The housing crisis and where we go from here

Gatling

Just seen on the Echo Facebook page 50 social houses are to be built in letts field in clondalkin but 2 sinn fein councilors are trying to get the number down to only 15 ,
Beggers belief crying about homelessness one minute then trying to block social houses been built another.

Stheno

Gatling wrote: »

Just seen on the Echo Facebook page 50 social houses are to be built in lotts field in clondalkin but 2 sinn fein councilors are trying to get the number down to only 15 ,
Beggers belief crying about homelessness one minute then trying to block social houses been built another.

Why are they trying to reduce the number?

Gatling

Stheno wrote: »

Why are they trying to reduce the number?

They want to keep a football pitch and don't want a autism unit at a near by school disturbed.
Also apparently labor supplied the cash for the new homes( which may just have something to do with it )

punisher5112

Plenty of land outside Dublin.

Why is it always about social housing and the sob stories.

Why can't they move like the rest of us in many cases have had to.

I moved out of Dublin not even close more bray then Dublin but had to go much further out and that was 2 years ago due to crippling rent and now same happening again having to move again because house has being taken back from bank as LL was not paying mortgage for at least 2 years and now rents even crazy here.

Will it actually ever end this mess.

CatFromHue

I don't know the area but removing a sports field may sound like nothing but what if it's the only one in the area, or used alot by the locals?

Communities do need these facilities to live in too.

Gatling

CatFromHue wrote: »

I don't know the area but removing a sports field may sound like nothing but what if it's the only one in the area, or used alot by the locals?

Communities do need these facilities to live in too.

Plenty of park space and football pitches around clondalkin as far I remember and several astro pitches 5 minutes away from this particular field that's not an official pitch

riclad

Maybe it,s nimby people ,locals dont want lots of social housing beside a private estate.
I heard an interview with a government minister on the radio,
he says the goverment can afford to build 1000,s of units for low cost housing.
Theres an awful lot of bureaucracy between the council,s
as to where to build , how many units,
is 2000 units in area x too much in 1 area.
I think the councils want a mix,
of private/ social housing in every area.
ie he,s not getting alot of help from the councils right now.
Look at the budget meath council has ,
the chances of them building 1000,s of houses is zero.
And they have a housing plan,
they dont build in certain area,s. its not just a matter of finding a few sites.

Mrs OBumble

Indeed: I don't think anyone wants a return to the days of 100% council estates. Which means that to build social housing, they also need to have developers willing to build private sector housing at the same time. Makes it a lot harder.

Eric Cartman

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Indeed: I don't think anyone wants a return to the days of 100% council estates. Which means that to build social housing, they also need to have developers willing to build private sector housing at the same time. Makes it a lot harder.

i think the only fair way of doing this is matching similar profiles. building social housing in high price areas / inside the m50 is nonsense. I would 100% agree with anyone in dundrum / rathfarnham etc.. getting annoyed when they spend 500k + on a house and across the road are people who got them effectively for free.

Social housing is going to have to sprawl with the rest of us, developments of houses with a retail price of 250k or under on a transport corridor to dublin should be where the social housing is built around. for other cities 200k might be a better limit as housing is cheaper in other parts of the country. this creates integrated communities of not too distant income levels and stops a "them and us" scenario.

riclad

There,s plenty of empty land inside the m50 , space to build on .
Also empty sites near the docklands area .
We could build 30k units easy if we build 7-8 storeys ,high density .
Whether we have the political will organisation and capability to do so is the question .
It,s seems to be harder to do anything in ireland ,
more expensive ,takes longer , than say the uk, germany .
in regard to large building projects .
Look at the new childrens hospital,
millions spent on planning ,not a single thing built yet.
There,s a housing finance agency for social housing , radio item on newstalk ,says its easier for for a charity to borrow money from aib, boi,
than the agency .
It,s very complex to get a loan from the agency .
The new apartments built in ballymun are 140 ft max height approx 3storey .

riclad

I would have no problem with 100 per cent social housing,
lets say 1000 units in one site , 4 or 5 7 storey buildings .
I dont think the council will do it though.
The new ballymun is mostly social housing ,
no one is complaining about it .
its not high density ,
The old council estate design where there was 1000,s of identical houses built ,in one area ,
3bed units with a garden , will not be viable .
its too expensive ,low density . We need 1000,s of units for single people too .
I think building a new 7 storey block in coolock ,for example, would not be possible now ,
at least just for social housing .
it would be against planning guidelines .

riclad

riclad wrote: »

There,s plenty of empty land inside the m50 , space to build on .
Also empty sites near the docklands area .

These places should be kept for building for private home owners or tenants so that those working in the city etc can find places to live close to work. Social housing should not be in prime locations close to the city centre.

sobeitamen

Tanner Old Claw wrote: »

These places should be kept for building for private home owners or tenants so that those working in the city etc can find places to live close to work. Social housing should not be in prime locations close to the city centre.

Interesting; you are assuming that no one in social housing works? Or that all tenants eg those on rent allowance work? A pity when social housing seems like a ghetto also. I am from the UK where the council estates are huge and impersonal and clearly council estates. Variety and mixing are good. Hate the stereotyping that goes on. Anyone including professionals can fall ill, become disabled, fall on hard times and need social housing. I did. Thankfully I now choose, thanks to rent allowance, isolated rural houses and refuse to go on the housing list!

handlemaster

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/plan-to-give-landlords-tax-deal-in-return-for-rent-freeze-31492619.html

On the whole this is not a bad idea I think.

Landlords who don't increase rent for 2 yrs get lower tax

should also give a better rate of tax for landlords who take on social welfare tenants

riclad

RE single mothers,
Some do work.
i know a single mother works 3 days a week.
You can be on rent allowance, and work as long as you earn 140 approx , in a part time job.
i think students get rent allowance too.
Theres alot of people in council housing that work.
They could get 12 sites in various area,s build 30 thousand units,
maybe outside the city centre .

Silverbling

riclad wrote: »

RE single mothers,
Some do work.
i know a single mother works 3 days a week.
You can be on rent allowance, and work as long as you earn 140 approx , in a part time job.
i think students get rent allowance too.
Theres alot of people in council housing that work.
They could get 12 sites in various area,s build 30 thousand units,
maybe outside the city centre .

I work 12 hours a day 7 days a week, I was just unfortunate that after 6 years my landlord needed his house for a family member

I have been given 2 years rent allowance after having 3 years bank statements very thoroughly checked, I invested 30k of my savings in starting a business which is not yet in profit but will be in the future

My books will be inspected every 6 months just in case I become an Anglo Irish banker or change my name to Sean, but there is now a claim for the self employed (if your stamps are up to date)

I am not looking for social housing just a landlord who wants a decent reliable tenant

Not all rent allowance tenants wreck the place, some of us have just hit a rough patch and gone in to the system for the first time and need someone who would like their property maintained as if it was my own

Basically I need a fecking break! starting a business in a recession is tough going, if I had known the landlord could just boot me out when I had 2 years left on the lease then I would have made different choices

*thinking of changing my name to ~notmysticmegffscanigobackintime

handlemaster

With à few thousand refugees arriving over the next year or two im sure there will be an up take in accomadation in areas previously showned by the Irish.

Villa05

handlemaster wrote:

With à few thousand refugees arriving over the next year or two im sure there will be an up take in accomadation in areas previously showned by the Irish.

Not sure what your point is, but the state will not send refugees to "troubled" estates for fear of them being targeted. The many ghost estates on the west coast may see some activity

Gatling

Villa05 wrote: »

Not sure what your point is, but the state will not send refugees to "troubled" estates for fear of them being targeted. The many ghost estates on the west coast may see some activity

They'll go to direct provision first.
but get the feeling this will drive the current thread off topic .

Not everyone of the current 100,000 + will have turned down houses ,
But sorting the current housing mess should take priority over issues involving migrants outside our state

ComfortKid

c montgomery wrote:

I have a relative who got a very nice council house fir him and his family about 5 years ago. House came with a check for 5 k to fit out the house. 3 years later relationship broke up and now both of them have a council house, both kids living with the mother. My relative now has a pretty good job earning about 40k per year and still living in his 3 bed council house alone! These situations should be reviewed regularly

But his rent will be increased according to his income, so whats the problem if he rents off the council or privately?

You'd swear these houses are free the way some of ye go on

athtrasna

ComfortKid wrote: »

But his rent will be increased according to his income, so whats the problem if he rents off the council or privately?

You'd swear these houses are free the way some of ye go on

The issue is that he no longer has a need to be housed by the state in a unit of that size. It would easily take a family of 5 off the housing list while a one bedroom unit would meet his housing needs.

Gatling

athtrasna wrote: »

The issue is that he no longer has a need to be housed by the state in a unit of that size. It would easily take a family of 5 off the housing list while a one bedroom unit would meet his housing needs.

They could but won't the most they could do is suggest a smaller property but I don't think they have any power to compel a move.

What annoying is your housed on your needs on this case the person doesn't need a 3bed so he should be rehoused based on his current need

ComfortKid

athtrasna wrote:

The issue is that he no longer has a need to be housed by the state in a unit of that size. It would easily take a family of 5 off the housing list while a one bedroom unit would meet his housing needs.

Agreed.

My mother in law is living alone in a 3 bedroom house in a nice quite estate, she asked the council to be transferred to a smaller house and she was refused because transfers aren't a priority. I can't understand their logic in that.

Silverbling

There was a post on facebook today, someone who had a council house, worked hard and bought her own property

She did the house up to a very high standard and posted the pictures. That house has been empty for 9 months while they wait for the council to "turn it around"

All they need is an electrician to make sure the wiring is not dodgy and then hand the keys to someone else, it's not rocket science!

The previous tenant posted because the house is boarded up and she heard the council were waiting for someone to rip her kitchen out to replace it with council approved stuff.....its madness!

Alan Kelly agreed yesterday to "meet half way" and re-energise vacant proprties as if they are working hard on the issue, it is not rocket science, fix up the social houses, move them off the list then those of us looking for a landlord just might get one

gaius c

handlemaster wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/plan-to-give-landlords-tax-deal-in-return-for-rent-freeze-31492619.html

On the whole this is not a bad idea I think.

Landlords who don't increase rent for 2 yrs get lower tax

should also give a better rate of tax for landlords who take on social welfare tenants

It's just taxpayer funded subsidisation of private landlords with no improvement of stock levels or quality.

Villa05

Gatling wrote: »

Not everyone of the current 100,000 + will have turned down houses ,
But sorting the current housing mess should take priority over issues involving migrants outside our state

The current housing mess is a direct result of national policy to make housing as expensive as possible. Where do you see the will to sort it out.

All I see is measures being introduced to make housing even more expensive.

Cuddlesworth

ComfortKid wrote: »

But his rent will be increased according to his income, so whats the problem if he rents off the council or privately?

You'd swear these houses are free the way some of ye go on

Assuming you are comfortable living in council housing, the rents payable come nowhere close to the market rate. I would assume that the council estate next to me would be about 35% of the current market rate for those in employment. It is meant to be subsidised housing for those in need, not a subsidised lifestyle choice. If somebodys income is the equivalent of those in private rental accommodation, why is one paying through the nose subsidising the lifestyle of the other.

http://www.dublincity.ie/main-menu-services-housing/rent-assessment

What is the maximum rent payable on a dwelling?

The maximum rent payable is based on the size of the dwelling as follows:

Bedsit (1 room) - €257.00

1 Bedroom (2 rooms) - €301.00

2 Bedroom (3 rooms) - €313.00

3 Bedroom (4 rooms) - €401.00

Greater than 3 Bedroom/4 rooms - €423.00

Cuddlesworth

Silverbling wrote: »

There was a post on facebook today, someone who had a council house, worked hard and bought her own property

She did the house up to a very high standard and posted the pictures. That house has been empty for 9 months while they wait for the council to "turn it around"

All they need is an electrician to make sure the wiring is not dodgy and then hand the keys to someone else, it's not rocket science!

The previous tenant posted because the house is boarded up and she heard the council were waiting for someone to rip her kitchen out to replace it with council approved stuff.....its madness!

Alan Kelly agreed yesterday to "meet half way" and re-energise vacant proprties as if they are working hard on the issue, it is not rocket science, fix up the social houses, move them off the list then those of us looking for a landlord just might get one

When the press breaks in her kitchen and the tenant complains, which is better? The worker has to find the exact same matching press door and hinges because otherwise the tenant complains. Or he fits one from the storeroom, which has a 100 doors and hinges that are the same. Same with plumbing fittings, wall fittings, etc. The council don't like people "doing" up their houses, its costs it money. Its just that nobody is bothered enforcing the existing rules on those lifelong tenants that flaunt them.

Eric Cartman

Silverbling wrote: »

There was a post on facebook today, someone who had a council house, worked hard and bought her own property

She did the house up to a very high standard and posted the pictures. That house has been empty for 9 months while they wait for the council to "turn it around"

All they need is an electrician to make sure the wiring is not dodgy and then hand the keys to someone else, it's not rocket science!

The previous tenant posted because the house is boarded up and she heard the council were waiting for someone to rip her kitchen out to replace it with council approved stuff.....its madness!

Alan Kelly agreed yesterday to "meet half way" and re-energise vacant proprties as if they are working hard on the issue, it is not rocket science, fix up the social houses, move them off the list then those of us looking for a landlord just might get one

they replace the wiring in a lot of council houses at turn around due to certain sections of 'society' ripping copper wiring and piping out of walls. it takes a lot of time to rectify these issues.

Silverbling

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

When the press breaks in her kitchen and the tenant complains, which is better? The worker has to find the exact same matching press door and hinges because otherwise the tenant complains. Or he fits one from the storeroom, which has a 100 doors and hinges that are the same. Same with plumbing fittings, wall fittings, etc. The council don't like people "doing" up their houses, its costs it money. Its just that nobody is bothered enforcing the existing rules on those lifelong tenants that flaunt them.

Why does it have to be matching? I am not going to get a social house but if I was offered one then I would gratefully accept it.

I do not know much about social housing though, I presumed you got a house at reduced rent and looked after it like you would if you owned a house