Ring Of Kerry Charity Cycle 2016 - **no entry requests/offers**

spookwoman

I have to wonder how they will choose the winners and will they get an impartial person to pick them. I have a feeling that those who are complaining if they did enter would not be ones to win.

touts

Eamonnator wrote: »

It says there, that minimum amount remains the same as last year, €85.


http://www.ringofkerrycycle.ie/announcements/2016-registration-date/

Ok thanks. Either I missed it when I read it first or they have added it since. Either way good to know the cost before we enter the lottery.

I'm not sure what to make of it to be honest. I'll enter the lottery and see but I'll be fairly pissed off if they just take my €10 and say sorry you didn't get drawn.

xxyyzz

spookwoman wrote: »

I have to wonder how they will choose the winners and will they get an impartial person to pick them. I have a feeling that those who are complaining if they did enter would not be ones to win.

Eh, if there's 11,000 entries they won't be picking them from a bowl. It'll be a random selection by a software algorithm.

Leroy42

First off, fair play to them for building such a big event that it has to run a lottery to avoid the rush. 11k people on a charity cycle in Kerry is an amazing achievement and coupled with the amounts of money that are being raised for charity is something that anyone involved can be rightly proud.

IMO, the no-refund lottery is tasteless. You are basically taking €10 of everyone but giving it back to those you get an entry. Why do that. Surely the 'ticket' should cost €10, regardless of whether you get entry of not. The €85 entry fee then remains the same.

Whilst it does hit a somewhat sour note for me, I haven't done the ROK before and won't be entering on this basis, but if they have the numbers to make this work then fair play to them.

I do think that they are missing a major benefit here. Why are they limiting it to 11k? Why not run it over two days, close the roads etc. This event seems to have the ability to generate the same numbers as the Dublin Marathon, yet for some reason they (and I don't just mean the organisers but Kerry CoCo, the local hoteliers & BB's etc) they could double they numbers and have the increased tourism.

Koobcam

Leroy42 wrote: »

Why not run it over two days, close the roads etc. This event seems to have the ability to generate the same numbers as the Dublin Marathon, yet for some reason they (and I don't just mean the organisers but Kerry CoCo, the local hoteliers & BB's etc) they could double they numbers and have the increased tourism.

I suppose you could argue that this event is so big and takes up the whole of the Ring of Kerry route on the day that it hampers other people's ability to drive around one of the key tourist roads in the country. Fully closing the roads and making it a two-day event would really annoy some people. I do agree though that it has the potential to get even bigger, maybe it could be turned into some sort of weekend cycling festival. You could have different start points along the route and maybe people could choose different distances as well, thus spreading the benefit along the whole route. Maybe we could use the RoK as Ireland's first Zwift route...

Leroy42

But it is a guaranteed 11k plus people staying over, mostly for the weekend. Think of all the extra business that is done by the hotels, restaurants, shops etc because of this. Closing the roads of course means putting the drivers out for a day or two, but they have 200 odd (excluding the winter months) to drive around.
On that basis why do we allow the Dublin Marathon take over the streets of Southside Dublin every year. Look at what the TdF brings to French tourism (I'm not equating ROK with TdF) as people from all over the world see the wonderful scenery etc whilst watching the stages. Take some drone footage and use it sell the place to both cyclists and non cyclists alike.

Failte Ireland should be all over this. We out so much time and effort into golf the last decade and cycling is the new golf. Ireland has amazing cycling available. Great scenery, quite(ish) roads. If we work on this (and the ROK organisers have done most of the heavy lifting) Ireland Inc could really make something out of both the ROK and W200 (just an example).

But I already know the answer. Try to make the above arguement and all you'll get is 'but what about the cars?".

Look at places like Franch/Spain etc with the spotives. The locals, for the most part, embrace it. They see it as something to drive business and tourism. Do you reckon people who live in Alpe D'Huez not get fed up with cyclists but that's the summer business. We don't have a 'mythical' place like Ventoux of Alpe but we can do something like ROK to generate the same impact.

Koobcam

The locals in France seem happy with the sportives alright, but not in Belgium if Liege-Bastogne-Liege is anything to judge by. One of my abiding memories of that event was the rain and the pi**ed off drivers. It's probably better to just close the roads. RoK is actually pretty good from that point of view. I get the impression that people are aware of the event and generally embrace it and as a result traffic tends to be really light on the day of the event.

brocbrocach

Leroy42 wrote: »

But it is a guaranteed 11k plus people staying over, mostly for the weekend. Think of all the extra business that is done by the hotels, restaurants, shops etc because of this. Closing the roads of course means putting the drivers out for a day or two, but they have 200 odd (excluding the winter months) to drive around.
On that basis why do we allow the Dublin Marathon take over the streets of Southside Dublin every year. Look at what the TdF brings to French tourism (I'm not equating ROK with TdF) as people from all over the world see the wonderful scenery etc whilst watching the stages. Take some drone footage and use it sell the place to both cyclists and non cyclists alike.

Failte Ireland should be all over this. We out so much time and effort into golf the last decade and cycling is the new golf. Ireland has amazing cycling available. Great scenery, quite(ish) roads. If we work on this (and the ROK organisers have done most of the heavy lifting) Ireland Inc could really make something out of both the ROK and W200 (just an example).

But I already know the answer. Try to make the above arguement and all you'll get is 'but what about the cars?".

Look at places like Franch/Spain etc with the spotives. The locals, for the most part, embrace it. They see it as something to drive business and tourism. Do you reckon people who live in Alpe D'Huez not get fed up with cyclists but that's the summer business. We don't have a 'mythical' place like Ventoux of Alpe but we can do something like ROK to generate the same impact.

In the ideal world you're right and self-interest should take a back seat. But unfortunately real people live in Kerry too. They have to go to work in factories, do the shopping, move the cows to the lower field, take the kids to the beach, etc. As far as i know the roads aren't technically closed but the reality is that a good lot of people are trapped in their homes on the day of the ROK - the ould linear development and the fact that Iveragh is a peninsula make this worse.
I think adding an extra day would lose a lot of the feel-good factor the event has in Kerry.

PeadarCo

brocbrocach wrote: »

In the ideal world you're right and self-interest should take a back seat. But unfortunately real people live in Kerry too. They have to go to work in factories, do the shopping, move the cows to the lower field, take the kids to the beach, etc. As far as i know the roads aren't technically closed but the reality is that a good lot of people are trapped in their homes on the day of the ROK - the ould linear development and the fact that Iveragh is a peninsula make this worse.
I think adding an extra day would lose a lot of the feel-good factor the event has in Kerry.

The other issue is that with the current date, nearly every 2nd year the Munster Football Final is on the day after in Killarney on the same weekend. That would effectively rule out the Sunday even if the above factors could be accommodated.

Masala

and the other major problem is getting Volunteers for 2 days.

Kudos for those people who get up early to be in position for the day and get stuck there till at least 8pm that evening. There is great goodwill among Volunteers and they are very generous with their time.

To ask them to do 2 x days is pushing it.

Wishbone Ash

Koobcam wrote: »

... but not in Belgium if Liege-Bastogne-Liege is anything to judge by. One of my abiding memories of that event was the rain and the pi**ed off drivers...

It's funny how people's experiences differ! I thought the drivers in Belgium during this year's Liege Bastogne Liege were the most polite I've ever experienced. I only recall hearing one car horn sounding and that was on one of the 20%+ climbs when riders were crawling and weaving across the road - not bad going for a 270k sportive in pissing rain!

(My abiding memory of it was the amount of littering - gel wrappers strewn everywhere).

Koobcam

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

It's funny how people's experiences differ! I thought the drivers in Belgium during this year's Liege Bastogne Liege were the most polite I've ever experienced. I only recall hearing one car horn sounding and that was on one of the 20%+ climbs when riders were crawling and weaving across the road - not bad going for a 270k sportive in pissing rain!

(My abiding memory of it was the amount of littering - gel wrappers strewn everywhere).

They were probably more understanding of you since you did the full 270km. Probably their horns were mocking me for just doing 158.

spookwoman

Judging by their copy and paste comments strong impression they are not listening

RandRuns

I was quite taken aback this year to see that the ROK are charging a non-refundable €10 fee just to enter the lottery system. I know it is for charity, but it just looks bad to me. It smacks of underhand tactics. And yes, I know one can choose not to enter.

I have done the ROK for the past 2 years. Last year I felt it was fine, but this year I felt it was dangerous at times. One of the cyclists in my group suffered a bad fall near Caherciveen after being knocked off her bike by a swerving cyclist. I don't think inexperienced cyclists are to blame for all of the incidents btw - I saw several "kitted out" club cyclists doing dangerous manoeuvres (in a couple of cases it seemed they were showing off, and in one case, obviously trying to intimidate another cyclist), and I witnessed some very dangerous cycling by a guy wearing a marshall's top near Coomakista.

I am a relatively inexperienced cyclist (I do the odd triathlon and sportive), and am no expert, but I really think the ROK would be a better event if they copied some of the tactics used in large marathons - hold the lottery well in advance, strictly enforce a wave start (if you are not in your wave you don't start) where faster cyclists go before slower ones, do away with the mass food stops and just have quick in-and-out aid stations, and strictly enforce an "overtaking lane" policy. Easy to say, harder to do perhaps, but I feel the event will not be safe if it continues as it is.

outfox

I've been following the various ROK threads with interest over the last 3 years. I'll probably get lambasted for this, for here goes:

I don't see why it should be limited to 11,000 participants. There WILL be accidents. It's a sport. All sports have accidents, but we still participate. Driving is dangerous, but we still drive. So 10 operations were required last year. That's less than 0.1 %. (This is not to take from VAGABOND'S experience). It's an acceptable level of risk, IMO.

I've done the ROK the last 3 years. I saw some silly stuff, and nearly got creamed each year coming down into Caherdaniel by some inexperienced cyclists pulling stupid manoeuvres. But that's cycling. It's my call. I assess the risk, and then decide. If it's too dangerous, then I can chose not to do it. The level of mollycoddling in this country is frustrating at times. Mollycoddling by people who believe ZERO risk is the only option.

11,000 is such an arbitrary number. Where did that come out of? Is there a ROK algorithm which determines that 11,000 is OK, but 13,000 is too much? I reckon it should be unlimited, but with a few changes like enforced wave times. The triage stations mentioned above is a great idea.

Surely the most enjoyable part of the event IS the masses of cyclists. The buzz, the noise, the craic, the colour.
I probably wont do it next year. Not because of risk, but because of the extra hassle that the lottery brings.

killalanerr

I tend to agree about the tenner reg fee it is a bit tasteless.But the cute kerry boys know well that the leinster boys love handing over money to the Kerry men and I'm sure the demand for entries will outstrip the entries available insuring lots of free tenners

I also agree that the 11k number is no where near the capacity of a course that size ,with proper staggered starts or and multi start locations a lot more people could be accommodated and at the end of the day more money for the charities without scamming a tenner of the those who will not be there !

PeadarCo

RandRuns wrote: »

I am a relatively inexperienced cyclist (I do the odd triathlon and sportive), and am no expert, but I really think the ROK would be a better event if they copied some of the tactics used in large marathons - hold the lottery well in advance, strictly enforce a wave start (if you are not in your wave you don't start) where faster cyclists go before slower ones, do away with the mass food stops and just have quick in-and-out aid stations, and strictly enforce an "overtaking lane" policy. Easy to say, harder to do perhaps, but I feel the event will not be safe if it continues as it is.

The problem with the staggered start is that some people start the route at first light i.e. 5.30 where others may not start till about 8/9. A few years ago the organisers asked all club cyclists to start at 6 which was basically ignored as it was way to early for people who' do the route in 5-8 hours. The main issue being slower cyclists need the extra time while faster cyclists can afford to start later.

The idea has merit but it means closing off the road going out of Kilarney for a few hours in the morning and probably moving the start time of the event from to about 8am ish. This is later than most people tend to start at the moment. Even dividing groups based on something like Cycling Ireland licence type would in the term support bigger numbers you'd imagine or at least ensure better numbers for what the currently have.

From what I've seen at the event and the organisers over the last few years I doubt there's the will to organise something like that as it will put off some of the slower cyclists who need 12/13 hours +. To a degree the organisers are in a no win situation, they'll get complaints what ever they do.

Wishbone Ash

PeadarCo wrote: »

.. The main issue being slower cyclists need the extra time while faster cyclists can afford to start later.....

+1

I did the 2014 event and started at 6am and was in the car driving back to Dublin by 1pm. There was no finish line set up when I came in and I missed a lot of the 'buzz'. (I also missed a proper breakfast in my hotel as they didn't open till 7am). 3 or 4 hours into it I was still passing much slower cyclists who must have been out from 3 or 4am. An official told me later that one person started at midnight.

If I was doing it again. I'd probably leave at 8am.

outfox wrote: »

... All sports have accidents, but we still participate. Driving is dangerous, but we still drive...

Everyday driving is not a great analogy as it has not been 'organised' as an event. Sadly, once something is organised, many people feel the need to consult their solicitor if they get injured.

seanin4711

never considered the ROK but when i did the Westsportif chatting to a few cyclists on it,they claimed it was getting too busy and dangerous.
As for charity ,CAS being one, I am skeptical about where the money goes

Eamonnator

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

+1

I did the 2014 event and started at 6am and was in the car driving back to Dublin by 1pm. There was no finish line set up when I came in and I missed a lot of the 'buzz'. (I also missed a proper breakfast in my hotel as they didn't open till 7am). 3 or 4 hours into it I was still passing much slower cyclists who must have been out from 3 or 4am. An official told me later that one person started at midnight.

If I was doing it again. I'd probably leave at 8am.

Everyday driving is not a great analogy as it has not been 'organised' as an event. Sadly, once something is organised, many people feel the need to consult their solicitor if they get injured.

I started at 6.00am in 2014, finished before noon. I wonder did our paths cross

outfox

I've started later and later each year. Last year at 0800. Seem to get in around 1500-1530 each year. Next year, I'd go at maybe 0830 or 0900 if I was doing it.

jon1981

It look likes they have deleted the negative/complaint posts on facebook. Could see them yesterday. Can't see them today. Might be an issue on my end.

funnights74

The negative comments are still up on my feed but they're giving a standard reply to anyone questioning their Thursday announcement.


Ring of Kerry Charity Cycle Hi Michael , We are a fundraising cycle and we want to make the process as fair, for everyone, as possible. The minimum donation, which is deductible if you get through, is to prevent multiple registrations from the same person, giving everyone a fair chance at a place. If you are not successful your €10 will go into the general fund to be divided out to over 30 charities. In 2015 alone over €1.85 million was raised thanks to the cycle. The minimum charitable donation is the same as last year at €85. Hope this clears up any confusion. Thanks, The Ring of Kerry Charity Cycle Team.

What gets me is why they feel the need to distribute the unsuccessful e10 pre-registration fee to the chosen charities. I am quite capable of deciding which charity i wish to donate to myself. If i am not successful the money should be returned!!
I am aware of the nature of the event, but if i am unsuccessful in the participation lottery then why should the committee donate my money to their fund raising event?

Wishbone Ash

funnights74 wrote: »

...I am aware of the nature of the event, but if i am unsuccessful in the participation lottery then why should the committee donate my money to their fund raising event?

I'm not here to defend the ROK Committee but it's not as if they announced after the event that the tenner would go into general fund. They have announced it in advance and you have the option of deciding whether to enter or walk away.

(PS - I don't like it either. Just playing devil's advocate).

spookwoman

Did anyone notice they started putting that they were doing a buddy system so you could nominate another when entering. They posted it as a reply on some of the comments

seanin4711

shot dead

jon1981

Done it the last two years. Just getting less and less enjoyable due to the registration mess, will pass this year. Signed up to ring of Beara, 4000 cyclists, can't wait.

jon1981

funnights74 wrote: »

I am aware of the nature of the event, but if i am unsuccessful in the participation lottery then why should the committee donate my money to their fund raising event?

Someone mentioned that this might be a ploy to reduce numbers, I doubt it but who knows. If it is to reduce the number of applicants then most entering the lottery should get a ticket.

ItsLikeThis

jon1981 wrote: »

Someone mentioned that this might be a ploy to reduce numbers, I doubt it but who knows. If it is to reduce the number of applicants then most entering the lottery should get a ticket.

Its a ploy to raise more funds without raising the registration fee as they have done over the past few years. If they say the 10 Euro is to prevent multiple registrations, why couldn't they take card details, only charging the winners?
I know its all for a good cause, but I would rather give that money to an event that I am taking part in.

spookwoman

This so called donation of €10 for a lottery I wonder if this might be against Public Lotteries rules "You may not be able to class your raffle under the heading ‘Private Lotteries’ for example, if you are mailing out tickets to individuals in the post, if you are advertising the raffle to customers, or if the value of the prizes will be more than €4,000. "

If 11,000 people pay €10 per ticket and they win the prize of getting a cycle ticket they then get a refund of €10 totaling €110,000.......