Dublin Bus 7/59/111 Changes

punisher5112

Stephen15 wrote: »

I have mixed emotions about the 63 changes. Part of me thinks it makes sense to have a good bus service on a newly widened road bit the other part of me thinks it's taking away a well used link on Clonkeen Road although most of Clonkeen Road is within walking distance of Pottery Road I'm sure more will walk up as far Deansgrange for 46a/75 to get to Dun Laoghaire.

The numbers carried on clonkeen aren't big.

Stephen15

punisher5112 wrote: »

The numbers carried on clonkeen aren't big.

Not big but it's gets decent enough numbers especially at the lower end around the Texaco garage. The change is for the most part positive with the drawback of longer journey times on a route which does enough wandering aswell as the removal of direct link to Deansgrange from Ballyogan, Carrickmines and Kilternan.

SimonMaher

Changes on the above routes are due to take place on Sunday November 13th.

Simon

http://www.dublinbus.ie/News-Centre/General-News/Dun-Laoghaire-Sallynoggin-and-Loughlinstown-Route-Changes/

Stephen15

SimonMaher wrote: »

Changes on the above routes are due to take place on Sunday November 13th.

Simon

http://www.dublinbus.ie/News-Centre/General-News/Dun-Laoghaire-Sallynoggin-and-Loughlinstown-Route-Changes/

Great to see these changes being finally implamented

dublinman1990

I rarely use this bus at all but why is there a 2 hour gap between buses on the 59 on Sunday evenings in both directions?

http://www.dublinbus.ie/Your-Journey1/Timetables/All-Timetables/591/

xper

This started out as a plausible plan to improve the speed and reliability of the desperately unreliable route 7 while also reorganising local routes in south east Dublin. It has, in the end, been usurped by a vote winning exercise in one part of one local council ward to the detriment of all other public transport customers on the route.

Well done Ossian Smyth and the good people of Pearse St/Pk/Ave/etc in Sallynoggin. You've managed to convince transport planners in Dublin Bus and the NTA (who should know better) to split a trunk commuting route in half, keep one half winding through the twisty narrow roads of your housing estate notwithstanding the fact that they also added thirteen departures each day on the 111 that follow that same around the houses route, all because you couldn't be arsed walking 200-300m to the faster, more reliable route.

One of Ossian's published priorities in his general election campaign earlier this year was "Access to efficient, regular and safe public transport." But when push came to shove, however, his green sustainable development principles were jettisoned in favour of good old fashioned parish pump politics.

Stephen15

xper wrote: »

This started out as a plausible plan to improve the speed and reliability of the desperately unreliable route 7 while also reorganising local routes in south east Dublin. It has, in the end, been usurped by a vote winning exercise in one part of one local council ward to the detriment of all other public transport customers on the route.

Well done Ossian Smyth and the good people of Pearse St/Pk/Ave/etc in Sallynoggin. You've managed to convince transport planners in Dublin Bus and the NTA (who should know better) to split a trunk commuting route in half, keep one half winding through the twisty narrow roads of your housing estate notwithstanding the fact that they also added thirteen departures each day on the 111 that follow that same around the houses route, all because you couldn't be arsed walking 200-300m to the faster, more reliable route.

One of Ossian's published priorities in his general election campaign earlier this year was "Access to efficient, regular and safe public transport." But when push came to shove, however, his green sustainable development principles were jettisoned in favour of good old fashioned parish pump politics.

The 7/a changes were a bit ridiculous. Wasn't the orginal plan for the 45a to run via Sallynoggin. The 111 changes were an absolute joke though good for Dalkey to have a bus up to Cherrywood and the n11 but running it through The Noggin and Louglinstown Park is ridiculous they have theye already have the new 7a.

The 59 terminating back in Killiney Village is fairly logical look Killiney Village has very little. Its bit of a walk from the DART it only has one tiny shop and a pub no post office, petrol station or a take away etc. features which most suburban villages have. The least it deserves is a bus. For a suburban area its isolated. Surely it deserves an hourly bus. I know frequency is now reduced but it will be more reliable now as it will do less wandering over the course of its route.

The 63 change makes sense as it gives a quicker, more frequent and reliable connection to Dun Laoghaire than the current 59 joke bus.

dublinman1990

Would the 111 route would still be even classed as a DART feeder any more even though it will go from Dalkey instead of Dun Laoghaire?

The more obvious fact is that it still has no Sunday service in it's timetable even though it will serve the LUAS & the DART for six days a week.

Stephen15

dublinman1990 wrote: »

Would the 111 route would still be even classed as a DART feeder any more even though it will go from Dalkey instead of Dun Laoghaire?

The more obvious fact is that it still has no Sunday service in it's timetable even though it will serve the LUAS & the DART for six days a week.

I don't understand why is still being called the 111 when it dosent bear a whole lot of remblence to the old route.

dublinman1990

Stephen15 wrote: »

I don't understand why is still being called the 111 when it dosent bear a whole lot of remblence to the old route.

Part of the new 111 route is still identical from Sallynoggin Roundabout to Loughlinstown Park.

Maybe if it is going from Dalkey; DB could instead have changed it to the 58 to make the route numbers a little simpler in that area?

Or am I going too far ahead of myself with that idea?

LXFlyer

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I rarely use this bus at all but why is there a 2 hour gap between buses on the 59 on Sunday evenings in both directions?

http://www.dublinbus.ie/Your-Journey1/Timetables/All-Timetables/591/

Presumably so the late driver can take his break in DL.

xper

Commuters may be interested to know that in this service 'improvement', the number of city-bound departures along the Rock Road corridor between 7am and 9am will be reduced by two. This is due to the cancellation of route 8, no uptick in the combined 7/7A departures and no change to route 4.

Stephen15

xper wrote: »

Commuters may be interested to know that in this service 'improvement', the number of city-bound departures along the Rock Road corridor between 7am and 9am will be reduced by two. This is due to the cancellation of route 8, no uptick in the combined 7/7A departures and no change to route 4.

I don't that corridor but two buses is surely not that big a number on relatively high frequency QBC. Was it not the same when they cancelled the 45 which ran a similar amount of buses as the 8. What I would suggest they should do run the 84a which goes to Vicents all the way into town if there is a need for extra buses.

What I can not understand is why they kept the 7a running via Blackrock. I understand why they kept buses running via Sallynoggin as the residents were unhappy let me say no more. But Blackrock Village had to go it was a complete and utter traffic nightmare and it had to go. I won't be surprised if commuters at peak times would wait the 15 or so minutes for a quicker 7 or a 4 if a 7a came first. It's like the time when the 46a ran via Stillorgan people would happily wait for a 145 if a 46a came first and that was before real time info was around. Also many people will be sitting on a 7a with a faster just behind it.

I hope in a few years time these changes will be reviewed and all 7/a's will bypass Blackrock and Sallynoggin. The compromised changes may not be ideal but they are a start and hopefully they will be received well and the PBP bandwagon brigade will be silenced.

Green Party: Ossian Smyth

Hi there

In my submission to Dublin Bus I said, "I would like to see the core services running at high frequency along the most direct routes". I don't think any other councillor made a case for commuters. I certainly didn't seek a reduction of service frequency on main route corridors.

I published a web page last summer outlining the winners and losers from the proposed changes.
http://www.ossiansmyth.ie/dublin-bus-proposes-route-changes-for-dun-laoghaire-sallynoggin-and-loughlinstown/
This information was not in the public domain at that time.

The compromise proposals were designed by the NTA and were in response to the public consultation and submissions from many interested parties.

Major changes are now proposed to the bus rail, and cycling facilities along the Rock Road corridor under the NTA's Merrion Gates proposals and I will publish some analysis of this shortly.

dublinman1990

Well; the changes to the 7 along with the new 7a route have happened this morning.

Any new updates or thoughts on the new routes?

Stephen15

I'm bit disappointed to see that the 63 only has two new stops going towards Dun Laoghaire with just the two existing stops and none the Cabinteely Community School going towards DL they should have really waited until the road works at the n11 junction with Johnstown Road have finished to implament these changes Students are glingus to have to trek all the way over to Pottery Road or the n11 to catch a 63 towards Dun Laoghaire.

I'm also disappointed with the lack of bus shelters on the Sallyglen road. Other than that I'd say all good im surprised to see that there's been no rendering issues on the displays on buses the only one I have seen is on some of the rpti screens with just 7a being displayed with no destination.

Fratton Fred

Does this mean the bus lane outside Park Pointe will now be removed, or will this ridiculous bus lane remain, albeit even more ridiculous than before?

patrickbrophy18

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Does this mean the bus lane outside Park Pointe will now be removed, or will this ridiculous bus lane remain, albeit even more ridiculous than before?

No, the 111 bus will be operating along that stretch and far more regularly than the cancelled 8 at a consistent hourly basis Monday to Saturday. See the below link for more info:

http://www.dublinbus.ie/Your-Journey1/Timetables/All-Timetables/11111/

This will mean that the QBC on Upper Glenageary Road adjacent to Park Pointe will now have a frequent connection to the Green Luas Line and Dalkey.

Fratton Fred

patrickbrophy18 wrote: »

No, the 111 bus will be operating along that stretch and far more regularly than the cancelled 8 at a consistent hourly basis Monday to Saturday. See the below link for more info:

http://www.dublinbus.ie/Your-Journey1/Timetables/All-Timetables/11111/

This will mean that the QBC on Upper Glenageary Road adjacent to Park Pointe will now have a frequent connection to the Green Luas Line and Dalkey.

A QBC for one bus per hour does seem a little excessive. Still, it's better than six per day I guess.

Stephen15

Fratton Fred wrote: »

A QBC for one bus per hour does seem a little excessive. Still, it's better than six per day I guess.

It's not exactly a QBC it's about 150m of bus lane and yes it is unessecary. I would suggest extending the 4 down to Honeypark since there are shelters down there it would also give that area a direct link to Blackrock, Ballsbridge and Vincents and give back Monkstown Farm a dI rectangular link into town since there was so much huffing and puffing when they removed the 46a.

Fratton Fred

Stephen15 wrote: »

It's not exactly a QBC it's about 150m of bus lane and yes it is unessecary. I would suggest extending the 4 down to Honeypark since there are shelters down there it would also give that area a direct link to Blackrock, Ballsbridge and Vincents and give back Monkstown Farm a dI rectangular link into town since there was so much huffing and puffing when they removed the 46a.

that's what i don't get, is why bother to build 150m of bus lane.

I can understand why at the Sally Glen roundabout, but there are no other traffic holdups along that stretch, other than the right turn in to Mount Town road, which doesn't have a bus lane.

It just all smacks of a council planner ticking a box to show that they have constructed "X" amount of bus lanes.

Larbre34

Its a planning condition. All big developments are conditioned to upgrade adjoining roads to the modern design standards and to increase capacity. The golf course sites are adding 1,100 homes and at least as many cars after all. Its a free road upgrade to the Council, albeit delivered piecemeal.

Stephen15

Fratton Fred wrote: »

that's what i don't get, is why bother to build 150m of bus lane.

I can understand why at the Sally Glen roundabout, but there are no other traffic holdups along that stretch, other than the right turn in to Mount Town road, which doesn't have a bus lane.

It just all smacks of a council planner ticking a box to show that they have constructed "X" amount of bus lanes.

I understand your frustration another one I can't understand is the one on Mount Merrion Avenue a bus lane stretching the length of the road for what the half hourly 17 why don't they build a bus lane along any road that has a bus running whether it be half hourly, hourly or daily.

patrickbrophy18

Stephen15 wrote: »

I understand your frustration another one I can't understand is the one on Mount Merrion Avenue a bus lane stretching the length of the road for what the half hourly 17 why don't they build a bus lane along any road that has a bus running whether it be half hourly, hourly or daily.

Me three. I find it frustrating with the amount of disused or underused bus lanes and/or QBCs. Mount Merrion Avenue and Upper Glenageary Road are examples of ones that need far more use by buses. Granted that the new alignment of route 111 is a drastic improvement in use of the latter, now both roads have a similar level of service with the exception of Sundays.

Having said that, the bus stops along the south-eastern end of Upper Glenageary Road (i.e. the stretch between Glenageary Shopping Center and Killiney Towers Roundabout) and Castlepark Road will permanently (or for the foreseeable future) see no use with the cancellation of the 8. The Monkstown Ring Road is also one that has been given almost no attention with a grand total of only 10 buses a day (Monday to Friday) using it.

This is where I believe the 8 and 7D could have been merged and made into an all day (hourly) service Monday to Saturday and 1.5 hourly on a Sunday. The 7B could also be transformed into an hourly service (possibly half hourly at peak times) to augment the level of service on the Monkstown Ring Road and also the northern half of Rochestown Avenue as well as Abbey Road.

dublinman1990

If your waiting for a bus to Brides Glen or Loughlinstown from Monkstown Road onwards; you could have suffered a little delay in your bus earlier today on the 7 or 7a route. I saw a bus full of passengers that had broke down, which was marked "Sorry - Not in Service" on the front display, at the Montpellier Manor Bus Stop in Monkstown Road sometime between 4pm & 4:15pm this afternoon.

The bus stop number was 3036, which is the stop before Alma Road, if you're were asking about the location of the stop.

I wasn't in the bus now as I had walked home after travelling on the DART from Bray to Seapoint. The bus that broke down at the stop was a 12D reg GT; which had the number GT6 on it. It had both doors open for some reason when I walked past it.

Does anyone know what route number was used on the bus before it broke down?

Did anyone get home on a full bus by the time the next bus came for you? Where any of you were waiting long for your next bus home earlier?

Does anyone know the reason why it broke down at that stop today?

Stephen15

It looks like a new bus stop is going in where they are doing the roadworks on the n11 at the Cabinteely Village/Johnstown road junction I wonder is this bus stop going to be used by both the 63 and the 145 or just the 63 with the stop 100m down continued to be used by the 145.

Another thing with the changes in about a month at this stage this how do you think they are working good, bad or not much different.

punisher5112

Stephen15 wrote: »

It looks like a new bus stop is going in where they are doing the roadworks on the n11 at the Cabinteely Village/Johnstown road junction I wonder is this bus stop going to be used by both the 63 and the 145 or just the 63 with the stop 100m down continued to be used by the 145.

Another thing with the changes in about a month at this stage this how do you think they are working good, bad or not much different.

Its 63 stop that's what they put it there for and now will have a pedestrian light set up on road plus the bridge so more traffic.

Its a terrible set up and will only slow things down(not speed) but more traffic congestion.

I don't know who these engineers are but they need to do something with what they seem to think is an OK width of a road as any works I see being done they are cutting width of road extending out paths and or cycle lanes while making less safe space on road lanes.

How does the 63 get back out of the stop dealing with main lanes and traffic turning off while having to negotiate the turn while cyclists are passing on all sides and pedestrians.

ted1

punisher5112 wrote: »

Its 63 stop that's what they put it there for and now will have a pedestrian light set up on road plus the bridge so more traffic.

Its a terrible set up and will only slow things down(not speed) but more traffic congestion.

I don't know who these engineers are but they need to do something with what they seem to think is an OK width of a road as any works I see being done they are cutting width of road extending out paths and or cycle lanes while making less safe space on road lanes.

How does the 63 get back out of the stop dealing with main lanes and traffic turning off while having to negotiate the turn while cyclists are passing on all sides and pedestrians.

Have you not got it yet. The Luas, DART, Busses, cycle paths all service the area. They don't want people using cars. More people will cycle now that the facilities are being put in.

Cyclists are inside the bus stop so there's no issue with them being on the outside. It's also going back into a bus lane so there should be no cares there either.

punisher5112

ted1 wrote: »

Have you not got it yet. The Luas, DART, Busses, cycle paths all service the area. They don't want people using cars. More people will cycle now that the facilities are being put in.

Cyclists are inside the bus stop so there's no issue with them being on the outside. It's also going back into a bus lane so there should be no cares there either.

I get it if its done right and nothing on the n11 is as every junction is designed and lay out differently.

Find a concept that works and put that across the board.

It won't make more cycle because one junction is changed and honestly 63 won't make more use cars less.

Stephen15

punisher5112 wrote: »

Its 63 stop that's what they put it there for and now will have a pedestrian light set up on road plus the bridge so more traffic.

Its a terrible set up and will only slow things down(not speed) but more traffic congestion.

I don't know who these engineers are but they need to do something with what they seem to think is an OK width of a road as any works I see being done they are cutting width of road extending out paths and or cycle lanes while making less safe space on road lanes.

How does the 63 get back out of the stop dealing with main lanes and traffic turning off while having to negotiate the turn while cyclists are passing on all sides and pedestrians.

Tbh I thought running the 63 on a very short stretch of the n11 was a very wise idea instead I would have realigned it so that the 84 would run down the n11 as far as Clonkeen road and the 63 would run via Cabinteely Village. It would mean the the 63 and the 84 could both go straight on without so much twisting only problem being it would make two bus shelters redundant.

I see your point about traffic but really the stop does need to be there for the Community School and obivously since isint much place to put it on lower Johnstown Road it was the only place to put it.