Match Thread: Ireland v Wales [2.30pm 29/08/15 Aviva Stadium] Guinness Series

awec

I don't think a back row of POM, Murphy and Heaslip works. Especially with no Best on the pitch. We just miss a real nuisance at the breakdown.

Maybe awful is harsh but Murphy was at least the worst back row on show today.

It's not a back row trio I'd like to see finish out a tight game or if we were chasing a game.

Stheno

Deleted User wrote: »

Heaslip was, by a substantial margin, the best back row.

POM and Murphy had largely similar games.

Yeah agreed, I thought Heaslip was a real busy body today, seemed to pop up a lot.

aimee1

twinytwo wrote: »

Ah here, you might as well call a spade a spade... while he was on the pitch POM was easily the best of the backrow.

yeah whatever. Heaslip was very good today. He just never stopped working.

awec

awec wrote: »

I don't think a back row of POM, Murphy and Heaslip works. Especially with no Best on the pitch. We just miss a real nuisance at the breakdown.

Maybe awful is harsh but Murphy was at least the worst back row on show today.

It's not a back row trio I'd like to see finish out a tight game or if we were chasing a game.

Murphy destroyed the English backrow during the 6N. Him and O'Donnell worked them off the pitch. POM Murphy Heaslip is fine, today they weren't on song and honestly, and I hate to say it, but Joubert was a complete disgrace and whilst he got things wrong for Wales also, he made 3 - 4 fairly significant errors today that cost us penalty scoring opportunities.

Sour grapes and all that, but it's not the first time matches (not just irish teams) have been spoiled by officials not observing half of what is going on.

Still, lots of our guys looked rusty today or were minding themselves. I also fully believe that we will see our armed and fully operational battle squad in the tournament and not before. Expect a similar outing next week.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Sexton was pretty poor today, no? Quite a few mistakes, blunders you might call them. First match of the season for him and all so no need to panic but still.... Jackson didn't make as many mistakes in the first match against Wales and he hadn't played internationally for quite some time, is all I'm saying

Stheno

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

Sexton was pretty poor today, no? Quite a few mistakes, blunders you might call them. First match of the season for him and all so no need to panic but still.... Jackson didn't make as many mistakes in the first match against Wales and he hadn't played internationally for quite some time, is all I'm saying

Rusty I'd say, I can see himself and Murray starting next week to gel more.

errlloyd

Madigan is our only in form 10, this is a concerning state of affairs.

Rightwing

I'm beginning to think France look like great value to top the group. Schmidt's rugby is just far too conservative.

Squidgy Black

errlloyd wrote: »

Madigan is our only in form 10, this is a concerning state of affairs.

Depends on how you describe "in form", I'd still rather an out of form Sexton than Mads.

phog

errlloyd wrote: »

Madigan is our only in form 10, this is a concerning state of affairs.

In form maybe but definitely below par for an international outhalf.

Stheno

errlloyd wrote: »

Madigan is our only in form 10, this is a concerning state of affairs.

He's had more game time than any other though no?

Rightwing wrote: »

I'm beginning to think France look like great value to top the group. Schmidt's rugby is just far too conservative.

I don't agree, I think Schmidt is being clever here and using the warm ups for what they are, warm ups

PTH2009

Probly the worse game I saw ireland play in the aviva was today's . Both teams were bad and there was no atmosphere.

England will win handy next week

If Italy pull a Argentina 2007 on it then we are in trouble if we don't improve. France are in a good place

Our international soccer counterparts are playing there final Euro 2016 qualifier vs Poland on the 11th October just after our potentially huge game vs France. Could be a dark day for irish sport

phog

PTH2009 wrote: »

Probly the worse game I saw ireland play in the aviva was today's . Both teams were bad and there was no atmosphere.

England will win handy next week

If Italy pull a Argentina 2007 on it then we are in trouble if we don't improve. France are in a good place

Our international soccer counterparts are playing there final Euro 2016 qualifier vs Poland on the 11th October just after our potentially huge game vs France. Could be a dark day for irish sport

Today was a warm up game, we knew players would be rusty.

I still think we'll top our group.

total former

PTH2009 wrote: »

Probly the worse game I saw ireland play in the aviva was today's . Both teams were bad and there was no atmosphere.

England will win handy next week

If Italy pull a Argentina 2007 on it then we are in trouble if we don't improve. France are in a good place

Our international soccer counterparts are playing there final Euro 2016 qualifier vs Poland on the 11th October just after our potentially huge game vs France. Could be a dark day for irish sport

It's hard to know where to start with this.

You may want to check the results from today and then let us know if you think Italy are a threat.

PTH2009

phog wrote: »

Today was a warm up game, we knew players would be rusty.

I still think we'll top our group.

I have a feeling joe knew his 31 for the World Cup before the game and told the players

thomond2006

PTH2009 wrote: »

Probly the worse game I saw ireland play in the aviva was today's . Both teams were bad and there was no atmosphere.

England will win handy next week

If Italy pull a Argentina 2007 on it then we are in trouble if we don't improve. France are in a good place

Our international soccer counterparts are playing there final Euro 2016 qualifier vs Poland on the 11th October just after our potentially huge game vs France. Could be a dark day for irish sport

Are you ever not pessimistic? This is really worst possible scenario stuff. Italy are not going to pull an Argentina 2007. It's a bit early to say that France are in a good place, they were 1-1 in their matches against England. I'm certain that leaving out FTD is going to cost them. Since you seem to believe warmups matter, Italy got murdered today in Scotland...

The only effect today will really have on RWC are the injuries and we have quality players available to replace Earls and/or Fitzgerald. A lot of the key starters were playing their first match today for 3 months, there was some rustiness... quelle surprise!

Stheno

PTH2009 wrote: »

Probly the worse game I saw ireland play in the aviva was today's . Both teams were bad and there was no atmosphere.

England will win handy next week

If Italy pull a Argentina 2007 on it then we are in trouble if we don't improve. France are in a good place

Our international soccer counterparts are playing there final Euro 2016 qualifier vs Poland on the 11th October just after our potentially huge game vs France. Could be a dark day for irish sport

Wow I was in the Aviva today and the atmosphere was much better than against Scotland when it was dire.

Dunno that England will win handy next week at all, after a first defeat in close to two years, Ireland will be gunning for it I reckon

The Lost Sheep

PTH2009 wrote: »

Probly the worse game I saw ireland play in the aviva was today's. Both teams were bad and there was no atmosphere.

England will win handy next week

If Italy pull a Argentina 2007 on it then we are in trouble if we don't improve. France are in a good place

Our international soccer counterparts are playing there final Euro 2016 qualifier vs Poland on the 11th October just after our potentially huge game vs France. Could be a dark day for irish sport

Ah don't go overboard....
I don't see any reason why England will "win handy next week". Italy wont pull anything like Argentina in 2007
Are France really in a good place?
Today was a warm up. Very different to 6N/AIs... hard to get atmosphere going for games like todays...

PTH2009 wrote: »

I have a feeling joe knew his 31 for the World Cup before the game and told the players

That's rubbish.
He wouldn't have tried out so many guys in different areas if he did.....

thomond2006

PTH2009 wrote: »

I have a feeling joe knew his 31 for the World Cup before the game and told the players

What's the benefit of doing that?

kenmc

awec wrote: »

I'm not on the Fitz hype train either. Though I am not a card carrying member of the Earls hype club either.

thank christ, I thought I was the only one seeing Fitz thinking the emperor has no clothes. even as a Leinster fan, I just can't see what he brings ahead of say zebo.
likewise rory best, dodgy darts is his calling card in my opinion.

clsmooth

PTH2009 wrote: »

Probly the worse game I saw ireland play in the aviva was today's . Both teams were bad and there was no atmosphere.

England will win handy next week

If Italy pull a Argentina 2007 on it then we are in trouble if we don't improve. France are in a good place

Our international soccer counterparts are playing there final Euro 2016 qualifier vs Poland on the 11th October just after our potentially huge game vs France. Could be a dark day for irish sport

Slight over reaction to a preseason friendly. Italy lose 48-7 to Scotland and you think they might pull an 'Argentina 2007'? We admittedly don't play well against a close to full strength Welsh team who need to be peaking earlier than us in a few weeks, and we still come that close to beating them.. And yet we're the ones in trouble?

And where are you getting England will win handy next week from? Did you see them vs France last week? They were appalling and even then that French team (in such good place) nearly threw the game away. They're glorified preseason friendlies. A result would be nice, but avoiding injuries and giving the squad minutes is the priority. All the teams have been poor so far. Let's see whose firing on all cylinders in October. I'd put good money on Ireland clicking. The past two years backs that up.

Stheno

kenmc wrote: »

thank christ, I thought I was the only one seeing Fitz thinking the emperor has no clothes. even as a Leinster fan, I just can't see what he brings ahead of say zebo.
likewise rory best, dodgy darts is his calling card in my opinion.

I didn't think Fitz did much at all today either.

As for best, dodgy throws aside, I do think he brings a lot to the side.

clsmooth

kenmc wrote: »

likewise rory best, dodgy darts is his calling card in my opinion.

As opposed to Cronin who is guaranteed line out ball?

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

I thought Best was a bit dodgy during the 6 Nations. Strange we haven't seen him at all so far.

Ceadog

clsmooth wrote: »

As opposed to Cronin who is guaranteed line out ball?

Best is by far our best scrummaging hooker, is extremely effective on the ground, and is one of the squad leaders.

Cronin is a very good player coming off the bench and is a devastating carrier but Best is a far more rounded player.

kenmc

clsmooth wrote: »

As opposed to Cronin who is guaranteed line out ball?

might be blinkered, but don't remember ever fearing either Cronin or Strauss about to throw into the lineout, either for Leinster or Ireland, but every time best picks up the ball I reckon its at best 50/50. Cronin and Strauss both better carriers IMO, although I worry about Strauss and the number of concussions he's had

clsmooth

Ceadog wrote: »

Best is by far our best scrummaging hooker, is extremely effective on the ground, and is one of the squad leaders.

Cronin is a very good player coming off the bench and is a devastating carrier but Best is a far more rounded player.

Agree with you 100%. Best is incredibly underrated. As good as Cronin can be off the bench, I'd be worried to see him starting one of the bigger games, his thowing is the least consistent of the 3. I'd probably have Strauss to start ahead of him. Cronin is an ideal impact player.

Stheno

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

I thought Best was a bit dodgy during the 6 Nations. Strange we haven't seen him at all so far.

Did he not play in the first Welsh game?

Any highlights

digzy

Rightwing wrote: »

I'm beginning to think France look like great value to top the group. Schmidt's rugby is just far too conservative.

I'd be inclined to agree with you.
Gatand said earlier that we don't play much rugby....he's bloody right. I'd be shocked if we beat France. Even more so if we make a semi.

bilston

digzy wrote: »

I'd be inclined to agree with you.
Gatand said earlier that we don't play much rugby....he's bloody right. I'd be shocked if we beat France. Even more so if we make a semi.

I'm not sure why you'd be shocked given they haven't beaten us in 5 attempts.

Anyway given these are warm up games I wouldn't be too concerned. They are fitness exercises more than anything else. You aren't going to give your playbook away in these matches. There will be more to come from Ireland. I'm not saying we'll change dramatically but we will play more rugby.

To be honest I'm pretty sure I could see signs of one or two things that were tried today but just didn't quite come off. The reasons for that would be that some of the players were rusty (especially Sexton) and that we had unfamiliar partnerships in action too.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Stheno wrote: »

Did he not play in the first Welsh game?

You're right, he did. Had about 15 minutes at the end. Still strange not to have seen more of him.

Dave_The_Sheep

digzy wrote: »

I'd be inclined to agree with you.
Gatand said earlier that we don't play much rugby....he's bloody right. I'd be shocked if we beat France. Even more so if we make a semi.

Gatland, such the neutral observer, must be correct so.

I'm surprised. Two 6 Nations without playing any rugby. Good call by Warren, alright.


...


...

You ... <expletive deleted>.

Stheno

Deleted User wrote: »

Any highlights

From the Telly?

RTE player

http://www.rte.ie/player/ie/show/10461185/

croot

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Any highlights

Ya. The standing ovation Paul O'Connell got at the end. That was about it.

duckysauce

croot wrote: »

Ya. The standing ovation Paul O'Connell got at the end. That was about it.

Henderson :cool::cool::cool::cool:

Stheno

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

You're right, he did. Had about 15 minutes at the end. Still strange not to have seen more of him.

I reckon we'll see him next week, and he's on the plane regardless.

ionadnapokot

1 Cant stand losing to Wales
2 Gatland...Really dislike that man
3 Still tired and emotional
4 Why do Ireland continually run it up the guts of the Welsh? Why Joe? Why?
5 No injuries to our key players
6 Hendo = Beast = Starting No4
7 DK in RWC squad
6 I really fear for Ireland if we have to chase a score*

*B2B 6N Champions

Funk It

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Joubert was a complete disgrace and whilst he got things wrong for Wales also, he made 3 - 4 fairly significant errors today that cost us penalty scoring opportunities

Tend to agree. In his defense, I think the he went to the TMO but gave a knock-on when Tipiric stole the ball close to the line. All of a sudden we were back 5m from our own line, thought that was massive.

Few forward passes missed, and not sure if I'd agree with some of the scrum calls.

Thankfully it was only a warmup game, so certainly not the end of the world.

rrpc

Watching the match, the biggest issue for me was how badly we protected our own ball at rucks. Twice in a row Conor Murray was the first in to ruck over the ball and the second time we lost the ball. We seemed to have backs in the rucks more than forwards at times.

I'd like to see Demented Mole's ruck marks for that game because it seemed to me that a lot of our forwards went missing.

I agree that as a losing team we tend to look at the ref to blame, but the consistency annoyed me. POC's penalty was for around the neck but it looked more shoulders than neck. Later SOB got tackled in a stranglehold and it seemed like an age before Joubert gave the penalty whilst the stranglehold never let up.

The TMO decision giving a knock on against us when you could clearly see Tipuric rip the ball and carry it over the line was unforgiveable given the pictures we could all see.

stephen_n

What is it with some Irish people, they just love the misery of failure, second defeat in two years (with probably only half a starting test side) and suddenly we are a **** team, with a limited game plan. Sometimes the BS posted online makes you seriously question, if the posters were dropped as babies. It was a WARMUP match, with 8 players starting who either won't start against top tier opposition, or won't start in the positions they're in and five more playing their first game in three months, that we lost by one score, perspective people ffs, it's not that difficult a concept.

phog

stephen_n wrote: »

What is it with some Irish people, they just love the misery of failure, second defeat in two years (with probably only half a starting test side) and suddenly we are a **** team, with a limited game plan. Sometimes the BS posted online makes you seriously question, if the posters were dropped as babies. It was a WARMUP match, with 8 players starting who either won't start against top tier opposition, or won't start in the positions they're in and five more playing their first game in three months, that we lost by one score, perspective people ffs, it's not that difficult a concept.

I accept it was a warmup game and I understand why some players were rusty but the performance yesterday was below par for that team and I bet they and Joe know it.

DrFloppy

PTH2009 wrote: »

Probly the worse game I saw ireland play in the aviva was today's . Both teams were bad and there was no atmosphere.

England will win handy next week

If Italy pull a Argentina 2007 on it then we are in trouble if we don't improve. France are in a good place

Our international soccer counterparts are playing there final Euro 2016 qualifier vs Poland on the 11th October just after our potentially huge game vs France. Could be a dark day for irish sport

Hard to even reconcile that drivel with a response to be honest.

stephen_n

phog wrote: »

I accept it was a warmup game and I understand why some players were rusty but the performance yesterday was below par for that team and I bet they and Joe know it.

A below par performance given the respective strengths of the teams facing each other, to be honest I would think Wales have more to be concerned about after yesterday than we do. SOB and heaslip starting, Sexton playing anywhere near what he's capable of and that game would look very different. The performance and execution was poor at times, from a scratch team, it's not great but according to some of the cr@p being posted, all of a sudden we'll be lucky to make it out of our group, off the back of that one performance.

smiley_face

It really looked like Ireland refused to give away any training ground moves.
We were missing a bit of a surprise here and there, but I suspect we have stuff in the works for the RWC if we need a moment of creativity from set pieces and attacking ball on opposition's 22.
We did a lot of one-out passing mixed with back inside pops, which seemed like handling practice and a bit forced.
Similarly there were some chip kicks in behind Wales' defensive line that didn't really create anything, seemed more like we were giving away possession and were willing to defend in their half.
Joe mentioned that the ball was slow so it was nearly preferable to not have to carry it.
The biggest surprise for me was POC not really giving the crowd anything to cheer, given it was his last Home game, but at his age he prob needs a few matches to get up to speed.
Watching back the highlights and noticed Strauss had a few bad moments so wouldn't be surprised if the video analysis will count against him and put Cronin ahead again for bench cover.
D Kearney and Henderson gave great effort, and they should start again against England IMO.
Would move Henderson to 6 and start POC and Toner together, Ryan on bench.
Expect a lot more from Sexton from now on, no more excuses about rustiness from here on in, we need a 10 to be way more accurate with his chip kicks and cross field kick passes and no more block downs or slices to touch.

The Rape of Lucretia

Was Geraldsie's problem not just one of bad boots ? Middle of the second half he started looking uncomfortable and massages the boots. The goes down looking injured but a water boy comes over and hands him another pair of the same yellow boots and Geraldsie puts them on. Still looks uncomfortable though and is fiddling with them. Then wants to come off but forced to stay on due to Earlsie's injury. Struggles, and messes with the boots again, then comes off anyway even though we had no real sub for him.
What was wrong with those two pairs of yellow boots I want to know .

sullivlo

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Was Geraldsie's problem not just one of bad boots ? Middle of the second half he started looking uncomfortable and massages the boots. The goes down looking injured but a water boy comes over and hands him another pair of the same yellow boots and Geraldsie puts them on. Still looks uncomfortable though and is fiddling with them. Then wants to come off but forced to stay on due to Earlsie's injury. Struggles, and messes with the boots again, then comes off anyway even though we had no real sub for him.
What was wrong with those two pairs of yellow boots I want to know .

He was seen to say "my ****ing back" as he limped off. Joe said after that he has bruising on his glutes.

Utah_Saint

Wouldn't read much into the result. For all of Welsh domination they beat us by less than converted try. Gatland should be more worried. He said in paper that we are limited and wales held back. I really don't think they held back. I doubt wales have many more gears to go up. Welsh next gear is give it to Roberts and make him run really hard in a straight line.

Most Ireland players didnt do much wrong or right....just avg. I really cant see how Fitz will go ahead of earls, zebo or dk. Fitz has perfected the art of working his ass off without actually making a big influence on the result. If Joe wants his wingers to work hard, defend well and not score or provide and offensive threat then Fitz is his man. otherwise for me its earls all day. Just my personal opinion..

Tox56

Utah_Saint wrote: »

Wouldn't read much into the result. For all of Welsh domination they beat us by less than converted try. Gatland should be more worried. He said in paper that we are limited and wales held back. I really don't think they held back. I doubt wales have many more gears to go up. Welsh next gear is give it to Roberts and make him run really hard in a straight line.

Most Ireland players didnt do much wrong or right....just avg. I really cant see how Fitz will go ahead of earls, zebo or dk. Fitz has perfected the art of working his ass off without actually making a big influence on the result. If Joe wants his wingers to work hard, defend well and not score or provide and offensive threat then Fitz is his man. otherwise for me its earls all day. Just my personal opinion..

Fitzgerald against Scotland in the six nations was probably the most offensive threat shown by any of our wingers in any game in the tournament

molloyjh

PTH2009 wrote: »

Probly the worse game I saw ireland play in the aviva was today's . Both teams were bad and there was no atmosphere.

England will win handy next week

If Italy pull a Argentina 2007 on it then we are in trouble if we don't improve. France are in a good place

Our international soccer counterparts are playing there final Euro 2016 qualifier vs Poland on the 11th October just after our potentially huge game vs France. Could be a dark day for irish sport

PTH2009 in doom and gloom shocker.

A bit of context is required. I know optimism isn't your thing (to put it very, very mildly) but that was a warm up game for a competition where we don't need to hit our peak for another 4-5 weeks. It wasn't a full strength squad, we weren't utilising our full attacking game and a few lads were understandably rusty. It's early days yet so let's leave the panic button alone for now shall we and set the hyperbole and melodrama to one side.