Would you vote for a party that promised Tax increases?

JPNelsforearm

oscarBravo wrote: »

It's not going to happen. Even if it was a good idea (simple solutions to complex problems tend not to be)

it fails the only metric that ever seems to be applied to taxes in this country: it's not progressive.

1.Disagree, simple solutions are the best, the more complex you make a thing the more loopholes/potential for disaster occurs. Look at any of the best engineering feats, law, whatever, none are convoluted or needlessly complex. Its only when special interest groups and politicians/bureaucracy get involved that things become "complex"

2.Agree.

FreudianSlippers

oscarBravo wrote: »

So, a 20% tax on minimum wage earners, and the same 20% tax on a billionaire? I can see that being universally popular.

Firstly, we don't really have a whole lot of billionaires in Ireland. I really resent this argument, as it is effectively a kind of slippery-slope argument used to scare people into punitively taxing those earning 6 figures - not billionaires.


Secondly, this is also not how a flat tax would operate. I'll just also say that I advocate a flat tax with a negative income tax, so that we could completely abolish the dole.

From wikipedia (actually a good summary tbh):

A flat rate income taxation with tax exemption implements a negative income tax as well as maintaining an actual tax rate progression at extremely low administrative cost. This is achieved by paying a tax on the tax exemption to all taxpayers, e.g. in monthly payments. The tax on the tax exemption is computed by applying the nominal flat tax rate to the exemption. The tax on the income is drawn directly from the source, e.g. from an employer. The tax on income is computed by applying the nominal flat tax rate to the income.

This simple method results in an effective progressive rate taxation (although the tax rate for the taxes drawn at the source is flat) which is positive once the income exceeds the tax exemption. If, however, the income is less than the tax exemption, the effective progressive rate actually becomes negative without any involvement by any tax authority. As for the positive progression, only very high incomes would lead to an actual tax rate which is close to the nominal flat tax rate.

The tax on tax exemption also can be understood as a tax credit, which is paid back once an income has reached the level of the tax exemption. This level marks the point where paid taxes and the tax credit are equal. Above that point the state earns taxes from the taxpayer. Below that point the state pays taxes to the taxpayer.

Example:

The income tax rate is 50%.
The tax exemption is $30000.
The subsidy rate is 50% and equal to the income tax rate.

Under this scheme:

A person earning $0 would receive $15,000 from the government.
A person earning $25,000 would receive $2,500 from the government.
A person earning $30,000 would neither receive any money nor pay any tax.
A person earning $50,000 would pay a tax of $10,000.
A person earning $100,000 would pay a tax of $35,000.

Flat tax implementations without the provision of a negative income tax actually need an additional effort in order to avoid negative taxation. For such a tax, the exemption only can be paid after knowing the earned income. Flat tax implementations with negative income tax allow to pay the tax on the tax exemption independent of the amount of the actual income.

K.Flyer

Ireland Inc. Needs a complete and total financial overhaul.
In my opinion, the country is like a poorly build house on sh!tty foundations, that has been extended and added to over the years by owners who are too pig headed to realise that it needs to be bulldozed and built again, but properly this time.
Our health service is laughable and a shameful reflection of absurd management to the point people are terrified to be ill in this country.
Our police service is demoralised and decimated to the point that the criminal world is running free reign with no solid judicial system to deter them.
I could go on about the education system and the care for the elderly, but you get the picture.
We need true reform, not pithy lip service.

FreudianSlippers

K.Flyer wrote: »

Ireland Inc. Needs a complete and total financial overhaul.
In my opinion, the country is like a poorly build house on sh!tty foundations, that has been extended and added to over the years by owners who are too pig headed to realise that it needs to be bulldozed and built again, but properly this time.
Our health service is laughable and a shameful reflection of absurd management to the point people are terrified to be ill in this country.
Our police service is demoralised and decimated to the point that the criminal world is running free reign with no solid judicial system to deter them.
I could go on about the education system and the care for the elderly, but you get the picture.
We need true reform, not pithy lip service.

I agree- I wish that we had collectively taken 2015 as a year of reflection on where we are and where we're going and conducted a root-and-branch overhaul of the mechanics of this country.

We have a broken system that stems from a broken tax system and barely functional government system.

JPNelsforearm

K.Flyer wrote: »

Ireland Inc. Needs a complete and total financial overhaul.
In my opinion, the country is like a poorly build house on sh!tty foundations, that has been extended and added to over the years by owners who are too pig headed to realise that it needs to be bulldozed and built again, but properly this time.
Our health service is laughable and a shameful reflection of absurd management to the point people are terrified to be ill in this country.
Our police service is demoralised and decimated to the point that the criminal world is running free reign with no solid judicial system to deter them.
I could go on about the education system and the care for the elderly, but you get the picture.
We need true reform, not pithy lip service.

and there is not a single reformist political party on the horizon............ More of the same and lots of it, for the foreseeable future.