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4 years renting now looking for a 12-month lease

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  • 22-07-2015 12:06am
    #1
    wicklowwonder
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭


    Got a letter today informing us of a 20% rent increase, which is massive but one or two houses in the area on daft for this price most are 10% dearer but that's another issue.

    The letter also said that because we rented the property for 4 years the landlord required us to sign a new 12 month agreement. Is this legal/correct?

    In our last contract signed 4 years ago it said the contract would continue with either party giving the other 30 days notice to vacate after initial 12 months which suited us fine, now they want a 12 month agreement, so we would be tied on for another year. Any thoughts? My thoughts are maybe they feel we are here too long and would like us to move along for some reason? We always pay on time, never cause hassle and here four years I can't understand why they want a 12 month commitment. We have had a rent rise every year but this is by far the largest. I was expecting a 10% rise not 20% I was not expecting a 12 mth commitment and obviously a new contract too.

    If mortgages rose by 20% with a months notice it would be front page of every paper but renters are not cared about at all. Anyway any thoughts on the new contract or advice?


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    #2
    moc moc a moc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,299 ✭✭✭moc moc a moc


    Look up 'further Part 4 tenancy rights'.


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    #3
    wicklowwonder
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭wicklowwonder


    moc moc a moc wrote: »
    Look up 'further Part 4 tenancy rights'.

    Cool, so I need to inform them I want to further my part 4 tenancy rights and if the landlord isn't happy they can throw me out in the first 6 months of this period with 112 days notice but I can leave in this six months with 4 weeks notice... Ideal really

    Thanks


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    #4
    moc moc a moc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,299 ✭✭✭moc moc a moc


    Personally I'd start looking at similarly priced places in the vicinity and inform the landlord that you are doing so and expect to give moving notice soon. This might give you a bit more bargaining power.


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    #5
    cmssjone
    Registered Users Posts: 355 ✭✭cmssjone


    moc moc a moc wrote:
    Personally I'd start looking at similarly priced places in the vicinity and inform the landlord that you are doing so and expect to give moving notice soon. This might give you a bit more bargaining power.


    Depends on your location. You have already said that other similar properties in the area are more expensive and remember rents are increasing at the moment.


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    #6
    wicklowwonder
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭wicklowwonder


    cmssjone wrote: »
    Depends on your location. You have already said that other similar properties in the area are more expensive and remember rents are increasing at the moment.

    I am only moaning about the 20% increase. It is excessive, I don't mind paying 10% extra but I am happy to negotiate with them on that, I am not keen on signing a new 12 month agreement. The way I look at it, signing a 12 month deal I could move somewhere cheaper and still have to commit to 12 months but I would rather stay where I am on a part 4.


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    #7
    Michael D Not Higgins
    Registered Users Posts: 7,223 ✭✭✭Michael D Not Higgins


    wicklowwonder wrote: »
    Cool, so I need to inform them I want to further my part 4 tenancy rights and if the landlord isn't happy they can throw me out in the first 6 months of this period with 112 days notice but I can leave in this six months with 4 weeks notice... Ideal really

    Thanks

    8 weeks notice not 4. The notice periods don't reset for further Part 4 tenancies. You cannot agree shorter notice in advance either, although you can agree a shorter notice when the time comes.


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    #8
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,423 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Haggle. Not just cash - is there anything you need done to the property?


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    #9
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,218 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »
    8 weeks notice not 4. The notice periods don't reset for further Part 4 tenancies. You cannot agree shorter notice in advance either, although you can agree a shorter notice when the time comes.

    I thought at the end of the year period it reverts to the start again?


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    #10
    Michael D Not Higgins
    Registered Users Posts: 7,223 ✭✭✭Michael D Not Higgins


    godtabh wrote: »
    I thought at the end of the year period it reverts to the start again?

    The security of tenure operates in 4 year cycles, but notice periods do not.


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    #11
    gizmo555
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,948 ✭✭✭gizmo555


    wicklowwonder wrote: »
    I am only moaning about the 20% increase. It is excessive . . .

    Why is it excessive? You say yourself the proposed new rent is still 10% less than some similar properties in the area and there are none available for less. It actually sounds like you've been getting a very good deal up to now, but that the rent is now being adjusted in line with the market.

    The landlord is entitled to charge the prevailing market rent, which is defined as what a willing new tenant would be prepared to pay to a willing landlord.


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    #12
    wicklowwonder
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭wicklowwonder


    Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »
    The security of tenure operates in 4 year cycles, but notice periods do not.

    Ok, my reading of this

    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/types_of_tenancy.html

    under Further Part 4 tenancy
    gave me the impression that a new tenancy began and the periods where reset.


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    #13
    wicklowwonder
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭wicklowwonder


    gizmo555 wrote: »
    Why is it excessive? You say yourself the proposed new rent is still 10% less than some similar properties in the area and there are none available for less. It actually sounds like you've been getting a very good deal up to now, but that the rent is now being adjusted in line with the market.

    The landlord is entitled to charge the prevailing market rent, which is defined as what a willing new tenant would be prepared to pay to a willing landlord.

    Yeah I know I am on a good deal that is why I said:

    "one or two houses in the area on daft for this price most are 10% dearer but that's another issue."

    I have no problem paying a 10% increase and I will be telling the landlord this. I just think 20% is excessive.


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    #14
    gizmo555
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,948 ✭✭✭gizmo555


    Sorry, I may have misunderstood you. I thought you were saying the proposed new rent is still 10% less than other rents in the area.

    If you feel the proposed new rent is genuinely out of line with the going market rate and you don't get anywhere negotiating, you can always complain to the PRTB, who will decide the matter.


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    #15
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,218 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »
    The security of tenure operates in 4 year cycles, but notice periods do not.

    are they not the same thing?


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    #16
    wicklowwonder
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭wicklowwonder


    gizmo555 wrote: »
    Sorry, I may have misunderstood you. I thought you were saying the proposed new rent is still 10% less than other rents in the area.

    If you feel the proposed new rent is genuinely out of line with the going market rate and you don't get anywhere negotiating, you can always complain to the PRTB, who will decide the matter.

    No one or two similar properties are 20% higher than our rent and the same price as proposed by the landlord the majority are 10% higher and one or two (which I wouldn't live in) are the same rent as I currently pay, sorry if I confused you. I could settle for a 10% increase.

    It is the 12 month commitment I would not be keen on, truthfully I hope to be in a position to move out within 6-9 months.


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    #17
    Michael D Not Higgins
    Registered Users Posts: 7,223 ✭✭✭Michael D Not Higgins


    wicklowwonder wrote: »
    Ok, my reading of this

    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/types_of_tenancy.html

    under Further Part 4 tenancy
    gave me the impression that a new tenancy began and the periods where reset.

    The table shows over 2 years is 8 weeks notice from the tenant. I understand your confusion though, it is clumsily worded.
    godtabh wrote: »
    are they not the same thing?

    No, the security of tenure is the right of the tenant to stay in the rented home (providing they meet their obligations) in 4 year cycles. The notice periods are the lengths of time when breaking of the tenancy must be notified in advance.


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