Jobstown water protesters to be charged

Little CuChulainn

Lantus wrote: »

Presumably when I was stuck in traffic I was falsely imprisoned as well. They knew traffic levels were rising and not building more roads would cause entrapment. It was intentional.

Protesters shouldn't of done it but this is OTT. Its all about making sure ordinary people remember their place and remain placid.

I think it's already been pointed out that that is a moronic argument. Being stuck in traffic this not equate to being trapped in your car.

darkpagandeath

Graham wrote: »

That's probably better decided by a Court who will probably be in a much better position to make that decision than you are.

Exactly....

Lantus

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

I think it's already been pointed out that that is a moronic argument. Being stuck in traffic this not equate to being trapped in your car.

Agreed. But wasting so much time on this is equally moronic. It happened so long ago. There are real problems in society. A few people gently rocking a car for a few hours shouldn't be on that list. Fix the health system, water system and eliminate poverty and disease. Then if you have any spare time try to ruin peoples lives with this nonsense.

darkpagandeath

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

I think it's already been pointed out that that is a moronic argument. Being stuck in traffic this not equate to being trapped in your car.

Did the doors stop working ?

end of the road

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Did the doors stop working ?

they could have

Little CuChulainn

Lantus wrote: »

Agreed. But wasting so much time on this is equally moronic. It happened so long ago. There are real problems in society. A few people gently rocking a car for a few hours shouldn't be on that list. Fix the health system, water system and eliminate poverty and disease. Then if you have any spare time try to ruin peoples lives with this nonsense.

So I guess you feel we should focus on fixing our economy instead of prosecuting the Anglo chiefs too?

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Did the doors stop working ?

If you looked outside your front door and there was a man with a large machete running his finger across his throat would you consider yourself free to leave simply because your door was working? Do you genuinely not understand the difference between getting stuck in a crowd and getting your car surrounded by a mob threatening you? If you don't just tell me now.

darkpagandeath

end of the road wrote: »

they could have

Did she not get out of that car and into a Garda one ?

darkpagandeath

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

So I guess you feel we should focus on fixing our economy instead of prosecuting the Anglo chiefs too?



If you looked outside your front door and there was a man with a large machete running his finger across his throat would you consider yourself free to leave simply because your door was working? Do you genuinely not understand the difference between getting stuck in a crowd and getting your car surrounded by a mob threatening you? If you don't just tell me now.

Who had weapons ? The Garda as far as I know are we just making up stuff now ? I think it would have been all over the news if someone had a Machete..

Little CuChulainn

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Who had weapons ? The Garda as far as I know are we just making up stuff now ? I think it would have been all over the news if someone had a Machete..

I think it's easiest just to leave you to your thoughts. Even a troll understands metaphor and analogy

conorh91

Lantus wrote: »

Agreed. But wasting so much time on this is equally moronic. It happened so long ago. There are real problems in society. A few people gently rocking a car for a few hours shouldn't be on that list. Fix the health system, water system and eliminate poverty and disease.

Fixing the health and water systems, and curing poverty and disease, are not the role of the DPP.

darkpagandeath

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

I think it's easiest just to leave you to your thoughts. Even a troll understands metaphor and analogy

What has a guy with a machete outside a house threatening someone have to do with a TD who knew there was a protest outside ? The same TD who looked Quite normal thought the entire event With an Armed Garda in the Car surrounded by loads of Garda in absolutely zero danger. I would hazard a guess that car was probably armoured as well. Who then after the event suddenly on advise was afraid of ones life.

The Muppet

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

I think it's easiest just to leave you to your thoughts. Even a troll understands metaphor and analogy

Only good analogies and metaphors, yours need a little work.

Merrion

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

You're not seriously equating trapping a woman in her car, intimidating her and generally behaving in a violent and thug like manner to the 1916 Rising and the War of Independence are you?

Not even vaguely - I am providing a counter example to the "violence never solves anything" newspeak. Basically there is nuance here - maybe their actions were right or maybe wrong, and a court is a good place to use the current agreed interpretation of right and wrong to test this.

That said - it's pretty close to what the civil war was about, no?

NorthStars

darkpagandeath wrote: »

What has a guy with a machete outside a house threatening someone have to do with a TD who knew there was a protest outside ? The same TD who looked Quite normal thought the entire event With an Armed Garda in the Car surrounded by loads of Garda in absolutely zero danger. I would hazard a guess that car was probably armoured as well. Who then after the event suddenly on advise was afraid of ones life.

AGS did a great job on the day in question in Jobstown, didn't they?
Hundreds of them there, riot gear and all, yet they still allowed these dastardly deeds, like 'false imprisonment', take place right in front of their eyes.
Hero's to a man.......

Much easier to allow these 'crimes' take place and then,weeks later, have 10 of them do dawn raids on kids getting ready to go to school.
Most coppers are like an asses cock.....big when they're out....in coppers!

Little CuChulainn

NorthStars wrote: »

dawn raids on kids getting ready to go to school.

You should write headlines for the Journal.

Cold War Kid

Was talking to a legal eagle - the "false imprisonment" thing is valid. It doesn't have to be kidnapping, it just has to be keeping someone against their will/threatening them.

Kermit.de.frog

Paul Murphy carries around a loud speaker in his car.


You know, just in case he happens upon a protest.

conorh91

Cold War Kid wrote: »

Was talking to a legal eagle - the "false imprisonment" thing is valid. It doesn't have to be kidnapping, it just has to be keeping someone against their will/threatening them.

False imprisonment has even been proven where a person was locked, after hours, in a place of work, where the employer's security ought to have checked for the presence of employees still in the building.

It is a particularly broad offence, hence (presumably) why it was chosen for trying multiple defendants.

Don't Chute!

NorthStars wrote: »

AGS did a great job on the day in question in Jobstown, didn't they?
Hundreds of them there, riot gear and all, yet they still allowed these dastardly deeds, like 'false imprisonment', take place right in front of their eyes.
Hero's to a man.......

Much easier to allow these 'crimes' take place and then,weeks later, have 10 of them do dawn raids on kids getting ready to go to school.
Most coppers are like an asses cock.....big when they're out....in coppers!

Of all the incredibly stupid posts in this thread, and there are many, this one has to be the worst. Well done.

wendell borton

Political Kite flying was been brought to new heights with this case.

Billy86

end of the road wrote: »

not everyone works 9 to 5 and thats the end of it

The poster was clearly referring to unemployed people who are not seeking employment.

Billy86

mickydoomsux wrote: »

I've encountered no one like that so they can't be all that prevalent.

I've encountered plenty who claim to be in that situation.

To be fair (and I'm close to as anti-Murphy as you will get, and am delighted about these fully justified charges), there are a good few people in that situation - but nowhere near "hundreds of thousands" as someone else claimed.

But you're right that there are an awful lot who complain about being in that situation, while smoking a pack a day, going out drinking at least 1-2 nights a week, getting takeaway regularly, and spending their food budget awfully.

Banjo String

Same people have Murphy hung drawn and quartered that are on these threads telling us that Denis O'Brien deserves the right to be presumed innocent until proven guilty.

Speaks volumes as far as I'm concerned.

foggy_lad

Afaicr when the protestors were arrested in the dawn raids the Gardai also took away laptops and computers and other things like notebooks etc which may have been used in arranging these protests and might also details of how certain people were expected to act/behave during the protests. There might be evidence to show that blocking the car was planned or that the torrents of abuse aimed at those in the car and the Gardai were orchestrated by a few members of a group like eirígi

It is clear that there is a dangerous "provo/paramilitary" element mainly from the Newry/Louth area including members of eirígi who were welcomed to attend and "manage" these protests and the torrents of abuse mainly aimed at Gardai and those going about their jobs installing water meters.

Some of the protesters who were arrested looked quite worried on the news earlier and I'd say they have good reason to be worried as if links are made to provo/paramilitary groups they could be charged with very serious crimes against the state.

Banjo String

foggy_lad wrote: »

Afaicr when the protestors were arrested in the dawn raids the Gardai also took away laptops and computers and other things like notebooks etc which may have been used in arranging these protests and might also details of how certain people were expected to act/behave during the protests. There might be evidence to show that blocking the car was planned or that the torrents of abuse aimed at those in the car and the Gardai were orchestrated by a few members of a group like eirígi

It is clear that there is a dangerous "provo/paramilitary" element mainly from the Newry/Louth area including members of eirígi who were welcomed to attend and "manage" these protests and the torrents of abuse mainly aimed at Gardai and those going about their jobs installing water meters.

Some of the protesters who were arrested looked quite worried on the news earlier and I'd say they have good reason to be worried as if links are made to provo/paramilitary groups they could be charged with very serious crimes against the state.

Eh, what


Clear how exactly?

Did you hover over the 'submit reply' icon before posting this waffle, because you probably should have.

Provo/Erigi does not compute btw.

falan

foggy_lad wrote:

It is clear that there is a dangerous "provo/paramilitary" element mainly from the Newry/Louth area including members of eirígi who were welcomed to attend and "manage" these protests and the torrents of abuse mainly aimed at Gardai and those going about their jobs installing water meters.

Wow! Don't suppose you've any evidence?

Billy86

Banjo String wrote: »

Same people have Murphy hung drawn and quartered that are on these threads telling us that Denis O'Brien deserves the right to be presumed innocent until proven guilty.

Speaks volumes as far as I'm concerned.

Name them.

Banjo String

Billy86 wrote: »

Name them.

Want me to make your breakfast in the am too

How's about using the search function, chief.

Billy86

Banjo String wrote: »

Want me to make your breakfast in the am too

How's about using the search function, chief.

Ah, so it's an unfounded accusation. Because without evidence, that's all it is.

I thought so since I'm all for Murphy meeting the justice system (don't recall anyone for him to be 'hung, drawn and quartered' though - either I missed the posts that did, or it's just a classic case of the Murphy supporters hyperbolic victim complex), but despise Denis O'Brien myself.

foggy_lad

I suppose all the Jobstown 23 will be demanding free legal aid? It will be interesting to see how much these crowd of thugs cost the state. The whole aim of these gurriers and thugs is civil disobedience and causing as much hassle and expense for the state as possible!

Penny Tration

Bracken81 wrote: »

"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." JFK

Great to see some Irish people stand up for what they believe in
Of course I'm sure they're all Jobless/Dole scrounging scumbags, or at least that what the Upper & Middle classes want you to believe :-)

I'm working class, and a lot of the protesters ARE unemployed and scumbags looking for trouble.

The protests originally were genuinely peaceful events.

Unfortunately, Paul fcuking Murphy, Eirigi and a group of professional protesters decided peaceful protests weren't enough.

Banjo String

Billy86 wrote: »

Ah, so it's an unfounded accusation. Because without evidence, that's all it is.

Unfounded? I told you to head over to the relevant threads and you would get your answer, I only do so much of other people's research for them.

I thought so since I'm all for Murphy meeting the justice system (don't recall anyone for him to be 'hung, drawn and quartered' though - either I missed the posts that did, or it's just a classic case of the Murphy supporters hyperbolic victim complex), but despise Denis O'Brien myself.

Well firstly, I think you're putting too much emphasis on the 'hung drawn and quartered' but, it's a figure of speech, implying a wish to see someone tried, convicted and punished. I'm actually surprised I have to clear that up tbh.

Lastly, I'm not a Murphy supporter, but I am growing more and more concerned at the length FG and Labour are going to, to protect the clusterfcuk that is Irish water.

You know things are severely fcuked up in the state, when you have eurostat implying that even our cso massaged figures in a vain attempt at getting the 'unmitigated disaster' passed by them.

For the record, do you think Murphy will be convicted on a charge of false imprisonment?

NorthStars

black and amber wrote: »

Of all the incredibly stupid posts in this thread, and there are many, this one has to be the worst. Well done.

A quick look through your posts in after hours and I see 90% of them are personal attacks on other posters, so I'll take your comment with a large pinch of salt.
Thank you.

NorthStars

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

You should write headlines for the Journal.

I don't need to.
Your lot provide plenty of them.
You denying that there was dawn raids involving 10 coppers and that at least one of them was to arrest a kid who was getting ready for school?

NorthStars

Banjo String wrote: »

Eh, what


Clear how exactly?

Did you hover over the 'submit reply' icon before posting this waffle, because you probably should have.

Provo/Erigi does not compute btw.

He was talking to dx...........

Banjo String

Didn't realise who the head of the directing division was in the DPP until this morning.

Is it true that she's the niece of a very prominent member of the cabinet, also a Labour TD?



It's nearly as interesting as this

The Garda Commissioner is defending the appointment of her husband to a team investigating alleged leaks of information to journalists.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/garda-commissioner-defends-husbands-appointment-to-investigation-687916.html

in light of the likes of this

INDEPENDENT TD Clare Daly is taking High Court action against the garda commissioner over claims that her arrest for drink driving was deliberately leaked to the media.

Ms Daly filed the motion last Monday and says that details of her arrest were passed on to journalists to discredit her for raising “issues of malpractice within the Garda”.

“This information could only have come from within,” she said on her website.

In her action to the High Court, the left-wing TD is claiming negligence against garda commissioner Noirin O’Sullivan for the leak and the manner of her arrest.

Best little country in the world (to pull strokes in) so it is.

NorthStars

Banjo String wrote: »

Didn't realise who the head of the directing division was in the DPP until this morning.

Is it true that she's the niece of a very prominent member of the cabinet, also a Labour TD?



It's nearly as interesting as this
http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/garda-commissioner-defends-husbands-appointment-to-investigation-687916.html

in light of the various complaints about leaks to the media.

Best little country in the world (to pull strokes in) so it is.

Is there any way of verifying that Elizabeth Howlin is related to this Labour minister?
If this is true then something really nasty and subverted is possibly happening with this case.

The Rape of Lucretia

Banjo String wrote: »

You know things are severely fcuked up in the state, when you have eurostat implying that even our cso massaged figures in a vain attempt at getting the 'unmitigated disaster' passed by them.

Unmitigated disaster due to the lack of sophistication of the Irish people n general though who dont understand or dont wish to understand the reality of water services. The CSO is doing their best for us ( though embarrased to have to do it this way I am sure) and trying to do the best for the country as a whole, but have been dealt a tough hand by the protester group. The lack of maturity of the wider population here would get you down.

Banjo String

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Unmitigated disaster due to the lack of sophistication of the Irish people n general though who dont understand or dont wish to understand the reality of water services. The CSO is doing their best for us ( though embarrased to have to do it this way I am sure) and trying to do the best for the country as a whole, but have been dealt a tough hand by the protester group. The lack of maturity of the wider population here would get you down.

If I understand you, you're saying the irish electorate are dumb, and that the cso (who should be a respected and independent body) were embarrassed at having to lie through their teeth in order to try and flog eurostat a dead duck.

Is that really what you believe?

NorthStars

Banjo String wrote: »

If I understand you, you're saying the irish electorate are dumb, and that the cso (who should be a respected and independent body) were embarrassed at having to lie through their teeth in order to try and flog eurostat a dead duck.

Is that really what you believe?

And they call people who aren't FG/Lab supporters conspiracy theorists.......;)

Little CuChulainn

foggy_lad wrote: »

Afaicr when the protestors were arrested in the dawn raids the Gardai also took away laptops and computers and other things like notebooks etc which may have been used in arranging these protests and might also details of how certain people were expected to act/behave during the protests. There might be evidence to show that blocking the car was planned or that the torrents of abuse aimed at those in the car and the Gardai were orchestrated by a few members of a group like eirígi

It is clear that there is a dangerous "provo/paramilitary" element mainly from the Newry/Louth area including members of eirígi who were welcomed to attend and "manage" these protests and the torrents of abuse mainly aimed at Gardai and those going about their jobs installing water meters.

Some of the protesters who were arrested looked quite worried on the news earlier and I'd say they have good reason to be worried as if links are made to provo/paramilitary groups they could be charged with very serious crimes against the state.

I'd say it's more to do with getting video sources. But you might not be far off with the rest.

foggy_lad wrote: »

I suppose all the Jobstown 23 will be demanding free legal aid? It will be interesting to see how much these crowd of thugs cost the state. The whole aim of these gurriers and thugs is civil disobedience and causing as much hassle and expense for the state as possible!

It will be interesting to see who represents who. Murphy might lose a lot of his support if his Dáil wages pays for a big legal team and his cohorts are left on legal aid. We don't really do plea deals in this country but lads with long conviction histories will know when it's best to plead guilty.

NorthStars wrote: »

I don't need to.
Your lot provide plenty of them.
You denying that there was dawn raids involving 10 coppers and that at least one of them was to arrest a kid who was getting ready for school?

Yes. I don't think it was dawn. I don't think it was a "raid". And you said kids, not kid. So I think everything in your post was nonsense.

The Rape of Lucretia

Banjo String wrote: »

If I understand you, you're saying the irish electorate are dumb, and that the cso (who should be a respected and independent body) were embarrassed at having to lie through their teeth in order to try and flog eurostat a dead duck.

Is that really what you believe?

I wouldnt say dumb. I dount fundamental intelligence is varies much throughout all of Europe. But unsophisticated, or a little backward, or or at a lower level of culture and civilisation, yes. To their cost. But remain optimistic that this will improve in time. The transition is causing them some discomfort though.

Hans Bricks

It still amazes me that even when tens to hundreds of thousands turn out three times in dublin alone to peacefully protest, people still defend the fringe element tossers taking over O'connell bridge just looking to stir the pot with the first garda in sight.

We've all seen the videos. Some of the local scum with the standard hoody covering the face surrounding cars and just spitting dogs abuse at anyone IW or AGS related. Same thing in jobstown.

Banjo String

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

I wouldnt say dumb. I dount fundamental intelligence is varies much throughout all of Europe. But unsophisticated, or a little backward, or or at a lower level of culture and civilisation, yes. To their cost. But remain optimistic that this will improve in time. The transition is causing them some discomfort though.

Um. Fair enough. (I think).

Could you clarify your position in reference to our (supposedly) independent CSO, apparently intentionally trying to dupe the eurostsat by sending massaged figures?

The Rape of Lucretia

Banjo String wrote: »

Um. Fair enough. (I think).

Could you clarify your position in reference to our (supposedly) independent CSO, apparently intentionally trying to dupe the eurostsat by sending massaged figures?

We all know the old line about lies, damned lies, and statistics.
Numbers give an impression of precision and definitiveness. But things are never so black and white. So correct of the CSO to present a view that is the most favourable to to the good of the country.

NorthStars

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

Yes. I don't think it was dawn. I don't think it was a "raid". And you said kids, not kid. So I think everything in your post was nonsense.

https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CC8QFjACahUKEwir7qKG3qrHAhWFodsKHcBNC_A&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishmirror.ie%2Fnews%2Firish-news%2Fjobstown-protest-16-year-old-released-without-5136387&ei=_ADPVauADoXD7gbAm62ADw&usg=AFQjCNHcS3FWuqwkFyx-Vwd3C-lvG0CMxw

7.10 am on Febuary 15th 2015.
So, you're right, it wasn't dawn it was before dawn.
1 kid, 16 years old and 10 of your lot.
Grand so, it wasn't a dawn raid.....:rolleyes:

Up until a couple of years ago I had the utmost respect for AGS, I've never had any dealings with them other than the usual office type work they provide, passport forms etc.

We've seen the other side now though, throwing women into bollards, raiding houses to arrest a child and all the other corrupt stuff the whistleblowers have exposed recently.

Root and branch reform is needed in AGS and the defenders of their actions, like yourself, need to be put out to pasture.
Mind you, when you can retire at 50 with the pension and start another career, that shouldn't be too difficult.

Banjo String

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

We all know the old line about lies, damned lies, and statistics.
Numbers give an impression of precision and definitiveness. But things are never so black and white. So correct of the CSO to present a view that is the most favourable to to the good of the country.

I bet you felt the same way about the Greeks cooked books too, eh?

NorthStars

As Banjo pointed out earlier, this nicely sums up what's wrong with AGS in this country..




"The Garda Commissioner is defending the appointment of her husband to a team investigating alleged leaks of information to journalists.
Detective Superintendent Jim McGowan is one of two senior Gardaí leading the investigation.

Speaking at a Garda graduation ceremony in Templemore, Commissioner Noirín O'Sullivan denied that any tapping or monitoring of journalists' phones was taking place.
She said: "I think it is a matter of public record that my husband is a Detective Superintendent in An Garda Síochána.
"Any roles he carries out in An Garda Síochána is in that capacity."





Proper little old boys/girls club, isn't it?


http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/garda-commissioner-defends-husbands-appointment-to-investigation-687916.html


How did Noreen O'Sullivan get the job in the first place?

Oh yea, the last lad had to 'retire' (after another house call under the cover of darkness from the taoiseach's office) after his dodgy dealings and mouthing off to the other lad who had to resign as minister for justice.
She was his next in command.

The Rape of Lucretia

Banjo String wrote: »

I bet you felt the same way about the Greeks cooked books too, eh?

More so. They went off the deep end altogether and tried to present fantasy to the Troika. And were correctly laughed at (sympathetically though) and rebuffed. There's presentation in a positive light, and presentation of complete fiction.
Ireland, fortunately, while towards the Greek end of the spectrum, isnt quite as bananas.

Little CuChulainn

NorthStars wrote: »

7.10 am on Febuary 15th 2015.
So, you're right, it wasn't dawn it was before dawn.
1 kid, 16 years old and 10 of your lot.
Grand so, it wasn't a dawn raid.....:rolleyes:

That kid was in the house on his own was he?

NorthStars wrote: »

Up until a couple of years ago I had the utmost respect for AGS, I've never had any dealings with them other than the usual office type work they provide, passport forms etc.

We've seen the other side now though, throwing women into bollards, raiding houses to arrest a child and all the other corrupt stuff the whistleblowers have exposed recently.

Root and branch reform is needed in AGS and the defenders of their actions, like yourself, need to be put out to pasture.
Mind you, when you can retire at 50 with the pension and start another career, that shouldn't be too difficult.

So what you are saying is, although all your actual dealings with the Gardaí have been fine, you're still dismissing the whole force. You sound like exactly the type of personality people like Murphy target.