Would you date a smoker?

lanos

Mister Vain wrote: »

The one night stand was exactly that, one night, so it wasn't that big of a deal. Plus I didn't know she was a smoker before hand. She only lit up after the shag so I then went on my way.

Your story does not add up.
The length of time from when you met her to the time you did the biz was so short
that she only needed a fag after the shag.
Let me guess, you picked up a girl and she was so attracted to you that you rushed
back to her place and shagged her brains out then she reveals the truth. SHE SMOKES.
so you get up and leave. I CALL BULLSH1T

lanos

Mister Vain wrote: »

Maybe she was just an occasional smoker, I don't know.

occasional smokers don't light up immediately after a shag with a new lover
committed smokers do.
also, where did this ONS occur
was it from a chance meeting on the supermarket aisles.
was it from a speed-date evening
or much more likely in a pub or night-club (although you claimed not to be intoxicated)

if it was a pub/night-club meeting, your occasional smoker would have smoked at least 5 fags from 9PM onwards.
And you didn't detect it.

come clean and admit its all crap

beks101

Yeah but not voluntarily. As in, it would turn me off if I just met a fella on a night out etc and he was a chain smoker. Would probably turn me off straight away.

But if I knew him for a while and then found out he was a smoker...I'd probably still fancy him but think "ah, shame."

My OH is a social smoker. He trains a lot so doesn't chain smoke or anything, three or four on a night out and he knows I'm not going to be kissing him if he's been on the fags. It's like kissing an ashtray.

PLL

I've never smoked in my life, and I've never taken drugs either. Don't like either. Yet I've been with someone 5 years who smokes cigarettes and the odd joint (neither are smoked in the house though). Why? You can't help who you fall in love with.

Shanotheslayer

Ianos should be a private detective.

Mister Vain

lanos wrote: »

Your story does not add up.
The length of time from when you met her to the time you did the biz was so short
that she only needed a fag after the shag.
Let me guess, you picked up a girl and she was so attracted to you that you rushed
back to her place and shagged her brains out then she reveals the truth. SHE SMOKES.
so you get up and leave. I CALL BULLSH1T

Jesus talk about going off on a tangent. What does it matter how it went down? My point is still valid.

lanos wrote: »

occasional smokers don't light up immediately after a shag with a new lover
committed smokers do.

if it was a pub/night-club meeting, your occasional smoker would have smoked at least 5 fags from 9PM onwards.
And you didn't detect it.

Ohh so you can speak for all smokers now can you? For the record, we didn't meet in a bar or club and it wasn't after 9pm so your point is completely irrelevant, as is the rest of your post.

Cold War Kid

Deleted User wrote: »

I occasionally like a smoke myself so dating an occasional or social smoker wouldn't be a problem.

Dating a 20-a-day smoker would be bother me a bit, though more so because I'd be worried about their health than the "eww" factor. I wouldn't necessarily refuse to date them but would definitely try and get them to cut back a lot if things got serious between us.

Very same here.

Greentopia

If he smoked the odd rollie socially maybe, if he was otherwise a great guy. They don't smell too bad IMO.

I hate the smell of filtered cigarettes though and find it a turn off-that smell on a smoker's breath when they come close is revolting, so I definitely wouldn't want to kiss them!

lanos

Mister Vain wrote: »

Jesus talk about going off on a tangent. What does it matter how it went down? My point is still valid.



Ohh so you can speak for all smokers now can you? For the record, we didn't meet in a bar or club and it wasn't after 9pm so your point is completely irrelevant, as is the rest of your post.

you're caught by the balls and have taken the title as After Hours biggest bullsh1tter.
I'm guessing the closest you have ever come to a one night stand was with pam and
her 5 sisters except you are probably acquainted with her multiple times, round the clock continuously since you turned 13.

next time you indulge in wishful thinking, make it some way plausible and don't mix your agendas.
Agenda 1: smoker bashing
Agenda 2: pretending you're sexually experienced.

cos those of us that have had quite a lot of ass can see right through you.


I'm expecting to be banned now, but that's ok cos I have a heavy workload coming up.

eternal

Humour interlude.

Mister Vain

lanos wrote: »

you're caught by the balls and have taken the title as After Hours biggest bullsh1tter.
I'm guessing the closest you have ever come to a one night stand was with pam and
her 5 sisters except you are probably acquainted with her multiple times, round the clock continuously since you turned 13.

next time you indulge in wishful thinking, make it some way plausible and don't mix your agendas.
Agenda 1: smoker bashing
Agenda 2: pretending you're sexually experienced.

cos those of us that have had quite a lot of ass can see right through you.


I'm expecting to be banned now, but that's ok cos I have a heavy workload coming up.

Ohh no you didn't. :pac: You always know a poster can't have an intelligent discussion when they have to resort to this sort of childish nonsense and snide remarks. There's only one bullsh1tter here and that's you mate. You've nothing to support your claims except for a set of bulls1t scenarios about one night stands and peoples smoking habits. You can't speak for all smokers.

I don't have an agenda, I just wouldn't date a smoker. You refuse to believe that a man could turn down a smoker just because she is attractive. This is what you said earlier -

I think some of the responses here say more about the persons indifference to sex than their aversion to smokers.
they should get more iron in their diet cos red-blooded they are NOT

That's just a bunch of crap, and again you've nothing to back it up. We all have deal breakers, and for some, smoking is one of them.

Mister Vain

Mister Vain wrote: »

I don't have an agenda, I just wouldn't date a smoker.

As a matter of interest, why not?

For others here it seems to be the smell, but you said you were with a smoker and you didn't even notice anything until they lit up afterwards. Which I completely accept - I think the smell thing all a bit exaggerrated to be honest, people overstating the smell as being the worst thing ever. People down through the decades seem to have overcome their outrage and disgust and managed to go (in much greater numbers) to pubs and clubs and cinemas and other areas where the smell of smoke was pervasive

So if you can't detect it by smell, ruling out the common objection, what is it? The concern that they are weak, that they'll die young?

Mister Vain

Deleted User wrote: »

As a matter of interest, why not?

For others here it seems to be the smell, but you said you were with a smoker and you didn't even notice anything until they lit up afterwards. Which I completely accept - I think the smell thing all a bit exaggerrated to be honest, people overstating the smell as being the worst thing ever. People down through the decades seem to have overcome their outrage and disgust and managed to go (in much greater numbers) to pubs and clubs and cinemas and other areas where the smell of smoke was pervasive

So if you can't detect it by smell, ruling out the common objection, what is it? The concern that they are weak, that they'll die young?

No it is just the smell and nothing else. Obviously if someone hasn't smoked in a while its not going to be as noticeable, and some people cover it up better than others with chewing gum etc. Now in saying that, some cigarettes are not as bad as others. Someone else said that the rollies are not as bad and I'd agree. For the most part though its just a horrible smell that I could never get used to. I've always hated it.

darkdubh

We don't date in this country,we shift.

Mister Vain

Mister Vain wrote: »

No it is just the smell and nothing else.

But you are saying you were so intimate with a woman as to have sex with her and had no idea she smoked until you saw it?

So clearly while the smell might be bad once detected and you hate it, you can say from your own experience that in reality - for all the exaggeration here - it can be undetectable.

I think the "it's vile, you can smell it a mile off, the worst thing ever" stuff is vastly overstated. No one is really referring to dating someone chain smoking woodbine, which even casual smokers might find too much. And your experience is a perfect demonstration of the nonsense, you didn't even realise it.

DivingDuck

Deleted User wrote: »

So if you can't detect it by smell, ruling out the common objection, what is it? The concern that they are weak, that they'll die young?

I wouldn't date a smoker. Partially because of the smell/taste issues mentioned previously, but there are other issues, also.

Smokers are less likely to be fit, which seems to be important to a lot of people on the dating scene.

Smoking increases your risk of many diseases and illnesses. I personally do not engage in high-risk behaviours, and I wouldn't want a life partner who did.

Also, if I were dating someone, it's likely they'd be in my house for prolonged periods. I wouldn't allow someone to smoke in my home, and I'd find it irritating if a partner had to keep popping outside every hour or two for a cigarette.

Everyone must have the right to make his or her own choice when it comes to smoking, but equally everyone must have the right to make their own choice about which actions and behaviours they find unacceptable in a partner.

padd b1975

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Suuuuure, all the fellows who'd turn down Cheryl Cole, Jessica Alba, Miley Cyrus, Keira Knightley, Gwyneth Paltrow etc. etc.

That's a fine gang of headwreckers you've assembled there.

The fact that they're smokers would be well down most people's* list of turn offs.




*Does not include hormonal teenage boys.

DivingDuck

DivingDuck wrote: »

I wouldn't date a smoker. Partially because of the smell/taste issues mentioned previously, but there are other issues, also.

Smokers are less likely to be fit, which seems to be important to a lot of people on the dating scene.

Smoking increases your risk of many diseases and illnesses. I personally do not engage in high-risk behaviours, and I wouldn't want a life partner who did.

Also, if I were dating someone, it's likely they'd be in my house for prolonged periods. I wouldn't allow someone to smoke in my home, and I'd find it irritating if a partner had to keep popping outside every hour or two for a cigarette.

Everyone must have the right to make his or her own choice when it comes to smoking, but equally everyone must have the right to make their own choice about which actions and behaviours they find unacceptable in a partner.

I smoke the occasional ciggie. I have run marathons and ultramarathons. My fitness is pretty outstanding. I also drink beer and eat chips by the way.

Do people really expect an idea of life expectancy when considering dates? That sounds...hilarious. Do they take family medical history, job, diet and all those other crucial matters into account?

As for prolonged periods, I step out of the house for about 10 minutes a day. My wife somehow manages to get through that time alone.

Mister Vain

Deleted User wrote: »

But you are saying you were so intimate with a woman as to have sex with her and had no idea she smoked until you saw it?

So clearly while the smell might be bad once detected and you hate it, you can say from your own experience that in reality - for all the exaggeration here - it can be undetectable.

I think the "it's vile, you can smell it a mile off, the worst thing ever" stuff is vastly overstated. No one is really referring to dating someone chain smoking woodbine, which even casual smokers might find too much. And your experience is a perfect demonstration of the nonsense, you didn't even realise it.

I've already explained this several times. There's a difference between having a one night stand with a smoker and being in a relationship with a smoker. In a relationship you have to put up with it constantly. As I said earlier, there are plenty of celebrities I'd gladly shag if I had the chance. If Cheryl Cole wanted to shag me, I could tolerate the tobacco stench for 20 minutes for the sake of the ride. But this thread is about dating smokers which is a different matter entirely.

Some people probably do exaggerate the smell, but for a lot of people, myself included, it is quite nasty and not something we could, or should have to put up with.

Btw, Cheryl is the only celebrity I'd shag out of the ones that were listed earlier. The rest I wouldn't touch regardless of whether or not they are smokers.

recipio

Smoking is repulsive. Having worked in the health services however its obvious that smokers attract smokers and vice- versa.
In a hundred years, when people look at old movies I'm sure they are going to wonder why people needed little white sticks between their fingers to function.

DivingDuck

Deleted User wrote: »

I smoke the occasional ciggie. I have run marathons and ultramarathons. My fitness is pretty outstanding. I also drink beer and eat chips by the way.

Do people really expect an idea of life expectancy when considering dates? That sounds...hilarious. Do they take family medical history, job, diet and all those other crucial matters into account?

As for prolonged periods, I step out of the house for about 10 minutes a day. My wife somehow manages to get through that time alone.

Do you disagree that your fitness would be better if you didn't smoke?

Different people consider different things. Some will and some won't, but the thread is simply about what each individual's answer is. I would.

I did not say that smokers would be outside for prolonged periods, I said they would be in my home for prolonged periods-- as in, they would be in my house long enough that they would require a cigarette within that time, and for me, that means they'd have to go outside. I'd feel badly forcing someone outside in Irish weather, but I wouldn't be happy letting them smoke in my home, either. Either way it's an uncomfortable situation easily avoided by dating a non-smoker like myself.

Overall, dating a non-smoker makes more sense for me personally. This is not an attack on smokers or anyone's right to smoke, it's simply an additional complication which I personally don't want to deal with.

Mister Vain

Mister Vain wrote: »

I've already explained this several times.

Oh I know you have tried to backtrack several times, but nevertheless you have clearly stated you had sex with a smoker and had absolutely no idea she smoked.

Which as I said does not mean that the smell is good bad or indifferent, but simply demonstrates that it can be pretty much undetectable. And so further undermines those who insist on absolutes, they would never ever dream of considering a woman even if she just had the occasional cigarette, they are tainted, smokers are only drawn to other smokers (a welcome and hilarious addition from someone claiming to work in the health service ) etc. etc.

DivingDuck

DivingDuck wrote: »

Do you disagree that your fitness would be better if you didn't smoke?.

The difference would be negligible, for what I smoke.

Changing my diet, or training more, would actually have a far more beneficial effect on my fitness. I can smoke a fag, put it out, and run 20km at well under 5 min per km easily. If I changed my diet or upped my training to, say 100km per week, I could make serious inroads in that.

Buck Melanoma

RichardCeann wrote: »

From the other thread.

As a reformed smoker, I wouldn't.

No, but i am married. If i wasn't.... i still wouldn't, disgusting habit.

Mister Vain

Deleted User wrote: »

you have clearly stated you had sex with a smoker and had absolutely no idea she smoked.

It's not like I was with her all day. It wasn't a date. She wasn't smoking when we met and probably hadn't smoked for a while before hand so how would I know? And even if I did detect it, I probably would have went ahead with it anyway for reasons I've already mentioned. But I wouldn't date or would want to be in a relationship with a smoker. End of story.

I wonder how many posters are here today cos somewhere going back along the chain, one of their parents or grandparents didn't apply such absolute rules, tolerated the smell that has recently become awful, and not only dated but had children with a smoker.

Neither myself now my wife would be around if people felt so strongly, in each case our mothers were non smokers.

Mister Vain

Mister Vain wrote: »

It's not like I was with her all day. It wasn't a date. She wasn't smoking when we met and probably hadn't smoked for a while before hand so how would I know? And even if I did detect it, I probably would have went ahead with it anyway for reasons I've already mentioned. But I wouldn't date or would want to be in a relationship with a smoker. End of story.

We don't gotta do this again, do we?

You had sex with a smoker. You couldn't tell that she smoked. It was, contrary to many claims here, undetectable. That's kinda the nub of the story, for all your efforts to say "but...but...I didn't mean it to be taken like that" now.

Mister Vain

Deleted User wrote: »

We don't gotta do this again, do we?

You had sex with a smoker. You couldn't tell that she smoked. It was, contrary to many claims here, undetectable. That's kinda the nub of the story, for all your efforts to say "but...but...I didn't mean it to be taken like that" now.

I don't know how you're not understanding this. If you're in a relationship with a smoker you're going to know about it. They'll be smoking near you regularly and that's something I couldn't tolerate. Can you not see how that's such a huge difference to a quick shag?

DivingDuck

Deleted User wrote: »

The difference would be negligible, for what I smoke.

Fair enough. I'm not a medical or sports professional, so I can't comment beyond saying that smoking is generally considered a detriment to physical fitness by those who do have expertise in those fields. Your personal situation may be different, I wouldn't know.

Deleted User wrote: »

I wonder how many posters are here today cos somewhere going back along the chain, one of their parents or grandparents didn't apply such absolute rules, tolerated the smell that has recently become awful, and not only dated but had children with a smoker.

This argument is ridiculous. The fact that something was once considered acceptable en masse (and indeed, highly desirable at various points in time) doesn't mean it needs to be considered desirable en masse now. There are many things which would have been previously considered acceptable/desirable in the past which would be looked on very poorly these days. Times and attitudes change, as they must. This perspective does not further your argument at all.

Unfortunately, this thread seems seems to have become "Defend your rationale for disliking something I enjoy doing because I'm offended that people wouldn't consider me good mating material on the basis of it". If that's your perspective, I don't think anything anyone can say is going to convince you that everyone has the absolute and total right to exclude anyone from their pool of prospective dates for whatever reason.

Chickentown

gud wrote: »

Not a hope. Even if she looked like Michelle keegan. ....

If Michelle Keegan was a heroin addict suffering from an extremely rare and vicious strain of AIDS, i'd not only go out with her but i'd never use protection.

I'm a responsible adult

lanos

Mister Vain wrote: »

That's just a bunch of crap, and again you've nothing to back it up. We all have deal breakers, and for some, smoking is one of them.

ah look lets agree to disagree, you wouldn't date a smoker and that's that
however I want to draw your attention to one thing

Mister Vain wrote: »

She only lit up after the shag so I then went on my way.

Mister Vain wrote: »

For the record, we didn't meet in a bar or club and it wasn't after 9pm so your point is completely irrelevant

that was a bit cruel wasn't it.
the poor girl met you somewhere (not a bar) during the day/early evening and was nice
enough to have a shag with you (personally I would take that as a nice compliment)
presumably it was a nice shag cos you said it was fine but then SHE LIT UP.
and instead of saying to her sorry I would prefer if you didn't smoke beside me.
instead you get up and leave, you just stood up and walked out
that comes across as very childish to me
.
.
.
if I believed any of it, but I don't

Mister Vain

lanos wrote: »

ah look lets agree to disagree, you wouldn't date a smoker and that's that
however I want to draw your attention to one thing





that was a bit cruel wasn't it.
the poor girl met you somewhere (not a bar) during the day/early evening and was nice
enough to have a shag with you (personally I would take that as a nice compliment)
presumably it was a nice shag cos you said it was fine but then SHE LIT UP.
and instead of saying to her sorry I would prefer if you didn't smoke beside me.
instead you get up and leave, you just stood up and walked out
that comes across as very childish to me
.
.
.
if I believed any of it, but I don't

I couldn't care less if you believe me or not and it doesn't really matter either as the thread is about dating smokers. I was merely explaining how its not as much of an issue (at least not for me), in a ONS situation because you're only with the person for a short period of time. If I'm with a smoker over a long period of time and I hate the smell, then obviously its going to be more bothersome, which is why I wouldn't date a smoker. Surely you can understand that even if you don't believe everything else I said?

Big Nasty

Mister Vain wrote: »

I couldn't care less if you believe me or not and it doesn't really matter either as the thread is about dating smokers. I was merely explaining how its not as much of an issue (at least not for me), in a ONS situation because you're only with the person for a short period of time. If I'm with a smoker over a long period of time and I hate the smell, then obviously its going to be more bothersome, which is why I wouldn't date a smoker. Surely you can understand that even if you don't believe everything else I said?

At least you know what you want and when you want it Mr. Vain.

Mister Vain

Big Nasty wrote: »

At least you know what you want and when you want it Mr. Vain.

Exactly. I'm fairly sure she did too, otherwise I'm been cruel apparently. :pac:

Big Nasty

Mister Vain wrote: »

Exactly. I'm fairly sure she did too, otherwise I'm been cruel apparently. :pac:

Sing it with me:

I know what I want and I want it now,
I want you, 'cause I'm Mister Vain.

:pac:

lanos

Mister Vain wrote: »

Surely you can understand that even if you don't believe everything else I said?

i understand that you have very polarized views.
i see this a lot with my 20-something work colleagues.
it fades a bit in their 30s and is mostly gone by
the time they reach their 40s

the girl of your dreams may be a smoker just waiting for an excuse to quit.

you have probably seen the movie Yes Man starring Jim Carey
watch it again and heed the message.
open your mind to new possibilities and the next time a stranger beside you
reaches for a post-coital cigarette, don't bolt for the door immediately.
peace dude - sorry for calling you a bullsh1tter

Mister Vain

lanos wrote: »

i understand that you have very polarized views.
i see this a lot with my 20-something work colleagues.
it fades a bit in their 30s and is mostly gone by
the time they reach their 40s

the girl of your dreams may be a smoker just waiting for an excuse to quit.

you have probably seen the movie Yes Man starring Jim Carey
watch it again and heed the message.
open your mind to new possibilities and the next time a stranger beside you
reaches for a post-coital cigarette, don't bolt for the door immediately.
peace dude - sorry for calling you a bullsh1tter

There are plenty of people that don't date smokers though. There is a reason why it is asked on most dating sites. On POF it is the very first thing that comes up on a persons profile. It's obviously a big issue for a lot of people. Granted for some it may be more to do with health implications more so than the smell, but either way it would appear to be a deal breaker for a lot of people.

Medusa22

I'd date a smoker if I liked the person enough. It wouldn't put me off but I wouldn't be too ecstatic about it either. I have a lung condition though so it would be problematic if the person wanted to smoke indoors or if we were to live together, I just couldn't have them smoking around me indoors.

Stacksofwacks

As an ex smoker, i know how hard it is to give up. I tried for years before i finally gave up. I'd be prepared to give a person a break as long as they want to give it up eventually. I know it takes time and many tries and many different approaches. It's not until you actually go off them a while do you fully realise how bad it actually is, the smell particularly.

metaoblivia

No, wouldn't date a smoker. It's one of my few deal breakers right off the bat. I'd reiterate several of the reasons already stated - health, smell, etc. Plus, I'm a classical singer and being around smoke isn't good for my vocal chords. I've put in too many years of training and practice to put that at risk. As it happens, I don't actually know many people who smoke. No one in my family does and none of my close friends do. For me, that's a good thing.

NotYourYear20

I have dated a smoker but I'd never do it again. Because the taste and nicotine smell of their breath eventually killed off the passion in me.

MysticalRain

Definitely a deal breaker for me as well. The smell is up there with BO and bad breath. It's not like there isn't plenty of other fish the pond to choose from.

Tropheus

No and there are so many young women that chose to smoke for some reason.

Tony Beetroot

Once she wouldn't be a star fish I would.

DivingDuck

DivingDuck wrote: »

This argument is ridiculous. The fact that something was once considered acceptable en masse (and indeed, highly desirable at various points in time) doesn't mean it needs to be considered desirable en masse now. There are many things which would have been previously considered acceptable/desirable in the past which would be looked on very poorly these days. Times and attitudes change, as they must. This perspective does not further your argument at all.

Unfortunately, this thread seems seems to have become "Defend your rationale for disliking something I enjoy doing because I'm offended that people wouldn't consider me good mating material on the basis of it". If that's your perspective, I don't think anything anyone can say is going to convince you that everyone has the absolute and total right to exclude anyone from their pool of prospective dates for whatever reason.

I didn't know what smells good or bad (or what really doesn't smell that much at all, but prompts slight overreaction these days) changes over time. Thanks.

And I don't think excluding anyone from the pool of prospective dates because they smoke, eat chips, eat chocolate etc. is beyond criticism.

I am amused you brought "I'm offended" into it. Surely, if anything, the sensitive people here are the ones saying "smoking offends me so much that if Stevie Nicks herself begged me, even if I couldn't smell one whiff of smoke, I'd turn her down...cos she'd be outside the house too often".

We also both know that...well it's a lie and people are taking positions that are really not true.

Mister Vain

Deleted User wrote: »

I didn't know what smells good or bad (or what really doesn't smell that much at all, but prompts slight overreaction these days) changes over time. Thanks.

And I don't think excluding anyone from the pool of prospective dates because they smoke, eat chips, eat chocolate etc. is beyond criticism.

I am amused you brought "I'm offended" into it. Surely, if anything, the sensitive people here are the ones saying "smoking offends me so much that if Stevie Nicks herself begged me, even if I couldn't smell one whiff of smoke, I'd turn her down...cos she'd be outside the house too often".

We also both know that...well it's a lie and people are taking positions that are really not true.

It's not a lie, you just refuse to believe it. So many on this thread have said they wouldn't date a smoker. Have a look at the deal breakers thread, same thing. And as I mentioned already, its one of the first questions thats asked on dating sites. Would you date someone with BO or who had horrible breath all the time?

Mister Vain

Mister Vain wrote: »

It's not a lie, you just refuse to believe it. So many on this thread have said they wouldn't date a smoker. Have a look at the deal breakers thread, same thing. And as I mentioned already, its one of the first questions thats asked on dating sites. Would you date someone with BO or who had horrible breath all the time?

You are the person whose absolute position on not dating smokers is the least credible.

Seeing as (i) you'd have sex with them and (ii) you can't detect it unless they pretty much light up and blow a smoke ring in your face!

Akrasia

My wife smokes and the smell isn't the biggest issue, it's all the other aspects of smoking that bother me.

1. The fact that every time she calls me on the phone, she's outside having a fag, and I can hear her dragging on the cigarette and holding her breath and blowing it out over the phone. It's like talking to someone on a ventilator, and that's probably what will happen eventually

2. Smoking takes priority over everything else. It's the first thing she does in the morning and the last thing she does at night. If we're going somewhere it's always 'I know we're late, but i'll just have a quick fag first'. With the children, sometimes one of the kids is screaming for her mother and I'm left literally holding the baby while she's outside having a fag.

3. it's messy and the ashtrays/bins are smelly and 90% of smokers throw their butts on the floor at least sometimes, and cigarette butts are invisible to smokers, so I'm the one who ends up cleaning them up.

4. It affects her mood. If she thinks she's going to run out of tobacco and doesn't have access to a shop to get more, she gets so so so cranky.

5. it's a topic that is completely off limits. I cannot bring it up because she already knows that she should quit

6. it's the most selfish thing that she does, in every other aspect of her life, she's warm and generous and wonderful in every way, but with smoking, it can bring out the worst in her and will probably end up killing her.

Akrasia

Akrasia wrote: »

every time she calls me on the phone, she's outside having a fag...
...
2. Smoking takes priority over everything else. It's the first thing she does in the morning and the last thing she does at night...
4. It affects her mood...she gets so so so cranky....
will probably end up killing her.

It sounds like she smokes a lot.

But you say she is warm and generous and wonderful and ye married and have children and you can enjoy all the things that came because you did not take the absolute position that some here do.

Akrasia

Deleted User wrote: »

It sounds like she smokes a lot.

But you say she is warm and generous and wonderful and ye married and have children and you can enjoy all the things that came because you did not take the absolute position that some here do.

Yeah, obviously nobody's perfect, even I, have been known to have some minor flaws on occasion

Smoking is nowhere close to being the worst thing someone can do.

For me a real deal breaker would be something like habitual dishonesty or a callous disregard for the feelings of others. Someone's bad habits are minor character flaws, we all have them, every one of us. But if the rest of our character is decent and warm then that's the most important thing.