a D92 also, see where they're all at after the fall of the wall (spolier!). But that's years away from development, so I guess it all depends on the ratings.

weemcd

crushproof wrote: »

Seemingly it's going to be a This Is England kinda thing. There's plans for a D86 and D89.
Although it would be fantastic to have a D92 also, see where they're all at after the fall of the wall (spolier!). But that's years away from development, so I guess it all depends on the ratings.

I love that idea, as I am a big fan of This is England and The Take, a jump in time allows your characters room to grow, develop a backstory and new motivations etc.

Suits the format as you are dealing with different international landscapes and politics. Cannot wait to see more.

Boskowski

Just finished this off in a binge watch. As someone who grew up in West-Berlin at the time I must say they got it spot on and the era is very well replicated. They took some minor liberties but really impressed with it. Some of the tracks - especially the Neue Deutsche Welle stuff - I hadn't heard in years. Ah the memories

Only weakness was in episode 4 I think; the whole Linda thing between where she found out he's the spy and her death makes no sense at all. But other than that very well done and very entertaining. Good pace and like the actors too. Probably one of the best TV series that has come out of Germany. Really recommend it.

Barna77

Watched it all yesterday on a binge

Excellent series and soundtrack,

Caprica

I watched this is in the space of a week. A very entertaining series, that really wracked upped the tension as it progressed and really captured the paranoia of the cold war era. One or two things didn't fit for me where how he could go from being drugged in his kitchen in East Germany to be being a top notch spy with 5 minutes training and the freedom that Leonora seemed to have in wandering round Germany, I'm sure she would have been followed and tailed at tall times. The acting was of a very high standard, I was very impressed with Alex & Wolfgang Edel and Schwensteppe.

It would be interesting if it followed the This is England narrative, I would definitely watch it. The soundtrack was amazing, so many great 80's songs.

Caprica

I watched this is in the space of a week. A very entertaining series, that really wracked upped the tension as it progressed and really captured the paranoia of the cold war era. One or two things didn't fit for me where how he could go from being drugged in his kitchen in East Germany to be being a top notch spy with 5 minutes training and the freedom that Leonora seemed to have in wandering round Germany, I'm sure she would have been followed and tailed at tall times. The acting was of a very high standard, I was very impressed with Alex & Wolfgang Edel and Schwensteppe.

It would be interesting if it followed the This is England narrative, I would definitely watch it. The soundtrack was amazing, so many great 80's songs.

iguana

Deutschland '86 has been commissioned.
https://www.yahoo.com/movies/deutschland-83-renewed-season-2-101346576.html

The Black Oil

Great news.

Bandana boy

The Black Oil wrote: »

Great news.

agreed