Nissan Leaf

from_atozinc

from_atozinc wrote: »

True. But then you have not got the comfort of an ice car in regard to range anxiety.

another q. Is it true you get a grant of 600 Euro to buy install the home charger ?

Can the job essentially be done for this making the home charger free ? Or is trying to do it for 600 alone just cutting corners and asking for trouble ?

Any other comments on this?

Soarer

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks. What’s SOH ?

I’m doing some amount of humming and hawing alright

Sometimes I think yes, just do it. And then I think of the trickery involved with charging and range anxiety.

SOH is State Of Health, fancy speak for battery capacity.

There's no trickery involved with charging. You either charge or you don't.
Range anxiety only come into play if you do something out of the ordinary. What's your usual daily commute/routine?

from_atozinc wrote: »

Any other comments on this?

It means you can get it done for free if everything comes in under €600. No corner cutting needed.
I posted in another thread where you can get a tethered type 1 Rolec charger with additional 3 pin socket delivered for less than €400 ( I think). That leaves €200 for your local sparks to install, and the whole lot is free. Even if it cost you another €100 on top for awkwardness, it's still only standing you €100 all in.

from_atozinc

Soarer wrote: »

SOH is State Of Health, fancy speak for battery capacity.

There's no trickery involved with charging. You either charge or you don't.
Range anxiety only come into play if you do something out of the ordinary. What's your usual daily commute/routine?



It means you can get it done for free if everything comes in under €600. No corner cutting needed.
I posted in another thread where you can get a tethered type 1 Rolec charger with additional 3 pin socket delivered for less than €400 ( I think). That leaves €200 for your local sparks to install, and the whole lot is free. Even if it cost you another €100 on top for awkwardness, it's still only standing you €100 all in.

Thanks. be nice to get it done for free
Is the Rolec well regarded?
What is the story with 16 amp and 32 amp, I hear talk of this, but ntt sure what it means


Previous to this, was there any grant etc for SECOND hand EV buyers for the charger install?

waynegalway

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks. be nice to get it done for free
Is the Rolec well regarded?
What is the story with 16 amp and 32 amp, I hear talk of this, but ntt sure what it means


Previous to this, was there any grant etc for SECOND hand EV buyers for the charger install?

16a and 32a relate to how quickly you can get energy into the car. If your car has the 3.3kW charger onboard, then a 16a one is fine. However, I’d recommend getting the 32a, just to future proof. A 32a won’t charge a 3.3kW Leaf any faster, but it will charge a 6.6kW one if you ever upgrade.

As far as I know, there was never a grant for the unit for 2nd hand cars. There certainly wasn’t when I picked up my one last November. It only came in this year.

from_atozinc

waynegalway wrote: »

16a and 32a relate to how quickly you can get energy into the car. If your car has the 3.3kW charger onboard, then a 16a one is fine. However, I’d recommend getting the 32a, just to future proof. A 32a won’t charge a 3.3kW Leaf any faster, but it will charge a 6.6kW one if you ever upgrade.

As far as I know, there was never a grant for the unit for 2nd hand cars. There certainly wasn’t when I picked up my one last November. It only came in this year.

Thanks. That grant is great for 2nd have buyers.

Is there much of a difference in price between the 13a and 32a ?

In regard to the electrician, surely it can’t be that big of a job. Max 4 hours if nothing too complicated with the setup. What kind of prices have people been quoted ?

goz83

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks. That grant is great for 2nd have buyers.

Is there much of a difference in price between the 13a and 32a ?

In regard to the electrician, surely it can’t be that big of a job. Max 4 hours if nothing too complicated with the setup. What kind of prices have people been quoted ?

16 and 32A....no they are basically same price.

from_atozinc

goz83 wrote: »

16 and 32A....no they are basically same price.

No brainier so.

waynegalway

from_atozinc wrote: »

No brainier so.

When I was looking at chargers and fitting last October there was a price difference between the two versions. At that stage the 32a was about €200 more expensive.

If there is no price difference now, then it’s a no brainer.

TBH even if there still is a couple of hundred in it, you’d be as well of getting the 32a if your budget can cope. It leaves you set up for faster charging down the line.

The install is reasonably straightforward. In my case it involved about 7m of cable, plus whatever magic goes on in the fuse box, plus a priority switch. The switch is important if you have an electrical shower in your house, as it diverts power away from your car when the shower comes on to avoid over loading the system.

from_atozinc

waynegalway wrote: »

When I was looking at chargers and fitting last October there was a price difference between the two versions. At that stage the 32a was about €200 more expensive.

If there is no price difference now, then it’s a no brainer.

TBH even if there still is a couple of hundred in it, you’d be as well of getting the 32a if your budget can cope. It leaves you set up for faster charging down the line.

The install is reasonably straightforward. In my case it involved about 7m of cable, plus whatever magic goes on in the fuse box, plus a priority switch. The switch is important if you have an electrical shower in your house, as it diverts power away from your car when the shower comes on to avoid over loading the system.

your electrician cost 350, was that a bit steep?

waynegalway

from_atozinc wrote: »

your electrician cost 350, was that a bit steep?

I think the final bill was €320, actually. Possibly a little dear, but cost wasn’t my main reason for choosing him.

Shefwedfan

from_atozinc wrote: »

your electrician cost 350, was that a bit steep?

The cables are not cheap. I was similar money, circa 300....

Wait till you price some of the "specialist installer" companies. They will want 1,000 befor even looking at the house.....

Nothing specialist about them, any good electrician can do the install

unkel

Shefwedfan wrote: »

The cables are not cheap. I was similar money, circa 300....

6mm2 cable is a few euro per meter. A 40A RCBO is €25. Ducting is also a few euro. And that's all full retail prices. €300 is madness for a standard EVSE install that takes not much more than an hour to complete. Half of that is more than generous.

from_atozinc

unkel wrote: »

6mm2 cable is a few euro per meter. A 40A RCBO is €25. Ducting is also a few euro. And that's all full retail prices. €300 is madness for a standard EVSE install that takes not much more than an hour to complete. Half of that is more than generous.

That’s what I was thinking too. 300+ Euro for a standard enough job seems very expensive. Back to Celtic tiger rubbish again I suppose.

Blueskys!

Soarer wrote: »

SOH is State Of Health, fancy speak for battery capacity.

There's no trickery involved with charging. You either charge or you don't.
Range anxiety only come into play if you do something out of the ordinary. What's your usual daily commute/routine?



It means you can get it done for free if everything comes in under €600. No corner cutting needed.
I posted in another thread where you can get a tethered type 1 Rolec charger with additional 3 pin socket delivered for less than €400 ( I think). That leaves €200 for your local sparks to install, and the whole lot is free. Even if it cost you another €100 on top for awkwardness, it's still only standing you €100 all in.

Need to wait for tesla s lads the chargers are on motorways

waynegalway

unkel wrote: »

6mm2 cable is a few euro per meter. A 40A RCBO is €25. Ducting is also a few euro. And that's all full retail prices. €300 is madness for a standard EVSE install that takes not much more than an hour to complete. Half of that is more than generous.

The cable I got was much bigger than 6mm2.

My electrician and his assistant were here for about 3 hours, so in my case the price was about right considering parts and labour. Every job will be different, and I’m sure a very straightforward job, with the cheapest cable and shortest distance, with no priority switch, which could be done by one person in an hour would no doubt be less than the €320 I paid. But for my particular install, what I paid was about right. Yes, perhaps I could have got it slightly cheaper, but not by much, and importantly, not by the electrician that I can rely on.

unkel

That sounds like a big enough job alright!

waynegalway wrote: »

The cable I got was much bigger than 6mm2.

That's 6mm2 copper core width. How long was the run of cable roughly? If it is very long (over 20m or so iirc) then they need to use 10mm2 meter for a 32A EVSE. Otherwise 6mm2 is the standard (and just 4mm2 for a 16A EVSE)

And those figures seem to be very conservative, compared to Dutch building regs:

Linky


Apologies, was the first thing Google threw up, but the table is pretty easy to understand

waynegalway

unkel wrote: »

That sounds like a big enough job alright!



That's 6mm copper core width. How long was the run of cable roughly? If it is very long (over 20m or so iirc) then they need to use 10mm2 meter for a 32A EVSE. Otherwise 6mm2 is the standard (and just 4mm2 for a 16A EVSE)

And those figures seem to be very conservative, compared to Dutch building regs:

Linky


Apologies, was the first thing Google threw up, but the table is pretty easy to understand

Total cable length was about 7m, and IIRC it was the 10mm cable that was used, for a 32A unit. Definitely not the 6, as I recall the electrician saying that he used a bigger size. I've painted over the cable now, so I can't read what was printed on it. The overall diameter of the cable is about 17-18mm. I know the core is less, but all I can visually check at the moment is the overall cable diameter.

goz83

waynegalway wrote: »

Total cable length was about 7m, and IIRC it was the 10mm cable that was used, for a 32A unit. Definitely not the 6, as I recall the electrician saying that he used a bigger size. I've painted over the cable now, so I can't read what was printed on it. The overall diameter of the cable is about 17-18mm. I know the core is less, but all I can visually check at the moment is the overall cable diameter.

Sounds like 10mm2 alright. But for a 7m run, that is serious overkill as its a lot harder to work with than 6mm2. The run to my 32A evse is about the same and we used 6mm2. 10mm2 is only needed for long runs.

Anyway, i’m sure you’re happy with the install. Thats what matters.

from_atozinc

Can anyone recommend a model of charger. Be it online or in a shop etc. I have no idea of who the players are in this market.

unkel

waynegalway wrote: »

The overall diameter of the cable is about 17-18mm. I know the core is less, but all I can visually check at the moment is the overall cable diameter.

Yeah that sounds like 10mm2 core alright, that's a big fat cable!

Still I don't understand how a sparks and his apprentice spent 3 hours installing it, were there any complications?

In fairness my own installation was as easy as they come, EVSE on outside of the same wall that has my CU on the inside. 3-4m cable used tops. Took the installer a bit over an hour (that said, he was a very experienced installer, working for Nigel Daly).

from_atozinc

hi, to avail of the night rate with an electric supplier, I presume they have to come out and install something.

1. Is there a cost to getting this installed
2. Are there hidden extra costs associated with the night rate, like you are getting cheaper el;electricity at night, so would they add charges somewhere else because of this

waynegalway

from_atozinc wrote: »

hi, to avail of the night rate with an electric supplier, I presume they have to come out and install something.

1. Is there a cost to getting this installed
2. Are there hidden extra costs associated with the night rate, like you are getting cheaper el;electricity at night, so would they add charges somewhere else because of this

You need to contact and shop around with a few suppliers, but essentially the second meter should be installed free of charge.

You will then pay a second standing charge on that meter every month.

There are no "hidden extra costs" as such, but it is worth noting that any electricity you use during the day time will more than likely be more expensive than you are currently paying. As I said, you need to shop around, but from reading posts in here (and going off my sometimes dodgy memory from when I looked into it last October), in rough terms you will be paying in the region of about 8cent per unit at night and 15c during the day. Individual suppliers will have their own rates, so ring around.

In the end, I went with a flat rate (12.6c per unit) with Energia, because I knew I'd want to charge the car during the day just as much as at night.

I'm not sure of the exact figure, but I think the night meter only pays for itself if you use something like 30% of your electricity at night. Which you probably would if you charged your car only at night. But you'd probably want to consider timer switches too, so that things like clothes washing/drying and the dishwasher worked at night too, to get the most out of it.

unkel

You have to ring your own electricity provider (i.e. Energia), they will organise for the ESB to come out and change your meter

1. No, it is completely free
2. Yes. Your standing charge will go up by about €50 for the year. And your day rate will go up by about €0.01 per kWh. But your night rate will be really cheap. If you don't change any of your habits, but charge your car up from empty to full once a week, you already make a significant saving. You can save even more by running washing machine and dish washer etc. at night

Shefwedfan

unkel wrote: »

6mm2 cable is a few euro per meter. A 40A RCBO is €25. Ducting is also a few euro. And that's all full retail prices. €300 is madness for a standard EVSE install that takes not much more than an hour to complete. Half of that is more than generous.

Seemed reasonable enought to me....fuse board was at back of house. House already has 2 electric showers installed so a bit of messing with priority switch that was already installed....maybe 2 hours he was at it, not sure as he was doing a few other jobs so was around all day....

I was happy, he was happy.....everyone was happy

from_atozinc

still undecided after the weekend test drive, my main thing is range and the constant need to charge, maybe I am a bit nervous and charging to0 often. If I was in a routine and had a home charging point installed, I may be more comfortable.

This morning for example - drove in to work. no ac or heating on etc. drove 20.2 km. Battery went from 82% to 57%
so a 25% drop. so each journey to and from work is 50% gone lets say. If I potter about in evening or during day a few more % gone.
The during winter time, this could be 60% used. and pottering will add more.

and this is all in a 2106 car with all 12 bars.

If I buy a 2013 Gen 1, it will be worse.

So sounds like to be comfortable, I will nearly need to charge it very night from home.

waynegalway

from_atozinc wrote: »

still undecided after the weekend test drive, my main thing is range and the constant need to charge, maybe I am a bit nervous and charging to0 often.

This morning for example - drove in to work. no ac or heating on etc. drove 20.2 km. Battery went from 82% to 57%
so a 25% drop. so each journey to and from work is 50% gone lets say. If I potter about in evening or during day a few more % gone.
The during winter time, this could be 60% used. and pottering will add more.

and this is all in a 2106 car with all 12 bars.

If I buy a 2013 Gen 1, it will be worse.

So sounds like to be comfortable, I will nearly need to charge it very night from home.

I'd suggest that the more you drive it, the better you get at increasing economy. There's a mindset and a style of driving that comes naturally after a while. I'd say that most, if not all of us on here, got "better" at driving our EVs over time.

I know for myself, I was using 18/19kWh per 100km at the start. When I got used to how to drive it, that went to down to 16-ish in the cold weather. Now I'm down to 14-15kWh per 100km in the warmer weather.

You will get better economy than you got on the test drive, almost certainly.

You're saying it took 25% of the battery to go 20km, basically. That's a lot more than I would use in mine.

For example, yesterday I left home with 100%. Drove into Galway (24km) and had 83% left. Drove home (24km again), had 65% left. Had to nip out again (ironically, to the nearest petrol station for fuel for the lawn mower), so ended up parking up for the night having covered 58km, with 55% battery left. Drove to work this morning (25km), had 38% left. It's plugged in at work now, so I'll leave here with 100%, and repeat!

So, I covered 83km from 62% battery. To be honest, that's just about the best I ever got. That was with Eco mode on 95% of the time, and in D-mode all the time except when slowing down to junctions. That would give me about 130km range from full.

As I mentioned, 1km per 1% battery is a decent enough guideline, and should be easily achievable in all but the depths of winter (or if you drive too fast!).

from_atozinc

waynegalway wrote: »

I'd suggest that the more you drive it, the better you get at increasing economy. There's a mindset and a style of driving that comes naturally after a while. I'd say that most, if not all of us on here, got "better" at driving our EVs over time.

I know for myself, I was using 18/19kWh per 100km at the start. When I got used to how to drive it, that went to down to 16-ish in the cold weather. Now I'm down to 14-15kWh per 100km in the warmer weather.

You will get better economy than you got on the test drive, almost certainly.

You're saying it took 25% of the battery to go 20km, basically. That's a lot more than I would use in mine.

For example, yesterday I left home with 100%. Drove into Galway (24km) and had 83% left. Drove home (24km again), had 65% left. Had to nip out again (ironically, to the nearest petrol station for fuel for the lawn mower), so ended up parking up for the night having covered 58km, with 55% battery left. Drove to work this morning (25km), had 38% left. It's plugged in at work now, so I'll leave here with 100%, and repeat!

So, I covered 83km from 62% battery. To be honest, that's just about the best I ever got. That was with Eco mode on 95% of the time, and in D-mode all the time except when slowing down to junctions. That would give me about 130km range from full.

As I mentioned, 1km per 1% battery is a decent enough guideline, and should be easily achievable in all but the depths of winter (or if you drive too fast!).

Thanks, in depths of winter, how much could the battery decrease. 2% for every 1k ?

waynegalway

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks, in depths of winter, how much could the battery decrease. 2% for every 1k ?

In my experience, getting 1km per 1% was do-able, driving carefully. Others may have a different experience, but I'd imagine 0.8km per 1% would/should be the worst you'd get. I think if you were using 2% for 1km, you'd either be driving like a lunatic or there would be something wrong with the car.

The biggest drain on battery is speed (and arguably going up steep hills), so if you were doing 120km/h on the motorway, you probably would get less than 1km per 1%, but with that in mind most people would take it slower on the motorway.

from_atozinc

lets say I installed a charging point at my house. and all was working fine etc etc

Then If I was to move to a new house, are the only costs associated with this (1) uninstall old charging point (2) re install it at new house. i.e get an electrician again to do the work.
I presume a grant is not available in this Scenario of moving house

and obviously then, would need to sort out the night meter and rates stuff.

waynegalway

from_atozinc wrote: »

lets say I installed a charging point at my house. and all was working fine etc etc

Then If I was to move to a new house, are the only costs associated with this (1) uninstall old charging point (2) re install it at new house. i.e get an electrician again to do the work.
I presume a grant is not available in this Scenario of moving house

and obviously then, would need to sort out the night meter and rates stuff.

Yes, the grant is associated with the car, so you'd only get that once per purchase. (Now, I'm not sure how it would work if you were to "sell" the car to someone else in your household....)

So, yeah, the only cost would be the uninstall and reinstall.

For the night meter end of things, I assume you'd let your supplier know that you're moving, and then they'd put a night meter in your new place and carry on as normal. The question then would be whether the person buying your old house would want the extra standing charge for two meters, and if they didn't, then it would be their choice to have it removed. Alternatively, perhaps you could have the meter itself moved by the supplier to your new house, but you'd have to talk to a supplier to find out about that and whether there would be any costs associated.