OL Maths Marking Scheme Adjusted

lostatsea

Interesting article in today's Irish Times:

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/leaving-cert-maths-marking-scheme-adjusted-after-complaints-1.2305820

Doctorhopeful

Why is this news? This happens every single year and everyone was reassured straight after the exam that marking schemes are always adjusted to ensure that only a certain percentage of people fail. This is run of the mill stuff.

lostatsea

It is news because it is an acknowledgement by the SEC that a totally unsuitable exam paper was set in June putting thousands of students through unnecessary stress. The mere fact that the marking scheme is used in an arbitrary fashion to produce the same proportion of A's, B's... is purely a device aimed at covering up the real problem, i.e the inability of the SEC to produce a consistent paper year after year.

Mistakes of this nature will continue unless there is some accountability on this issue.

rainbowtrout

lostatsea wrote: »

It is news because it is an acknowledgement by the SEC that a totally unsuitable exam paper was set in June putting thousands of students through unnecessary stress. The mere fact that the marking scheme is used in an arbitrary fashion to produce the same proportion of A's, B's... is purely a device aimed at covering up the real problem, i.e the inability of the SEC to produce a consistent paper year after year.

Mistakes of this nature will continue unless there is some accountability on this issue.

It's actually very difficult to produce a paper that is of exactly the same difficulty from year to year without just substituting the numbers in the questions. It's the same for all subjects. Have a look at the marking schemes in other leaving cert subjects and you will see an adjustment of marks. The only reason maths gets so much coverage is that a lot of courses require it for entry, so if students fail they will probably not get their college course.

This goes on in third level too and all over the world. Adjusting marking schemes to fit a curve is not confined to Leaving Cert Maths.

Doctorhopeful

lostatsea wrote: »

It is news because it is an acknowledgement by the SEC that a totally unsuitable exam paper was set in June putting thousands of students through unnecessary stress. The mere fact that the marking scheme is used in an arbitrary fashion to produce the same proportion of A's, B's... is purely a device aimed at covering up the real problem, i.e the inability of the SEC to produce a consistent paper year after year.

Mistakes of this nature will continue unless there is some accountability on this issue.

But adjusting the marking scheme happens literaly EVERY YEAR regardless of whether people complained about it being unfair or not - that's just how things work, they just had to announce it this year to quell people's fears. The likelihood of the SEC producing a test that produces the desired amount of each grade without any adjustment is next to none.

And anyway, in the article the SEC specifically said that the test was within the boundaries of the syllabus so this isn't an admission of fault at all? This is what everyone was told would happen but everyone was in too much of a tizzy to listen (which is understandable due to the importance of maths and the general stress of the LC).

I'm glad that everyone can have this reassurance but this was always gonna be the outcome.

EDIT: ' adding that the SEC was “satisfied that the range of tasks set on the 2015 ordinary-level mathematics examination was fully consistent with the syllabus” ' - this is the part i was talking about re it not being an admission of fault

lostatsea

I cannot disagree with the previous two contributors. I suppose I'm making a slightly different point. What is really at issue here is the size of the adjustment made to the marking scheme in order to produce the same annual proportion of results among students.

If this adjustment was based let's say on a 40% failure rate based on the initial representative sample of results then there is a serious problem in the system: Either the SEC have no idea how to set a suitable paper or the standard of maths is plummeting.

Unfortunately, an adjusted marking scheme will hide these problems and allow them to continue unabated.

rainbowtrout

But now you're just making up a random stat, and then basing your opinion that the SEC aren't able to set suitable papers, on it.


There was a lot of complaining about this year's maths paper, but students mightn't have done as badly as they thought either. Nobody can speculate until the marking schemes are released at the end of August.

lostatsea

Of course I have to speculate when we just don't know. The problem is not knowing.

If we did know, it would help to inform the debate.

It is about the right to know so we don't have to engage in speculation.

rainbowtrout

lostatsea wrote: »

Of course I have to speculate when we just don't know. The problem is not knowing.

If we did know, it would help to inform the debate.

It is about the right to know so we don't have to engage in speculation.

Why do you feel you have a right to know this information?

lostatsea

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Why do you feel you have a right to know this information?

That's a good question - the public's right to know or not?

The Government brought in an initiative called Project Maths to improve the standard of maths in this country. Opinion is mixed on the success or otherwise of this initiative. It is very difficult to get solid statistical information on whether this initiative is improving the overall standard of maths. The Government tells us it is a success primarily based on the increased uptake at higher level maths although the effect of bonus points makes it very difficult to measure this effect.

The adjustment of the marking scheme based on the results of the representative sample of results masks any deficiencies in the standard of maths over time. A lot of research is using secondary sources as in the case of the University of Limerick who felt there was a deterioration in maths standards based on their first year intake over a number of years.

It is obviously in the Government's interest to tell us that this initiative is working given the amount of money and time invested in it. However, if there is a problem with maths education I think it is in the public interest to know.

rainbowtrout

1. If similar adjustments were made in the years prior to project maths then what conclusion could be drawn?

2. A lot of maths at third level involves calculus. A lot of project maths involves writing paragraphs on statistics. I think that has caused problems at third level.

3. Do I think maths has disimproved in students? Yes. Do I think it's all down to project maths? No. I think there is a much bigger problem. I see students in my classroom everyday up as far as leaving very reaching for a calculator to do basic arithmetic. They've been doing this since primary school and there is no longer any value placed on learning times tables. It's my view that if they don't know this basic stuff that part of the time spent on looking at complex problems is spent figuring this stuff out with their calculators. This is stuff that should come naturally to them so the rest of their time can focus on the complexities of problem solving.

lostatsea

rainbowtrout wrote: »

1. If similar adjustments were made in the years prior to project maths then what conclusion could be drawn?

2. A lot of maths at third level involves calculus. A lot of project maths involves writing paragraphs on statistics. I think that has caused problems at third level.

3. Do I think maths has disimproved in students? Yes. Do I think it's all down to project maths? No. I think there is a much bigger problem. I see students in my classroom everyday up as far as leaving very reaching for a calculator to do basic arithmetic. They've been doing this since primary school and there is no longer any value placed on learning times tables. It's my view that if they don't know this basic stuff that part of the time spent on looking at complex problems is spent figuring this stuff out with their calculators. This is stuff that should come naturally to them so the rest of their time can focus on the complexities of problem solving.

It would obviously be difficult to make comparisons from year to year because of some of the changing circumstances that you point out.

The statistical information of the breakdown of grades based on the initial representative sample probably represents a random sample of close to 5% of the population and gives us important information before artificial adjustments are made to the marking system.

I think if this information is analysed sensibly in conjunction with other factors it will add to our picture of the present state of maths in Ireland.

Trying to get the information is obviously the problem.

I agree with you about the problem of the calculator.