From Couch 25k To Where Ever

The Muppet

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Haha, you think that's a long report? I made the parkrun out to be the Olympics today!

Well done one the PB, sounds like you've plenty more to take off that at Jingle Bells.

yeah i read yours a while ago, brilliant stufff,. I definitely think i have some more , hiow much i don't know. It's only September since I ran malahide pr before , i dont know what made me think it was 3 laps. I'm quite flat about that tbh despite the PB which i would have been chuffed with if I'd given my all.

It looks like we'll be on pretty similar times for Jingle Bells , think I'll use you as a pacer.

Bungy Girl

Well done on the PB! And for the record, while I applaud your chivalry, there's no need to be such a gentleman at a parkrun (or a race) . If the positions had been reversed she would likely have done her best to pip you to the post. Take no prisoners! :pac::pac::pac:

The Muppet

Bungy Girl wrote: »

Well done on the PB! And for the record, while I applaud your chivalry, there's no need to be such a gentleman at a parkrun (or a race) . If the positions had been reversed she would likely have done her best to pip you to the post. Take no prisoners! :pac::pac::pac:

I'll man up next time.

The Muppet

Onto week 11 of my plan this morning this is the final 5 week phase of the plan.

55 minutes easy the plan said. I woke at 7 and lay there listening to the howling wind and rain and though I should stay where I was. 5 minutes later the guilt hit me so up I got, winter gear on including a base layer, hat glove and jacket and off I set.

It actually sounded worse from inside the house than it was outside by the time i got out, It was very windy but the rain had died down to a drizzle and It wasn't cold or at least I didn't feel it as I was wrapped up like an onion.

The run itself went well, I took it really nice and handy to allow for recovery after yesterdays parkrun.

5.14 Miles in 58:33 @ 11:24 pace.

1@11:21
2 @12:11 very steep hill on this which I ran up (slowly)
3 @11:06
4 @11:13
5 @11:04

avg HR 136




Week 11
Day|Run|Notes
Sunday|55 minutes easy|
Monday|10 x 6 to 8 seconds Hills with recovery|
Tuesday|55 minutes easy|
Wednesday|110 minutes easy|
Thursday| Rest|
Friday| 4 x 5 mins @ 5k effort with 3 minutes recovery| *8.39 per mile
Saturday|55 minutes easy



8.39 was my 5k pace when I started the plan so I'm assuming that's the pace i stick with or should I use my current 5k pace? Its probably a pointless question as I usually run the tempo sessions quicker than my calculated training times anyway.

Maximus Alexander

The Muppet wrote: »

8.39 was my 5k pace when I started the plan so I'm assuming that's the pace i stick with or should I use my current 5k pace? Its probably a pointless question as I usually run the tempo sessions quicker than my calculated training times anyway.

I'm not sure what the accepted wisdom is, but I'm going to change my training paces to reflect yesterday's time. It strikes me as suboptimal to be training slower than you are.

But as you say, probably fairly pointless anyway because how close do you really get to the pace the calculators suggest? Mine tend to drift around anyway.

Firedance

Well done on the pb! Well paced but as BG said, take no prisoners:)

Yes change your paces as you progress through the program, try not to run faster than your current race pace for intervals, it could lead to injury.

Bungy Girl

Base it off your current 5K time, but take account of the weather conditions and don't be concerned if your pace is off a bit either way. Getting the effort right is key (i.e. the sort of effort you could sustain for a full 5K). Seeing as you had a bit left in the tank yesterday you'll likely end up slightly faster than your PB anyway, but you shouldn't be way faster - as FD says that could lead to injury.

The Muppet

Thank you all for the advice . Off to calculate my new training times it is so .

tailgunner

Well done on the PB. Plenty more time to come off it in the near future too I think!

The Muppet

Today is hill sprint sesssion day, 10 x 6 - 8 seconds with recovery, 1 mile warm up and 1 mile cool down. Nice session , not too taxing though I did give the hills everything, jogged back between them too . theres a bit of a bite to the wind, its not a day to be hanging around.

FIFA2004

Just catching up on your log, congrats on the pb!!! You're doing great stuff, can't wait to see how you get on at jingle bells!

The Muppet

I decided to get today's 55 minutes easy in at lunchtime today to have it done before the worst of the weather hits later.



My chosen route was from swords to malahide on the main road and back along the estuary. It was dry but really windy. The wind was at my back on my way out which wss nice but in my face coming back which made for tough few miles on the return trip. At times I was leaning into it pushing hard but hardly moving, at least that's how it felt.

I am pleasently surprised with my times especially my retrurn splits due to the wind.

5.48 miles in 55:25@ 10:07:pace

1@ 10:48
2 @ 9:34
3 @ 9:40
4 @ 10:02
5 @ 10:29
.48 @ 4:52

The Muppet

A bit of a mixed bag today with my long run. The plan said 110 minutes easy.


Headed off for my usual Wednesday long run route from Coolock down to Fairview back to Kilbarrick and back up to Coolock.

I had decided going out that I Was going to stick to 11 minute pace for this as I had a tough easy run yesterday with the wind Hill sprints the day before A 5.5 mile On Sunday and the park run on Saturday and My legs were felling a little tired.

I also decide to take a gel starting out and another one at five miles just to see how my system deals with them for future reference. I had no adverse effects from the gel and I felt I had plenty of energy for the whole run, so that was a positive.



Unfortunately I also had a negative on the run, I started to feel the outside of my right knee at around five miles, noting too bad but a definite pain. I ran on but at 6 miles I had to stop to cross the road, When I started to run again the pain in my knee got worse and I was limping badly, I stopped and massaged the Knee , I thought about calling a halt but I was 5 miles from where i had parked my car, I decide to run again but if the pain ws too much I would hail a taxi but as I got going the pain eased and I ran for another mile or so before I had to cross the road again.

Same scenario when I started to run again Pain in my knee , I eased into it again and the pain eased again. I had to cross 2 more roads after this and it was the same situation soreness subsiding when I got running. I'm sitting here now with an ice pack on my knee and have it elevated. It's a little sore coming down stairs but fine otherwise. Tomorrows a rest day so hopefully it'll be grand for Friday If not I'll rest it as I don't want to aggravate it,


To finish on a positive my shiny new watch arrive today I went for garmin 220 as I think it has everything i need at the moment and it vibrates so no more missing beeps.

It was a lovely evening for a run if a little windy in places, despite my woes I still enjoyed my run.

10.86 miles in 1:59:06 @10:58 pace avg HR 134

Maximus Alexander

Sorry to hear about the knee, I hope it's nothing serious and clears up quickly.

Great news on the watch, I've the 225 (which is basically the same) and absolutely love it!

The Muppet

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Sorry to hear about the knee, I hope it's nothing serious and clears up quickly.

Great news on the watch, I've the 225 (which is basically the same) and absolutely love it!

Thanks I don't think its anything too serious, I've had niggles in the knee before. I'll mind it anyway. I see you had niggles yourself, I hope those settle down for you, Injuries are all part of the journey I suppose, I've been very lucky with them to date.

How do you find the optical heart monitor on the 225, some of the reviews I read said it was temperamental which put me off them so I played safe with the 220.

I need to get used to the 220. I wore both watches tonight to be sure i recorded the run. I must read the manual tomorrow.

Maximus Alexander

Yeah I thankfully haven't had anything too serious either, I just have a lot of paranoia about my foot in particular because it caused me a lot of trouble last year. I suppose it's just a matter of staying diligent, doing your warm ups and stretches, and learning when to back off for a few days. You're doing a lot of running, might not do you any harm to rest a couple of days and make sure it doesn't develop into anything?

I've nothing to compare the optical against, apart from a manual count when I'm not running. Under those conditions I find it very accurate, and when running it doesn't seem to throw up readings that I'd have any cause to doubt, but I can't say for certain. Davedanon on here did some testing with the 225 vs the HRM strap and he seemed to find that they matched pretty closely as long as the watch was worn tight to avoid light leakage, so that's good enough for me.

tailgunner

I had something very similar going on with my knee a few months ago. Definitely keep an eye on it in case it develops into something more serious. I ignored it at the time and ended up injured.

The Muppet

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Yeah I thankfully haven't had anything too serious either, I just have a lot of paranoia about my foot in particular because it caused me a lot of trouble last year. I suppose it's just a matter of staying diligent, doing your warm ups and stretches, and learning when to back off for a few days. You're doing a lot of running, might not do you any harm to rest a couple of days and make sure it doesn't develop into anything?

I don't stretch before runs I ease into the runs as my warm up. I think the learning to back off is very important, I'm not sure how good i'd be at that if the need arose if it was for any length of time, I wouldn't mind taking a few days off though if I had to.

tailgunner wrote: »

I had something very similar going on with my knee a few months ago. Definitely keep an eye on it in case it develops into something more serious. I ignored it at the time and ended up injured.

Thanks for the advice, I won't ignore it , it feels a little sore this morning but not painful if that makes any sense. I iced it for 15 minutes before work. Today is a rest day anyway, if there is no improvement tomorrow I will not run on it.

I actually think it may have been the camber of the footpath I ran on that caused it, I got a similar but not as bad pain after running along there before , perhaps that and tiredness played its part. I dont think its anything too serious at the moment.

Maximus Alexander

I don't stretch before a run either, but afterwards it's a wonderful thing.

The Muppet

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I don't stretch before a run either, but afterwards it's a wonderful thing.

I always stretch my hamstrings quads and calfs after a run. When I finish the plan I' m on at the moment I planned to ease back a little on the running for a month or so and to do this strength and flex program, .I started it before and did a week but then i fell off the wagon. Hopefully I can stick to my plans this time, I'm certainly more focused now than I was back then.

You foot injury sound nasty, was it caused by running?

Maximus Alexander

That program sounds interesting. When I hear people talking about drills and such I always feel I'm missing a trick - might look into it myself!

Yeah I think the foot was an overuse injury. I increased my mileage rapidly and was running on tired legs a lot. I got a really bad pain in the fifth metatarsal and could scarcely bare weight on it for about 3 weeks, hobbling around in pain. I was afraid run for months afterwards.

It taught me a valuable lesson about listening to the body and easing off when necessary - hint hint!

The Muppet

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

That program sounds interesting. When I hear people talking about drills and such I always feel I'm missing a trick - might look into it myself!

Yeah I think the foot was an overuse injury. I increased my mileage rapidly and was running on tired legs a lot. I got a really bad pain in the fifth metatarsal and could scarcely bare weight on it for about 3 weeks, hobbling around in pain. I was afraid run for months afterwards.

It taught me a valuable lesson about listening to the body and easing off when necessary - hint hint!

Ouch sounds painful, I've been very lucky , the odd niggle but nothing that has prevented me from running so far.

I get the message re easing off, sure I'm not running today at all.:)

The plan is good, I did 7 days of it, as it progresses the sessions take longer than the advertised 15 minutes though we'll they did for me anyway.

Ososlo

Nice long run The Muppet!

On the knee, do you foam roll regularly? I remember getting knee issues a few years ago and found rolling the calves regularly really helped. Grid roller is the best for this I find.

Just a thought... sounds like you're very in tune with your body and what's going on anyways.

The Muppet

Ososlo wrote: »

Nice long run The Muppet!

On the knee, do you foam roll regularly? I remember getting knee issues a few years ago and found rolling the calves regularly really helped. Grid roller is the best for this I find.

Just a thought... sounds like you're very in tune with your body and what's going on anyways.

cheers ososlo, I used to roll my calves with a wooden roller on occasion but not regularly tbh. I bought a form roller last week with good intentions but so far its been sitting unused in the corner of the room, I will break it out this evening. Is grid roller an exercise? I assume utube will show me how.

ah just found out its a type of roller my bad. Mine is notched but not in grids.

Ososlo

The Muppet wrote: »

cheers ososlo, I used to roll my calves with a wooden roller on occasion but not regularly tbh. I bought a form roller last week with good intentions but so far its been sitting unused in the corner of the room, I will break it out this evening. Is grid roller an exercise? I assume utube will show me how.

ah just found out its a type of roller my bad. Mine is notched but not in grids.

notched is good. Get deep in there nice and deep. I'd get to work on that if I were you this evening. Sure if you're not running what else would ya be doin' like:pac:

The Muppet

Ososlo wrote: »

notched is good. Get deep in there nice and deep. I'd get to work on that if I were you this evening. Sure if you're not running what else would ya be doin' like:pac:

I'd be reading about running or other people running:eek:, but will defo do some foam rolling this evening.

Ososlo

The Muppet wrote: »

I'd be reading about running or other people running:eek:, but will defo do some foam rolling this evening.

ha ha sounds like you got the bug big style:D

DubOnHoliday

I thought it might help to post my experience of recent knee issues. I've had sometimes some shooting or tingling pain on the outside of my right knee. It mostly happens when I play football and do a twisting motion, but it also happens during sprint training. I've been to the physio, he said it was a tightness of the ITB. But that was not the real issue. The main issue comes from the fact that one side of the body (the right side) is a lot weaker than the other. I hadnt been doing core work, so he prescribed me various core exercises including the likes of lunges to build up my right side, squats, crab walks etc. I'm doing some yoga too, which is great for the core. The only thing is to find time to do everything! Good luck.

The Muppet

DubOnHoliday wrote: »

I thought it might help to post my experience of recent knee issues. I've had sometimes some shooting or tingling pain on the outside of my right knee. It mostly happens when I play football and do a twisting motion, but it also happens during sprint training. I've been to the physio, he said it was a tightness of the ITB. But that was not the real issue. The main issue comes from the fact that one side of the body (the right side) is a lot weaker than the other. I hadnt been doing core work, so he prescribed me various core exercises including the likes of lunges to build up my right side, squats, crab walks etc. I'm doing some yoga too, which is great for the core. The only thing is to find time to do everything! Good luck.

Thanks for that, it's really helpful to hear other peoples experience.

DubOnHoliday

The Muppet wrote: »

Thanks for that, it's really helpful to hear other peoples experience.

No problem, btw your training log is a great read and you've made great progress. Keep up the good work.

The Muppet

Thats very kind of you, Thanks , The log keeps me honest and helps with the motivation plus the advice and encouragement from more experienced runners here is invaluable.

I have always logged my uns. I had my own word press log when I stated running and then I used to log on facebook, I 'd say my friend are delighted I've moved to log here.

The Muppet

For anyone that has never used a foam roller don't be fooled by the word foam, Its painful. First session completed, Ice pack applied now so lets see how things are tomorrow before deciding whether I do my session or not.

Maximus Alexander

How's the knee treating you today?

The Muppet

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

How's the knee treating you today?

Its a little better today , I can still feel it coming down stairs, I'm definitely going to give the tempo session a miss today , but i'll see how its feeling this evening and may go for a light short jog on it to see how that feels and take things from there. Thanks for asking.

Hows you foot and glutes today?

Firedance

The Muppet wrote: »

For anyone that has never used a foam roller don't be fooled by the word foam, Its painful. First session completed, Ice pack applied now so lets see how things are tomorrow before deciding whether I do my session or not.

it is quite painful! but if done regularly* very beneficial



*if I took my own advice I'd be sorted

Maximus Alexander

The Muppet wrote: »

Its a little better today , I can still feel it coming down stairs, I'm definitely going to give the tempo session a miss today , but i'll see how its feeling this evening and may go for a light short jog on it to see how that feels and take things from there. Thanks for asking.

Hows you foot and glutes today?

Glad to hear it! Sounds like you're being sensible anyway.

Much better on both counts, thanks. Glute seemed worse last night but it seems back to normal today. Only problem is I deferred last night's easy run to today to let it rest and now I'm struggling to see where I'm going to fit it in!

Firedance wrote: »

it is quite painful! but if done regularly* very beneficial


*if I took my own advice I'd be sorted

Yeah I always have good intentions but then end up only doing it when I feel like I need it. :rolleyes:

The Muppet

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Glad to hear it! Sounds like you're being sensible anyway.

No point being silly about it and being out for longer than I need, That's the huge advantage of this forum, my instinct is telling me to run as the pain eased the other night when I ran but the more experienced runners here say rest it or it will force me to stop for longer.

Much better on both counts, thanks. Glute seemed worse last night but it seems back to normal today. Only problem is I deferred last night's easy run to today to let it rest and now I'm struggling to see where I'm going to fit it in!
Yeah I always have good intentions but then end up only doing it when I feel like I need it. :rolleyes:

Good, it's a little better, take it easy. That can be a struggle, fitting in the runs but you'll find a way I'm sure, Enjoy it, I'll be reading about it with envy if I don't get out myself.

The Muppet

Firedance wrote: »

it is quite painful! but if done regularly* very beneficial



*if I took my own advice I'd be sorted

Couldnt believe how sore it was. I will do it regularly,

Like you were saying in own log regarding strength and fexibility its an aspect of training that I didn't give the attention it needs. Lesson learned I will have to devote some time to it a couple of times a week at least.

hows the foot today?

Firedance

The Muppet wrote: »

Couldnt believe how sore it was. I will do it regularly,

Like you were saying in own log regarding strength and fexibility its an aspect of training that I didn't give the attention it needs. Lesson learned I will have to devote some time to it a couple of times a week at least.

hows the foot today?

we're not alone I think though, lots of runners neglect this area of training in favour of, well, running! foot is still sore but am optimistic I'll see an improvement by the end of next week as long as I put the work in of course! Good call to skip todays tempo run, don't go out later either if you feel another days rest would help even more.

The Muppet

Just had my second date with my foam roller, It was painful but not as painful as yesterdays .

My legs feel good this evening, very little pain in the knee, I really had to fight with myself not to go out for a few easy miles.

If they are the same tomorrow im going to try a warm up mile and see where i go from there, if there is no reaction I might try the tempo session I missed today, I will play safe though if I feel any pain at any stage.

Ososlo

The Muppet wrote: »

Just had my second date with my foam roller, It was painful but not as painful as yesterdays .

My legs feel good this evening, very little pain in the knee, I really had to fight with myself not to go out for a few easy miles.

If they are the same tomorrow im going to try a warm up mile and see where i go from there, if there is no reaction I might try the tempo session I missed today, I will play safe though if I feel any pain at any stage.

IMO very little is too much to even consider doing a tempo tomorrow.
I'd go for a recovery effort run tomorrow (if no pain at all) and if everything's ticket-boo 100% during and after I'd count my lucky stars and then go for it Sunday or Monday. I know it might mess up your plan but think of the bigger picture and all that...
Good work on the foam rolling:)

The Muppet

Ososlo wrote: »

IMO very little is too much to even consider doing a tempo tomorrow.
I'd go for a recovery effort run tomorrow (if no pain at all) and if everything's ticket-boo 100% during and after I'd count my lucky stars and then go for it Sunday or Monday. I know it might mess up your plan but think of the bigger picture and all that...
Good work on the foam rolling:)

Ok , no tempo tomorrow , Recovery run if there is no pain in the knee it is.

Ososlo

The Muppet wrote: »

Ok , no tempo tomorrow , Recovery run if there is no pain in the knee it is.

For the sake of a day or two, might be the best thing... Everything's going so well for you, you don't wanna scupper the progress etc.

The Muppet

Ososlo wrote: »

For the sake of a day or two, might be the best thing... Everything's going so well for you, you don't wanna scupper the progress etc.

Yeah I know you're right, I just hate missing planned runs. Thanks

Ososlo

The Muppet wrote: »

Yeah I know you're right, I just hate missing planned runs. Thanks

Oh I know how you feel!! It's the old runner's OCD in us all! Usually a good thing but has its downside too!

The Muppet

No pain in the knee when I woke this morning so I ventured out for an easy few miles as instructed:). I just upped the pace slightly on each mile and all felt quite good and no pain so far after.

I'm unsure of where to go from here , whether I go for a few more days of easy runs and rest just to be sure all is ok or go back on to my plan from tomorrow.



3.1 miles @9:52 pace

splits
1@ 10.23
2@ 9:54
3@ 9:15

Ososlo

The Muppet wrote: »

No pain in the knee when I woke this morning so I ventured out for an easy few miles as instructed:). I just upped the pace slightly on each mile and all felt quite good and no pain so far after.

I'm unsure of where to go from here , whether I go for a few more days of easy runs and rest just to be sure all is ok or go back on to my plan from tomorrow.



3.1 miles @9:52 pace

splits
1@ 10.23
2@ 9:54
3@ 9:15

Ha ha you're quite welcome to ignore my advice/comments:D. That's all they are at the end of the day as I ain't no expert! Far from it but I am quite sensible when it comes to listening to my body.

Only you know your body, but it does sound like you'd be fine to give it a good old lash tomorrow! You approached today very sensibly btw. Exactly how I would have:)

The Muppet

Ososlo wrote: »

Ha ha you're quite welcome to ignore my advice/comments:D. That's all they are at the end of the day as I ain't no expert! Far from it but I am quite sensible when it comes to listening to my body.

Only you know your body, but it does sound like you'd be fine to give it a good old lash tomorrow! You approached today very sensibly btw. Exactly how I would have:)

I wouldn't dare,

I do appreciate the help. I'm here to learn and improve, there would be no point looking for advice here if I'm not going to take it on board.

Maximus Alexander

Delighted all went well today. Not sure what you should do tomorrow, so I'll say nothing this time.

The Muppet

On the premise that lost workouts are gone and I didn't want to put too much strain on my knee too soon I decided not to do Fridays missed 5k tempo session today, My ocd allowed me do this as I did the parkrun last weekend which should adequately cover for the missed session.

So it is onto week 12 of the plan which allowed me to do the sensible thing and do another easy run this morning.

55 minutes easy it was . The run went well but I did feel some soreness in my knee nearing the end, I've had that before on runs so I'm not too concerned about it but I will take this week day by day be extra careful not to push things too far on any of the runs and bail if I feel any pain.


Todays run
5.26 miles in 54:46 @10:24 pace avg hr 132

1 @ 11:00
2@ 10:55
3@ 10:04
4@ 9:58
5@ 9:58

No pain after the run, I have some foam rolling planned for later in the day.:eek:

Week 12
Day|Run|Notes
Sunday|55 minutes easy|
Monday|4 x 90 seconds Hills with recovery|
Tuesday|55 minutes easy|
Wednesday|110 minutes easy|
Thursday| Rest|
Friday| 72 mins with 24 minutes temp| *8.40 per mile
Saturday|55 minutes easy