BER assessment head-scratcher

alastair

Just had a BER assessor in ahead of putting our house on the market.
It's a Victorian end-of-terrace, with primarily single glazing, lots of open fireplaces, and probably too many halogen downlighters, so we weren't expecting a fantastic rating (and we don't know yet what it'll be), but...

I hadn't realised that any uncertified insulation is effectively ignored. The house has a mix of external, underfloor, and dry lining insulation in place, but this doesn't register in the assessment - without some form of certification, it's as if it's not there at all. The face of some of the external insulation is actually visible, but it can't be included in the rating!

Now, I know that the system is a broad brushstroke one, and shouldn't be mistaken for a serious energy-effeciency measure, but that's rather farcical.

ted1

Yep.

Cuddlesworth

But a quick walk around changing some lightbulbs and your current appliances can affect the rating instead.

Youngblood.III

If I removed a condenser dryer (probably a high energy user) from a house would this improve my rating during an assessment?

billbond4

@Youngblood.III I always wondered the same as well

MicktheMan

Youngblood.III wrote: »

If I removed a condenser dryer (probably a high energy user) from a house would this improve my rating during an assessment?

No

Youngblood.III

Bar fitting energy saving blubs...what else can a person do to improve a rating? Thanks.

MicktheMan

Youngblood.III wrote: »

Bar fitting energy saving blubs...what else can a person do to improve a rating? Thanks.

Nothing really unless you want to invest on upgrading the building fabric, windows, ch boiler and/or controls.

Beware though that some poorly thought through "energy upgrades", while improving the BER, can actually have no effect on comfort / pocket of the homeowner or even degrade the comfort and the health of the inhabitants.

Cookie_Monster

alastair wrote: »

I hadn't realised that any uncertified insulation is effectively ignored.

why is this, do you really need a cert these days if you want to redo your attic insulation, a bit much isn't it?

crisco10

MicktheMan wrote: »

Nothing really unless you want to invest on upgrading the building fabric, windows, ch boiler and/or controls.

Beware though that some poorly thought through "energy upgrades", while improving the BER, can actually have no effect on comfort / pocket of the homeowner or even degrade the comfort and the health of the inhabitants.

Care to elaborate?

alastair

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

why is this, do you really need a cert these days if you want to redo your attic insulation, a bit much isn't it?

To be fair - attic insulation doesn't seem to be an issue - they check that, and measure thickness - it doesn't seem to require anything other than to exist.

iguana

alastair wrote: »

Now, I know that the system is a broad brushstroke one, and shouldn't be mistaken for a serious energy-effeciency measure, but that's rather farcical.

When I bought my house last year I expected a reasonably low BER rating but was surprised to see it was written that the singleglazing was a cause of massive heat loss and it was suggested that they be replaced asap. I was pretty surprised as I was sure the house had double glazing. Our survey was a couple of weeks later and I brought along the BER to go through it with the engineer and he said the windows were actually extremely high quality double glazing, only a few years old and with no issues. On further investigation we found one small single glazed window on the back extension. So in a house with 17 windows, the 16 double glazed ones were ignored and the whole rating was based on one window. It really is an absolute joke of an assessment and to prove it, I had a perfectly toasty winter in my F rated, large roomed house on just €500 worth of oil.

D_D

iguana wrote: »

When I bought my house last year I expected a reasonably low BER rating but was surprised to see it was written that the singleglazing was a cause of massive heat loss and it was suggested that they be replaced asap. I was pretty surprised as I was sure the house had double glazing. Our survey was a couple of weeks later and I brought along the BER to go through it with the engineer and he said the windows were actually extremely high quality double glazing, only a few years old and with no issues. On further investigation we found one small single glazed window on the back extension. So in a house with 17 windows, the 16 double glazed ones were ignored and the whole rating was based on one window. It really is an absolute joke of an assessment and to prove it, I had a perfectly toasty winter in my F rated, large roomed house on just €500 worth of oil.

Same thing with myself. House with 8 windows, all relatively new and all double glazed. The assessment was based on assuming single glazing for the windows as beside my front door there was a small square feature window, about 500mm x 500mm. This was the only single glazed window. Thought it was madness at the time to make their assumption.

MicktheMan

crisco10 wrote: »

Care to elaborate?

Sure. One example,
A common "upgrade" is to dryline the external walls on the inside with insulated plasterboard. This moves the dew point of the external walls to the old inner surface where significant condensation can occur. This condensate then allows mould to thrive at the back of the insulation.
It also increases the relative humidity inside the dwelling with a commensurate rise in the dust mite population. There are direct links established between dust mite concentration (really their faeces) and respiratory illnesses such as asthma.

the_syco

iguana wrote: »

On further investigation we found one small single glazed window on the back extension.

You'll also find that two BER assessors may give different reading, as like any surveyor it's their experience that differs the outcome, from my understanding.

L1011

D_D wrote: »

Same thing with myself. House with 8 windows, all relatively new and all double glazed. The assessment was based on assuming single glazing for the windows as beside my front door there was a small square feature window, about 500mm x 500mm. This was the only single glazed window. Thought it was madness at the time to make their assumption.

Limitation of the software that generates the reports

Between this and lazy/useless assessors (and no easy way of telling if you had a good one or not) the system is worthless. Its basically a job creation scheme.

Michael D Not Higgins

L1011 wrote: »

Limitation of the software that generates the reports

Between this and lazy/useless assessors (and no easy way of telling if you had a good one or not) the system is worthless. Its basically a job creation scheme.

I know the idea is that they can do limited training and get people out doing assessments, but they should really have some experienced people they can defer part of an assessment to like in this case.

scrimshanker

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

I know the idea is that they can do limited training and get people out doing assessments, but they should really have some experienced people they can defer part of an assessment to like in this case.

Yeah, in the meantime though, best look for an assessor who is also an architect, engineer or building surveyor. Or a retired arch/eng/surveyor. At least then you're getting someone who is knowledgeable about buildings!