13 Vacant units on Main St Castlebar

6541

There are 13 Vacant units on Main st Castlebar between the bridge and The Connaught Telegraph, that does not include Ellison Street.

yop

6541 wrote: »

There are 13 Vacant units on Main st Castlebar between the bridge and The Connaught Telegraph, that does not include Ellison Street.

And? That is hardly news and probably applicable to many many towns.

Even this morning they were talking about O'Connell St this morning on Newstalk and the amount of vacant units on one of the countrys main streets.

yorlum11

Main streets are not what they once were, the centre of a towns business and activity. Now it's retail parks and the likes. Also parking is easier. It's time for main streets to reinvent themselves.

mickdw

yorlum11 wrote: »

Main streets are not what they once were, the centre of a towns business and activity. Now it's retail parks and the likes. Also parking is easier. It's time for main streets to reinvent themselves.

Main street Castlebar really is dead. It is awkward to park, doesn't have the Top shops anymore and generally is of poor appearance.
The main shopping area surely had to be the new street with argos, post office etc.

Westernyelp

Main st. needs to become an entertainment/ restaurant zone, proper financial incentives etc to develop and refurbish these businesses. Op is right about all the empty units. it is time to try some thing radical. Pedestrianisation under a roof anyone?

mickdw

Westernyelp wrote: »

Main st. needs to become an entertainment/ restaurant zone, proper financial incentives etc to develop and refurbish these businesses. Op is right about all the empty units. it is time to try some thing radical. Pedestrianisation under a roof anyone?

Yes I think you are right re the future of the area. Pedestrianised certainly. I like your idea of an outdoor roofed area. Not sure it would need that though.

henryporter

Was roofing not proposed a few years ago. Tbh it's the fault of allowing all the retail development of recent times to migrate out towards Tescos and that is irreversible damage to the main street

Shelflife

Its the result of poor planning that the heart has been ripped out of so many towns in the whole country. They allowed the Tescos Aldis and Lidls to build on the outskirts and drag all the business away from the area.

its the same in the Uk where high streets are filled with charity shops and amusement arcades and attract no one into the area.

CoCo allow too many of the big outlets into an area and this in turn kills off many of the smaller shops, net result is fewer shops,fewer employed and fewer paying rates. This leads to a loss in income and a lowering of services and standards and the introduction of parking charges which puts another nail in the coffin of the main street businesses as people go to the out of town shops where there is no parking charge which leads to fewer ..... you see where im going here .

The sad thing is that this was all clearly signalled in the UK yet the Irish authorities let it happen here.

The worst thing is that people really think that bringing Tesco,Aldi and Lidl into a town give them more choice but over time it doesnt.

Tesco for eg sells white goods, books,flowers and Cds. There will usually be specialist shops in the town for all these. Tesco will sell the top 20 best sellers in these 3 categories and because of their size will be able to sell these items cheaper than the specialist shops. So the specialist shops close as they cant compete on their bread and butter items.

Now you can no longer get your CD of the best of Barry Manilow or your Book on the art of fly fishing by J R Hartley or a bulb for your 10 year old fridge or your wifes favourite orchid for her birthday.

Prior to the arrival of these shops you could get all these things but now you cant and yet people claim they have more choice ?

yop

Shelflife wrote: »

Its the result of poor planning that the heart has been ripped out of so many towns in the whole country. They allowed the Tescos Aldis and Lidls to build on the outskirts and drag all the business away from the area.

its the same in the Uk where high streets are filled with charity shops and amusement arcades and attract no one into the area.

CoCo allow too many of the big outlets into an area and this in turn kills off many of the smaller shops, net result is fewer shops,fewer employed and fewer paying rates. This leads to a loss in income and a lowering of services and standards and the introduction of parking charges which puts another nail in the coffin of the main street businesses as people go to the out of town shops where there is no parking charge which leads to fewer ..... you see where im going here .

The sad thing is that this was all clearly signalled in the UK yet the Irish authorities let it happen here.

The worst thing is that people really think that bringing Tesco,Aldi and Lidl into a town give them more choice but over time it doesnt.

Tesco for eg sells white goods, books,flowers and Cds. There will usually be specialist shops in the town for all these. Tesco will sell the top 20 best sellers in these 3 categories and because of their size will be able to sell these items cheaper than the specialist shops. So the specialist shops close as they cant compete on their bread and butter items.

Now you can no longer get your CD of the best of Barry Manilow or your Book on the art of fly fishing by J R Hartley or a bulb for your 10 year old fridge or your wifes favourite orchid for her birthday.

Prior to the arrival of these shops you could get all these things but now you cant and yet people claim they have more choice ?

Agreed, thats why I hate the likes of Tesco, over power and under price the local shops/stores and then drag everything to their side of town. Few towns seem to able to resist.
Also the planning was short sighted and not probably thought out.
If they roofed it then it would certainly help.

monument

yop wrote: »

And? That is hardly news and probably applicable to many many towns.

Yes and no.

It's not half as bad in Ballina for example. As others have pointed out, poor planning killed Castlebar Main Street.

yop wrote: »

Even this morning they were talking about O'Connell St this morning on Newstalk and the amount of vacant units on one of the countrys main streets.

O'Connell Street in Dublin isn't any way as bad as it is made out to be, usually by people southsiders who always have a problem going north of the Liffey.

O'Connell In Dublin has three issues which should or will be sorted in the short to mid-term:

(1) Luas Cross City works are underway and are ramping up now; this makes the place into a on-going building site for the next two years or so. And it makes the place harder to get to (congestion, bus stops moving on an on-going bases, taxi ranks moving, bicycle parking limited etc). So, unless the retailer has no clue or unless rents are dropped in a big way, empty units are unlikely to be rented any time soon. But Luas will improve the street once it is finished.

(2) Clerys was maybe the most landmark retailer on the street and the new owners had every intent in closing it down for their short-term gain of redeveloping the site. It's a property play which said to hell with Clerys and all the businesses and staff. This may get even more messy as many councillors are not impressed with the new owners and we don't know what the planners may do.

(3) a very large percent of the street is taken up by a late boom-time project which ran out of time. This will likely sort its self out but it will time.

All of these things are already progressing. Main Street Castlebar is not or does not seem to be.

yorlum11 wrote: »

Main streets are not what they once were, the centre of a towns business and activity. Now it's retail parks and the likes. Also parking is easier. It's time for main streets to reinvent themselves.

It's true to say that the some things have changed and those things are unlikely to change back (ie affect from the internet, expanded retail area etc).

But retail parks have killed town centres but there was no need for that to happen. It was poor planning.

henryporter wrote: »

Was roofing not proposed a few years ago. Tbh it's the fault of allowing all the retail development of recent times to migrate out towards Tescos and that is irreversible damage to the main street

Shelflife wrote: »

Its the result of poor planning that the heart has been ripped out of so many towns in the whole country. They allowed the Tescos Aldis and Lidls to build on the outskirts and drag all the business away from the area.

its the same in the Uk where high streets are filled with charity shops and amusement arcades and attract no one into the area.

CoCo allow too many of the big outlets into an area and this in turn kills off many of the smaller shops, net result is fewer shops,fewer employed and fewer paying rates. This leads to a loss in income and a lowering of services and standards and the introduction of parking charges which puts another nail in the coffin of the main street businesses as people go to the out of town shops where there is no parking charge which leads to fewer ..... you see where im going here .

The sad thing is that this was all clearly signalled in the UK yet the Irish authorities let it happen here.

The worst thing is that people really think that bringing Tesco,Aldi and Lidl into a town give them more choice but over time it doesnt.

Tesco for eg sells white goods, books,flowers and Cds. There will usually be specialist shops in the town for all these. Tesco will sell the top 20 best sellers in these 3 categories and because of their size will be able to sell these items cheaper than the specialist shops. So the specialist shops close as they cant compete on their bread and butter items.

Now you can no longer get your CD of the best of Barry Manilow or your Book on the art of fly fishing by J R Hartley or a bulb for your 10 year old fridge or your wifes favourite orchid for her birthday.

Prior to the arrival of these shops you could get all these things but now you cant and yet people claim they have more choice ?

Agreed!

signostic

mickdw wrote: »

Yes I think you are right re the future of the area. Pedestrianised certainly. I like your idea of an outdoor roofed area. Not sure it would need that though.

cant seem to find many streets that are roofed but hers an example
Petling St Kuala Lumpar

witnessrenegade

signostic wrote: »

cant seem to find many streets that are roofed but hers an example
Petling St Kuala Lumpar

Was in Hobart in Tasmania during New Years and one of their main shopping streets is roofed and pedestrianized, the street had some of the big names in Australia store on the street and all the coffee shops and restaurants had tables outside which was nice too. Imagine if Castlebar did something like that, it would be great. At the moment for such a big county town the range of eateries is low as well as the quality. Something like this should be done for Main Street, if the incentives were their to attract a few bars/restaurants to take the plunge it would be great for the street, not to mention with more choice it could curb the amount of people that leave the town every night for Westport.

6541

11 units on Ellison Street are empty, cavendish lane completely empty

*Mod Note: Don't post comments like again pls. Won't be warned again.*

6541

Fair point, but what I said is true. Ask anyone in Castlebar.

yop

6541 wrote: »

Fair point, but what I said is true. Ask anyone in Castlebar.

I don't really care, comments like that don't belong on a public forum like this.

nuac

Out of town supermarkets have done a lot of damage to town centres

In the eighties there was Ministerial Directive in force under t he Planning Acts disallowing out of town supermarkets unless the retail space was under 25% of the total retail space in the town.

That went, I think on competition grounds. Even the smaller centres in Mayo - e.g. Swinford and Ballinrobe have their out of town Tescos.

Likewise the other supermarket chains. Along with the garage shops this creates the doughnut effect. Castlebar is an extreme examples

When that happened in Galway ( Dunnes on Headford Road ) it was thought that all Galway retail trade would likewise migrate to the outskirts. Some did, but not all,

The centre of Castlebar is not as strong commercially as the heart of Galway,

Re Roofing it in, I recall P Flynn suggesting that years ago. It would take a lot to organise, pay for, and retain that.

I doubt if there are enough shoppers in the catchment area to justify it.

As Castlebar Town COuncil has now gone, thanks to Hogan and FG, the County Councilllors may not support such a project. There are only small number of councillors from the town. The others arr unlikely to support a project which does not benefit the county at large

Tourists prefer to head for the coastal resorts rather than come for a shopping experience, even if covered in.

Perhaps pedestrianisation of the street, and marketing of the main street and adjoining streets are the way to go.

Councils now seem to rely on income from parking as part of it's revenue stream rather than payment for providing a serviice. Free parking would attract more footfall. The parking areas are now provided for some time, so much of the capital cost should have been paid off. Some wardens would be needed to control parking, but not as many as now. The warden could be paid from general council income . i.e. rates. Fines imposed could offset this

monument

nuac wrote: »

Free parking would attract more footfall.

That's not at all proven -- the opposite seems to be true.

If you put in free-for-all parking it kills turnover of shoppers etc, spaces get filled up by retail staff and other town-centre workers who fill spaces; people who are not spending money fill spaces; people who could have walked or cycled are encouraged to drive and fill the spaces.

nuac wrote: »

The parking areas are now provided for some time, so much of the capital cost should have been paid off.

On-street paid parking and car park parking does not work that way and capital costs are just one cost -- maintenance, staff costs etc and revenue raising to provide other services. Local government is chronically under-funded. Instead of property tax adding to funding, they reduced other funding at the same time.

mickdw

signostic wrote: »

cant seem to find many streets that are roofed but hers an example
Petling St Kuala Lumpar

Cabot circus in Bristol is an interesting layout imo.
It's a purpose built shopping area, roofed but with an outdoor feel as the roofs are only rain shields so to speak. They do not seal the building and you get lots of fresh air and and outdoors feeling with light rain sprinkling in at a couple of small areas - by design I feel.
While it is very different to trying to roof an existing street, I can imagine the atmosphere that could be created.

Westernyelp

nuac wrote: »

Out of town supermarkets have done a lot of damage to town centres

In the eighties there was Ministerial Directive in force under t he Planning Acts disallowing out of town supermarkets unless the retail space was under 25% of the total retail space in the town.

That went, I think on competition grounds. Even the smaller centres in Mayo - e.g. Swinford and Ballinrobe have their out of town Tescos.

Likewise the other supermarket chains. Along with the garage shops this creates the doughnut effect. Castlebar is an extreme examples

When that happened in Galway ( Dunnes on Headford Road ) it was thought that all Galway retail trade would likewise migrate to the outskirts. Some did, but not all,

The centre of Castlebar is not as strong commercially as the heart of Galway,

Re Roofing it in, I recall P Flynn suggesting that years ago. It would take a lot to organise, pay for, and retain that.

I doubt if there are enough shoppers in the catchment area to justify it.

As Castlebar Town COuncil has now gone, thanks to Hogan and FG, the County Councilllors may not support such a project. There are only small number of councillors from the town. The others arr unlikely to support a project which does not benefit the county at large

Tourists prefer to head for the coastal resorts rather than come for a shopping experience, even if covered in.

Perhaps pedestrianisation of the street, and marketing of the main street and adjoining streets are the way to go.

Councils now seem to rely on income from parking as part of it's revenue stream rather than payment for providing a serviice. Free parking would attract more footfall. The parking areas are now provided for some time, so much of the capital cost should have been paid off. Some wardens would be needed to control parking, but not as many as now. The warden could be paid from general council income . i.e. rates. Fines imposed could offset this

The supermarkets in Castlebar are all quite close to thel town centre, with the exception of Lidl

nuac

monument wrote: »

That's not at all proven -- the opposite seems to be true.

If you put in free-for-all parking it kills turnover of shoppers etc, spaces get filled up by retail staff and other town-centre workers who fill spaces; people who are not spending money fill spaces; people who could have walked or cycled are encouraged to drive and fill the spaces.



On-street paid parking and car park parking does not work that way and capital costs are just one cost -- maintenance, staff costs etc and revenue raising to provide other services. Local government is chronically under-funded. Instead of property tax adding to funding, they reduced other funding at the same time.

OK, I suggest as in many places there should be free parking for,say, two hours, to be paid for after that

Charges should be the minimum.

E.g capital costs should already have been paid off in many cases.

E.g on Castlebar Main street the property owners had extensive back gardens. On the north-side these extended to the river. They dedicated that ground free of charge to the Urban Council to provided parking. There could not have been undue expense in surfacing it as the ground was firm and reasonably level. In many other places Councils similarly got backland at no cost e.g. in compliance with PP conditions.

Re : maintenance and management costs

I know local authorities bump up parking fees to use as a revenue stream to cover their other expenses, and to meet salaries.

However that is wrong. None of the governments since 1977 have fully replaced the revenue lost by local authorities since the abolition of rates on private houses that year. Local authorities and remaining ratepayers should demand this be done.

I recall some Town Planner saying that parking spaces are the lungs of a town. Only the direct cost of providing them should be charged

Xenji

Just noticed that Bolands have closed as well, and that the building that got gutted by that fire years back was actually a double unit, so technically there are 15 vacant units.

6541

Xenji wrote: »

Just noticed that Bolands have closed as well, and that the building that got gutted by that fire years back was actually a double unit, so technically there are 15 vacant units.

Seriously loads of empty units around. Not one street that is not effected.

Westernyelp

To let sign has been taken down from Bolands again and the sign painted out. maybe it has been let

Xenji

I see that the hairdressing supply shop has moved from main street to Thomas street, another empty unit now.