Today FM 15 for 15

Meath Centre Forward

This is my team based on who was available in each of the dropdowns:

Cluxton
McKeever - Fay - Lacey
O'Se - McGeeney - Jordan
O'Se - Cavanagh
Flynn - McDonald - Galvin
Cooper - Canavan - Fitzgerald

I considered everyone available even if they only played a year or two in the 15 year period.

Cluxton in goals is a certainty.

I found the backs much easier to pick than the forwards. For me, the most difficult player from 2 - 7 to leave out was Conor Gormely. In fact if he was available as a number 7, I'd have picked him ahead of Jordan. Marc O'Se, Sean Marty Lockhart, Anthony Lynch and Graham Canty are all unlucky but I would not pick any of them ahead of them ahead of any of those I picked.

Midfield comes down to O'Se, Cavanagh and Tohill. Tohill is the unfortunate one.

The forwards are really difficult to pick and there's a long list of players that you have to consider. For me the options at 10 and 12 are weak compared to 11 where I had to leave out the likes of Giles and Declan O'Sullivan for McDonald but I'd have Giles and O'Sullivan at 10 and 12 if they were available there. The competition is fierce for the full-forward positions but I can't see too many picking teams without Gooch, Canavan or Fitzgerald. There around a dozen unlucky players including Ollie Murphy, Padraic Joyce, Stephen O'Neill, Stephen McDonnell & Bernard Brogan.

So if you could move players around I would go with something like

Cluxton
McKeever - Fay - Lacey
O'Se - McGeeney - Gormely
O'Se - Cavanagh
Giles - McDonald - O'Sullivan
Cooper - Canavan - Fitzgerald

ciarriaithuaidh

Meath Centre Forward wrote: »

This is my team based on who was available in each of the dropdowns:

Cluxton
McKeever - Fay - Lacey
O'Se - McGeeney - Jordan
O'Se - Cavanagh
Flynn - McDonald - Galvin
Cooper - Canavan - Fitzgerald

I considered everyone available even if they only played a year or two in the 15 year period.

Cluxton in goals is a certainty.

I found the backs much easier to pick than the forwards. For me, the most difficult player from 2 - 7 to leave out was Conor Gormely. In fact if he was available as a number 7, I'd have picked him ahead of Jordan. Marc O'Se, Sean Marty Lockhart, Anthony Lynch and Graham Canty are all unlucky but I would not pick any of them ahead of them ahead of any of those I picked.

Midfield comes down to O'Se, Cavanagh and Tohill. Tohill is the unfortunate one.

The forwards are really difficult to pick and there's a long list of players that you have to consider. For me the options at 10 and 12 are weak compared to 11 where I had to leave out the likes of Giles and Declan O'Sullivan for McDonald but I'd have Giles and O'Sullivan at 10 and 12 if they were available there. The competition is fierce for the full-forward positions but I can't see too many picking teams without Gooch, Canavan or Fitzgerald. There around a dozen unlucky players including Ollie Murphy, Padraic Joyce, Stephen O'Neill, Stephen McDonnell & Bernard Brogan.

So if you could move players around I would go with something like

Cluxton
McKeever - Fay - Lacey
O'Se - McGeeney - Gormely
O'Se - Cavanagh
Giles - McDonald - O'Sullivan
Cooper - Canavan - Fitzgerald

Maurice Fitz was an impact sub with Kerry (rightly or wrongly) in 2000 and 2001, and never played for Kerry after that.

It's ridiculous to pick him on this team and that's coming from a Kerry man who thinks he's in the top 5 players he's ever seen...

If that's Kieran McKeever right corner back ahead of Marc O'Sé and Sean Marty Lockhart then you've lost it aswell IMO.

Ceist_Beag

This team will always be more about who is left out than who is in the 15 ... that said I can't imagine any 15 for this period which does not have Seamus Moynihan in the back 6.

JB81

I am from Tyrone and may be called bias for this but;

Peter Canavan may have played the majority of his football in the 90's, but he done enough in the 5 years from 2000 that i cant get over how many people have not got him in their team.

ciarriaithuaidh

JB81 wrote: »

I am from Tyrone and may be called bias for this but;

Peter Canavan may have played the majority of his football in the 90's, but he done enough in the 5 years from 2000 that i cant get over how many people have not got him in their team.

Have to agree there..and I'm no Tyrone fan as my username indicates!

2005 final performance was at a level of genius that few players ever reach.

Royce McCutcheon

Gary Connaughton
Marc Ó’Sé
Darren Fay
Keith Higgins
Tomas Ó’Sé
Kieran McGeeney
Philip Jordan
John Galvin
Darragh Ó’Sé
Stephen O’Neill
Ciaran McDonald
Declan Browne
Colm Cooper
Bernard Brogan
Padraic Joyce


I think Cluxton will be a shoein for the actual selection but from my own pov Connaughtan was a lot more solid despite being in a much weaker team. Was a tough decision in midfield and it was basically a flip of a coin between o Se and Cavanagh

Felexicon

BonnieSituation wrote: »

I am extremely biased against him and it would be with a heavy heart that I would list him as my 15th player.

As I said, the ones above are in my team without an iota of questioning from me.

The problem with Canavan is that despite him possibly being the greatest ever that I've seen, he only played til 2005 and I'm doing my darnedest to get a good spread over the years.

You can be biased against him all you want but that doesn't mean you can deny that he has been the best player in country over the last 15 years.
Crazy not to have him in the side.
Being a Meath man I'm not a big fan of Diarmuid Connolly but at the same time I can appreciate what a fantastic footballer he is

BonnieSituation

Felexicon wrote: »

You can be biased against him all you want but that doesn't mean you can deny that he has been the best player in country over the last 15 years.
Crazy not to have him in the side.
Being a Meath man I'm not a big fan of Diarmuid Connolly but at the same time I can appreciate what a fantastic footballer he is

I know I can. But I seem to recall that I stated that I would probably include him after some soul searching.

I don't like him as a player.
Never have. Same with all those people picking Graham Canty. Cannot abide the man. There's no real rationale. C'est la vie.

So while there is say justification of including him over say Stephen O'Neill, O'Neill is probably in my top-5 favourite players of all time and therefore will probably end up in my 15.

The list is subjective. That's the fun part of it.

Stoner

Lots of guys picking lads from their own county alright. While that is fair enough saying they were great but saying they were held back playing in weaker teams is inaccurate. Many of these lads were big fish in little ponds and never really went through the complete tests for players.

However we can still hold a belief that they would be on the best team and select them, but that would be an opinion of how they would perform versus players who did perform and that's shakey ground. But they should be listed.

I couldn't imagine a top 15 without P Canavan. Not my favourite person but definitely the best I ever saw by a mile.

Hulk Hands

It's just whether you take the 15 years stuff literally with Canavan. People can look with rose tinted glasses a bit, and I'd agree he's probably the best forward listed overall, but he was used as an impact sub for a fair period of that 00-05 time which technically we're judging on. As in did he realistically get close to footballer of the year in that time? 2 all stars, one of which was contentious at the time as he only started the final (05). So should you leave out say Gooch (best forward over the whole period), Brogan (nearly single handedly dragged dubs to a final, played huge role in winning the following year), Joyce (dragged team to 00 final, 10 pts in 01 final), McDonnell (FOTY in 03, great for years after). That's without mentioning great players like Declan Browne, Michael Murphy etc

davegrohl48

Who would people rate as the best forward from a weaker country?
For me it is Paul Barden. When he was on his A Game he was going at the centre of the oppositions defence like a force of nature. He has some 80 yard solo run and score if I recall? The other thing was that he was big and physical so could mix it in any company. Whenever Longford won qualifier games it usually coincided with a 10/10 display by Paul Barden.

ciarriaithuaidh

davegrohl48 wrote: »

Who would people rate as the best forward from a weaker country?
For me it is Paul Barden. When he was on his A Game he was going at the centre of the oppositions defence like a force of nature. He has some 80 yard solo run and score if I recall? The other thing was that he was big and physical so could mix it in any company. Whenever Longford won qualifier games it usually coincided with a 10/10 display by Paul Barden.

Would have Declan Browne, Niall McNamee, Matty Forde ahead of him at least.

Current Donegal manager Rory Gallagher was a hell of player on his day aswell. Any man who can score 3-9 in an Ulster championship match deserves a mention!

Paul Barden was a good player, but not even the best Longford player of my lifetime I'd have to say. Dessie Barry would take the laurels there. Saw him play a few times and he was a really classy corner forward.

davegrohl48

ciarriaithuaidh wrote: »

Would have Declan Browne, Niall McNamee, Matty Forde ahead of him at least.

Current Donegal manager Rory Gallagher was a hell of player on his day aswell. Any man who can score 3-9 in an Ulster championship match deserves a mention!

Paul Barden was a good player, but not even the best Longford player of my lifetime I'd have to say. Dessie Barry would take the laurels there. Saw him play a few times and he was a really classy corner forward.

All of those good players too you mention. I don't know much about Dessie Barry but you clearly know your Longford football. I just liked the way Barden would be out around the middle or centre forward and driving at teams. Like in the kind of way that if you replaced him with whomever was a bench option Longfords overall performance would have seriously dipped.
A very good forward from Tipp very briefly was Brendan Cummins the goalkeeper. He had I think one season of championship action and looked useful. A player who was just looking to get on the ball and take scores.

ciarriaithuaidh

davegrohl48 wrote: »

All of those good players too you mention. I don't know much about Dessie Barry but you clearly know your Longford football. I just liked the way Barden would be out around the middle or centre forward and driving at teams. Like in the kind of way that if you replaced him with whomever was a bench option Longfords overall performance would have seriously dipped.
A very good forward from Tipp very briefly was Brendan Cummins the goalkeeper. He had I think one season of championship action and looked useful. A player who was just looking to get on the ball and take scores.

Ah Dessie Barry was class. Stood out even at Railway cup level with Leinster back in the day.

Brendan Cummins almost beat Kerry on his own in Tralee in 1997. Scored a brilliant goal and 3 or 4 points with it. He had serious pace, something people just seeing him as a hurling goalie wouldn't realise. If he and Declan Browne had been together in a Tipp full-forward line, they would have been some handful.

davegrohl48

ciarriaithuaidh wrote: »

Ah Dessie Barry was class. Stood out even at Railway cup level with Leinster back in the day.

Brendan Cummins almost beat Kerry on his own in Tralee in 1997. Scored a brilliant goal and 3 or 4 points with it. He had serious pace, something people just seeing him as a hurling goalie wouldn't realise. If he and Declan Browne had been together in a Tipp full-forward line, they would have been some handful.

So Cummins and Browne didn't manage to feature on the same team in '97?
Agree that would have been a handful. Must be from 98 Browne started?

ciarriaithuaidh

davegrohl48 wrote: »

So Cummins and Browne didn't manage to feature on the same team in '97?
Agree that would have been a handful. Must be from 98 Browne started?

I think, could be wrong here, that Browne came on as a sub in 1997. I remember the following year Cummins and Browne both played in the Munster final in Thurles. Cummins was on the wing, I recall, with Browne inside.
They just never got a sustained run together as Cummins obviously focused on hurling.

Dirty Dingus McGee

Barden was a class act in fairness one of the best half forwards I've seen.I'd say if Gary Hurney had been from a stronger county he would have been a really quality player he always stood out any time I saw him play. Unfortunately he's from Waterford and he hadn't much chance to shine with them.

There are a lot of great players from weaker counties who would have been so much better had they been playing with stronger counties,Niall McNamee was as naturally a talented a footballer in the country and one of the great ball winning full forwards he has brilliant vision as well and he used to create buckets loads of chances for his team mates as well.

Playing for Offaly held him back a lot with Offaly's demise post 2006 and in the last few years he has visibly got more and more frustrated on the field.

The sad thing about GAA is that so many players never get the chance to fully prove how good they are because they are stuck with struggling teams and have to do more than they should, bad service into them etc.It's easy being a quality player in a Kerry,Dublin,Cork Mayo etc .You put the likes of McNamee,Barden,Browne etc in high quality teams with quality players to support them and imagine how good they would have been.

Nidgeweasel

Hulk Hands wrote: »

It's just whether you take the 15 years stuff literally with Canavan. People can look with rose tinted glasses a bit, and I'd agree he's probably the best forward listed overall, but he was used as an impact sub for a fair period of that 00-05 time which technically we're judging on. As in did he realistically get close to footballer of the year in that time? 2 all stars, one of which was contentious at the time as he only started the final (05). So should you leave out say Gooch (best forward over the whole period), Brogan (nearly single handedly dragged dubs to a final, played huge role in winning the following year), Joyce (dragged team to 00 final, 10 pts in 01 final), McDonnell (FOTY in 03, great for years after). That's without mentioning great players like Declan Browne, Michael Murphy etc

He can't be left out for me.

I've rejigged the forward line.

I've done

10: Flynn 11: Declan O Sullivan 12: Dooher

13:Gooch 14: Canavan 15: Bernard Brogan.

Can't win with that forward line. How can you justify leaving out Galvin, or Michael Murphy, or Joyce or McDonald (Armagh), or O'Neill and that's only a few of them! And on a personal level I'm not a wild fan of Brogan as a player, but he makes a hard case for going in there.
Some incredible footballers over the past few years.

Nidgeweasel

Stoner wrote: »

Lots of guys picking lads from their own county alright. While that is fair enough saying they were great but saying they were held back playing in weaker teams is inaccurate. Many of these lads were big fish in little ponds and never really went through the complete tests for players.

However we can still hold a belief that they would be on the best team and select them, but that would be an opinion of how they would perform versus players who did perform and that's shakey ground. But they should be listed.

I couldn't imagine a top 15 without P Canavan. Not my favourite person but definitely the best I ever saw by a mile.

This is the thing I've been thinking to myself. It's why I've wrote off the likes of Forde, Barden, Browne, Sweeney, even McDonald (Mayo) who is one of the best I've ever seen. I thought he played on a different level than most other players but he cannot go in ahead of someone like Brogan etc.

Case in point just as an example I've seen alot of Lacey v Higgins arguments.

Lacey:
2 x All Stars in the corner.
2 x All Stars playing at 6.
FOTY
All Ireland.

If you're doing a stress test then he (Lacey) has to get the shout. And Higgins is an outstanding footballer. Seriously good. But that's the scrutiny you've to go for I think.

Had this discussion last week and somebody scoffed when I said Jordan was a no-brainer for me in the half backs, putting Aaron Kernan ahead of him . I'm getting €50 when Jordan is announced.

ciarriaithuaidh

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

This is the thing I've been thinking to myself. It's why I've wrote off the likes of Forde, Barden, Browne, Sweeney, even McDonald (Mayo) who is one of the best I've ever seen. I thought he played on a different level than most other players but he cannot go in ahead of someone like Brogan etc.

Case in point just as an example I've seen alot of Lacey v Higgins arguments.

Lacey:
2 x All Stars in the corner.
2 x All Stars playing at 6.
FOTY
All Ireland.

If you're doing a stress test then he (Lacey) has to get the shout. And Higgins is an outstanding footballer. Seriously good. But that's the scrutiny you've to go for I think.

Had this discussion last week and somebody scoffed when I said Jordan was a no-brainer for me in the half backs, putting Aaron Kernan ahead of him . I'm getting €50 when Jordan is announced.

Very good last few posts here.

Nidge, you're right in my view..Jordan is a non-debatable for me.

The "ultimate test" argument is what I've been using in most cases.
Ciarán McDonald for example, was very good in 1st half of 2004 final under pressure, did as much as he could. In 2006 however he was totally outplayed by O'Mahony (who got MOM), so that's a black mark against him.
Barden played a qualifier for Longford against Kerry in 2006 and wasn't great.
At the opposite end of the spectrum, Niall McNamee at his peak, had the whole Dublin defence in tatters for 40 mins of a Leinster Final in 2006. Declan O'Sullivan roasting no less than Philip Jordan for 3/4 of 2008 final is another one I've used in this debate. He was immense in that game.

When you examine the candidates in close detail there's a good few "ultimate test" situations you can use as a gauge.

On Bernard Brogan, he just can't be left out in my view. He's done it in almost every single big game for Dublin since 2009. Yes 2009..he was actually decent enough in the "startled earwigs" game on limited ball.

seligehgit

ciarriaithuaidh wrote: »

Very good last few posts here.

Nidge, you're right in my view..Jordan is a non-debatable for me.

The "ultimate test" argument is what I've been using in most cases.
Ciarán McDonald for example, was very good in 1st half of 2004 final under pressure, did as much as he could. In 2006 however he was totally outplayed by O'Mahony (who got MOM), so that's a black mark against him.
Barden played a qualifier for Longford against Kerry in 2006 and wasn't great.
At the opposite end of the spectrum, Niall McNamee at his peak, had the whole Dublin defence in tatters for 40 mins of a Leinster Final in 2006. Declan O'Sullivan roasting no less than Philip Jordan for 3/4 of 2008 final is another one I've used in this debate. He was immense in that game.

When you examine the candidates in close detail there's a good few "ultimate test" situations you can use as a gauge.

On Bernard Brogan, he just can't be left out in my view. He's done it in almost every single big game for Dublin since 2009. Yes 2009..he was actually decent enough in the "startled earwigs" game on limited ball.

Fair point re Brogan,he has always produced it in the big games but I don't know how one can leave out the Gooch,Murphy or Canavan from the inside line? Such is the fun of this selection!It killed me to leave out my county men Keith Higgins and Kieran McDonald but I based my selections on the performances in the very biggest of games and honours attained.

ciarriaithuaidh

seligehgit wrote: »

Fair point re Brogan,he has always produced it in the big games but I don't know how one can leave out the Gooch,Murphy or Canavan from the inside line? Such is the fun of this selection!It killed me to leave out my county men Keith Higgins and Kieran McDonald but I based my selections on the performances in the very biggest of games and honours attained.

It's simple. Murphy has spent so little time at 14 and is relatively early in his career, so he isn't in my team. Gooch - Canavan - Brogan inside line.

ProudDUB

ciarriaithuaidh wrote: »

It's simple. Murphy has spent so little time at 14 and is relatively early in his career, so he isn't in my team. Gooch - Canavan - Brogan inside line.

Exactly. He spends far too much time further out the field, to be considered as a pure forward anymore. Plus, Donegal & MM have only been back playing at the very highest level again, for a relatively short number of years. In Donegals break out year in 2011, they were playing so defensively, MM just wasn't seen at his best. In the infamous semifinal v Dublin, the entire team only scored 6 pts all day. That's not enough to get a forward nominated for lists like these.

2012 was much better, but it was followed by an utterly dire year in 2013. 2014 was much better, but then this year, he was banished out to no mans land again. So we never get to see what he can really do as a forward, over a consistent period of time, in a consistent number of top level games, against top level opposition. That's not really his fault as such, but it does mean that he falls down the pecking order, compared to the other candidates whose CVs do tick all those boxes.

BonnieSituation

I finally did out my team. Dragged Cooper to CHF to accommodate him as there's no way in hell I would leave out Stephen O'Neill. Ever.

Relented on wee Peter as well.

County-by-County:
Tyrone: 6
Kerry: 4
Dublin: 3
Armagh: 1
Donegal: 1

It ended up being an accommodation exercise more than anything solid.

No room for Dooher, McGuigan etc

---

Cluxton

Ricey-Justin McMahon-Karl Lacey

McGeeney-Tomás-Philly Jordan

Darragh Ó Sé-Seán Cavanagh

Paul Galvin-Colm Cooper-Paul Flynn

Wee Peter-Bernard-Stephen O'Neill

---

Has anyone NOT picked Cluxton so far out of curiosity?

Darkest Horse

I know he didn't play for a bigger county so he's on people's minds less but I'm surprised that Matty Forde hasn't got more mention here.

BonnieSituation

Darkest Horse wrote: »

I know he didn't play for a bigger county so he's on people's minds less but I'm surprised that Matty Forde hasn't got more mention here.

It think when people do out their teams in their minds he is.

And then the raw reality hits and you see that drop down of Mattie Forde vs Peter Canavan, Colm Cooper and Bernard Brogan. No contest

Darkest Horse

BonnieSituation wrote: »

It think when people do out their teams in their minds he is.

And then the raw reality hits and you see that drop down of Mattie Forde vs Peter Canavan, Colm Cooper and Bernard Brogan. No contest

That's fair but to get GPA footballer of the year for Wexford in 2004 when some of those guys were tearing it up in All-Ireland finals was phenomenal. Perhaps your mind would change if he had had more exposure?

BonnieSituation

Darkest Horse wrote: »

That's fair but to get GPA footballer of the year for Wexford in 2004 when some of those guys were tearing it up in All-Ireland finals was phenomenal. Perhaps your mind would change if he had had more exposure?

Well as a Leinsterman I was pretty exposed to him (oooh matron).

And there is no doubting his absolute unbelievable ability and genius when measured against the all-time greats.

But we're picking 15 here.

If I was having a chat like this in the pub I would probably have Earley, Johnny Doyle, Ciaran McDonald, Brian McGuigan, Owen Mulligan, Brian Dooher, Conor Gormley and Mattie Forde etc in my team.

Then ya get faced with those lists...

But who do I drop?

The whole thing is an exercise in futility. A mighty fun one though.

Dirty Dingus McGee

BonnieSituation wrote: »

It think when people do out their teams in their minds he is.

And then the raw reality hits and you see that drop down of Mattie Forde vs Peter Canavan, Colm Cooper and Bernard Brogan. No contest

To be honest I'd have Mattie Forde at their level he was a phenomenal player and Wexford were a quality team during his time. I didn't put him on my list of players from weaker counties as I don't think Wexford were during his time they played in a League final, 2 or 3 Leisnter finals and an AI semi final but he didn't have same amount of exposure on really big days as the 3 above so I suppose that gives them the edge slightly and it's why he just misse out on my team.


Mattie Forde in my opinion had a brilliant kicking style for a corner forward.He used to loft the ball up really high and early which made him really difficult to block .If you were to copy one forwards technique for point kicking style it would be his.

student2010

Here's my tupence worth:


Cluxton

O' Sé Canty Lacey

O' Sé McGeeney Jordan

O' Sé Cavanagh

Connolly Murphy Dooher

Cooper Brogan McDonald

danganabu

An interesting project might be to pick the best 15 of the last 15 years that never won an all ireland?? Names like Galvin, Forde, Browne, Barden and about 6 Mayo lads come to mind straight away!

BonnieSituation

danganabu wrote: »

An interesting project might be to pick the best 15 of the last 15 years that never won an all ireland?? Names like Galvin, Forde, Browne, Barden and about 6 Mayo lads come to mind straight away!

And a couple of Jacks as well.

danganabu

BonnieSituation wrote: »

And a couple of Jacks as well.

Yeah, I kind of meant from counties that hadn't won Sam in 15 years, but I see now that wasn't very clear.

BonnieSituation

danganabu wrote: »

Yeah, I kind of meant from counties that hadn't won Sam in 15 years, but I see now that wasn't very clear.

Oh aye. Not saying that at all.

Just adding them in for consideration.

shockframe

I'd agree with the majority of players (O'Se x3, Canavan,Brogan etc) but I'm surprised that many have left out Oisin Mcconville.His record is staggering.

1-9 against Kerry in 2000, the crucial goal in the 2002 all ireland after a demoralising missed penalty, Top scorer of all time in Ulster and in the top 10 scorers ever.Not to mention 4 club all irelands and an outstanding equalizer against Crokes in 2007. There might be classier players in the timeframe one can argue but he got the job done more than most.

ciarriaithuaidh

shockframe wrote: »

I'd agree with the majority of players (O'Se x3, Canavan,Brogan etc) but I'm surprised that many have left out Oisin Mcconville.His record is staggering.

1-9 against Kerry in 2000, the crucial goal in the 2002 all ireland after a demoralising missed penalty, Top scorer of all time in Ulster and in the top 10 scorers ever.Not to mention 4 club all irelands and an outstanding equalizer against Crokes in 2007. There might be classier players in the timeframe one can argue but he got the job done more than most.

0-7 of that was frees, it was a decent performance in fairness, and a great tussle with Seamus Moynihan but in the end Moynihan got on top of him actually.

He was a good player but was a step behind McGuigan, Dooher, Declan Sullivan, Galvin, Flynn for me.

Padkir

So the poll was actually closed by the time I got around to looking at it so couldn't see the shortlist or selections for certain positions, so I had a think and came up with this. A few minor positional switches to accommodate certain people but in their strongest positions for the most part. (Sorry about the formatting!)

Position 1st choice County

1 Stephen Cluxton Dublin
2 Ryan McMenamin Tyrone
3 Marc O'Se Kerry
4 Karl Lacey Donegal
5 Tomas O'Se Kerry
6 Seamus Moynihan Kerry
7 Philip Jordan Tyrone
8 Dara O'Se Kerry
9 Sean Cavanagh Tyrone
10 Brian Dooher Tyrone
11 Colm Cooper Kerry
12 Oisin McConville Armagh
13 Stevie McDonnell Armagh
14 Bernard Brogan Dublin
15 Peter Canavan Tyrone


Position 2nd choice County

1 Brendan Murphy Meath
2 Justin McMahon Tyrone
3 Neil McGee Donegal
4 Keith Higgins Mayo
5 Sean Og De Paor Galway
6 James Nallen Mayo
7 Colm Boyle Mayo (toss up between him and Keegan given the last 4 years they both put in but I know Boyler so I'm biased!)
8 Ciaran Whelan Dublin
9 Kevin Walsh Galway
10 Ciaran McDonald Mayo
11 Padraig Joyce Galway
12 Stephen O'Neill Tyrone
13 Johnny Doyle Kildare
14 Declan Browne Tipperary
15 Mattie Forde Wexford


Position 3rd choice County

1 Gary Connaughton Westmeath
2 Conor Gormley Tyrone
3 Michael Shields Cork
4 Francie Bellew Armagh
5 Aaron Kernan Armagh
6 Graham Canty Cork
7 Anthony Rainbow Kildare
8 Dermot Earley Kildare
9 Neil Gallagher Donegal
10 Paul Flynn Dublin
11 Brian McGuigan Tyrone
12 Diarmuid Connolly Dublin
13 Conor Mortimer Mayo
14 Dessie Dolan Westmeath
15 Ross Munnelly Laois

keane2097

Only one Kerry player in the top 18 forwards of the last 15 years is a fairly novel stance to take I'd imagine.

Padkir

keane2097 wrote: »

Only one Kerry player in the top 18 forwards of the last 15 years is a fairly novel stance to take I'd imagine.

Fair point; don't think I'd change first and second choice teams to be honest but you're right, harsh on Declan O'Sullivan and maybe Galvin.

Edit: But most of my forwards are the top forwards in their County, outside of Cooper and Dec O'Sullivan I don't think it's unfair to exclude them for the likes of McDonnell, Dooher, O'Neill, Forde, Brogan, Joyce, etc. As a unit, the Kerry forwards were sublime, but I'm taking each individual player on their merit.

Nidgeweasel

keane2097 wrote: »

Only one Kerry player in the top 18 forwards of the last 15 years is a fairly novel stance to take I'd imagine.

You could fill the whole 6 with them and not have many complaints.

It'll be Gooch + AN other. It's like the All Stars there's usually some diplomacy.

Hulk Hands

Darkest Horse wrote: »

I know he didn't play for a bigger county so he's on people's minds less but I'm surprised that Matty Forde hasn't got more mention here.

Matty Forde always suffers in these discussions because of Declan Browne I think. Because as excellent as MF was, if you're going to select a superstar from a lesser county, Browne nearly always wins out.

Surprised at how common Dooher is. He played the role well, always thought Galvin was generally considered superior in the end if looking for that type of player. Tbh, thought neither of the got anywhere near the level of Michael Donnellan in his prime at that (somewhat similar) ground covering, ball winning role. Probably not relevant here though given the timeframes

Dirty Dingus McGee

Hulk Hands wrote: »

Matty Forde always suffers in these discussions because of Declan Browne I think. Because as excellent as MF was, if you're going to select a superstar from a lesser county, Browne nearly always wins out.

Surprised at how common Dooher is. He played the role well, always thought Galvin was generally considered superior in the end if looking for that type of player. Tbh, thought neither of the got anywhere near the level of Michael Donnellan in his prime at that (somewhat similar) ground covering, ball winning role. Probably not relevant here though given the timeframes

I'd always have Dooher ahead of Galvin.Not much in it though, but for me Dooher has the advantage of being a much better disicplined player and also there was something savage about the way he used to win breakng ball and the desire for the game he had in general that very few players have ever had.

homerjay2005

here is my team and to be honest, i think its as good as it gets. the lads in bold should be on every team no matter how biased people are.

ive also put the number of all stars each has and its pretty impressive for them all.

---

1 Cluxton (5)

---

2 Keith Higgins (3) ----3 Seamus Moynihan (3)---- ---- 4 Marc O Se 3 (3)

5 Tomas o Se (5)----6 Karl Lacey (4) ----7 Philip Jordan(4)

---

8 Darragh O Se (4) 9 Sean Cavanagh (5)

---

10 Brian Dooher (3)----11 Declan O Sullivan (3)----12 Paul Flynn (4)

13 Colm Cooper (8)----14 B Brogan (3) ---- 15 Stevie Mcdonnell (3)

Hulk Hands

By far the hardest line to choose is the half forward line imo. When fitting in superstars, it seems there's been so any more of them in the FF line in the last 15 years and those are the types we're struggling to fit in. You can cheat a bit and put the like of Cooper and Joyce at centre forward but it's not really correct.

The standard of half forwards seems to have dropped, but its likely to do with the evolving of the game and extra defensive responsibility. Hard to pick out a half forward that were the team's real stars, in the mould of Ja Fallon or Trevor Giles in the late 90s for instance. Connolly is probably the closest there's been on pure talent rather than achievement. Hard to find a wing forward on the list that can be compared to Donnellan or Geraghty even in their primes. Struggled so much in the end I plumped for McConville, a player I loved but who I never would've thought good enough to fit into a 'best of last 15 years' team. Other side was Galvin who probably deserves it on consistency

BPKS

So far

Its

1. Cluxton
2. Marc O Se
3. Seamus Moynihan
4. Keith Higgins


I'm 4 from 4 so far but fear my half forward line of Joyce/Murphy/Flynn will let me down. Dooher, Declan Sullivan or Galvin will surely be in there?

Nidgeweasel

BPKS wrote: »

So far

Its

1. Cluxton
2. Marc O Se
3. Seamus Moynihan
4. Keith Higgins


I'm 4 from 4 so far but fear my half forward line of Joyce/Murphy/Flynn will let me down. Dooher, Declan Sullivan or Galvin will surely be in there?

Lacey will have to be in there At 6 then.

Think one of those Kerry boys above had that.

BPKS

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

Lacey will have to be in there At 6 then.

Think one of those Kerry boys above had that.

I'm hoping McGeeney

zetecescort

Half back line of Tomas O Se, Kieran McGeeney and Phillip Jordan

but1er

4 out 7 anyone better?

castletownman

but1er wrote: »

4 out 7 anyone better?

Seven out of seven for me thus far.

Fairly confident Darragh O'Se and Sean Cavanagh will come in at midfield.

Lost the run of myself in the forwards though unfortunately