first time triathlete drownns

peter kern

Ok this is statistic from the USA not a single female died in the 20-3o category. Not 1. And I think out of 7 death 6 were male in mid to late 40s. So it's not relative iits based proportion . But the US has about 40% female participation anyway ie much higher than Ireland .

malequote="tunney;97030546"]

peter kern wrote: »

After work I'll go home and ask my five year old, maybe the three year old.

If most people in a race are boys, and only some girls - if someone is going to get dead is it more likely to be a boy or a girl?

Djoucer

Ultimately, the TI needs to get on top of this.

As long as they and races are happy to take beginners' money, you'll have inexperienced and ill-prepared competitors.

Options are ask for a swim cert and see numbers drop initially or continue with the status quo were some races are cancelled despite OK conditions.

A lot of ultra running races require you to submit a previous race result to show that you have trained and are capable of completing the race.

This has led to races being elevated in status in that you have to 'qualify' in order to enter.

Also means smaller races are attracting entries as people seek to get races under their belt.

sconhome

A little known fact I'd forgotten about until recently is that Galway Aquathon when first organised insisted on proof of proficiency. This was done away with when it got National Championships status (not the club's decision)

Even person registering for a triathlon and collecting their number is signing a statement of swim proficiency. It is personal responsibility and people need to be aware of this. There are different levels and distances of triathlon races for a reason. Find a distance that suits you and stop putting others at risk.

This topic has long moved away from the death of this particular triathlete and onto the regular swim ability topic.

JohnBee

AKW wrote: »

Even person registering for a triathlon and collecting their number is signing a statement of swim proficiency. It is personal responsibility and people need to be aware of this. There are different levels and distances of triathlon races for a reason. Find a distance that suits you and stop putting others at risk.

This topic has long moved away from the death of this particular triathlete and onto the regular swim ability topic.

If people behaved responsibly then we wouldn't need this thread. But hey, why then do we have laws for seatbelts?
And yes, swim ability is definitely what this thread is about.

Fact is, no matter what, some entrants will not have the ability. They should not be in the race. Unfortunately it is because of inexperience. For people that are getting pulled out of the water, the trouble is not that they lack the ability, it is that they do not know that they lack the ability.

Swim proficiency certs offer a fun race for people without previous race experience to do, a money making opportunity for governing bodies, and a means to improve race safety. What part of this is bad?

Kurt_Godel

peter kern wrote: »

Ok this is statistic from the USA not a single female died in the 20-3o category. Not 1. And I think out of 7 death 6 were male in mid to late 40s. So it's not relative iits based proportion . But the US has about 40% female participation anyway ie much higher than Ireland .

Statistically we need exactly zero safety procedures for F20-30. And exactly six times as much safety procedures for M45-50.

The more the merrier in Tri, is my overall philosophy. I'm more concerned with swims going ahead, than with beginners doing breaststroke per se. If everyone is swimming strongly and confidently in OW (rather than clinging to kayaks after 50m), then more will be merrier.

peter kern

Kurt_Godel wrote: »

Statistically we need exactly zero safety procedures for F20-30. And exactly six times as much safety procedures for M45-50.

The more the merrier in Tri, is my overall philosophy. I'm more concerned with swims going ahead, than with beginners doing breaststroke per se. If everyone is swimming strongly and confidently in OW (rather than clinging to kayaks after 50m), then more will be merrier.

good and i think to bring it down to the basics positive steps
like reccis before the race, wider promotion of the health issues in tri
more wave starts etc
will do more than forcing people to do a test. which would create more of a barrier and massive bureucray (folowed by higher entry fees) . and I think we rather have a few idots entering a tri than making it harder for the majority of responsible people ( and lets face it until now the majorty of newbees are responsible)

I think your thread for beginner swimmers did much more good than your ranting about swims getting cancelled.

Kurt_Godel

peter kern wrote: »

I think your thread for beginner swimmers did much more good than your ranting about swims getting cancelled.

It did, but it came about from ranting. Nature of the beast Peter, I whinge and moan like there is no tomorrow but realise there's no point in moaning unless you are going to do something about it. Ranting can make you do something about it.

I don't see swim competency course as a barrier at all though; more of an opportunity to skip the bad OW experience many newbies have, and go direct to a more enjoyable OW experience that will keep them in the sport.

MojoMaker

Ironically the opening article makes no presumption that the deceased man was a poor or novice swimmer at all, only that he was new to triathlon, and makes absolutely no correlation with any aspect of safety arrangements or competence in or on the water.

Overall, demonstrable swim competence can only be a good thing but it looks neither TI or SI are remotely interested in supporting this within the context of mass participation events.

JohnBee

peter kern wrote: »

good and i think to bring it down to the basics positive steps
like reccis before the race, wider promotion of the health issues in tri
more wave starts etc
will do more than forcing people to do a test. which would create more of a barrier and massive bureucray (folowed by higher entry fees) .

Shouldn't really, indeed significantly less bureaucracy than organizing an actual triathlon. Remember, those with evidence of a satisfactory swim time from a previous race would be exempt. This will leave a smaller number. Then TI puts on a few events per year, makes them fun events for beginners: I think you will find that rather than creating a barrier, a more closely supervised swim might actually encourage others to enter who currently are afraid of the swim. This is a perfect opportunity to test the water and build the confidence.

Oryx

JohnBee wrote: »

Shouldn't really, indeed significantly less bureaucracy than organizing an actual triathlon. Remember, those with evidence of a satisfactory swim time from a previous race would be exempt. This will leave a smaller number. Then TI puts on a few events per year, makes them fun events for beginners: I think you will find that rather than creating a barrier, a more closely supervised swim might actually encourage others to enter who currently are afraid of the swim. This is a perfect opportunity to test the water and build the confidence.

triAthy already do a swim day prior to the actual race. Its very popular. thats all it takes.

tunney

Oryx wrote: »

triAthy already do a swim day prior to the actual race. Its very popular. thats all it takes.

That you pay to do. and its not a race. and its not mandatory.

strewelpeter

tunney wrote: »

That you pay to do. and its not a race. and its not mandatory.

Genuinely confused as to what qualifies as a race
People start in waves but it is chip timed and results are published in net time.

Despite Athy putting on that warm up swim there I saw more than a dozen people starting the oly swim the following week who didn't manage the upstream section, a good few were out of the water after 100M. There was even one lad who actually couldn't swim... there was no way this guy was doing 100M in a pool never mind 1500 in the barrow!

tunney

strewelpeter wrote: »

Genuinely confused as to what qualifies as a race
People start in waves but it is chip timed and results are published in net time.

Athlete: "Hey were is my prize? I was first"
Organisers: "Oh its not a race, so no prize"

(And yes, A, you can go mad at me for posting this but it is true)

iwillhtfu

tunney wrote: »

Athlete: "Hey were is my prize? I was first"
Organisers: "Oh its not a race, so no prize"

(And yes, A, you can go mad at me for posting this but it is true)

Hmm seems the same rule applies to their triathlon.

Funny they never have an issue taking money. :rolleyes:

rooneyjm

Looks like swimmers are not the only ones at risk. Second man in 4 years on that course, first time I think the man was in his 40's this time he was 23.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0919/728964-man-dies-at-dublin-half-marathon/

iwillhtfu

rooneyjm wrote: »

Looks like swimmers are not the only ones at risk. Second man in 4 years on that course, first time I think the man was in his 40's this time he was 23.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0919/728964-man-dies-at-dublin-half-marathon/

It could have easily happened him sitting at home on the couch. Unfortunately exerting the body brings out the underlying conditions.

Terrible for himself and his family though only a baby. RIP