Leinster schools league/cup 2015/2016 senior&junior

RedemptionZ

D14Rugby wrote: »

Considering what he did against Blackrock and Roscrea his size isn't really a problem

Once he starts coming across backrows that are 6'4 115kg + it'll be a significant barrier. I don't know his exact height or weight but he looks like he'd very likely come against centres that are bigger than him.

Had a great cup campaign but in the same sense that people say size isn't enough at the pro game, neither is pure ability. You need to be a certain size to play backrow.

D14Rugby

RedemptionZ wrote: »

Once he starts coming across backrows that are 6'4 115kg + it'll be a significant barrier. I don't know his exact height or weight but he looks like he'd very likely come against centres that are bigger than him.

Had a great cup campaign but in the same sense that people say size isn't enough at the pro game, neither is pure ability. You need to be a certain size to play backrow.

Just gonna point out JVDF isnt exactly massive in comparison to most international 7's. Its not how big you are its how you use it

gazump123

Alan Tynan is on the bench tomorrow for a Munster u19 development side playing a South African touring team. Also has Milne moved to the Munster set up too?

brokenhooker

gazump123 wrote: »

Alan Tynan is on the bench tomorrow for a Munster u19 development side playing a South African touring team. Also has Milne moved to the Munster set up too?

it would appear so. Although I thought you had to play for your schools province upto u18 level.

brokenhooker

Donn O Sullivan ‏@DonnOSullivan 11h11 hours ago
Also.... Did I miss the memo on the fact that the U/20 rugby inter pros are no more? To be replaced by development squad games. Hmmm

Seems like Nucifora is ending the under-20 interpros.

Tarf1234

brokenhooker wrote: »

Seems like Nucifora is ending the under-20 interpros.

Has this been officially announced? Not sure how I'd feel on about them going. Can see positives and negatives.

brokenhooker

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Has this been officially announced? Not sure how I'd feel on about them going. Can see positives and negatives.

No. Care to share these positives and negatives?

Because i'm not sure what positives there are.

I's another step toward Nucifora trying to dilute provincial loyalties and ties.

Tarf1234

brokenhooker wrote: »

No. Care to share these positives and negatives?

Because i'm not sure what positives there are.

I's another step toward Nucifora trying to dilute provincial loyalties and ties.

Just think if it is development squads it doesn't cut out those players who are slightly over age and would probably increase the standard. More an issue with the rigidity of age deadlines then the inter pro's themselves. I presume the development squad would still be roughly at the age of under 20/21. Under 20s is very early to basically cut off someone's career in rugby if they don't make inter pro's as an age in my opinion.

brokenhooker

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Just think if it is development squads it doesn't cut out those players who are slightly over age and would probably increase the standard. More an issue with the rigidity of age deadlines then the inter pro's themselves. I presume the development squad would still be roughly at the age of under 20/21. Under 20s is very early to basically cut off someone's career in rugby if they don't make inter pro's as an age in my opinion.

Oh no it would still be u20 development squads, but instead of having 4 provinces there would be no provincial ties and players from different provinces would play together. It is after all an exercise to identify players for Ireland u20.

I think the likely scenario would be 2 u20 development squads made up of players from all 4 provinces. Probably 60 players total with a breakdown along something like this: 5 Connacht, 12 Ulster, 18 Munster, 25 Leinster.

How that would work in regards to players training together over the summer I'm not sure. Seems like a bad idea to me, Nucifora really trying to dilute importance of provinces and where you are from. Trying to get the best 60 players playing as opposed to the best 15 from each province.

Tarf1234

brokenhooker wrote: »

Oh no it would still be u20 development squads, but instead of having 4 provinces there would be no provincial ties and players from different provinces would play together. It is after all an exercise to identify players for Ireland u20.

I think the likely scenario would be 2 u20 development squads made up of players from all 4 provinces. Probably 60 players total with a breakdown along something like this: 5 Connacht, 12 Ulster, 18 Munster, 25 Leinster.

How that would work in regards to players training together over the summer I'm not sure. Seems like a bad idea to me, Nucifora really trying to dilute importance of provinces and where you are from. Trying to get the best 60 players playing as opposed to the best 15 from each province.

Ah ok, hadn't seen anything on it before this and presumed differently. Seems like an odd move. Why only 2 development squads? Surely that is just significantly reducing the number of players exposed. Can't see the value in that if I'm honest.

brokenhooker

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Ah ok, hadn't seen anything on it before this and presumed differently. Seems like an odd move. Why only 2 development squads? Surely that is just significantly reducing the number of players exposed. Can't see the value in that if I'm honest.

have heard it could be 2 or 3.
players to train over summer with sub-academy then squads will be chosen.


want to focus development on elite group of players.

Tarf1234

brokenhooker wrote: »

have heard it could be 2 or 3.
players to train over summer with sub-academy then squads will be chosen.


want to focus development on elite group of players.

I'm all for examining the way we operate and how we organise every level but reducing to 2 or 3 teams seems a bit short sighted to me. Surely we have enough quality to maintain 4 teams

RuPi

brokenhooker wrote: »

Complete Squad breakdown:

Prop: Eoghan Clarke (CBC Monkstown / Leinster)
Prop: Evin Coyle (Gonzaga / Leinster)
Prop: Cathal Duff (Clongowes / Leinster)
Prop: Michael Milne (Roscrea / Munster)- ex Leinster youth
Prop: Tom O'Toole (Campbell College / Ulster)
Prop: Callum Reid (RBAI / Ulster)
Prop: Paul Mullan (Armagh RFC / Ulster)
Prop: Fergus O'Brien (Whitgift School / Exiles)
Hooker: Tadgh McCarthy (Bantry RFC / Munster)
Hooker: Diarmuid Barron (Rockwell College / Munster)
Hooker: Ronan Kelleher (St. Michael's College / Leinster)
Hooker: Stephen McLaughlin (Blackrock College / Leinster)
Hooker: Alexander Clarke (Ballymena Academy / Ulster)
Lock: Charlie Ryan (Blackrock College / Leinster)
Lock: Aaron Browne (Roscrea / Leinster)
Lock: Jack Dunne (St.Michael's College / Leinster)
Lock: Ronan Coffey (Ard Scoil Ris / Munster)
Lock: John McCusker (Rainey Old Boys / Ulster)
Lock: Matthew Dalton (Belfast Royal Academy / Ulster)
Lock: David Robb (Galwegians / Connacht)
Backrow: Caelan Doris (Blackrock College / Leinster)
Backrow: Richard Dunne (Blackrock College / Leinster)
Backrow: Sean Masterson (Portlaoise RFC/Leinster) - will probably move to Connacht but stranger things have happened
Backrow: JJ O'Dea (Navan / Leinster)
Backrow: Andrew Murphy (Blackrock College / Leinster)
Backrow: Jack Daly (Castleisland / Munster)
Backrow: Jack O'Sullivan (PBC / Munster)
Backrow: Jonjo Fanning (Bugbrooke RFC / Exiles)
Scrumhalf: Hugh O'Sullivan (Belvedere College / Leinster)
Scrumhalf: Jonathon Stewart (Wallace High School / Ulster)
Scrumhalf: Rhys O'Donnell (RBAI / Ulster)
Scrumhalf: Alex Crocker (Henley College / Exiles)
Outhalf: David Hawkshaw (Belvedere College / Leinster)
Outhalf: Conor Dean (Blackrock College / Leinster)
Outhalf: Peter Sylvester (PBC / Munster)
Outhalf: Bruce Houston (Ballymena Academy / Ulster)
Outhalf: James Newey (Christ College Brecon / Exiles)
Centre: Tommy O'Brien (Blackrock College / Leinster)
Centre: Liam Turner (Blackrock College / Leinster)
Centre: David McCarthy (Skibbereen RFC / Munster)
Centre: James Hume (RBAI / Ulster)
Cory Reid (Buccaneers & Marist College / Connacht)
Wing: Conor Philips (Crescent College / Munster)
Wing: Thomas O'Callaghan (CBC Monkstown / Leinster)
Wing: Ollie Brown (Harpenden RFC / Exiles)
Fullback: Michael Sylvester (Clongowes Wood College / Leinster)
Fullback: Sam Dardis (Terenure / Leinster)
Fullback: Daniel Hurley (Cresent CC / Munster)
Fullback: Conor Wharton (Oaklands College / Exiles)

Is there many lads from Leinster and Munster who didn't play Inter pros in September? Hawkshaw is obviously one, Bruce Houston was only in the Ulster 17's, so that is encouraging that both those 10's will be eligible next year.

brokenhooker

RuPi wrote: »

Is there many lads from Leinster and Munster who didn't play Inter pros in September? Hawkshaw is obviously one, Bruce Houston was only in the Ulster 17's, so that is encouraging that both those 10's will be eligible next year.

1. Sam Dardis(u17)
2. Michael Milne(u17)
3. Liam Turner(u17)
4. David Hawkshaw(u17)
5. Conor Phillips(u17)
6. Stephen McLaughlin(unsure)
7. Richard Dunne(didn't make leinster squad)
8. Jack Dunne(didn't play in interpros but involved in wider squad)
9. Ronan Kelleher(injury)
10. Rhys O'Donnell(unsure)
11. Conor Dean(injury)
12. Bruce Houston(u17)

I've also heard Charlie Ryan is u17 too.

brokenhooker

OceanSixteen wrote: »

O'Sullivan is being used as a fullback AFAIK

then they only brought 1 scrumhalf with the A team.

brokenhooker

OceanSixteen wrote: »

Belvedere lads involved with the Ireland U19s
Tom de Jongh (Backrow)
Conor Jennings (Outhalf/Centre)
James McKeown (Wing)

3 Munster lads invovled:
Calvin Nash(Centre/Wing)
Jack Lyons(Scrumhalf)
Colm Hogan(Back Three)

Jack Kelly(Fullback/Centre) & Oisin Dowling(Lock) there too.

brokenhooker

Mick McCormack(Prop) from St. Marys there too.

RugbyRugby2016

brokenhooker wrote: »

Mick McCormack(Prop) from St. Marys there too.

Any idea if McGowan or Mullin are in the squad?

brokenhooker

RugbyRugby2016 wrote: »

Any idea if McGowan or Mullin are in the squad?

havent heard.

brokenhooker

Ireland u19 squad

Prop: Peter Cooper (Belfast Harlequins RFC/Ulster)
Prop: Dylan Murphy (CC Roscrea/Munster)
Prop: Richie Mouatt (Blackrock College/Leinster)
Prop: Mick McCormack (St. Marys College/Leinster)
Hooker: Conor Maguire (Boyne RFC/Leinster)
Hooker: Tadgh McElroy (Lansdowne FC/Leinster)
Lock: Jack Regan (UCD RFC/Leinster)
Lock: Oisin Dowling (St. Michael's College/Leinster)
Lock: Gavin Coombes (Bandon Grammar/Munster)
Backrow: Tom de Jongh (Belvedere College/Leinster)
Backrow: Paul Boyle (Lansdowne FC/Leinster)
Backrow: Johnny Guy (UCD RFC/Leinster)
Backrow: John Foley (Shannon RFC/Munster)
Backrow: Marcus Rea (Ballymena Academy/Ulster)
Scrumhalf: Niall Saunders (Epsom College/Exile)
Scrumhalf: Jack Lyons (Crescent College/Munster)
Outhalf: Ciaran Frawley (Skerries RFC/Leinster)
Outhalf: Conor Fitzgerald (Ard Scoil Ris/Munster)
Centre: Peadar Collins (Ard Scoil Ris/Munster)
Centre: Gavin Mullin (Blackrock College/Leinster)
Centre: Michael McDermott (Dublin University FC/Leinster)
Wing: James McKeown (Belvedere College/Leinster)
Wing: Jordan Larmour (St. Andrew's College/Leinster)
Wing: Calvin Nash (Crescent College/Munster)
Wing: Colm Hogan (Dublin University FC/Munster)
Fullback: Jack Kelly (St. Michael's College/Leinster)

Leinster: 15
Munster: 8
Ulster: 2
Exile: 1
Connacht: 0

brokenhooker

stream of Ireland u18 game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OB-DbIkdp_c

errlloyd

Will Larmour play do we reckon?

brokenhooker

errlloyd wrote: »

Will Larmour play do we reckon?

where? or will he?

typhoony

no sign of the wesley out-half adam curry on any of the underage teams. he looks a serious athlete

brokenhooker

Starting u18 team:

1. Callum Reid(Ulster)
2. Ronan Kelleherv
3. Tom O'Toole(Ulster)
4. Matthew Dalton(Ulster)
5. Charlie Ryan(Leinster)
6. Ronan Coffey(Munster)
7. Richard Dunne(Leinster)
8. Caelan Doris(Leinster)
9. Jonny Stewart(Ulster)
10. Conor Dean(Leinster)
11. Daniel Hurley(Munster)
12. James Newey(Exile)
13. James Hume(Ulster)
14. Conor Wharton(Exile)
15. Hugh O'Sullivan(Leinster)

gazump123

Try for Ronan Kelleher. Conversion from the touch line by James Hume. 7-7 at half time.

errlloyd

brokenhooker wrote: »

where? or will he?

Will, looks like they've named him wing, he played outside centre this year, but more a case of Andrews putting the talent closer to the ball.

brokenhooker

errlloyd wrote: »

Will, looks like they've named him wing, he played outside centre this year, but more a case of Andrews putting the talent closer to the ball.

Too small for centre even at underage international level.

DV3

Very poor performance by the 18s against England. Dominated at the breakdown and handling errors ultimately cost them the game. Finished 15-12.

brokenhooker

DV3 wrote: »

Very poor performance by the 18s against England. Dominated at the breakdown and handling errors ultimately cost them the game. Finished 15-12.

considering we rarely if ever beat England, let alone keep it close at this level.
I would say it's not a bad result as we were playing away in the teams first game together, against a more physically developed english team who have played several games together already.

Too many handling errors and turnovers though that's for sure.

DV3

brokenhooker wrote: »

considering we rarely if ever beat England, let alone keep it close at this level.
I would say it's not a bad result as we were playing away in the teams first game together, against a more physically developed english team who have played several games together already.

Too many handling errors and turnovers though that's for sure.

They did far better than in previous years granted, but still, better doesn't always equate to good. Was probably being a tad harsh considering the time they've had together as a team, but regardless I certainly wasn't impressed by the rugby played today.

Here's hoping with a bit more time they'll gel as a team, as they certainly have some promising individuals.

brokenhooker

DV3 wrote: »

They did far better than in previous years granted, but still, better doesn't always equate to good. Was probably being a tad harsh considering the time they've had together as a team, but regardless I certainly wasn't impressed by the rugby played today.

Here's hoping with a bit more time they'll gel as a team, as they certainly have some promising individuals.

underage international teams rarely play well as a team... mostly all about individual performances and moments of magic.

Tyler Durdenn

gazump123 wrote: »

Alan Tynan is on the bench tomorrow for a Munster u19 development side playing a South African touring team. Also has Milne moved to the Munster set up too?

Any word on how this game went?

mistdub

brokenhooker wrote: »

Starting u18 team:

1. Callum Reid(Ulster)
2. Ronan Kelleherv
3. Tom O'Toole(Ulster)
4. Matthew Dalton(Ulster)
5. Charlie Ryan(Leinster)
6. Ronan Coffey(Munster)
7. Richard Dunne(Leinster)
8. Caelan Doris(Leinster)
9. Jonny Stewart(Ulster)
10. Conor Dean(Leinster)
11. Daniel Hurley(Munster)
12. James Newey(Exile)
13. James Hume(Ulster)
14. Conor Wharton(Exile)
15. Hugh O'Sullivan(Leinster)

Kearney and Hawkshaw of belvedere outclassed their blackrock counterparts in the cup yet they both start and Kearney isn't even in the squad. Am I missing something?

The Lost Sheep

mistdub wrote: »

Kearney and Hawkshaw of belvedere outclassed their blackrock counterparts in the cup yet they both start and Kearney isn't even in the squad. Am I missing something?

Hawkshaw is only an under 17. And cup performances are simply one small part of selection process. They don't simply deserve to be ahead because of that...

mistdub

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Hawkshaw is only an under 17. And cup performances are simply one small part of selection process. They don't simply deserve to be ahead because of that...

Well I really hope size isn't an important part of the selection process (as has been mentioned with Kearney). If underage setups are truly focused on developing talented rugby players and not just winning games they should be less focused on size and more so on raw ability. Kids playing at u18 are nowhere near fully grown physically so if youre aiming for long term 'development' size shouldn't come into it much at all, and unfortunately from what I have seen it does

Hagz

mistdub wrote: »

Well I really hope size isn't an important part of the selection process (as has been mentioned with Kearney). If underage setups are truly focused on developing talented rugby players and not just winning games they should be less focused on size and more so on raw ability. Kids playing at u18 are nowhere near fully grown physically so if youre aiming for long term 'development' size shouldn't come into it much at all, and unfortunately from what I have seen it does

Where are you seeing size come into it?

D14Rugby

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Hawkshaw is only an under 17. And cup performances are simply one small part of selection process. They don't simply deserve to be ahead because of that...

If you're good enough you're old enough. How else would you pick players other than on match form? Unless the two Blackrock lads completely outclassed the two Belvo guys in screening and training then there's no reason for them to be starting over them.

RugbyRugby2016

D14Rugby wrote: »

If you're good enough you're old enough. How else would you pick players other than on match form? Unless the two Blackrock lads completely outclassed the two Belvo guys in screening and training then there's no reason for them to be starting over them.

Maybe the coaches liked what they saw from Dean when he played Ireland u18 last year....

Might simply be they went with experience at 10 and size at 7 (which is understandable based on the fact that they were going up against a physically bigger English pack).

Anyway I doubt it's some grand conspiracy against selecting players from a universally lauded belvedere team. Those two will get their chance soon enough

brokenhooker

Ireland u18 side who lost to France u18 over the weekend: 23-10.

15. Michael Sylvester (Clongowes Wood College/Leinster)
14. Thomas O'Callaghan (CBC Monkstown/Leinster)
13. Corey Reid (Buccaneers RFC/Connacht)
12. David McCarthy (Skibbereen RFC/Munster)
11. Conor Phillips (Crescent Comprehensive College/Munster)
10. Peter Sylvester (Presentation Brothers Cork/Munster)
9. Rhys O'Donnell (RBAI/Ulster)
1. Cathal Duff (Clongowes Wood College/Leinster)
2. Diarmuid Barron (Rockwell College/Munster)
3. Paul Mullan (Armagh RFC/Ulster)
4. Jack Dunne (St. Michael's College/Leinster)
5. JJ O'Dea (Navan RFC/Leinster)
6. Jack O'Sullivan (Presentation Brothers Cork/Munster)
7. Jack Daly (Castleisland RFC/Munster)
8. Andrew Murphy (Blackrock College/Leinster) (capt).
16. Stephen McLoughlin (Blackrock College/Leinster)
17. Fergus O'Brien (Whitgift School/Exiles)
18. Evin Coyle (Gonzaga College/Leinster)
19. Aaron Browne (Cistercian College Roscrea/Leinster)
20. Jonjo Fanning (Bugbrooke RFC/Exiles)
21. Alex Crocker (Henley College/Exiles)
22. Bruce Houston (Ballymena Academy/Ulster)
23. Conor Dunne (Tullamore RFC/Leinster)
24. Sam Dardis (Terenure College/Leinster)

brokenhooker

Max Kearney was called up by the 5 nations side due to injury but was on holiday in Dubai so was unable to answer the call.

RugbyRugby2016

brokenhooker wrote: »

Max Kearney was called up by the 5 nations side due to injury but was on holiday in Dubai so was unable to answer the call.

That's unfortunate for him.

I presume he was to be a replacement for Dunne? Think he went off with a shoulder injury (or that's what it looked like) against England.

brokenhooker

RugbyRugby2016 wrote: »

That's unfortunate for him.

I presume he was to be a replacement for Dunne? Think he went off with a shoulder injury (or that's what it looked like) against England.

yeah dunne was the injured player.

Conor Jennings also missed out on Ireland u19 squad due to injury picked up in trial game weekend before squad was picked.

DV3

Anyone know the result/squad from the under 18s game yesterday?

brokenhooker

DV3 wrote: »

Anyone know the result/squad from the under 18s game yesterday?

i posted it above

DV3

brokenhooker wrote: »

i posted it above

Sorry should've been more specific, was talking about the game in England against either Italy or Scotland? Up on the Irish rugby site it was scheduled for yesterday

The Lost Sheep

DV3 wrote: »

Sorry should've been more specific, was talking about the game in England against either Italy or Scotland? Up on the Irish rugby site it was scheduled for yesterday

There wasn't one yesterday. They played Scotland today and won 43-0

firstshorn

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

There wasn't one yesterday. They played Scotland today and won 43-0

Any match report on this or stand out performers?

brokenhooker

15. Hugh O'Sullivan (Belvedere College/Leinster) moved to 9(61)
14. Liam Turner (Blackrock College/Leinster)
13. James Hume (RBAI/Ulster)
12. Tommy O'Brien (Blackrock College/Leinster)
11. Daniel Hurley (Crescent CC/Munster)
10. David Hawkshaw (Belvedere College/Leinster)
9. Jonathon Stewart (Wallace High School/Ulster)
1. Eoghan Clarke (CBC Monkstown/Leinster)
2. Alexander Clarke (Ballymena Academy/Ulster)
3. Tom O'Toole (Campbell College/Ulster)
4. John McCusker (Rainey Old Boys/Ulster)
5. Charlie Ryan (Blackrock College/Leinster)
6. Ronan Coffey (Ard Scoil Ris/Munster)
7. Sean Masterson (Portlaoise RFC)
8. Caelan Doris (Blackrock College/Leinster) (capt).
16. Ronan Kelleher (St. Michael's College/Leinster) for A Clarke (45)
17. Callum Reid (RBAI/Ulster) for E Clarke (45)
18. Michael Milne (Cistercian College Roscrea/Munster) for O'Toole (58)
19. Matthew Dalton (Belfast Royal Academy) for McCusker (51)
20. David Robb (Galwegians/Connacht) for Doris (59)
21. Conor Dean (Blackrock College/Leinster) for Stewart (61)
22. Conor Wharton (Oaklands College/Exiles) for Hurley (63)

brokenhooker

Ireland u19 side for tonights game:

15. Jack Kelly (St Michael’s College/Leinster)
14. Colm Hogan (Dublin University RFC/Munster)
13. Gavin Mullin (Blackrock College/Leinster)
12. Michael McDermott (Dublin University RFC/Leinster)
11. Calvin Nash (Crescent Comprehensive College/Munster)
10. Conor Fitzgerald (Ard Scoil Ris/Munster)
9. Niall Saunders (Epsom College/Exile) (Vice-Captain)
1. Richard Mouatt (Blackrock College/Leinster)
2. Tadgh McElroy (Lansdowne RFC/Leinster)
3. Peter Cooper (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster)
4. Oisin Dowling (St Michael’s College/Leinster)
5. Jack Regan (UCD RFC/Leinster)
6. Marcus Rea (Ballymena Academy/Ulster) (Captain)
7. Jonny Guy (UCD RFC/Leinster)
8. John Foley (Shannon/Munster)
16. Conor Maguire (Boyne RFC/Leinster)
17. Michael McCormack (St Mary’s College/Leinster)
18. Dylan Murphy (Cistercian College Roscrea/Munster)
19. Gavin Coombes (Bandon Grammar School/Munster)
20. Tom De Jongh (Belvedere College/Leinster)
21. Jack Lyons (Crescent Comprehensive College/Munster)
22. Ciaran Frawley (Skerries RFC/Leinster)
23. Jordan Larmour (St Andrew’s College/Leinster)